Vaginal Fantasy Book Club discussion
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Desperate Duchesses
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Jul 2012: SUBMIT QUESTIONS FOR MONDAY HANGOUT!
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are the hangouts going to change when they move to the geek and sundry channel ? if so how will they change ?I cant comment/question on this months book picks I didnt read them cos ive only just finished kushiels! Im so glad I read kushiels though I loved it and ordered the next book straight away and cant wait to dive in I just love Phedre and Joscelin so much and have become hoooked on their story/journey.
I would love to hear a discussion on rutting and phizles......My question..I have to think about that one..
Usually in a Romance book you are pretty clear from the beginning who is 'the hero' and who is 'the heroine", for at least the first couple of chapters of this book I was kind of confused with the introduction of all the various characters. Were others confused by all this as well? Looking back this is an obvious series setup, but I found it took away from the enjoyment of this book.
Jute wrote: "Usually in a Romance book you are pretty clear from the beginning who is 'the hero' and who is 'the heroine", for at least the first couple of chapters of this book I was kind of confused with the ..."I think in Desperate Duchesses there are multiple heroes/and heroines. Eloisa James does explore them in other books. There is a Jemma book and a Villiers book, etc. The main story centers on Roberta and her budding romance with Damon.
QUESTION: Why is Roberta such a vapid, shallow character swimming in a sea of intelligent, deep and charismatic supporting characters?
I would like a discussion regarding this....or even simply the general theme in romance novels of the naive young virgin....why is she always at the epicenter of novels written entirely for adult women?
With regards to LOCAL hangouts,The Northern Central Florida group is meeting up tomorrow for lunch and book talk. I am bringing my "nice" camera (aka not just my cell phone) so that I can share photos on G+. I'll be sure to tag the Vaginal Fantasy page.
Also, Vicky has been great getting additional video hangouts going on the book reads! We meet Wednesday twice a month, once for the main read and once for the alt read. So far, we have been groups of 5-8. It's A LOT of fun! Great way to get to know other vaginal fantsy-ers. I'm linking the thread below, if anyone is interested. We use G+ event to facilitate.
http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/9...
Now my question for this month,
Both of these books had a heroine that lost her virginity prior to marriage, I was wondering if that is an uncommon (or common) occurrence in the historical romance genre? These have been my first historical romance books, so I'm just curious because it seems kind of counter intuitive.
I am huge fan of this series and other romances in this genre.....but why is the heroine always best if she young and pure and the hero always best if he is a rogue and 'experienced'? Is he suppose to be a better lover because he has been with other women and she is just suppose to be an overnight success?
An obvious question/discussion topic on this one would be the role of chess in the book. How their love of it influenced some characters and caused them to do things they might otherwise have not done (for instance Villiers wouldn't have come to the ball if Jemma hadn't lured him there with chess talk). Also, how much do you think the overall plot played out like a chess game? (perhaps one that's only just begun, and the rest remains to be played in the later books).
I think I deserve extra credit this month. Not only did I read both books. I also read all the rest in each series. I read a book called "Heaving bosoms..smart bitches guide to romance" and then read the "50 shades of grey" of my parents generation "The Flame and the Flower".. the book that started the hisoric romance genre.My question:
The Desperate Duchesses is the first in a six part series. The story is laid out in the first book with the Romance of Damon and Roberta but if you read the whole series Viller's story and Jemma and Elijah's story is the main backbone. On Eloisa James website she mentioned that the books were loosely based on the show "Desperate housewives". From the characters in the book could you see any of yourself in one of the following characters:
Harriet-Jemma's widow friend whose husband commited sucide.
Lady Isidore-Jemma's exotic friend who was married at 13 but has never met her husband.
Robeta-The eccentric country bumpkin cousin
Jemma-Who is trying to fall back in love with her dying husband
Viller-The rackshell and loyal duke wanting to get married.
My question:having read all of the 6 books in the series:
1) which relationship do you identify with the most? Jemma's, Henrietta's, Eleanor's and Viller's, Poppy's, Roberta's or Isidore's?
2) with which of the male characters from the books (Villers, Beaumont, Lord Strange, Damon, Simeon or Fletcher) would you find yourself playing a game of chess?
3) despite this(these) book(s) being 'fluffy reads' do you find the relationship development in them believable? do you like the development?
Can we discuss the creepy baby action at the end? Because yeah...
Jessica wrote: "Can we discuss the creepy baby action at the end? Because yeah..."I agree, that was a total WTF moment in the epilogue.
Oh, the Austin, TX peeps got together in person last week, and we have plans in motion for possible in person hangouts every two weeks! YAY!
Misstessamelissa wrote: "Jessica wrote: "Can we discuss the creepy baby action at the end? Because yeah..."I agree, that was a total WTF moment in the epilogue."
It kinda did come out of nowhere. It was probably meant to be sweet and endearing, but it came off a bit weird when talking about a fetus doing acrobatics. It made me think the dancing baby from of Ally McBeal.
Jute wrote:"Looking back this is an obvious series setup, but I found it took away from the enjoyment of this book. "QUESTION: What series have you read that you thought should have been condensed into one great stand-alone instead of a dozen (shorter) good books ... or vice versa? Alternatively, if you could travel back in time and convince just one author to retire after book 1 OR to keep writing more of the same series for all eternity, who would it be?
I hope we will soon have a stand-alone book as our monthly pick. I haven't been invested in most of our books enough to sift through a whole series to find the plot & character development points or plot-hole-fixes that other readers insist are in there somewhere and when I have been keen, the series hasn't been great. Hope's Folly was AMAZING but I won't read more until there's a book about Ren; both sequels to Nine Rules were OKAY; and I'm only 4 chapters into the 3rd Alex Craft book and it's AWFUL (grave-witchery is taking a back seat to the love triangle and that's a bit too Twilight for me). I'd love a stand-alone so that I know the author has to focus on just this one story and not on how its going to play out over a 5 book contract.
Shout out to Seattle! We met last Wednesday 7/25 at The Duchess Tavern :)
What did you think of Damon? Some seemed to love him, others hated him. I liked that he wasn't all dark and broody like so many leading men seem to be these days.Also, throwing cowpats...good first 'date'?
Molly wrote: "What did you think of Damon? Some seemed to love him, others hated him. I liked that he wasn't all dark and broody like so many leading men seem to be these days.Also, throwing cowpats...good f..."
I LOVED Damon. So much so, that he is now included in my fictional five. He was very affectionate instead of domineering, which was refreshing. One of my favorite parts was when they went to take Teddy to see the mermaid, and Damon just couldn't keep his hands off of her. He wrapped his arms around her waste from behind, rubbed the small of her back in the carriage...it seemed so romantic. *sigh*
Felicia! Portland had their hang-out already at the Lucky Lab (local brewery). We'll be doing one monthly if you don't mind telling the world in case there are people who don't forum.
I'm still trying to understand how Roberta was "in love" with Villiers and could just run off and do dirty things with Damon. Also, how did she not comprehend Damon's feelings???In regard to Nine Rules - I loved it through and through. Callie was relate-able and the story was compelling, even through the oh so yummy smut scenes. My heart was sad when the story ended... The only problem I had was the fencing club scene. How is it that he just so happened to be in the room she was assigned to?
which author's smut scenes - duchesses or nine rules - did you like better and why?
Leah wrote: "I'm still trying to understand how Roberta was "in love" with Villiers and could just run off and do dirty things with Damon. Also, how did she not comprehend Damon's feelings???In regard to Nin..."
I don't think she was really in love with Villiers. I think she thought he was sexy, but also believed he would never embarrass her. So...the combination of not being mortified in public anymore and having a passionate man make you feel like you were beautiful (even if it was just during sex) were her ideal characteristics in a mate.
But I do agree that it was a bit ridiculous that she clung to her "feelings" for Villiers while thoroughly enjoying Damon.
Question: What did you think of Roberta's "deflowering" encounter? Did you find it humorous that she didn't like the experience and didn't want to do it again? Did you find it anti-climactic and a little sad?
Jessica wrote: "Can we discuss the creepy baby action at the end? Because yeah..."For sure! Such a bizzare way to end a romance novel!
Both books were good. I LOVED!!!! Nine Rules way more than Duchess. Which was your favorite? Have all of you read both books before? Also I've always picked books by the cover art and would have never chosen Nine but I'm so happy I found out about the book club (thanks geek and sundry & then Felicia's Facebook).
Thanks!!
I definitely liked 9 rules better. I liked both books, but Callie was much more relate-able for me. Though the basic plot was pretty typical, the characters really made it for me. I also felt that instead of good girl trying to reform bad boy, it was more like good girl using the fact that he's a bad to her advantage and bad boy changing himself.
Did anyone find the setup of Roberta's "love" for Villiers too easy and unrealistic? I felt that it suspended the disbelief of the novel for me. Also, what did you think about the introduction of so many characters and story-lines so early in the book?
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QUESTION: What series have you read that you thought should have been condense..."
Good comment PointyEars, we'll do that (not next month but as soon as we can fit it in)
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PointyEars42 wrote: "Jute wrote:"Looking back this is an obvious series setup, but I found it took away from the enjoyment of this book. "QUESTION: What series have you read that you thought should have been condense..."
I'm in agreement with the idea of a stand-alone in the future. I read the whole Love by Numbers series quickly, though the first book was the best. I'm still working through the Parasol Protectorate as well, and I plan to gradually read the rest of Kushiel's Legacy. Otherwise, I haven't been sold enough on a first book to finish a series, and by stopping at the first book of a series, it feels so "incomplete" to me. I would love to see certain characters' development (e.g Ren, Jemma, etc.), but I can't bring myself to read all the books in between.
Amanda wrote: "Did anyone find the setup of Roberta's "love" for Villiers too easy and unrealistic? I felt that it suspended the disbelief of the novel for me. Also, what did you think about the introduction of..."I did, and I thought it was a little much, but you could attribute it to her being so young and immature.
The Chicago group has had an IRL meetup at the Book Cellar in Lincoln Square. It was small -- just two of us were able to make it to this one -- but there are others expressing interest in the forum. There will definitely be another meetup next month!One question we talked about at the meetup were the different types of historical romance -- Georgian, Victorian, Edwardian, Regency -- and we weren't quite clear on what time period is what and how to identify them. And is Jane Austen considered Edwardian or Victorian?
Jane Austen is Georgian, which is from 1714–1830Regency is a sub- period of the Georgian era, from about 1811 till 1837.
Victorian era (1837–1901)
Edwardian era (1901–1910)
Enjoyed the books, but did anyone else think the duels were sort of really anticlimactic? I mean, all of the apologizing beforehand and the whole "this is a gentleman's agreement and we're not really going to try to kill each other" thing. I mean, that would be good irl, but it doesn't exactly make for dramatic storytelling. And when Callie got Ralston shot...*facepalm*
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I hated her for being so stupid, both of them acted like idiots, but I guess if you're a sheltered virgin who finally got some lovin', you might wanna save your man hahahaha
Bleh, am I the only one that didn't get past the first couple of chapters for the main book?? I loved Nine Rules, but could not get into DD as it was "unrealistic" to me. Yet looking back, the coincidences and plot progression in Nine Rules was pretty absurd too - and surprisingly this made the book better for me!! So I have no idea why I liked it..?We discussed this somewhat in our Aussie hangout. But couldn't really figure out why everyone enjoyed the alt book more :/
What is it about a bodice that makes it so much hotter to rip off than a bra? I concur that it is, but I wonder why :)
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If you were to live in that time period, who would you be? What would your profession be and what kind of man would you hunt?
Molly wrote: "Enjoyed the books, but did anyone else think the duels were sort of really anticlimactic? I mean, all of the apologizing beforehand and the whole "this is a gentleman's agreement and we're not real..."To be fair the whole premise of the book then should be silly to you. She risked her future and more importantly, her reputation (which is the only thing women "own" in that society) to "feel free" which is taboo back then. Following the logic of the book, her attending the duel to save her future husband (basically the result of her silliness) was in the same line of logic. Also, it was on her "To-do List" which just had to make it so.
Do you ladies find it hard accept "book society" (things the author tells you are facts or are truth) or do you find it easy to play along(even if you dont agree with them)?
Why do so many romance books think it's ok to use the term "wanton"????? It's Everywhere and so very not PC.
I know this has come up a couple times in the discussion thread, but I'm not quite sure I buy that sexually experienced guys would fine a young and virginal partner as intriguing as they seem to in these books. Anyone else find this strange?Also, not sure that in a male dominated society that these rogue-ish men would be so versed in providing for their partners pleasure?
Felicia, Can we finally see the picture at VidCon? Also I would love to rename 50 shades of grey to 50 shades of dull if we can as well as epilogue'd being made into a thing called baby maker. Again with the also, could you tell us if you met any other authors at Comic-Con. Lastly can we have the fiasco tabletop episode made into a book?
Throwing my support in for the liking the alt pick more than the regular. However, my questions will be regarding the regular:I'm not sure if DD was typical of the genre, but the inclusion of so much detail regarding children really drew me out of the story. Romances are unrealistic as a rule, and the addition of children really brought it back to reality and took me out of the pleasurable fantasy that the rest of the book encompassed.
Maybe it rubs me the wrong way because I'm not a mother, nor do I want to be one in the near future (someday, just not now), but I would rather have more dashing rake/heaving bosoms than thumb-sucking child. (And to all of you who are moms, no offense meant, just throwing in my two cents. :) )
(I also second hotmama's question)
Why is the YT livestream unavailable in Germany?
Nine Rules all the way. Absolutely loved it.
My question for the VF gals: Was I the only one whose brain veered onto the off-ramp of What-The-Fuckery when Roberta and Damon were essentially throwing calcified cow shit in the river? (160)
I never understood why women were obsessed with romance novels, until I read this book. Now, I get it! SO RACY. SO ROGUISH! I could easily take this up as a habit. Who needs to work? ;P
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Germany for some reason blocks the stream :( SOmeone posted a workaround link on one of the forum posts a while back, maybe search "Germany" on the forum search to find it?
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Few things:
-This month's Hangout will still be on youtube.com/feliciaday, we're moving to the last TUESDAY of each month on Geek and Sundry starting in August
-For ease of use, I think we will switch to using the chat on Geek and Sundry Community site THIS month because it loads in-browser easily for everyone.
http://geekandsundry.com/community
We will also take questions when we live broadcast with #vaginalfantasy hashtag on Twitter as always.