Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows
discussion
the consequence of dumbledore being gay
Well, since it wasn't in the story, i choose to reject that idea. Yes, I know Rowling said it, but I reject it.
But a romance with McGonagall's a little disturbing because if I'm remembering right, she's quite a bit younger than he was.
I mean, I know she's not 20 or anything, but I'd venture a guess that she was about half his age...
I never really though of Dumbledore having a romantic life - when I heard what Rowling had said though it does make sense with some of the things in Deathly Hallows. TBH I do not think it matters what a characters sexual preference is as long as it is handled in a tasteful manner.Part of me does think though that she could have made it more obvious in the books - when she said about it in a interview I remember a lot of people being shocked becuase it was so out of the blue.
he was in love with snape
Well it was handled tastefully.I think why it wasn't made obvious in the books because it had nothing to do with what was going on. They were trying to defeat Voldemort, so how would Dumbledore being gay make a difference? It's not like he was in love with voldemort or anything, lmao.
My point is, it isn't relevant to the series, or the overall story being told. The point of the novels was not to tell Dumbledore's life story (that would be part of what Pottermore is for I guess..) it was to tell the story of Harry Potter. Dumbledore's sexual preference was no part of that.
I think theres no point to judge and he is was and always will be the same person he was in the beginning i completely agree with courtney on this "Dumbledore's sexual preference was no part of that. "
His supposed sexual orientation has no bearing on the story, so just read it and enjoy! Don't try to read something into it that isn't there.
As JulieLaLa said above, it has no bearing on the story so shouldn't affect your own percception of the story. However, I personally thought it was very interesting to hear he is gay and I feel I now understand him a bit more. I think there was so much more to Dumbledore than anyone could ever have know, no matter how well they knew him. Just like Harry begins to discover in DH. I would love to read a story by JKR about Dumbledore's life however I like that he has that air of mystery to him to so it could wreck the illusion too.http://divaliciouzbookreviews.blogspo...
Frankly, Lupin always struck me as an allegory for homosexuality, from the very first reading. Dumbledore has always, and will always, read as asexual to me.
Dumbledore being gay for me adds a new level to the relationship between Grindelwald.
Aaron wrote: "Frankly, Lupin always struck me as an allegory for homosexuality, from the very first reading. Dumbledore has always, and will always, read as asexual to me."Yeah I always saw that as well, I suppose just because he married a woman and was actually heterosexual doesn't mean he's not still an allegory.
Meanwhile Dumbledore is definitely a-sexual when I'm reading the books but now that I'm a little older, I can maturely accept sexual relationships at their base value and it's no longer a potentially icky novelty to me. Ex: I know my parents do it, and I'm glad because that's a healthy marriage, I obviously don't think about it but it's stupid when people make such a big squirmy deal out of one of the only things mankind has been doing since day one.
On my first reading of DH, however, I did read a bit of a different relationship between Dumbledore and Gindlewald and was not remotely surprised when Rowling made the anouncement, I WAS actually pretty surprised at how many people were shocked by it. Mostly, I was very pleased that she had characterized Dumbledore as such and never felt the need to stuff it into the storyline where it had no reason to be.
Afterall, Dumbledore is a good and complex person who happens to be gay, not a gay person who happens to be good and complex.
Very eloquently said. Took the words right out of my mouth, and then some.
I like what Samantha wrote too!
I don't want to even think about .... it wasn't mentioned okay( in the book ) so I chose to ignore it too sorry :)
Levi wrote: "he was in love with snape"He was definitely not in love with Snape. He was in love with Grindelwald.
Samantha wrote: "Aaron wrote: "Frankly, Lupin always struck me as an allegory for homosexuality, from the very first reading. Dumbledore has always, and will always, read as asexual to me."Yeah I always saw that..."
I completley agree. Well said.
Noooo... Dumbledore's gay??? Really...
thanks for correcting the spelling.and those who don't like this discussion,they can choose to ignore it.but thanks for commenting anyway
I don't care if anyone says that it's "not canon" just because you couldn't read it in the books: J.K. Rowling created the character so what she says is valid. Dumbledore is homosexual. There you have it. After all, if I told you that one of my characters is this and that without writing about it you would have to take it for valid too because I created that character. Duh.The only thing that disturbed me was the reception and all the stupid quarrel of it being "canon" or not. Strictly speaking, you can't change a damn thing about it that Rowling said it.
It changes absolutely nothing....No actually, Now I imagine that Dumbledore wore the highest quality Robes and had the best furnished Headmasters room of all time...
Oh and when he looked into the Mirror of Erised he saw himself in front of a smorgasbord...
I assume that’s the level of reply expected in this futile thread.
This discussion topic should be
deleted
because its stupid and a little offensive to those who are gay/lesbians. There weren't any consequences caused by Doumbledore being gay. His sexuality didn't affect the outcome of the story or hurt any character physically or mentally. Just cause someone's gay/lesbian doesn't change the type of person they are or makes them any different then those who are not. Love is love. They aren't hurting anybody by being the way they are. They aren't being treaty any different then a straight person would be treaty. If you don't like someone because of their sexuality perference, that doesn't mean that you can harrassed them or talk shit about them. It's their
choice
who to love. If they don't hit on you, then you have no right to say anything to them. Like I said before, they aren't hurting the economy or causing global warming so why not let them be happy or love who they wanna love. Why does there have to be laws preventing them from love?Why are there so many stupid laws that only cause hurt and cause they economy to drop?Seriously, the Admistrator of this discussions should really DELETE this topic. Its offensive to gays/lesbians. I have friends who are gay/lesbians and i don't let anybody say shit to them and I'm not gonna stand for this!
Rather or not Dumbledore is gay or straight, has nothing to do with the man he was. I loved Dumbledore so much, I wish I had a Dumbledore in my life. What an amazing man. I thought it was a cool tidbit ,my hero J.K. Rowling, added about him. Its great to have such a strong, needed, brilliant, powerful character be gay, like I'm sure many of Harry fans are. Everyone should have a beloved character to look up too.
Lauren wrote: "Noooo... Dumbledore's gay??? Really..."
I agree. I never knew that!
I agree. I never knew that!
Samantha wrote: "Aaron wrote: "Frankly, Lupin always struck me as an allegory for homosexuality, from the very first reading. Dumbledore has always, and will always, read as asexual to me."Yeah I always saw that..."
I like your response.
Thanks Raisa and the others who liked my comment :)But to the few negative posters up there:
Sooo I don't really see how the original post is offensive. I mean, I can see how it seems like it at first but the OP said she had a perception for the whole book and when she found out she was wrong she was shocked - not upset because she hates gays, just upset that her perception had to be changed. ANY situation could work here and it would be fine, just because she is admitting surprise she's not being hateful. If, after reading a book, you suddenly found out a character you'd read as a boy was actually a girl, wouldn't you be shocked? Would that make you sexist?
MAYBE she could be a little more aware or accepting but for all the people who are crying "Prejudice! Bigotry!" don't you think that maybe you're insulting the community you're defending by suggesting a young girl on a message board weilds enough power to offend them so badly by simply admitting surprise?
While we're on the "they're people" topic why don't you remember that they're also not paper flowers in a rainstorm. Also, Margarita, do you defend your homosexual friends by talking about their choice to be gay? "It's their choice who to love." I've only ever heard that argument from the other side...
And no, I don't think this topic should be deleted on goodreads, though I disagree about it being offensive even if I agreed I wouldn't think it should be deleted. It's not blatant hatred, spammy or even off topic. If you want to think it's a dumb question or rude that's fine but it's a topic the OP found interesting enough to post so it's an apt enough discussion.
Jace wrote: "sorry, but how did u guys not know that???"
JK Rowling said he was at a book tour event.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7053982.stm
JK Rowling said he was at a book tour event.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7053982.stm
Pigletto wrote: "Jace wrote: "sorry, but how did u guys not know that???"JK Rowling said he was at a book tour event.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7053982.stm"
Think you misread that.
I wasn't surprised when I read this and was really happy that it was never exclusively addressed in the novels. It's annoying when a gay character gets all the attention as THE GAY CHARACTER, just because they're gay. In the end, Dumbledore is still a great Wizard, headmaster, and mentor to Harry, no matter what his sexual orientation or preference.
Finding out that Dumbledore was gay was just another background tidbit of the character, it gave him added depth but it didn't affect the story at all. This series was The Harry Potter series, not The Albus Dumbledore series. Also, to those who find this thread offensive, I have yet to see an offensive comment. This is a discussion, no one is throwing haterade around, no one is bashing, it's just one person asking others their opinions.
I read Dumbledore as asexual, as well. Which, come to think of it, should be preferable--no matter his orientation--since he is the headmaster of a school for children.
It doesn't matter to me whether Dumbledore was gay or not. I consider the text of the books to be authoritative, rather than what the author says outside of the books. There have been other books (I won't mention them so as not to derail the thread) where I've disagreed with an author's interpretation because I just couldn't see any indication of that in the text. I'm not arguing against Dumbledore being gay. I'll accept that he was. It's just so inconsequential. If it mattered a bit, put it in the books.Sure, I understand that people really would have been up in arms over the books if she had put that in. But simply being told that he was gay doesn't impact the story or what I think of the character, it is pretty inconsequential. It's like she's saying "In part of the story that you didn't get to read, you find out he's gay". Give me that part of the story. Go ahead and write a Harry Potter prequel that deals with the relationships of a young Dumbledore. I will not object to another Harry Potter book. But simply being told he's gay just makes me shrug. It's like being told that he collects stamps.
What I think is very important to the conversation is the idea that his sexuality is not mentioned in the books, yet he is homosexual as described by the author, who, after all, knows her characters far better than any of us commenting here.What we can learn from this is simply that his sexual preference doesn't matter, and moreover shouldn't matter to the rest of us, since it's his private life. This lesson can and should be applied to our lives here in the real world.
I always hoped that in last part he would marry McGonnagall and live as long as Nicholas Flamel does, but.. Ech, as you can see, you can't always get what you want.Anyway, the idea of Dumbledore being gay wasn't completly surprising for me. There was something with him.. and his ''hand-made'' magazines ;)
I'm not disappointed. He's just like he's.
Robert wrote: "It doesn't matter to me whether Dumbledore was gay or not. I consider the text of the books to be authoritative, rather than what the author says outside of the books. There have been other books (..."Precisely, she didn't try to force it on us after HP was finished, somewhere down the road she just stated her opinion of what she believed she included in the subtext. If people read it there, great, if not, the book is still their own to enjoy.
An author I'm quite fond of (Kristen Cashore) has strong opinions on this actualy and refuses to answer questions about the subtext of her books. She left a homosexual relationship entirely in subtext of her first one and only confirmed it in a much later (and not originally planned) installment.
Who cares if Dumbledore is gay? It doesn't give or take away from the story. Why do we have to make a big deal about this?
I refuse to believe that. If so, that would very well ruin the story for me. It's a children's book, there is no need to be political or down right inappropriate with it.
Levi wrote: "he was in love with snape"No, he was in love with Grindelwald in his youth before the Ariana scene.
NO HE WAS NOT GAY, THE STORY IS NOT RUINED, STOP PERPETUATING THIS LIE!
Faith wrote: "Are you crazy , the poster above me?"Crazy about keeping the series wholesome and good, yes.
A what if he's gay? It isn't ruining the story! We're living in 21st century. No one has to hide in wardrobe.
Not wanting to sound prejudiced, but Dumbledore did dressed fabulously.Ok, serious now. The fact that Dumbledore was gay was only relevant to explain his relationship with Grindelwald and that's why Rowling thought it was important to tell us about it. I think she said Dumbledore was in love with him.
Faith I'm fairly certain that this Dakota person is trolling. She's really exagerrating her words and didn't try to make her case at all. She's making grand sweeping statements with absolutely no context in a discussion that is positively teeming with acceptance.A person who legitimately believed homosexualism was blasphemy would probably not bother with this topic or at least come better armed to cleanse our souls. They would have seen how the op was chewed out when she wasn't even really being homophobic and realized how silly it'd be to just drop by and start saying these things unless it was specifically to get a rise out of us.
But on that topic Dakota, Achilles was in love with his male cousin. Da Vinci and Michaelangelo were both gay. Oscar Wilde and Walt Whitman and Cyrano De Bergerac... http://www.lambda.org/famous.htm
Levi wrote: "he was in love with snape"He was in love with grindewald (sp?)
If you have pottermore you'd find that Mcgonnagal was engaged to a man earlier... :)
If you have pottermore you'd find that Mcgonnagal was engaged to a man earlier... :)
Honestly I dont care If he is Straight or Gay..I love Dumbledore anyway.
@ Dakota Crazy about keeping the series wholesome and good, yes."
Don't get me wrong I am not going to trash this book and say it is inappropriate. However, I would never use the words "wholesome and good" to describe it either.It deals with murder, black magic, genocide. Comparatively a gay celibate character is rather wholesome.
As to the original posters comment. I can see where if something altered your take on the story then you would be surprised. That is why sometimes it is a shame when author's start to reveal too much and start to take away our interpretations.
Like many others though I read him as an asexual character. Never really thought about it. Since he was an old bachelor it didn't hardly matter. It would be like Rowling coming out to say "by the way McGonogall was straight." Since she had no romantic story in the books it doesn't really pertain.
Margarita wrote: "This discussion topic should be deleted
because its stupid and a little offensive to those who are gay/lesbians. There weren't any consequences caused by Doumbledore being gay. His sexuality di..."
I don't think that is the OP intent. From reading their comment I think they are just curious about how it changes the story. Their choice of the word consequence was perhaps not the best word, however, I don't think she is trying to be prejudice or malicious.
Gretchen wrote: " It would be like Rowling coming out to say "by the way McGonogall was straight." Since she had no romantic story in the books it doesn't really pertain.Which makes this topic so interesting--it doesn't pertain to either character, yet one's sexuality has "consequences" while the other's doesn't.
When neither's sexual orientation has consequences, we'll probably be doing better as a species.
Wow I did not know this!!! I love that she (Rowling) didn't make it a big issue in any of her books, because in reality it shouldn't be an issue at all.
Harry loved Dumbledore because he was a fantastic teacher and the closest thing to a parent to him. It is irrelevant what his sexual identity was.
I am just happy to find that J.K. Rowling is so relaxed about it :) Kudos to her
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now its your turn to comment please.you can create your own version of student teacher interaction based on that fact if you want....