The Great Gatsby
discussion
worst book ever!
Between reading posts on goodreads and discussions with my Book Club, I'm developing a clearer understanding of why people despise books I love and why others love books I can't stomach. One dealbreaker for many people is the CHARACTERS - there has to be a character they identify with or love or even like. I think Golden Rose has noted that phenomenon well in response to Faith.
Other readers (and these are not mutually exclusive mind you) read for PLOT - it needs to keep them moving and interested (I fall into this category generally).
There's likely other reader types too - those who enjoy STYLE or PLAUSIBILITY (ie could it really happen).
That said - I'll repeat that I like Gatsby and it's mostly for STYLE - I too find the characters unredeemable. But for ME, that's not a dealbreaker :-)
Well, to respond to Golden Rose, the lack of likeable characters isn't a flaw so much as it can be a hindrance and there are more books with flawed characters that I like than that I don't. It IS real life. However, Fitzgerald never made me feel like it mattered what happened to the characters, like I should even care - this is one of the many flaws in this book for me. The strength is the beautiful writing but is that enough. Wouldn't we be better served reading 200+ pages of poetry than listening to a bunch of whining, self-pitying, lazy rich people? This book lives on because it's short and on the curriculum for a lot of schools but it's irrelevant today to most of them and only gives them a good reason to hate reading rather than seeing it as a portal into so much more. This is what's ultimately unforgiveable.
To respond to Kristal, I think that if you read the previous posts, you'll find that quite a few came to Gatsby on their own, including me, and found it overrated. Equally, a lot were assigned the book in high school and loved it. Like many books, I think it all depends on where your head's at when you read it. I may re-read it in the future but I just don't think it was one of his best, just his entrance into the commercial market as it existed at the time.
I think that if you go through reading it letting the text guide you, then you're going to get nothing out of it. You can't read it like a normal book, you have to read it constantly alert and looking and searching in the text and you will really get something phenominal out of it. everything in htis book is great.
I love this book, but I can understand what people don't like about it. I think there is a certain amount of appreciation if you weren't 'forced' to read it in high school. The language is undeniably some of the best in literature, but I think that may also be what turns people off about it. I have seen several postings complaining about the characters being 'boring' and self indulgent, but I believe that is part of Fitzgerald's point...the Ennui is purposeful. I say, if you read it when you were young and didn't like it like, read it again. If it just isn't your style, then there really isn't anything wrong with that. To say it is overrated doesn't really make sense...this isn't a Hannah Montanna movie we are talking about, its Fitzgerald. He's an icon and the novel is one of the most well known and appreciated...you can't just trash talk it like this isTMZ and make it not so...
I'm with Megan, this book is awesome! Just because you have to force yourself to have an ounce of respect for the corrupt characters, it must be realized that making morally imperfect characters is Fitzgerald's craft. Look at his other stuff, especially "Bernice Bobs Her Hair," an awesome short story of his. These characters reflect the materialistic, shallow, and whimsical people that Fitzgerald was disgusted with in his life and environment, so he mocked them in his writing.But, I admit, I am guilty of detesting a well-written book myself: Tess of the d'Ubervilles. Awful book (!), but its themes are timeless and the book itself is extremely well-written and extremely applicable to any AP free-response question.
In a way, it's all relative.
With you Laura-lou. What is the attraction? Rory
Oddly, I recently began re-reading this for an online book group - and immediately put it down! I too read this in high school (many years ago) and even did a report on F. Scott Fitzgerald, Zelda, and The Great Gatsby for the class. Now I'm not sure why ...
I was forced to read it in high school, and hated it. Couldn't relate to the characters at all.Then, for fun, I re-read it a few years ago...in my early 30s.
My advice to the people who read it as teenagers and didn't understand it: read it again. You need to have some adult life experiences under your belt in order to relate to the characters.
Do I think it's the best or worst book ever? No. But it made a lot more sense to me at age 30 than it did at age 15.
Boring with a capital B. Maybe I just did't get it. Mr. Jones read all of F. Scott Fitzgerald's books and he is still a cow.
Definitely one of the worst books. Why are books like these "classics"?
After closing this book I regretted that I hadn't gone out and weeded the flowerbed instead. It sucked all of my pleasantness out and put me in a bad mood. I could not care less about the style, the craft, the symbolism or anything else. If I close it and missed that part of my life, it's not for me.Hit and miss with some books, though, huh?
It is always interesting to read negative comments about a book or movie one loves. I realize there is a bit of hyperbole in suggesting "Gatsby" is the worst book of all time. Clearly it doesn't come close to meeting that standard. It is a depressing book about chasing dreams and never being satisfied--perhaps not a subject that resonates for high school readers--especially when the book is assigned. But the beauty of Fitzgerald's language and images shine through. I don't think there's a better word stylist in American letters than F. Scott Fitzgerald. There are plenty of books I read that others treasure but leave me cold. Yet, when one of these books finds a great following I never question the wisdom of the readers. If a book resonates for others but not for me, I figure they must know or feel something I don't (or can't) and I am jealous that I cannot enter their minds--at least for a moment.
All I'll say is Dr. Eckleburg's watching you!
Could any of the esteemed critics in this thread please account for their shoddy opinions with some credible argumentation and evidence?Or try this: sit down for a few hours, days, or weeks, and see if you can craft prose as poignant as can be found throughout The Great Gatsby.
I eagerly await your replies.
Ok...I loved reading this discussion. I think what ultimately is to be decided before you make a stand is "Why am I reading this book?"I read 'junk food mysteries' by the dozens. Sometimes I stick in a vampire or fantasy, just as I would add a Twinkie every once in a while to my Hostess Cupcakes.
However, I read about 20 other books a year, as well. These are the books that make you think and work. Not all mysteries don't make you work, but for the most part they are plot oriented and aren't complicated prose.
If I were to start a book like Gatsby in my junk food phase, I would probably put it down until I wanted to totally engage my brain.
If you read for a good story and characters you like, don't read too many classics...Miss Haversham is a witch, it's hard to feel all warm and fuzzy about Lady MacBeth, even to Kill a Mockingbird had some pretty dispicable characters.
I don't think great literature required characters you like. Maybe hating them is part of the process. Relating to them is another story. My son was assigned Street Car Named Desire and I was amazed. I thought the Glass Menagerie, about parents, children, expectations and disappointment...teenager stuff to be sure, would have been a better high school choice. HOWEVER, he loved Street Car!
I do agree with whoever said their teacher was good and it was hard to tell if they liked the book or just 'got it' because of the teacher.
Teachers can be the best thing that happened to a book or they can ruin one.
basically, yes. maybe "an american tragedy" was slightly worse given that it was about 500 pages longer, but yeah, this blew chunks. i haven't read it in about 15 years but i HATED it.
...I don't know about this idea that it depends on why you're reading the book. I feel that there have been plenty of times that despite not being in the mood for a particular book, I appreciated the value of it - or alternatively, was totally in the mood for something and even the epitome of what I thought I wanted wasn't necessarily satisfying....But The Great Gatsby just wasn't good. There is no situation in which it suddenly would have been. It wasn't the worst book ever written, because I've read plenty of books with bad prose and non-existant storylines - where you find yourself thinking, "How was this person published??" But I don't feel that way about The Great Gatsby. I understand why it was published. ... By comparison to worse works. But why people still read it... Enh.
"In my younger and more vulnerable years my father gave me some advice that I've been turning over in my mind ever since."'Whenever you feel like criticizing anyone," he told me, 'just remember that all people in this world haven't had the advantages that you've had.'"
I don't mean 'being in the mood for' is quite right. When you read the Great Gatsby you have to be willing to think beyond the words on the page. You have to be willing to invest time to mull over in your brain what these people are doing and why. You must be an active participant in the process.Not all books call for this, but the really great ones do.
Just my opinion.
One of my favourite novels. I have read it several times, and I will keep reading it until I die.
My brother certainly would agree with you. I may also. I haven't read it since my sophomore year - HATED it then. Rereading it now, and, um, not loving it.
I didn't realize till last night that apparently it's the "best-selling novel of the 20th century". Still trying to figure out why.
I hope it's not that terrible. We're about to read that in English.
I think it's worth a read, and there are things to learn from it...it's just that I feel like it doesn't deserve its reputation. The symbolism and Fitzgerald's use of language are quite good. The characters severely lack redeeming characteristics, so that makes it difficult to enjoy. However, I highly doubt "enjoyment" was his purpose in writing this book. If it helps, it's quite a short read!
I was assigned this book in high school (like many other people). Even though I was supposed to read it - I couldn't. I picked it up, read a few lines, and totally lost interest. I hated this book. I failed all the quizzes and assignments that were based on this book because I honestly couldn't make myself read it.
This book was uber boring and basically the worst book ever!!!
Everyone who thinks this was a bad book should not comment, becuase they are ignorant to what makes this book, and are far to lazy to try and figure out what makes this book. For those people who say it is terrible and boring, you should go back to reading your advanced in depth twilight series.
I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE!? I have felt so alone so long in my hatred of this book. I loathed Daisy so much and I had no idea why Gatsby was so desperate to get her back. I had no idea why anyone would care about these rich, annoying, worthless human beings. It was awful. Wait, I have one more: I don't like Led Zeppelin; I think Robert Plant's voice is grating. WHEW!! That felt good.
Definitely not the WORST book. Not a favorite of mine, but I've read MUCH MORE BORING books before.The Great Gatsby was beautifully-written, if there's nothing else good to say about it.
It`s a tiresome, overrated book by an author who was convinced there was something special about the rich. Yup, there is. They have gadzillions of bucharoos and get to play in the sun, play with other people`s hard earned money, or the money that should have gone to workers, and play loose with theirr morals, like Daisy. Who give a d---.?
LOL! Love it!!Geoffrey wrote: "It`s a tiresome, overrated book by an author who was convinced there was something special about the rich. Yup, there is. They have gadzillions of bucharoos and get to play in the sun, play with ot..."
I didn't find The Great Gatsby to be the worst book ever. Fitzgerald was a wordsmith and he did a great job of writing a novel full of very unlikeable, but real, characters. Gatsby was a gifted, handsome young man who hit his peak during WWI and it all down hill from there. From a misguided attempt to enter into Daisy's life, he became involved in criminal activities to get rich. But he knew he would never be accepted into her society or he would have just invited her over to his house to renew an old acquaintance. Instead, he waited for her to just drop in on a party.The book is a wonderful slice of the American upper class of the 1920's and worth reading just for that aspect of it.
I thought Fitzgerald did an excellent job of depicting shallow, self-absorbed people who have no redeeming qualities. That he would write a book about such people is amazing. John Updike did the same thing with his Rabbitt series.
As a writer, I think The Great Gatsby is one of the shining lights in American literature. I read it years ago when I was in my twenties and I thought it fabulous then: subtle, ironic, sparely written. I've forgotten the story now but I think it was something to do with the power of money, decadence and loss of values. Young
people should be proud of this book, seek to understand it, not to trash it.
people should be proud of this book, seek to understand it, not to trash it.
Malla wrote: "As a writer, I think The Great Gatsby is one of the shining lights in American literature. I read it years ago when I was in my twenties and I thought it fabulous then: subtle, ironic, sparely writ..." I agree. The book isn't to everyone's taste of course. No book is. But it does have somehting to offer. Substitute drugs for prohibition alcohol and a blackberry for the butler delivering messages and the story could be written today.
I could never say it so well. Thank you!Norman wrote: "To love The Great Gatsby, you need to appreciate Fitzgerald's craft. His use of language is amazing when you stop to consider all shades of meaning that his descriptions (especially of character) ..."
I totally agree that this book is probably the worst I have ever read. I have had to read this book roughly a half dozen times in school and it is the first and only paper I ever got an F on...after reading it for like the 5th time...totally bummed me out and have hated it since!!
I think it is one of those books that, if you go back to, actually makes more sense. Many high schoolers "forced" to read it will say the usual "boring" comments about it, but, behind some seemingly artificial characters, there is the idea of having a dream and believing in it, which is what Gatsby is all about. To say it is "the worst book ever" probably means you need to read more books :)
I found this book to be somewhat interesting. It most definitely wasn't the best book that I've ever read, but it wasn't the worst book.
This book was good in the sense of time and place. Tragic ending.
No, not the worst, but definitely divisive (as evident by this thread). I've read it twice at two different times in my life, and despised it both times. And before you can brush that aside by saying I wasn't paying close enough attention, I was. I'm a very careful and engaged reader, but I cannot stand Fitzgerald's writing style, his anvilicious symbolism, or his characters (and believe me, I like plenty of morally ambiguous--or worse--characters elsewhere). That's just my taste; I'm not wrong for it, just like you're not wrong if you happen to connect with the book.
I just finished reading this book for the 4th time. This is one of my all time favorite books and it seems everytime I read it I add more and more notes to the pages, which are already coverd in pen and highlighter. I think anyone who takes this book at face value will dislike it, but once you look for the deeper meaning and at the symbolism used throughout it becomes like a whole new book.
It amazes me that people will give a book 1 star because they don't like the characters. What about all the other great elements? If you're looking for a straightforward, fast-paced action book, why pick up The Great Gatsby at all? I think people who dislike this book just don't like literary fiction. I can't think why else anyone would hate this book. Sure, it's not Harry Potter or Twilight. It's not *supposed* to be.
Lena, I gave it three stars. Fitzgerald's writing can still be amazingly evocative. But the characters are all, without any exception than possibly Mr. Wilson, self-absorbed narcissists with no sense of values. That includes Nick, I'm afraid. I think the book represents very confused thinking from Fitzgerald and so it is deeply flawed -- not something that can be read with delight on any level. The best stuff, for me, was Nick's return to his Midwestern home at the end. There was real feeling there, and at least the hope that he might have learned something from his sojourn among the flotsam and jetsam of the Roaring '20s. But I wouldn't bet my house on his having learned much.
Laura-lou wrote: "does anyone agree with me that this is the worst and most boring book of all time?"It is ok if you only read it one time. In my Junior year of high school we spent a whole semester on this book. To this day I can quote it but I will never read it again and I tell everyone I meet to borrow it from the library because the second time you read it you realize just how awful it truly is.
I agree with Norman, but I read the book for an American lit course when I was in my 30s and I think the tutor (an American Fulbright Scholar) made all the difference. As Norman pointed out, it is rich in symbolism and defined an age where "The American Dream" of wealth wasn't enough without human relationsips as well. thus, Gatsby's pursuit of Daisy and Tom's relationship with the execrable Myrtle.As Fitzgerald said, "they were careless people, Tom and Daisy", referring to their complete lack of knowledge of how their society worked, and of th epeople who made it work, like truckdrivers driving thouhg the night so people could buy goods the next day.
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Now, I can't say that everybody felt that way, because obviously a lot of you were very clear about disliking them. But the point is, what you see as a flaw in this novel is what makes it such a brilliant piece of work, what makes it different from any other novel that exists today (or at least any other novel I have read).