Infinite Jest – David Foster Wallace discussion
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Infinite Jest
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Moira wrote: "Nathan "N.R." wrote: "I'll be reading the hd, because I'm too cheap to buy a pb. "Oh wow. It could be like an exercise ball. An exercise book.
One thing that really helped me during the Anna Kar..."
Yes, I think we need to have a schedule or two - perhaps one for a December start and one for a January start. People can read ahead or fall behind (in other words, read at a pace that works for them), but it's useful to have some goals in mind when you are reading a work like this. It also will make it easier to divide up the discussion threads into sections. I anticipate that the discussion could well continue past March, depending on the interest of the group. We'll just have to see how it goes.
And Moira, I love the idea of the DFW exercise plan. :)
Kris wrote: "You are both feeding my footnote addiction. My dissertation is just filled with them, and I now gravitate to literary fiction that includes them as well."I looooooove footnotes, absurdly so. I have a book about them called the Devil in the Details, I think.
Kris wrote: "perhaps one for a December start and one for a January start. "Oh, I like that idea. Dividing threads up into chronological sections helps prevent spoiling for people who haven't read the whole thing, too.
Moira wrote: "Kris wrote: "perhaps one for a December start and one for a January start. "Oh, I like that idea. Dividing threads up into chronological sections helps prevent spoiling for people who haven't rea..."
Yes - I think it's essential for a book of this length, especially with so many people in the group. We can have a good balance of structure and flexibility.
Moira wrote: "Kris wrote: "You are both feeding my footnote addiction. My dissertation is just filled with them, and I now gravitate to literary fiction that includes them as well."I looooooove footnotes, absu..."
Ooh - I have The Devil's Details: A History of Footnotes on tbr list - considering something like that for my class on Academic Writing and Research Design. I also want to read The Footnote: A Curious History and Marginalia: Readers Writing in Books. I love some of the scholarship on readers' marks in Early Modern books, and what that tells us about how they approached reading and understood information.
Kris wrote: "Yes - I think it's essential for a book of this length, especially with so many people in the group. We can have a good balance of structure and flexibility. "Yeah, and I really like the way threads can keep going past the reading schedule itself, and how people can dip back after finishing later sections with new insights - that's a great thing about the net, and not really possible with f2f book clubs.
Kris--you probably already saw this article I'm now thinking about... I can't remember the title of the article or who wrote it or who it was about or who published or who tweeted it, but I remember reading something recently about someone studying a particular lady's marginalia, particularly concerning how men were writing about women. I'm sure I can find it....
Jason wrote: "According to my kindle, Atlas Shrugged is even longer than Infinite Jest"This must not be apparent since it's set in that teensy-tiny 1940's type? The kind that causes blindness and feelings of retinal detachment. My copy of Ayn Rand, which lays in my graveyard depositary of books, taking all the room on my bed, when compared with IJ looks not much bigger than the classic, "Are You My Mother?" Ok, I'm jesting, it's not quite not that slim, still, not quite the wrist breaker either. Actually Infinite Jest is the first book I've been worried about holding in my hands. Ever.
That's it, yes! Surely you have seen the hilarious Frustrated Monk Footnotes, yes? ....bah, can't find it right now. I imagine DFW would have gotten a kick out of that one. There are also some books where alternate stories start getting told in footnotes, or even by footnotes - http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/56... and http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/27... come to mind. (And of course, Pale Fire....)
....NO, GR HTML, I did NOT mean 'Hymns Of The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints 1985' - talk about corruption of the text!
Marieke wrote: "Kris--you probably already saw this article I'm now thinking about... I can't remember the title of the article or who wrote it or who it was about or who published or who tweeted it, but I remembe..."Ooh - I'd be very interested in the citation if you can dig it up.
Moira wrote: "That's it, yes! Surely you have seen the hilarious Frustrated Monk Footnotes, yes? ....bah, can't find it right now. I imagine DFW would have gotten a kick out of that one. There are also some bo..."
Ooh - these both look like fun. More to add to tbr. :)
in scrolling through all my favorited tweets, i have yet to find the article. booo (i'll keep looking for it in other ways). but i did find this brownie recipe.
i think possibly A Suitable Boy might challenge IJ on the wrist breakage. i'll get back to y'all on that.
Moira wrote: "That's it, yes! Surely you have seen the hilarious Frustrated Monk Footnotes, yes? ....bah, can't find it right now. I imagine DFW would have gotten a kick out of that one. There are also some bo..."
I don't think I've seen Frustrated Monk Footnotes - sounds enticing. :)
I did find this just now: http://www.brainpickings.org/index.ph...
When I was reading 15th-century ecclesiastical court records for diss research, I could tell from the handwriting when scribes were getting tired - and some of them doodled in the margins when bored (including sketching a woman). It humanized all those sexual misconduct and marriage cases!
Marieke wrote: "in scrolling through all my favorited tweets, i have yet to find the article. booo (i'll keep looking for it in other ways). but i did find this brownie recipe."Good substitute.... :)
FYI: I just added this to the first comment in the IJ Music Thread: ETA: Jason has created a collaborative playlist on spotify, so that group members who are Spotify users can help to create and listen to an Infinite Jest group playlist. Here's the link:
http://open.spotify.com/user/ancatdub...
Thanks Jason - great idea!
Ali wrote: "Marieke wrote: "i think possibly A Suitable Boy might challenge IJ on the wrist breakage. i'll get back to y'all on that."I think the largest book in a single volume I have is a collection of wei..."
Eesh - does it come with a magnifying glass, like those old 2-volume sets of the OED did?
Ali wrote: "I wish. Even though it doesn't matter to me, it would be hilarious to read all the reviews saying when the book was delivered to them they weren't expecting to receive a magnifying glass with it, a..."Laughing here - new book designation - BYOMG :)
Kris wrote: "I don't think I've seen Frustrated Monk Footnotes - sounds enticing. :)"HA FINALLY, a dear friend who's a Shakespeare scholar dug it up for me - I was using All The Wrong Search terms (you don't want to google for "monks dirty manuscript," believe me).
http://brainpickings.org/wp-content/u...
I think it first appeared here, this blog has great stuff: http://www.gotmedieval.com/
Kris wrote: "does it come with a magnifying glass, like those old 2-volume sets of the OED did? "I actually got one of those off Amazon marketplace for something like less than a hundred bucks. I had to buy my own magnifying glass, tho, but it fits in the little drawer.
Jason wrote: "My bad."Hey look, I was just rereading the Max article again and DFW mentions Rand:
But they disagreed on how “Broom” should end. Howard felt that the text called for some sort of resolution; Wallace did not think so. Howard urged him to keep in mind “the physics of reading”—or, as Wallace came to understand the phrase, “a whole set of readers’ values and tolerances and capacities and patience-levels to take into account when the gritty business of writing stuff for others to read is undertaken.” In other words, a reader who got through a long novel like “Broom” deserved a satisfying ending. Wallace was not so confident a writer as to simply ignore Howard’s suggestion; as he wrote to Howard, he didn’t want his novel to be like “Kafka’s ‘Investigations of a Dog’ . . . Ayn Rand or late Günter Grass, or Pynchon at his rare worst”—books that gave pleasure only to their authors. Yet when he tried to write a proper conclusion, “in which geriatrics emerge, revelations revelationize, things are cleared up,” the words felt wrong to him. “I am young and confused and obsessed with certain problems that I think right now distill the experience of being human,” he wrote to Howard. Reality was fragmented, and so his book must be, too. In the end, he broke the novel off midsentence
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/20...
I think it could be more interesting if we all go a little crazy...Don Quixote-shriveled brains and all...
Proustitute wrote: "Sounds good. I have several editions of Proust in storage, so I'm waiting on the Modern Library box set to arrive before I do the schedule with page spans, etc. I had hoped it would have arrived by now.Is there anything I should do on my end when compiling the Proust schedule to keep the IJ schedule and members in mind? "
Thanks so much for asking! We've been going back and forth in the resources thread about timing, and it looks like estimates range from 6 weeks to 2 months to 3 months on the outside to read Infinite Jest. Since the most challenging parts of Infinite Jest particularly come in the first 200-250 pages, I think if members of both groups try to start IJ in December, chances are they will all be well past the more challenging sections before Proust starts in January. There could be a tough overlap period in the first part of January - possibly a slightly slower start re. page ranges in Swann's Way during that period could be helpful. However, I know how ambitious the reading schedule for Proust 2013 will be, so please don't make any adjustments that will cause problems on your end.
We can keep talking about this as we go on!
Fwiw to both groups' moderators...I will in all likelihood "fall behind." but I'm not concerned about that. I like having the structure/schedule to refer to to find the apprropriate discussion thread once I get to whatever part of whichever book and I like being surrounded by smart people with insight. I'm an observer by nature, and since im both an IJ virgin and essentially a Proust virgin, i will probably be more passive than active, but definitely taking advantage of everything these groups have to offer. So I don't know, don't sweat it too much? But I do like the idea of starting IJ in December.
Marieke wrote: "Fwiw to both groups' moderators...I will in all likelihood "fall behind." but I'm not concerned about that. I like having the structure/schedule to refer to to find the apprropriate discussion thre..."This should work well. I have a feeling we'll all be moving back and forth from section to section as other members post, so no one will be left hanging without a discussion. I want everyone to participate in he way that is the most comfortable for them.
Proustitute wrote: "@KrisI'll glad welcome amendments to the schedule once I post it, so I'll look forward to your thoughts.
I also think easing into Swann's Way is a good idea. With that said, and a recent Brookly..."
I have a feeling we can keep up with the pace for Swann's Way with a good start in early December. No hurry re. schedule - members have an idea of the time frame now, so they can plan, but we can easily wait for more detail.
I normally find forewords to be rather dull and pointless. My copy of IJ has one by Dave Eggers, though, who not only stirs excitement for this novel with his words, but also mentions Proust (?!) of all people. He writes:“But Wallace is a different sort of madman, one in full control of his tools, one who instead of teetering on the edge of this precipice or that, under the influence of drugs or alcohol, seems to be heading ever-inward, into the depths of memory and the relentless conjuring of a certain time and place in a way that evokes—it seems so wrong to type this name but then again, so right!—Marcel Proust. There is the same sort of obsessiveness, the same incredible precision and focus, and the same sense that the writer wanted (and arguably succeeds at) nailing the consciousness of an age.”So I thought that was interesting. It has made me even more excited for the IJ read this winter.
Jason wrote: "I normally find forewords to be rather dull and pointless. My copy of IJ has one by Dave Eggers, though, who not only stirs excitement for this novel with his words, but also mentions Proust (?!) o..."That's a great quote, Jason! And I love the coincidence of the comparison with Proust. Could be an interesting point of comparison to consider as we move into the Proust read in January and after.
Jason wrote: "I normally find forewords to be rather dull and pointless. My copy of IJ has one by Dave Eggers, though, who not only stirs excitement for this novel with his words, but also mentions Proust (?!) o..."That's the perfect quote to tie this all together. It makes me wonder, though -- who will be the next great author to nail "the consciousness of an age." Sergio de la Pava? E.L. James?
S. Penkevich?
Y'all are going to make me cry! My grandmother, 'step'—that is, was French. And to my luck, a voracious reader and lover of books. My grandfather, a Colonel was in France for their Liberation. In the annals of family lore, he will forever be known as the 'bad' grandfather. He had the bad form while in Paris to fall in love, yep, it him hard.Alas, he fell in love with the wrong mamselle, in the end it cost him a star, maybe four, as he found the lady worth more than his career. In part this was due to the fact he was already married, but worse, in truth, the young lady was De Gaulle's personal assistant.
A black haired beauty, young, chic and sophisticated even in the aftermath and wrap up of the horrors. The lovers didn't care and flew back to America along with saved and sacred volumes of old Proust, Voltaire, Books on Art, Philosophy, etc. They made a life.
Going on: They settled down in Atlanta, she learned English, joined the Library and began filling up her own again. And it was a nice one. < Understatement. Seasons pass. Years go by and eventually all their accumulated "stuff" is passed down to my two sisters and me. We went oldest sister choose, me choose, younger sister choose and so on. They went for high dollar. I went for the books. The paintings. And, ok, I'm not stupid. Some beautiful inlaid furniture, ahhh, the writing table.Why am I crying? I recently moved. I'm overun with books. I have so many I don't know what to do with them. Yet so many are missing. The boxed up Faulkner's and all my Capote's and yes, the Proust, the Tolstoy's, the Kant's, the Woolf's. These things are irreplaceable. They are more than 'mere' stuff. I'm not a stuff kind of person. When we were packing I said like a mantra, "The Books, The Beads and The Clothes." (I make jewelry) I hope someone is loving those books.
Marieke wrote: "Fwiw to both groups' moderators...I will in all likelihood "fall behind." but I'm not concerned about that. I like having the structure/schedule to refer to to find the apprropriate discussion thread once I get to whatever part of whichever book and I like being surrounded by smart people with insight. I'm an observer by nature, and since im both an IJ virgin and essentially a Proust virgin, i will probably be more passive than active, but definitely taking advantage of everything these groups have to offer. So I don't know, don't sweat it too much? But I do like the idea of starting IJ in December."Yeah, this is me too - not an IJ virgin, but definitely a Proust one (is there a ritual, like with Rocky Horror showings?). I'll be lucky if I can make it through the LD SW, I think. I am not great at reading books that are in very long series, as opposed to trilogies or tetraologies (sp). But who knows maybe Proust will be my braekthrough!
http://www.mediabistro.com/fishbowlny...Speaking of Dave Egger's intro, I thought this was interesting. I'm sure Moira loves this.
Stephen M wrote: "http://www.mediabistro.com/fishbowlny...Speaking of Dave Egger's intro, I thought this was interesting. I'm sure Moira loves this."
Hmmm... I thought Eggers' first piece was going to be like something you might hear out of new parents who say their kid is cranky, smelly, boring, and the greatest thing that had ever happened to them. But it looks like he never got to the punchline.
Stephen M wrote: "http://www.mediabistro.com/fishbowlny...Speaking of Dave Egger's intro, I thought this was interesting. I'm sure Moira loves this."
HA
ILU
Besides frequently losing itself in superfluous and wildly tangential flights of lexical diarrhea, the book suffers under the sheer burden of its incredible length. (That includes the 96 pages of only sporadically worthwhile endnotes, including one that clocks in at 17 pages.) At almost 1,100 pages, it feels more like 3,000.
I had seriously never seen that before, ever. That is awesome.
"Infinite Jest" also ends abruptly, leaving as many questions unanswered as does X's suicide. Like his alter ego's experimental films, the book seems like an exercise in what one gifted artist can produce without the hindrance of an editor. Subsequently, it's also an exercise in whether or not such a work can sustain a reader's interest for more than 1,000 pages and thus find an audience outside academia. Wallace's take on that can be found in the book's apt title. It's an endless joke on somebody. "(view spoiler)
Wow, and all those websites are only 5-6 years old? but most of them are gone, you can't get the original references without archive.org. (That doesn't happen with books!)
Man, I wonder where the original review was....apparently back in 06 they got it from Wallace-L, but the link provided doesn't work anymore.
I tried searching for the original Eggers review too but nothing turned up. I'm almost ready to join your camp Moira, but I have What is the What on my shelf to carry me in one direction or the other.Thanks for the link too. It's interesting that Dave wouldn't respond to all those requests. I am a huge fan of the Bat Segundo Show as it has interview David Mitchell several times and, of course the show is named after his first book's radio show.
Stephen M wrote: "I tried searching for the original Eggers review too but nothing turned up.Yeah, that's weird. Was it in his original little zine or whatever it was? Usually reviews are easier to find than that.
I'm almost ready to join your camp Moira, but I have What is the What on my shelf to carry me in one direction or the other.
But this is better! http://www.lostboysfilm.com/
It's interesting that Dave wouldn't respond to all those requests. I am a huge fan of the Bat Segundo Show as it has interview David Mitchell several times and, of course the show is named after his first book's radio show."
Haha, I saw that and my brain kept going "....left my wallet in El Segundo. Left my wallet in El Segundo, I got to get it, got-got to get it...."
Ooo! Thanks for that link! I'll have to watch that as supplementary material.
From the book I'm currently reading, Nicola Barker's The Yips:The boy nods, obligingly. He is sitting, alone and – he had somewhat naively presumed – inconspicuously, at a small, corner table in the bar at the Thistle. He is enjoying a solitary glass of Coke as he reads a thick, paperback copy of David Foster Wallace’s Infinite Jest (which currently lies open, but face-down, at his elbow). (p186)
Ha! Wow, I wonder how many times IJ shows up in other books now........also has anyone linked this yet? http://imreadinginfinitejest.tumblr.com/
Finish Infinite Jest. Get to the last page and lose your shit. Email/text/call/hunt down on the street everyone you’ve ever met who has read this book and demand to know what the hell has happened, and if you’re right about Tooty. Debate the relative merits of Hal vs. Gately, and the creepiness factors of the assassins des fauteuils rollents, Charles Tavis, and Steeply. Write a how-to about the experience. Formulate strategies for converting the unconverted.
Why does my Nook suddenly weigh 7 pounds?
Also, damn, this is kind of beautiful. http://pooryorickentertainment.tumblr...
That first link was absolutely hysterical! I was laughing embarrassingly loud, drawing looks from others for sure.You are just a compendium of great links, thanks Moira.
I looked around on a couple other pics of the people holding IJ.
http://peopleholdinginfinitejest.tumb...
HELLO!
Do you see the size of the binding on that book? Daiimn.
Stephen M wrote: "You are just a compendium of great links, thanks Moira."Aww thanks! I enjoy it.
I thought for sure there was a Tumblr of people photographed actually READING Infinite Jest, but I can't find it.
One of my favourites is this: http://peopleholdinginfinitejest.tumb... There is ONE GUY not holding IJ. I think he is also the only one wearing jeans. I wonder what his story is. Did he have it memorized? Is his copy on a flash drive in a pocket of his unbearably ugly shirt? Does he side with James Wood instead?
I thought for sure there was a Tumblr of people photographed actually READING Infinite Jest, but I can't find it.then let's make one!
Marieke wrote: "I thought for sure there was a Tumblr of people photographed actually READING Infinite Jest, but I can't find it.then let's make one!"
Hah! I am so unphotogenic a picture of me would shatter your monitor.
well, we can do things discreetly. i'm not exactly friendly with cameras either, unless i'm behind one.
Infinite Jest – David Foster Wallace
Books mentioned in this topic
Women and Men (other topics)The Quincunx (other topics)
Every Love Story Is a Ghost Story: A Life of David Foster Wallace (other topics)
A Suitable Boy (other topics)
The Devil's Details: A History of Footnotes (other topics)
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That would be reason enough to read Boswell."
You are both feeding my footnote addiction. My dissertation is just filled with them, and I now gravitate to literary fiction that includes them as well.