Heart of the Matter
discussion
What do you think was the main problem the couple had in their marriage (besides the infidelity)?
I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, seriously???
Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, seriously???"yup!
Elena wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, seriously???"yup!"
The thing I find most disturbing is that Nick saw first hand what Tessa went through with her parents, and her fathers infidelities. I mean, where was his brain?
He knew her parents were never in the same room together or had contact. I think that is what did him in…in the sense while they were separated he was SOOOO scared of that happening, as he DID love Tessa. But what a POS. Nothing is worse than being without the one you love, and realizing that the person you love most, you have hurt.
Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, seriously???"
I have been thinking about your comment about us not knowing Nick's thoughts during the affair. Unfortunately we will never know. We are left to our own devices here.
One thing I find hard to think about is that 10 days between the time Tessa came home from New York and when Nick met with Valerie in the restaurant on Dec. 15th to break off their relationship.
(I have no idea why I have such a strong reaction to this book. Nothing like this has ever happened to me before and I've read a LOT of books. I see mention of the same thing in other reviews where women are confused by their strong feelings about this story. I have such pity for Tessa and such a strong dislike of Valerie even though I know they are fictional characters.)
During those 10 days Tessa is convinced that Nick loves Valerie. I believe that Nick THOUGHT he loved Valerie and (in my opinion) he really did contemplate leaving Tessa. One thing that clinches that for me is when Tessa describes the mournful way Nick puts the kids to bed at night as if he is imagining what it would be like being separated from them.
He might have spent longer trying to decide but he had no choice in the timing because Charlie had an appointment with Nick the following week. During that time Nick referred Charlie to another Dr. I absolutely believe that Nick thought he loved Valerie but he decided to stay with his children in the end.
If EG were to write a sequel to this book I really do think that Nicks thoughts during those 10 days would be that he wanted to go with Valerie.
HOWEVER!!! - As soon as Tessa threw him out - (and I believe almost instantly) - he KNEW that he loved Tessa and was in shock that he might actually lose her. From that moment on I don't think that Nick would be able to even think about Valerie and Charlie much any more.
If we were to hear his thoughts through the 2 months he and Tessa were separated I believe that they would be that he would do ANYTHING to get Tessa back.
We've rehashed this time period over so many times and again I repeat that if Nick loved Valerie he would have gone back to her during this time frame. He could have divorced Tessa, had Ruby and Frankie half of the time and because of the type of work he did he was separated from them a lot of the time anyways. He would have to "make time" for his children during his part time custody of them so he might actually see MORE of them than he had done before.
BUT HE DIDN'T GO BACK TO VALERIE!!!
I believe that his thoughts would be so consumed with regret and shame that this whole thing had happened that all he would want to do was go home to his family and prove to all three of them how much he loved them.
I have been thinking about your comment about us not knowing Nick's thoughts during the affair. Unfortunately we will never know. We are left to our own devices here.
One thing I find hard to think about is that 10 days between the time Tessa came home from New York and when Nick met with Valerie in the restaurant on Dec. 15th to break off their relationship.
(I have no idea why I have such a strong reaction to this book. Nothing like this has ever happened to me before and I've read a LOT of books. I see mention of the same thing in other reviews where women are confused by their strong feelings about this story. I have such pity for Tessa and such a strong dislike of Valerie even though I know they are fictional characters.)
During those 10 days Tessa is convinced that Nick loves Valerie. I believe that Nick THOUGHT he loved Valerie and (in my opinion) he really did contemplate leaving Tessa. One thing that clinches that for me is when Tessa describes the mournful way Nick puts the kids to bed at night as if he is imagining what it would be like being separated from them.
He might have spent longer trying to decide but he had no choice in the timing because Charlie had an appointment with Nick the following week. During that time Nick referred Charlie to another Dr. I absolutely believe that Nick thought he loved Valerie but he decided to stay with his children in the end.
If EG were to write a sequel to this book I really do think that Nicks thoughts during those 10 days would be that he wanted to go with Valerie.
HOWEVER!!! - As soon as Tessa threw him out - (and I believe almost instantly) - he KNEW that he loved Tessa and was in shock that he might actually lose her. From that moment on I don't think that Nick would be able to even think about Valerie and Charlie much any more.
If we were to hear his thoughts through the 2 months he and Tessa were separated I believe that they would be that he would do ANYTHING to get Tessa back.
We've rehashed this time period over so many times and again I repeat that if Nick loved Valerie he would have gone back to her during this time frame. He could have divorced Tessa, had Ruby and Frankie half of the time and because of the type of work he did he was separated from them a lot of the time anyways. He would have to "make time" for his children during his part time custody of them so he might actually see MORE of them than he had done before.
BUT HE DIDN'T GO BACK TO VALERIE!!!
I believe that his thoughts would be so consumed with regret and shame that this whole thing had happened that all he would want to do was go home to his family and prove to all three of them how much he loved them.
Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, seriously???"I have been thinking about ..."
I agree Linda, I have never had such a strong reaction to the book, and I think I blame the lack of Nick perspective and the open ended ending. My heart broke for Tessa, and I HATED Valerie. I found her to evil. I just did, the way she allowed Nick to ignore his own family disgusted me.
I agree that during those 10 days, Nick did THINK he loved Valerie, but he loved his family more. However, the moment he looked into Tessa’s eyes, game over. He could have cared less about Valerie; he was on the verge of losing everything that mattered to him. When he and Tessa are having that final conversation, he says he HATES himself for letting it happen. I believe, he was also indirectly stating his feeling towards Valerie in that moment; he wasn’t too fond of her in the end. What do you guys think?
I also believe that during the separation Nick would have waited as long as it took to get Tessa back. I see some people speculating that if Tessa hadn’t taken him back, he would have gone back to Valerie. I don’t believe that for a second, he was done with her and loved Tessa. His love for Tessa, for me, was obvious (some people debate he went back to her out of obligation, I SO disagree with that). It is actions that have always bothered me.
Nick didn’t seem like an evil man, such a selfish one. His thoughts and feeling during that 2-month period would have helped the reader greatly. I agree with you, he was filled with shame and remorse. Imagine how he must have felt, the moment he looked into Tessa’s eyes and REALIZED he caused his wife that pain and that is what kills me. Sad stuff.
Maybe I struggle with the fact, that I believe Tessa deserved someone better for her. Someone who put her first and loved her unconditionally. I hate how neglected she was.
One more thing, those 10 days greatly bother me as well. I was like, WTH is going on with Nick. Man up!To me, that it took him 10 days to realize he wanted his family, is also a huge betrayal. I mean, how do you rebuild a marriage when you realize your husband had an affair and also considered leaving you?
Sarah wrote: "One more thing, those 10 days greatly bother me as well. I was like, WTH is going on with Nick. Man up!To me, that it took him 10 days to realize he wanted his family, is also a huge betrayal. I ..."
Those 10 days have always bothered me…and only add to my anguish for Tessa. I feel she was so misunderstood and mistreated by Nick, I just hate what happened to her. As I have said numerous times, Nick did love Tessa, that isn't the problem I have with this book. I don't believe he loved Valerie, he only THOUGHT he did, which you all have pointed out as well. But Tessa now has a husband who not only cheated on her and her kids, but was contemplating leaving her? Makes me sick!
Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, seriously???"
I have been t..."
I'm not sure that Nick could ever hate Valerie. What I really believe is that she and Charlie would be in his thoughts for quite a while BUT those thoughts wouldn't have been about love, they would have been of shame and sadness for what he had done to them (although Valerie was almost as much to blame as Nick was). He admitted to Tess (when they were together in the last scene) that he had to admit that he feels sadness for that little boy and for any harm he could have caused a child. After all he was a Doctor and his job was to help children not harm them. Remember that Charlie was the innocent victim in all of this. He never hurt anyone.
I agree that Nick was not an evil man. Far from it. There were lots of complications and mistakes leading up to this affair and they were not all Nicks fault.
No one has really delved into the fact that EG deliberately made the length of their marriage "SEVEN YEARS". There are a lot of jokes about the "SEVEN YEAR ITCH", and I really do think they have some merit. Men (and women to a lesser degree) do go through a stage of unrest (usually in their very early 40's) when they find themselves getting older and yet they don't feel older. They think that by shaking things up a bit they can recall some of their youth (or something??) I never really figured it out. To be truthful I personally know of 2 or 3 acquaintances that had this happen to them or caused it to others.
I wonder if this is where male menopause comes in? L0L
As I have mentioned before - Nick was a very proud man. I think he probably thought he was above this kind of crude behaviour and will always feel humiliated by what he had done.
I have been t..."
I'm not sure that Nick could ever hate Valerie. What I really believe is that she and Charlie would be in his thoughts for quite a while BUT those thoughts wouldn't have been about love, they would have been of shame and sadness for what he had done to them (although Valerie was almost as much to blame as Nick was). He admitted to Tess (when they were together in the last scene) that he had to admit that he feels sadness for that little boy and for any harm he could have caused a child. After all he was a Doctor and his job was to help children not harm them. Remember that Charlie was the innocent victim in all of this. He never hurt anyone.
I agree that Nick was not an evil man. Far from it. There were lots of complications and mistakes leading up to this affair and they were not all Nicks fault.
No one has really delved into the fact that EG deliberately made the length of their marriage "SEVEN YEARS". There are a lot of jokes about the "SEVEN YEAR ITCH", and I really do think they have some merit. Men (and women to a lesser degree) do go through a stage of unrest (usually in their very early 40's) when they find themselves getting older and yet they don't feel older. They think that by shaking things up a bit they can recall some of their youth (or something??) I never really figured it out. To be truthful I personally know of 2 or 3 acquaintances that had this happen to them or caused it to others.
I wonder if this is where male menopause comes in? L0L
As I have mentioned before - Nick was a very proud man. I think he probably thought he was above this kind of crude behaviour and will always feel humiliated by what he had done.
Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, seriously???"..."
I disagree Linda, maybe Nick wouldn't hate Valerie, but I don't believe he respected her at all. She was a willing participant in breaking up his family.
nick seemed like he was having a mid life crisis, total seven year itch, no doubt about that.
nick totally would be humiliated by his behaviour, treating his family the way he did? Cringe worthy!
Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the affair. I mean, ..."I disagree, I don't believe Nick thought about Valerie in the end. Charlie, yes, but not Valerie.
Just to clarify, do you picture Nick while he was separated from his wife, kids, everything that he loved, even thinking about Valerie? I don't!
Tegan wrote: "Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking during the af..."
You two sure do give me a lot to think about! Just when I think I've pinned this thing down you bring up alternatives that make me question my original opinion.
You both disagree with me that Nick would think about Valerie at all and if he did it would be with dislike because she was part of a time he would desperately like to forget ever happened. I do agree.
I still don't think that Nick would ever hate Valerie. His biggest attraction to her in the first place was that she was so unhappy and he knows now that his actions will have make her even more unhappy (does that make any sense at all??)
Nick was a very proud, professional man. I believe that he was an excellent Doctor (at least I haven't read anything that would make me think otherwise). His reputation would be of foremost importance to him.
When he and Valerie were walking to the cafeteria in the hospital at the very beginning of the book Valerie noticed that the nurses were attracted to him. He was a very handsome man and would be used to women being interested in him. Until he met Valerie I doubt that he ever even considered becoming involved with another woman. I think he would believe himself to be ABOVE that kind of thing.
His feelings for Valerie after he dumped her would be of humiliation. He behaved very badly during that time. I have compared his actions to that of a infatuated teenager. The scene where he is talking on the phone to Valerie who is in Charlie's room - they continue to talk while Nick is walking towards Charlie's room until he comes into the room laughing. I feel embarrassed for him myself that such a professional man could behave in such a ridiculous manner.
Nick would be all consumed with what he had done to Tessa, Ruby and Freddie. He would be trying to put Valerie and Charlie from his mind because of his behaviour during the 7 weeks they were together. If he thought about them at all it would bring back all of the humiliation he feels and he would want to suppress any thoughts of them.
While this whole affair was going on - there is no mention in the book about hospital staff noticing what was happening. He spent so much time with them in Charlie's room (leaning on the windowsill while talking to her on Halloween for hours), How could the interns, nurses and all the other employees in the hospital not notice. Of course they did. He would know that as well and would be consumed with shame.
Nick would have a lot of work to do at the hospital to gain back their respect.
Nick would have a lot of work to do at home to gain back Tessa's respect.
You two sure do give me a lot to think about! Just when I think I've pinned this thing down you bring up alternatives that make me question my original opinion.
You both disagree with me that Nick would think about Valerie at all and if he did it would be with dislike because she was part of a time he would desperately like to forget ever happened. I do agree.
I still don't think that Nick would ever hate Valerie. His biggest attraction to her in the first place was that she was so unhappy and he knows now that his actions will have make her even more unhappy (does that make any sense at all??)
Nick was a very proud, professional man. I believe that he was an excellent Doctor (at least I haven't read anything that would make me think otherwise). His reputation would be of foremost importance to him.
When he and Valerie were walking to the cafeteria in the hospital at the very beginning of the book Valerie noticed that the nurses were attracted to him. He was a very handsome man and would be used to women being interested in him. Until he met Valerie I doubt that he ever even considered becoming involved with another woman. I think he would believe himself to be ABOVE that kind of thing.
His feelings for Valerie after he dumped her would be of humiliation. He behaved very badly during that time. I have compared his actions to that of a infatuated teenager. The scene where he is talking on the phone to Valerie who is in Charlie's room - they continue to talk while Nick is walking towards Charlie's room until he comes into the room laughing. I feel embarrassed for him myself that such a professional man could behave in such a ridiculous manner.
Nick would be all consumed with what he had done to Tessa, Ruby and Freddie. He would be trying to put Valerie and Charlie from his mind because of his behaviour during the 7 weeks they were together. If he thought about them at all it would bring back all of the humiliation he feels and he would want to suppress any thoughts of them.
While this whole affair was going on - there is no mention in the book about hospital staff noticing what was happening. He spent so much time with them in Charlie's room (leaning on the windowsill while talking to her on Halloween for hours), How could the interns, nurses and all the other employees in the hospital not notice. Of course they did. He would know that as well and would be consumed with shame.
Nick would have a lot of work to do at the hospital to gain back their respect.
Nick would have a lot of work to do at home to gain back Tessa's respect.
Linda wrote: "Tegan wrote: "Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "Linda wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over the book again last night, and I am truly bothered we have no idea what the heck Nick was thinking..."You raise some good points, and this is why Nick is such a mystery and the more we discuss this, the more I believe Tessa should have left him. His actions are/were beyond redemption in my opinion.
I so agree with you, on the humiliation aspect. I do believe he would be filled with that. His neglect of his children ( I mean, the children didn't even notice he wasn't living at home during the separation). I have always wondered about Nick and the children's interaction during the separation…I think it must have been awkward for him, to say the least.
I forsure think, the hospital must have caught on. He was lucky he didn't lose his license, I find this type of behaviour beyond disgusting, and professionally, it was INSANE.
This why I struggle with a HEA for Tessa and Nick, I don't know with his quick temper, would he be patient enough for Tessa to regain trust and respect. This would take YEARS.
I would like to add, I believe Nick and Valerie, brought out the worst in each other. Nick would forever resent Valerie.
What an interesting conversation about a wholly unsatisfying book! While I agree with many of the comments made above, I have a bit of a different take on Nick, his actions and motivations (I read this book a few years ago and my recollection of some of the specifics may be off. Also, I'm not condoning or agreeing with Nick. This is just my take for whatever that's worth!) I don't think Nick ever really contemplated leaving his family for Valerie. His comments during the "break up" indicate as much. Nick said that he thought if he "loved" Val, it would make what they were doing (seeing each other on the sly) alright and he could separate himself from men who have affairs for the wrong reason, but when Tessa came home from NY he realized that he couldn't do it (have an affair) without affecting everyone around him--his kids, Charlie and Tessa (as Val pointed out). He agrees that an affair would affect Tessa and says that while things aren't great between them and he doesn't know what the future holds, he respects Tessa and still cares deeply for her and unless he is ready to walk away from Tessa and the life they had built together, he couldn't continue an affair with Val because it's wrong and selfish. He says he looked at it from all different angles to figure out how he could continue to see Val, but not leave his family, and he concluded that he couldn't do it because it was just "wrong". During that conversation, Nick never says that he respects Val too much to keep her solely as his mistress, nor does he ever indicate that Val deserves more than an affair. I think he was pretty clear in this conversation that whatever love he felt for Val and Charlie, it wasn't enough for him to leave his family. In fact, he says that his feelings for Val were not even enough to allow him to continue the affair because his feelings for and commitment to Tessa and their kids were deeper. I think Val realized this on New Year's Eve when she says she wanted to text Nick to "remind him what he did". At that point, I think she was mad at Nick as much as she was hurt because she realized that he only wanted an affair. In my opinion, Nick spent the 10 days between Tessa's return from NY and the breakup trying to figure out how he could continue to see Val without losing his wife. Maybe this is reading too far between the lines? I think Nick got involved with Val for a number of reasons all of which have been discussed to death (mid-life crisis, martial boredom, the novelty of someone new, sympathy, God/hero/savior complex, confusion between his feelings for Charlie and his feelings for Val, wife who seemed to be more concerned with the kids,house and neighbors than with him, infatuation with this single mom raising this great kid while putting herself thru law school while his wife couldn't even work part time when she had him and a nanny to help out with the kids). I also think that he rationalized his behavior by thinking that Tessa didn't "want" or "need" him and by thinking that if he kept the affair a secret no one would get hurt. When Tessa returned from NY and questioned him (too vaguely in my opinion) about Val, he tried to make all of their martial problems Tessa's fault (again trying to justify his actions) but realized, when Tessa started to cry and when she told him that she still loved him, that Tessa did "want" and "need" him and that she loved him. At that point, I think he knew he wouldn't leave her. He ignored Val after that night and for 10 days, I think, he tried to figure out how he could continue the affair, concluded that he was just not that guy, found Charlie a new doc, and ended the affair. During that time, I'm sure he was thinking about the affair in more practical and less romantic ways--Charlie was going back to school--if Nick continued to go to Val's house, odds are Charlie would mention to his friends that Nick came over to play--eventually, that would get back to Tessa and his kids; both Charlie & Val would expect/want Nick to do things with them in public--they wouldn't be able to "hide" in Val's house forever--practically speaking, it would be almost impossible for Nick to keep an affair under wraps with a small child involved; what would happen if the hospital found out; what would happy if his mother found out!! Again, Nick respected and cared for Tessa too much to have her publicly humiliated and he was worried about his reputation, too. After ending it with Val, Nick could have just returned to business as usual in his marriage--sure, he knew that Tessa suspected that something was going on with Val, but the truth was not really out there and Nick did not have to confess. While many may think he confessed to soothe his guilty conscience, I like to believe that he confessed because he believed that was the only way to put his marriage on the path to healing. I don't think Nick hated Val. I think he truly was confused in the end as to how and why he got so deeply involved with her and that he was ashamed and sorry that he had. I'm sure he thought about her a lot in trying to figure out why he got involved and I'm sure he thought about how he felt when he was with her and how badly he felt when he hurt her. I don't think he would ignore or shun either Val or Charlie if he were to run in to them.
Maxwell03 wrote: "What an interesting conversation about a wholly unsatisfying book! While I agree with many of the comments made above, I have a bit of a different take on Nick, his actions and motivations (I read..."Great post Maxwell! I agree with about most things except how he felt about Valerie, I dont think he looked to kindly on her in the end (just my opinion). I do think he would be POLITE, but I mean really, could he really talk to Charlie and Valerie if he ran into them? That would only hurt Tessa more. Yes, Charlie was an innocent victim in all of this. I mean, when you look at Valerie and Tesss'a hurt in the whole process, Tessa is the more injured party. Yes, He may have felt bad about Valerie, but I do not believe he thought about Valerie at all. He was too focused on getting his life back, and seemed desperate to get Tessa back.
I just think can't even fathom Nick really focusing or even worrying about Valerie's hurt, when he hurt his OWN wife is such a horrible way.
I just thought, what if Nick ran into Charlie, with his OWN kids. I mean, talk about awkward. The more we discuss this book, the more I question how Tessa and Nick would move forward.
Tegan wrote: "I just thought, what if Nick ran into Charlie, with his OWN kids. I mean, talk about awkward. The more we discuss this book, the more I question how Tessa and Nick would move forward."I think people question this book and come back to it, time and time again, is just the overall sadness to it. People's heart break for what happens to Tessa, the injustice. Yes, people have affairs and reconcile. But this book did NOTHING to show the reader that Nick, really deserved a second chance. I believe that is why people struggle. We want Tessa to have a happy life, and we are left with so many questions unanswered
Tessa and Nick well NEVER be the same. They just won't. He betrayed her in the worse way a man who loved a woman can. Yes, Nick said they could try and make their relationship better, but I feel that may be unrealistic. Tessa has SO much to forgive.
But as we have said time and time, Nick really did learn a lesson, but was that enough to keep Tessa. I wish their had been an epilogue. All I want is for Tessa be to be happy…I never felt anything but disdain for Valerie. There was a reason she was friendless and alone, she was a bore and a sad woman. I never saw what Nick saw in her. But maybe this is what EG was trying to show us? Affairs rarely make sense!
Maxwell03 wrote: "What an interesting conversation about a wholly unsatisfying book! While I agree with many of the comments made above, I have a bit of a different take on Nick, his actions and motivations (I read..."
You make a great argument and really gave me a lot to think about. While I agree with you for the most part there are some things that I have interpreted differently. I agree that Nick wasn't a "bad guy". He made some dreadful mistakes but I still think that Tessa had a part in the state of their marriage as well.
I completely agree that when Nick started the affair with Valerie he had no intention of leaving Tessa. I don't think the thought entered his mind. It was an affair!! When Tessa returned from New York Nick had just slept with Valerie for the first time. He was so infatuated with her at that time that I believe he did contemplate leaving Tessa. He wasn't ready to leave Valerie so soon. He spent 10 days trying to decided what to do. We all know he decided to stay with Tessa. Nicks remorse when he met with Valerie in the restaurant to break up with her clearly shows his feelings for her. I still maintain though that what he felt for Valerie wasn't love but infatuation with a lot of pity thrown in. Valerie basked in self pity herself.
I absolutely agree with you that Nick didn't HAVE to tell Tessa about the affair. If he reverted to the old Nick - the one that Tessa had fallen in love with - I think she would have been willing to let the bad days go and concentrate on the future. BUT NICK DID TELL HER!! That to me shows that Nick truly is a fine person and how much he really did love Tessa. If he was going to make it work with Tessa he felt he HAD to confess to be able to start with a clean slate. The condition he was in when he told Tessa about the affair to me left no doubt that he loved Tessa dearly. Although she thought his tears were for Valerie I am sure they were for Tessa because of his shame for what he had done to his family and his fear that he might loose them.
One thing I strongly disagree with you about is when you say that Nick saw Valerie as this wonderful person who was raising this great kid and had worked her way through Harvard Law. (I agree that is what he thought - but disagree that Valerie was that kind of person).
First of all I don't think that Charlie was any different than most children - (he was 6 years old but was portrayed in the story as a child of about 9 or 10 years old). Ruby was a bit of a handful I agree (and she apparently was a clone of Nick) so Tessa can't be blamed for her personality but I believe that Frankie would grow up to be just as great a kid as Charlie was. I think that Tessa was a wonderful mother. She never ever neglected her children.
Tessa complained about working and caring for 2 kids (lets remember that Nicks job took him away from his family a great deal). Every mother complains about having to care for small children - it is often described as the toughest job there is. Tessa quit her job because she COULD. She had a husband who provided so well for them that she was able stay home. BUT - if she had to work out of the house and raise her children by herself I absolutely believe that she could have done it. In my opinion Tessa was a much stronger woman that Valerie could ever be.
Now back to Valerie. She was a para-legal with no outside financial assistance at all and yet she put herself through Harvard Law while raising a child. There is NO WAY that she could have done so!! Paralegals don't make huge salaries and she had to pay for day care for her son, housing for both of them plus all of the other expenses of daily life yet she was able to save thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars for a law degree. Nonsense....I think that EG slipped up a little here.
I really can't believe that if Nick were to run into Valerie and Charlie that things wouldn't be awkward. If he saw them in advance he would do everything he could to avoid them. In another review it was mentioned that maybe Nick and Tessa would move to New York. Nick had damaged his reputation at the hospital (no way could he have carried on with Valerie the way he did without being noticed). There would always be the fear of running into Valerie - they lived in the same general neighbourhood. Maybe if there is a sequel to this book these questions we have will be explained.
I've said this many times before that I do believe that Nick and Tessa will stay together (happily) - because they love each other.
You make a great argument and really gave me a lot to think about. While I agree with you for the most part there are some things that I have interpreted differently. I agree that Nick wasn't a "bad guy". He made some dreadful mistakes but I still think that Tessa had a part in the state of their marriage as well.
I completely agree that when Nick started the affair with Valerie he had no intention of leaving Tessa. I don't think the thought entered his mind. It was an affair!! When Tessa returned from New York Nick had just slept with Valerie for the first time. He was so infatuated with her at that time that I believe he did contemplate leaving Tessa. He wasn't ready to leave Valerie so soon. He spent 10 days trying to decided what to do. We all know he decided to stay with Tessa. Nicks remorse when he met with Valerie in the restaurant to break up with her clearly shows his feelings for her. I still maintain though that what he felt for Valerie wasn't love but infatuation with a lot of pity thrown in. Valerie basked in self pity herself.
I absolutely agree with you that Nick didn't HAVE to tell Tessa about the affair. If he reverted to the old Nick - the one that Tessa had fallen in love with - I think she would have been willing to let the bad days go and concentrate on the future. BUT NICK DID TELL HER!! That to me shows that Nick truly is a fine person and how much he really did love Tessa. If he was going to make it work with Tessa he felt he HAD to confess to be able to start with a clean slate. The condition he was in when he told Tessa about the affair to me left no doubt that he loved Tessa dearly. Although she thought his tears were for Valerie I am sure they were for Tessa because of his shame for what he had done to his family and his fear that he might loose them.
One thing I strongly disagree with you about is when you say that Nick saw Valerie as this wonderful person who was raising this great kid and had worked her way through Harvard Law. (I agree that is what he thought - but disagree that Valerie was that kind of person).
First of all I don't think that Charlie was any different than most children - (he was 6 years old but was portrayed in the story as a child of about 9 or 10 years old). Ruby was a bit of a handful I agree (and she apparently was a clone of Nick) so Tessa can't be blamed for her personality but I believe that Frankie would grow up to be just as great a kid as Charlie was. I think that Tessa was a wonderful mother. She never ever neglected her children.
Tessa complained about working and caring for 2 kids (lets remember that Nicks job took him away from his family a great deal). Every mother complains about having to care for small children - it is often described as the toughest job there is. Tessa quit her job because she COULD. She had a husband who provided so well for them that she was able stay home. BUT - if she had to work out of the house and raise her children by herself I absolutely believe that she could have done it. In my opinion Tessa was a much stronger woman that Valerie could ever be.
Now back to Valerie. She was a para-legal with no outside financial assistance at all and yet she put herself through Harvard Law while raising a child. There is NO WAY that she could have done so!! Paralegals don't make huge salaries and she had to pay for day care for her son, housing for both of them plus all of the other expenses of daily life yet she was able to save thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars for a law degree. Nonsense....I think that EG slipped up a little here.
I really can't believe that if Nick were to run into Valerie and Charlie that things wouldn't be awkward. If he saw them in advance he would do everything he could to avoid them. In another review it was mentioned that maybe Nick and Tessa would move to New York. Nick had damaged his reputation at the hospital (no way could he have carried on with Valerie the way he did without being noticed). There would always be the fear of running into Valerie - they lived in the same general neighbourhood. Maybe if there is a sequel to this book these questions we have will be explained.
I've said this many times before that I do believe that Nick and Tessa will stay together (happily) - because they love each other.
Linda wrote: "Maxwell03 wrote: "What an interesting conversation about a wholly unsatisfying book! While I agree with many of the comments made above, I have a bit of a different take on Nick, his actions and m..."Everyone has raised such good points.
I do believe Nick would avoid Valerie and Charlie, at this point, wouldn't he have to? By acknowledging them, he would only be causing his family more pain.
I think Tessa would be a brilliant single mom, as Linda pointed out. She would be able to take care of her family and support them. She was very strong, much stronger than Valerie. Valerie was weak.
Tessa is a great mom, she always took care of her children and put them first. Loved her. I think she is trying to forgive Nick, in large part, due to them.
The more we discuss this book, the more I hate Nick. I don't doubt Nick's love for Tessa (and I don't believe he loved Valerie, more infatuation), I just wish EG had given us a clue on WTH was up with him!
You guys have raised some excellent points, which have me question so muCh about this book.Nick, can I slap him? I know he's not real, but, I just want to!
I'm back at just feeling anguish for tessa, she was a great wife and mom, and got betrayed in the worst way. This book really makes you ponder the institution of marriage, and how a good marriage can so quickly fall apart.
Infidelity is heart breaking, in this book, it just shatters the reader.
The more I think about Nick and tessa, the more I question how their reconciliation plays out. Dex hates nick, Tessa's whole family knows about the affair, how do they move forward?
So many new comments! I don't know if I'll ever be able to get through them all. I've been away out of the country, and unfortunately have lost my kindle with all my notes and highlights. This feed moves so fast. So not too long ago I had posted about another book (The Affair by Collette Freedman) that I was trying to find out if any of you would be interested in reading, since it deals with an affair and has the perspective of all involved: wife, husband, mistress. I'd propose it to you all since so many of us were miserable because EG didn't include any POV perspectives for Nick and it continues to drive us nuts with all we don't know. I think we'd have great discussion potential if you guys were keen on the idea.
Stephanie wrote: "So many new comments! I don't know if I'll ever be able to get thought them all. I've been away out of the country, and unfortunately have lost my kindle with all my notes and highlights. This feed..."
Hi Stephanie, welcome back. Yes, I remember you mentioned the other book. I have had such a strange reaction to HOTM that I am still puzzling over it. I don't know if I can handle another book about infidelity or not. Did "The Affair" bother you as much as Giffin's book did?
Hi Stephanie, welcome back. Yes, I remember you mentioned the other book. I have had such a strange reaction to HOTM that I am still puzzling over it. I don't know if I can handle another book about infidelity or not. Did "The Affair" bother you as much as Giffin's book did?
Stephanie - I tried finding this book, but none of my city's library branches have it :( :( :(
Elena wrote: "Stephanie - I tried finding this book, but none of my city's library branches have it :( :( :("
I have a KOBO e-reader and they have it for sale for $12.98.
I also found it for sale on Amazon.com. The kindle edition is $9.25, paperback is $11.98
I have a KOBO e-reader and they have it for sale for $12.98.
I also found it for sale on Amazon.com. The kindle edition is $9.25, paperback is $11.98
Linda wrote: I have a KOBO e-reader and they have it for sale for $12.98.
I also found it for sale..."
Thanks Linda! But I dont think I will willingly pay for another frustrating book :))) lol, i'm so cheap
Hey Stephanie, I read that book but it didn't provide me with the emotional punch that HOTM left.
Linda wrote: "Stephanie wrote: "So many new comments! I don't know if I'll ever be able to get thought them all. I've been away out of the country, and unfortunately have lost my kindle with all my notes and hi..."Hey Linda,
Actually, "The Affair" is the book that kicked off my whole obsession with marriage affairs as the main theme in the book. Infidelity is such a hard limit for me and when I read the blurb, I was so intrigued that I decided to step out of my comfort zone and give it a try; and I am so pleased that I did! I really liked that book because everything wasn't so black and white and I felt it was a fair interpretation of what goes on in each of the minds of all those involved. There were some scenes that hurt me as a woman, sure, but I totally understand why it would, and why it even was something that happened. It was definitely less frustrating to experience than HOTM. I liked it because I simply had most of the information to make my own assumptions to validate my feelings.
I have my own Kindle/mobi copy that I would be happy to email anyone who is unable to get it from the library. Just send me a PM if you'd like me to.
Sarah wrote: "Hey Stephanie, I read that book but it didn't provide me with the emotional punch that HOTM left."What kind of emotional punch do you mean? The rage? The hope?...
I think HOTM was just so sad, and the affair(book), while heartbreaking, didn't gut me like HOTM.
Other books that deal with some of the HoTM themes (woe's of stay at home mom, marriage on the rocks, infidelity, loss of self...etc) that we discussed extensively here (though they also deal with other themes) and are less frustrating:Covet*
The Comfort of Lies*
Tear Stained Beaches*
The Husband's Secret*
Love the One You're With
Tear You Apart (this one is erotic drama?)
I would say that other EG title LTOYW frustrated me, but not as badly as HOTM. Same with Tear you apart. In fact that one is just very different.
The ones I starred were satisfying for me in how they ended.
Sarah wrote: "I think HOTM was just so sad, and the affair(book), while heartbreaking, didn't gut me like HOTM."Ahhh. You want to be gutted like a fish! My fellow self-mutilator. I love it! That's interesting. The Affair gutted me. Especially from Kathy's POV. I just couldn't imagine being in her shoes. But I suppose each book is different for every person.
I didn't like the follow up as much bc it included too many repetitious dialogue but I did like the developments; though, I am not sure how I felt about the end. Apparently, there is suppose to be one more written in the future.
Stephanie wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I think HOTM was just so sad, and the affair(book), while heartbreaking, didn't gut me like HOTM."Ahhh. You want to be gutted like a fish! My fellow self-mutilator. I love it! That'..."
Thanks for the book recommendations:) I read the comfort of lies a couple months ago, wow. So sad too.
Stephanie wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I think HOTM was just so sad, and the affair(book), while heartbreaking, didn't gut me like HOTM."
Ahhh. You want to be gutted like a fish! My fellow self-mutilator. I love it! That'..."
Hi: I finished "The Affair" by Collette Freedman. It wasn't my favourite book by a long shot. Couldn't get into it. It just didn't ring true to me.
I left my thoughts on the review page of The Affair, Collette Freedman, under Discuss This Book, Feelings About This Book - if you are interested.
Ahhh. You want to be gutted like a fish! My fellow self-mutilator. I love it! That'..."
Hi: I finished "The Affair" by Collette Freedman. It wasn't my favourite book by a long shot. Couldn't get into it. It just didn't ring true to me.
I left my thoughts on the review page of The Affair, Collette Freedman, under Discuss This Book, Feelings About This Book - if you are interested.
Hello friends. I left Goodreads for a short while and have returned with my name change. I am still thinking about this darn book (and have absolutely no idea why!)One question I have is if there is a sequel - what do you think Tessa and Nick will do to ensure their marriage is successful from this point on.
My first thought is that Tessa needs to return to work. She is not happy as things are and I think she shows the symptoms of depression. If she goes back to work she will be happier. The tiredness she seems to suffer from would improve if she feels better about herself.
As for NICK - What to do about NICK!! My suggestion would be - GROW UP!! The world does not owe you a perfect existence - there is no such thing. If you think there are problems in your marriage, talk to your wife and FIX THEM!! Don't go running after the first woman who stares lovingly into your eyes. The same problems you are experiencing with Tessa will occur in a new relationship as time goes on. Nothing is ever perfect. How could he not know that??
Any other thoughts?
Hey Linda,Nice to see you again. This book haunts many, myself included. I think it boils down to the fact, we are all anguished for Tessa. She was amazing, and was treated like dirt, by the person who was supposed to love her most.
I don't think Tessa has to return work, she just needed a supportful husband, something nick was not. He needed to emotionally and psychically make her feel safe, something I believe, he hadn't, in a long time.
Spot on about Nick. What an immature idiot. I believe he needed some serious therapy to work on himself. He was so blind to his own issues.
I think to make it work, they need to talk to one another, and be present. To me, the only shot they at reconciliation, was if nick stepped up big time and changed his ways. He seemed so cold and distant.
To Thart2002,I completely agree with your reply. It seems that the majority of women think they can "change" the man they are with. This rarely happens. As you say - men have affairs with women who are often less attractive than their wives. I think that is completely true in this story. Another statistic is that almost always - the man goes back to his wife in the end.
One redeeming thing about Nicks affair to me is that he rarely talked about Tessa to Valerie (I don't remembering him EVER talking about her) until the final night when they were together when Valerie asked him if he was happy. He replied, "I love my family but - no I'm not happy. Things aren't great at home with Tessa right now."
That is the first time Valerie ever heard Tessa's name. Prior to that (a few days earlier) Jason asked Valerie if Nick was separated from his wife - Valerie didn't know because he never talked about his and Tessa's relationship with Valerie.
One of the worst parts of an affair is the betrayal of the husband towards his wife. Nick didn't seem to do that. I guess we can chalk up a couple of "brownie points" for him in that regard (he needs all the help he can get.) He lied to Tessa and cheated on her which is unforgivable but he didn't discuss his marital problems with Valerie and I believe that to do that is about as low as a man can sink.
After Nick dumped Valerie he went home and told Tessa what he had done. I'm not sure if he needed to do that or not. I'm not sure that Tessa really wanted to hear the truth as she suspected it at that time. However I believe that if she and Nick didn't discuss everything then it would play on Tessa's mind and her imagination would run wild, so much so that in the end she would not be able to forgive him.
Sarah wrote: "Hey Linda,Nice to see you again. This book haunts many, myself included. I think it boils down to the fact, we are all anguished for Tessa. She was amazing, and was treated like dirt, by the pers..."
Thanks Sarah: It is a strange thing about the way this book makes us feel. I agree that it is mostly seeing what happened to Tessa that bothers us. She is a kind, loving woman and a great mother. She is intelligent and very well educated. She loves her husband and at the beginning of the book is sure that he loves her. How could something like this happen to such a woman? As far as I can see she never hurt anyone in her life and yet she is made to suffer to such an extent that we all feel sympathy for her. I think the bottom line is that if something like this could happen to Tessa it could happen to anyone. A frightening thought.
You mentioned that you didn't think that Tessa needed to go back to work but I still think it would make her feel better about herself. Her unhappiness seemed to start about the time she left her job. She worked hard to become a distinguished English Professor and it seems to me that she took a very impulsive step by leaving that position.
Nick seems to be the means to Tessa's happiness. I don't think that Tessa's happiness should have to come from her husband though. She is highly intelligent and if she has a life of her own - separate from Nicks - they will both be happier and have greater respect for each other.
Near the end of the story Tessa said: We owe it to each other to find individual happiness, even in a shared life. That is the only real way to grow together instead of apart.
I like that reference and believe it to be true. I also think that Nick received such a scare and felt such shame following what he did that he will do everything he can to revert back to the man that Tessa fell in love with. He learned a very, very hard lesson.
I think it boils down to WTH was nick thinking??? I mean, really? He gets into an affair with the weakest woman ever!! No one, and I mean no one, saw this attraction as 'real'. I think the reader is left with the question, do you walk out based on a mistake?? Do you try to fix it? Without Nick's POV, the reader is left anguished in thinking what really does happen to Tessa. Hence, all our heartbreak.
I skimmed over this book last night, and the feeling I was left with was just pure sadness. I was a huge believer in Nick, thinking he made a HORRIBLE mistake. I have changed my mind and I believe that is why the reader is left anguished. He was a jerk. Plain and simple. He did deserve to loose everything. The way he treated Tessa and the kids is disgusting. No amount of forgiveness or grovelling will suffice. The affair, the emotional aspect is the worst, in my opinion.I so wish Valerie and Nick had gotten together, freeing up Tessa to find her 'one true love'. It was obvious Valerie and Nick would have imploded, and Nick would have even been more anguished for what he had done.
Sarah wrote: "I skimmed over this book last night, and the feeling I was left with was just pure sadness. I was a huge believer in Nick, thinking he made a HORRIBLE mistake. I have changed my mind and I believe ..."I'm not sure I could ever wish that Nick and Valerie stayed together. It would be great to see their breakup and I agree with you that it would happen quickly but Tessa loved Nick and all I care about is her happiness.
Nick's behaviour was disgusting and he most certainly deserved to suffer much longer than he did but I still see a glimmer of hope in him. He made a terrible mistake and almost lost everything. Do you think that he would ever do it again? Personally I think that was a "one time" for him and he would never risk his family again. Hope I'm right. EG - please do a sequel so we can have some closure once and for all!!
While I think Tessa loved Nick, I think as Nick's action sunk in, she would have left him. I really do…to much damage had been done. If it had just been sex, I think yes, she could have forgiven him. It's the emotional aspect that is most disturbing, he basically abandoned his family for a period of time. No wonder Tessa was unhappy, she was left to mother on her own. Nick would have cared less.The thing is, I no longer see a glimmer of hope in Nick. I find that final conversation they had dreadful, he really didn't apologize enough in my opinion. I see Nick as someone who needs their ego stroked constantly, and the next woman who does this, I could see him in an affair. He has already shown he is capable of this type of behaviour.
Do I see a glimmer of hope in Nick? Yes, he made a horrible decision, however, I am beginning to think he COULD do this again. He clearly was ok having an affair with Valerie, heck, he even told her loved her. While Tessa took him back, he didn't LOSE his family. This is what I struggle with, I think he deserved to loose everything. That conversation when Tessa came back from NYC, and his final conversation with Valerie, make me question who he is. I hate that he got off with a slap on the wrist, he deserved much harsher treatment. I HATE how he treated his own children, i mean, come on, who does that? A man who is an ASS. Just my 2 cents. I think he is only capable of loving himself.
I so agree, that I wish Valerie and Nick had ended up together (for a period of time), once those rose coloured glasses were off and reality set it….
Hello ladiesMy thought on the current discussion:
"He was a jerk. Plain and simple. He did deserve to loose everything. The way he treated Tessa and the kids is disgusting." - Sarah
"That conversation when Tessa came back from NYC, and his final conversation with Valerie, make me question who he is." - Tegan
"Tessa needs to go back to work" - Linda
Those mirror my own sentiments. It is no secret just how much I did not like Nick and thought he didn't suffer enough for what he did, nor was a great guy I'm told he was suppose to be. HE was an arrogant ass.
I would have loved to see Nick go on ahead with Valerie and watch that ship sink worse than the Titanic. IT would be nothing less than they deserved.
"I would have loved to see Nick go on ahead with Valerie and watch that ship sink worse than the Titanic. IT would be nothing less than they deserved." Love this Stephanie...I could not agree with your more.I so wish we could have seen them get together and watch it implode...and Nick realize what an idiot he was and he lost the best thing that ever happened to him (Tessa).
I never understood what Nick saw in Valerie, I would have loved to have known what Nick really thought of her, after he was kicked out. I suspect, not too fondly. She was a willing participant in breaking up a family. While he thought he had deep feelings for her, it really was hero worship. What did he really think when all was said and done?
Stephanie wrote: "Hello ladiesMy thought on the current discussion:
"He was a jerk. Plain and simple. He did deserve to loose everything. The way he treated Tessa and the kids is disgusting." - Sarah
"That conver..."
This is a new angle to this story that we haven't explored before ---- WOULD LOVE TO SEE NICK AND VALERIE STAY TOGETHER SO WE COULD WATCH THEIR BREAKUP WHEN NICK REALIZED THAT HE DIDN'T WANT HER ---
I guess that makes us all look a little cruel but WHO CARES? I have such a dislike for Valerie that I hope she gets everything she deserves. There is no reason in the world for her to be so full of self pity. She had ONE bad break-up - with Lion. Does she think she is the only woman who has gone through rough times? Why couldn't she move on? How are we suppose to feel sorry for a woman who doesn't have a friend in the world because she is so afraid of being hurt and then jumps into bed with a married man?
I never could understand Nicks declaration of love for Valerie in the coffee shop during their break up. In a way it looks almost as if he COULDN'T have had deep feelings for her as what he was telling her seemed cruel and unnessesary. If he did love her as he proclaimed would he not have played his feelings for her down a little. I think it would have been kinder to simply tell her that he cared about her and wanted her to be happy but he couldn't be with her. Instead he proclaimed this great love for her - walked out of that coffee shop and went home and told Tessa what he had done.
There never seemed to be any clear reason why Nick was so attracted to Valerie in the first place. We hear about how he didn't want to be at home but were told nothing to indicate why! His home life looked pretty good to me. The problems between Nick and Tessa were all so trivial they could have been rectified if they had simply TALKED about them to each other.
I don't think there was any comparison between Tessa and Valerie. They were complete opposites. Tessa was outgoing, friendly, kind and beautiful. Valerie was pathetic, dowdy and weak. Nick could never have been happy with Valerie for long and I think even though he appeared to be so broken hearted over the break-up - he already knew that he didn't want Valerie.
Nick was a spoiled, conceited jack-ass! He didn't deserve Tessa. He should have been made to suffer much more than he did.
Linda wrote: "Stephanie wrote: "Hello ladiesMy thought on the current discussion:
"He was a jerk. Plain and simple. He did deserve to loose everything. The way he treated Tessa and the kids is disgusting." - ..."
Linda you raise an excellent point on when Nick told Valerie he loved her. I think you nailed it, It seemed so cruel what Nick was doing to her, and therefore, really didn't love her. If he really loved her, as you pointed out, wouldn't it have been kinder to let her down gently. I think this is another instance of Nick being selfish, he was trying to make Valerie feel good about them, while he was obviously lying. Didn't Valerie even indicate at the end, what they had wasn't 'real'.
Nick didn't deserve Tessa, in my opinion he deserved Valerie. She would have driven his crazy with her insecurities....
I find it fascinating how we were all so upset over this book...clearly this book brought out emotions in all of us.I keep asking myself why, why am I keep being drawn back to this book, and I think I finally have my answer...it's the lack of resolution. I hate how this book ended...I think we have all struggled with the ending. We wanted a HEA for Tessa, i think we know that maybe that wasn't in the cards for Tessa and Nick. Infidelity is horrible and shatters the foundation of a marriage. While couples attempt to rebuild, the marriage is never the same, no matter how hard people try.
That is what is so unsatisfying...Tessa now has live with a cheater and a cheater who had no reason to cheat. Maybe if we had gotten a clearer picture of Nick, the ending would have made more sense. I think I hated Nick for so many reasons, but to me, he was beyond redemption. Yes, this book is a perfect example of not knowing what you have until you lose it, but where in this book does EG show Nick as a good man? He didn't only make 'one' mistake, he made multiple.
I think a far more interesting book had we seen Tessa and Nick's reconciliation play out, just my 2 cents.
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Me too...I found Tessa's strengh to be a turning point in th story. I have seen people question if Tessa hadn't taken Nick back, would Nick have gone back to Valerie? To that I say no, and the ironic thing to me, had he, Valerie would have been ok with being 2nd best, she was such a weak woman. Nick hated weaknesses, and she was the worst link!