The Fellowship of the Ring
question
What edits MIGHT you have SUGGESTED for Lord of the Rings/The Hobbit?
Kyle
Jul 01, 2012 04:30AM
To begin, the trilogy/quadrilogy was a work of genius. We have the benefit of years and years to ponder over the books, minutiae and all. With that in mind, wouldn't it be interesting to go back in time and pose the potential issues we've noticed in all those years to Tolkien (and his editors)... if only to hear what the response would have been?
I have a deep and abiding respect for all those who hold these texts close to heart. As a (big?) fan of Tolkien and a fantasy writer myself, I am primarily trying here to challenge myself to look at things from a different angle, not to demean Tolkien or his magnificent work. I look forward to hearing from those who say, "No changes needed; you're simply ignorant and far too quick to generalize," as long as specifics are cited... because that will be the best way to win me over toward becoming an even bigger LOTR fan, I think?
I fully intend to do more research on my own, but having some direction from my fellow lovely Tolkien fans will be very helpful. Thank you in advance!
As inspired by the recent related post under Return of the King here on Goodreads, I would have suggested removing the giant eagles from the storylines entirely because they suggest (if not immediately open up) too many (potential) deus ex machina type of moments, and those rub me wrong. Maybe Gandalf could have glided down from the tower with the assistance of a troop of regular eagles, distracting Saruman as well. It seems to me that the same results could be achieved with less deus ex machina overtones, and we wouldn't have these "Where were the eagles THEN?" kind of moments.
I would also have suggested that Bilbo's somewhat idle use of the Ring at his birthday party immediately invite the gaze of Sauron. Wouldn't that be enough motivation to send out the Black Riders? I was inspired to say this because I don't understand how Gollum got away... if no one from Mordor was tracking him toward the Ring as well. And so, on a related note, I would have suggested that Gollum had been sulking around... perhaps until he sensed the Ring's power activated...
I am off to do some research, but I expect to be back with more issues that have... nagged at me. I look forward to interesting and illuminating conversation. I expect that I am presuming upon the indulgence of the fans who are more hardcore than I, so I'm a bit nervous, but, more than that, I am very hopeful that a good, polite conversation could easily win me over toward becoming an even bigger Tolkien fan, whether my ideas have direct answers or not.
I have a deep and abiding respect for all those who hold these texts close to heart. As a (big?) fan of Tolkien and a fantasy writer myself, I am primarily trying here to challenge myself to look at things from a different angle, not to demean Tolkien or his magnificent work. I look forward to hearing from those who say, "No changes needed; you're simply ignorant and far too quick to generalize," as long as specifics are cited... because that will be the best way to win me over toward becoming an even bigger LOTR fan, I think?
I fully intend to do more research on my own, but having some direction from my fellow lovely Tolkien fans will be very helpful. Thank you in advance!
As inspired by the recent related post under Return of the King here on Goodreads, I would have suggested removing the giant eagles from the storylines entirely because they suggest (if not immediately open up) too many (potential) deus ex machina type of moments, and those rub me wrong. Maybe Gandalf could have glided down from the tower with the assistance of a troop of regular eagles, distracting Saruman as well. It seems to me that the same results could be achieved with less deus ex machina overtones, and we wouldn't have these "Where were the eagles THEN?" kind of moments.
I would also have suggested that Bilbo's somewhat idle use of the Ring at his birthday party immediately invite the gaze of Sauron. Wouldn't that be enough motivation to send out the Black Riders? I was inspired to say this because I don't understand how Gollum got away... if no one from Mordor was tracking him toward the Ring as well. And so, on a related note, I would have suggested that Gollum had been sulking around... perhaps until he sensed the Ring's power activated...
I am off to do some research, but I expect to be back with more issues that have... nagged at me. I look forward to interesting and illuminating conversation. I expect that I am presuming upon the indulgence of the fans who are more hardcore than I, so I'm a bit nervous, but, more than that, I am very hopeful that a good, polite conversation could easily win me over toward becoming an even bigger Tolkien fan, whether my ideas have direct answers or not.
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I'd excise the whole Tom Bombadil section so that I don't have to feel like slapping him and shouting "for f-'s sake, speak normally!" every time I read it. "Hey-down-merry-dol-fol-de-rol-a-diddle-THWACK", (the thwack was me mentally slapping him, btw) and constant rhyming couplets - ARGH!
There are better reasons to get rid of it, of course. It seems like he doesn't actually do anything to advance the plot, doesn't throw any light on the main characters, it doesn't even seem to add to the Middle Earth mythos, since I can't think of any context for him in that (OK, so I suppose he must be part of the mythos, but where does he fit, Tolkein doesn't say), so what purpose does he serve?
However, my main reason is undoubtedly the enormous irritation factor he represents for me!
There are better reasons to get rid of it, of course. It seems like he doesn't actually do anything to advance the plot, doesn't throw any light on the main characters, it doesn't even seem to add to the Middle Earth mythos, since I can't think of any context for him in that (OK, so I suppose he must be part of the mythos, but where does he fit, Tolkein doesn't say), so what purpose does he serve?
However, my main reason is undoubtedly the enormous irritation factor he represents for me!
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i just wish that Tolkien would describe more about the feelings of his characters instead of the surrounding and pathways. I wanted to know how each of them felt or how they mourned to bring the tears; facial expressions and personal things to bring personal connection. and i wished he'd involve more women in the book like they did in the films.
Female versions of orcs, uruk-hai, dwarves, cave trolls, etc.
The reasoning behind the whole "Why didn't they just fly the eagles from Rivendell into Mordor and drop the ring in the volcano from way up high?" thing is hinted at in The Hobbit.
The Giant Eagles in The Hobbit (and in a few parts of Fellowship) were not just a species of hyper-intelligent animals that could be summoned at will, but a sapient race of people. They spoke to and reasoned with Gandalf and Co., and the Eagle King was gifted with a gold crown (or some other type of royal bling) after the Battle of the Five Armies. You give dwarvish crowns to respected allies and fellow royalty, not common animals.
Judging by this depiction of the Giant Eagles, they were a culture and a people unto themselves. For all we know, the Eagles had their own bigger problems to deal with, and could only make time out of their busy schedules to come to the Fellowship at their direst times of need.
I haven't read The Silmarillion yet, but from what I hear, it explains culture and origin of the Giant Eagles in much better detail.
The Giant Eagles in The Hobbit (and in a few parts of Fellowship) were not just a species of hyper-intelligent animals that could be summoned at will, but a sapient race of people. They spoke to and reasoned with Gandalf and Co., and the Eagle King was gifted with a gold crown (or some other type of royal bling) after the Battle of the Five Armies. You give dwarvish crowns to respected allies and fellow royalty, not common animals.
Judging by this depiction of the Giant Eagles, they were a culture and a people unto themselves. For all we know, the Eagles had their own bigger problems to deal with, and could only make time out of their busy schedules to come to the Fellowship at their direst times of need.
I haven't read The Silmarillion yet, but from what I hear, it explains culture and origin of the Giant Eagles in much better detail.
I would have written another trilogy about the previous age. But then again, considering how gargantuan a task his five books were, enough is enough.
I wouldn't change anything because if it were perfect would we be discussing it now? Its the imperfections that give things character and make them what they are
The only thing I would leave out would be the chapter on Tom Bombadil. It always struck me as out of place in Middlearth.
It also doesn't add much to the Hobitts' adventure and I always felt it was a character he wasn't sure how to develop further. Modern day editors would have struck it I guess.
Maybe Tolkien should have written another book and used Tom Bombadill in a more faery tale type of setting?
It also doesn't add much to the Hobitts' adventure and I always felt it was a character he wasn't sure how to develop further. Modern day editors would have struck it I guess.
Maybe Tolkien should have written another book and used Tom Bombadill in a more faery tale type of setting?
I wouldn't begin to tell the master what to do considering I have no writing skills of my own. As for Tom Bombadil, I love his character. He represents the oldest magic and probably wouldn't be affected no mater what happened. He is also a reminder to the reader no matter what happens you carry on. As for moving the story along, he is a brief respite, a rest, from the story. Besides he is a truly colorful character.
None because he wrote what he knows about, which appeared to be word origins and making up his own language, and didn't creep into territory about which he knows nothing so there was never any danger of a person using his books as excuses for why they act the way they do. The way that by and large is practiced by defense attorneys when someone goes off half-cocked, kills somebody and then claims such and such a book "spoke" to them. It's an obvious manipulation tactic to get a cold-blooded killer less time in prison or out of the death penalty. IMO, which is based on what I've seen first-hand, not read anywhere.
Then there are the people who know just absolutely nothing about health care, but don't even try to make it even a little accurate.
Like the largely unknown writer who had his character be a medical doctor and then had no idea that morphine and the same family of medications create pin-point pupils, not enlarged ones.
Other readers could care less about that but I'm a Paramedic so I care more than the average person, sometimes I even have more concern about it than my colleagues.
Well, I don't mind if you want to write about emergency medicine, but if you don't also understand it yourself, making your character be a medical doctor is IMO not a good idea. Not if you want the story to be as successful as it can be.
It seems like British writers do more research than American authors. Or they're less assuming than Americans. That's why most of my favorite authors are British or something besides American. The exceptions are Richard Matheson and Stephen King, although Stephen King at least admitted he doesn't do as much research.
I suppose it's just a pet peeve of mine when people are less interested in making health care as factual as possible.
That's why one of my favorite phrases is "Don't take advice about health care from a book; you might die of a misprint." Mark Twain
Then there are the people who know just absolutely nothing about health care, but don't even try to make it even a little accurate.
Like the largely unknown writer who had his character be a medical doctor and then had no idea that morphine and the same family of medications create pin-point pupils, not enlarged ones.
Other readers could care less about that but I'm a Paramedic so I care more than the average person, sometimes I even have more concern about it than my colleagues.
Well, I don't mind if you want to write about emergency medicine, but if you don't also understand it yourself, making your character be a medical doctor is IMO not a good idea. Not if you want the story to be as successful as it can be.
It seems like British writers do more research than American authors. Or they're less assuming than Americans. That's why most of my favorite authors are British or something besides American. The exceptions are Richard Matheson and Stephen King, although Stephen King at least admitted he doesn't do as much research.
I suppose it's just a pet peeve of mine when people are less interested in making health care as factual as possible.
That's why one of my favorite phrases is "Don't take advice about health care from a book; you might die of a misprint." Mark Twain
I would have liked an epic final battle between Aragorn and Sauron! After all, Aragorn should be at least one of his biggest enemies. My version is: The Ring is taken from Frodo by Gollum, then Gollum is killed by Sauron himself. He then turns to Frodo and at that moment, Aragorn appears, and the death defying battle follows. Finally, as the battle is tipping in Sauron's favour, Frodo grabs the Ring and hurls it over the side. Sauron quickly follows his precious.
But I am by no means criticizing Tolkien's work... these are just my childish fancies.
But I am by no means criticizing Tolkien's work... these are just my childish fancies.
I would accept that this is a classic and a work of genius and in the benefit of hindsight I wouldn't change a thing.
Next thing you will be asking why Chaucer didn't write in (Modern) English. or Shakespeare.....
Next thing you will be asking why Chaucer didn't write in (Modern) English. or Shakespeare.....
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