Stephen King Fans discussion
As troublesome as that scene is - although I would rationalise it in the same way as Kathryn and Lan Lan - I don't think it takes too much away from what is one of King's best books. There is an overbearing sense of dread throughout the story. Something is definitely off in this small town, and King makes the atmosphere so dark that even once the survivors reach the end there is no real sense of victory.
I'm almost halfway through the book. This is my first read as an adult. the movie scared the crap out of me as a kid and made me terrified of clowns. Now I'm reading the book because I lost a bet and I'm finding myself really enjoying it. It didn't really scare me or make me feel too much dread until they all get together at the restaurant and start talking about what's been happening in Derry. I don't know... I don't get scared too much of the random monsters stuff, but now that it's emphasizing more of the eerie supernatural unexplainable stuff, I"m finding that much more intriguing. I'm hoping that THE SCENE at the end that everyone is talking about doesn't ruin the book for me. I'm still enjoying it. It's a really long book too. Can't believe I'm only halfway finished with it!
Matthewcross87 wrote: "ive just been reading through the 1 star comments of this book , and 90% of them say the same thing - this book is rubbish because its over a thousand pages . if its to long and you can see it is w..."I think the people who say it is overly long (I'm not one of them) have no objection to long book sin general, just feel this one could have been edited a bit.
Kandice wrote: "Matthewcross87 wrote: "ive just been reading through the 1 star comments of this book , and 90% of them say the same thing - this book is rubbish because its over a thousand pages . if its to long ..."I also think there is an element of some folk getting a kick from trashing a book that's widely regarded as a classic of its genre. They dish out one star and it stands out from the mainly glowing reviews, meaning more people read their drivel.
One of the things I have seen is Stephen King uses bits from one book to link it to another. Have you read the Dark Tower series there is a general link between the DT series and IT. First is Pennywise possibly being the Red King or one of his underlings and then the turtle "The turtle holds the world on his back" DT series. Can't remember which book but remember the quote because I thought it was so deep and insightful. or I'm just a bit strange LOL.
I first read this when I was 14-15, and re-reading it now at 27 was an experience. I couldn't believe how much I had forgotten or perhaps just not appreciated at the time. It's one of the best novels I've ever read. The characters are so amazing and you love them all so much, as kids and adults.-plotlines/details vaguely mentioned below but not anything I'd consider really spoilery-
Upon watching the miniseries this week once I finished the book, I was a little disappointed by how much was changed (though I still think it was brilliantly done, just would have been better if they had more than 3 hrs to fit everything in). For example- Richie Tozier. I haven't liked a character that much in a while. He reminded me of a cross of Eddie Dean from DT and Henry Leyden from Black House, but he also had his own unique traits.
I thought he was hilarious and recklessly brave and SO much better in the book. In the series they made him the scared adult willing to leave Derry to It and get out- which isn't true to Richie at all. And it also took out the house 29 Neibolt St out entirely and that they had to try a second time to fight It as kids. I don't think it was made clear at all how progressively insane child Henry Bowers became under the influence of It or that adults like Bev's father were under the influence of It. I thought those were some of the best and most terrifying things in the novel.
We got Richie and Bill in Georgie's room, but not the great scenes in the book like them in 29 Neibolt St and trying outrun It on Silver and then both of them needing to be in the Ritual of Chud as adults- and Richie in the ritual was amazing. He was so 'Eddie Dean against Blaine the Mono' crazy-brave-hilarious... I loved him so much there.
And I know something like the Ritual of Chud would have maybe been impossible to make happen visually and still make sense (or even not look semi-ridiculous), but I feel like it's a really important part of the book and it adds SO much to the story.
It' great that in the book you get to see how old It is and how much its a part of the town. It really is the town. The end of the movie vs. the end of the book is no contest.
Also, my favorite thing in the world is the tie-in of King confirming that It and Dandelo from DT are similar creatures. I love the entire concept of todash darkness and monsters in it and how different they all are from one another-the creatures in the Mist, and Tak from Desperation/Regulators. They're honestly the most brilliant monster ideas ever created.
and mrbooks, I also love seeing the turtle, everyone's favorite guardian of a beam. Here's the quote from Song of Susannah:"See the Turtle of Enormous Girth
On his shell he holds the Earth.
His thought is slow, but always kind.
He holds us all within his mind.
On his back all vows are made;
He sees the truth but mayn't aid.
He loves the land and loves the sea,
And even loves a child like me."
Copied from the King wiki page on Maturin the turtle here :).
Thanks Nicole I knew I read it but wasn't certain in which book. I also loved your comparison of the book and the mini series.
mrbooks wrote: "Thanks Nicole I knew I read it but wasn't certain in which book. I also loved your comparison of the book and the mini series."I'm glad you weren't bored, I was afraid I went on too long! It's just such a great book. I want to read over again right now, haha.
no not to long at all. I know what you mean by wanting to read it over again I get that way about most of his books.
Probably the best book I have ever read so far. I am 96% through the book and it is so beautifully written. Highly recommend it!
I was able to actually acquire a first printing hardcover of this book in great condition before the movie was announced and the IT-craze began! I personally put it in my list of favorite novels by any author. I understand the issue people have with THE SCENE at the end, but I am one of few (that I have seen anyway) that thought it an interesting and highly symbolic moment that had little to do with actual sex. (Was that a spoiler? I hope not. If so, ignore it). I am also among the few that don't believe it was even a single page too long. I loved every moment of it, and found myself sorry to see it end! The scene with the psycho kid and the refrigerator haunts me still!
Nicole wrote: "and mrbooks, I also love seeing the turtle, everyone's favorite guardian of a beam. Here's the quote from Song of Susannah:"See the Turtle of Enormous Girth
On his shell he holds the Earth.
His ..."
One of my favorite Dark Tower connections EVER! Especially to think how long before the DT series was resumed it was written. Was that phrasing confused? You get me though I think haha.
some of this book was not good to me. but the rest of it was
Tammie I am assuming you disliked the episode in the sewers?
Dustin wrote: "Nicole wrote: "and mrbooks, I also love seeing the turtle, everyone's favorite guardian of a beam. Here's the quote from Song of Susannah:"See the Turtle of Enormous Girth
On his shell he holds ..."
I get it, yes! Very neat connection.
Meag wrote: "Probably the best book I have ever read so far. I am 96% through the book and it is so beautifully written. Highly recommend it!"Glad you love it!! It blew me away. I've never finished a 1000+ page book and immediately wanted to flip back to page one and start over before. Such a good book.
My Bible. I'll defend IT until the end of days
Daniel wrote: "My Bible. I'll defend IT until the end of days"Agreed!
Here you are safe no one will attack IT in and serious way. There opinion may differ form ours but they understand our dedication to our books.
I LOVE 'IT' so very much, and it cemented
as my favorite author.One of the main reasons? King can write about CHILDHOOD so very well. His childhood tone/voice throughout *all* of his novels is fantastic, but it is *especially* well done in It which I discovered when I was about 12(?) or so-a GREAT age to read 'IT' for the 1st time, btw!-...At *that* age? Man, I was so *quickly* able to identify with all of these young characters, because of King's fantastic way of writing childhood...and its friendships and dialogue...and the WORLD of childhood, really...so very well.
*(Lately, he has done a great job of writing about childhood via children's POV in the awesome 1st piece found in The Bazaar of Bad Dreams...It was called Mile 81 , and it was also released as its own separate story online, before the The Bazaar of Bad Dreams collection was released.
Check it out if you can- I recommend it highly!)*
The 'film' version of IT is a completely separate entity. Please, please, please discard the TV mini-series from your mind, as the NOVEL is an entirely different ballgame- and a better one!
King creates an utterly believable world down in The Barrens of Derry, and that feel is *never* captured in the 'film' as well as it is in the novel ...Also, that sense of deep, childhood friendship in the mini-series feels/looks/seems forced and fake, whereas the novel *always* rings so true.
And that is just a *teeny tiny portion* of the components that the mini-series missed! THE NOVEL IS THE REAL DEAL! Sorry- hit a nerve there. I was the crazy kid at school pushing the book on you in the hallway when that shit was on TV back in the day...
--Jen from Quebec :0)
I think the mini series was great in its time and was well done and the characters well drawn. However it did miss crucial portions of the book and important characters such as Patrick. From what I have seen of the new film and read on its Facebook page, it will be much more comparative with the novel. The scene where Patrick is killed which is witnessed by Beverley is in there I believe as is more of a deeper relationship between Bev and Bill.Pennywise seems to be far more evil than Tim Curry's version. I felt he was a little too comical at times in the mini series but realise the threat he created in the book had to be toned down for a TV audience. The new film seems to be a lot lot darker and more emotionally raw. I cant wait till the end of August to see it but will never forget the quality of the mini series even though it was made for TV and in the early 90's.
Matthewcross87 wrote: "i think im going to have to wait when the second part of the movie comes out and watch it back to back . i cant watch half of it ant wait 3 years to see the second part"I want to watch the movie when it comes out and then when Part 2 comes out three years later, watch them back to back (if I am still around)
Steve,I agree that for its time the mini series was great. I did like Tim Curry in it. He certainly did a good job spreading fear of clowns! Watching the mini series was my first exposure to IT so I saw those characters in my mind when I read the book. I still keep seeing the young Bill when I read and liked both the young and adult Eddie. Of course it did not contain a lot of things in the book and as always, the book is better. As I am rereading it right now I cringe when the adult Bev is first introduced.
Your at a good spot this is where Bev comes into her own as they say. Lessons need to be re learned but not in the way he envisioned, who learned the lesson...
I'm actually beyond that point but I meant that as I have been rereading it this time around. (Re-reading this and The Stand
I see you like a challenge, two very large books at once. I am currently reading The Great North Road by Peter Hamilton about 1100 pages and the stand so I am no better off LOL.
I love that I am reading two King books. When I finish these I think I will read two at a time again. I am listening on audio to a "light" book while doing odds and ends and need to start Dean Koontz' The Husband for the Koontzlandia BOTM read.
Karen B. wrote: "I love that I am reading two King books. When I finish these I think I will read two at a time again. I am listening on audio to a "light" book while doing odds and ends and need to start Dean Koon..."I have had a falling out with Dean Koontz but I feel like he might deserve another chance. I am undecided. I do NOT want to get involved in a series, so the 'Odd' stuff is out, but yet I feel that may be the only worthwhile works of his to read lately...?
Begrudgingly, on further reflection, I must admit that yeah-the mini-series, was, actually, good-for what it was. (I went on a rant in my previous post, due to my passion for the novel, and the sadness I felt that the mini-series was preventing my friends at the time from ever reading the novel, as they now felt they KNEW the story. I maintain they do not.)
After all, the mini-series had to try to capture the impossible, really. How could a 'low budget-drama-movie-on-television-with a family-FCC-related-non-R-rating EVER have a chance to be what I needed/wanted it to be, you know? So, acknowledging its framework and forced limitations, it does do a good job. (Just not the AMAZING job I wanted it do!)
I actually have only watched the trailer for the new 'IT' film one time and that is it. I want to go in blind. Perhaps I should search it out again. --Jen from Quebec :0)
(PS) This is not to say that some of the OTHER King movie adaptations are not as amazing as their book counterparts! Some are *every bit* as great as their corresponding novel. --Jen from Quebec :0)
Jennifer Lynn wrote: "Karen B. wrote: "I love that I am reading two King books. When I finish these I think I will read two at a time again. I am listening on audio to a "light" book while doing odds and ends and need t..."Hi Jennifer. The last Odd Thomas book is worth reading. The ones in between are just filling in time and apace in my eyes.
I've actually just finished a re-read of 'It' in anticipation of the movie. It's actually fairly rare that I even do re-reads, especially ones of such large books, but I just couldn't help myself. And really, I'm glad I did since it's been long enough that I ended up enjoying it just as much as I did during my first read. I don't know what it is about King's writing style, but he can be writing about just about anything and end up captivating me. Which is slightly ironic since when I was younger I absolutely hated the way he wrote and refused to touch any of his books.Jennifer Lynn wrote: "Karen B. wrote: "I love that I am reading two King books. When I finish these I think I will read two at a time again. I am listening on audio to a "light" book while doing odds and ends and need t..."
I would recommend the Odd series if you're feeling like giving Koontz a second go. If it helps at all, the first book is fairly self-contained and could be read as a stand alone if you wanted to do it that way. It's not until later in the series when it becomes apparent that it's a series in terms of it's larger plot. With that said, at the end of it all it does become fairly repetitive, and the final book was sort of a let-down for me once it was finished. But I found each book at the very least enjoyable, and even with the let-down feeling of the final one it still wasn't 'terrible'.
Jennifer Lynn wrote: "Karen B. wrote: "I love that I am reading two King books. When I finish these I think I will read two at a time again. I am listening on audio to a "light" book while doing odds and ends and need t..."I have only seen the trailer once, and that is all I want to see it. I like you want to go in blind, let it surprise me. I say surprise because it wont scare me nothing does. I can name two movies adapted that met the criteria and the feel of Stephen Kings writing. They are The Green Mile and Rita Hayward and the Shawshank Redemption.
Just finished the audiobook read by Steven Weber. Hadn't read this one before. It was really good, though I found the final confrontation to be a bit unsatisfying. I also thought that(view spoiler)
Diane wrote: "Paul, have you ever read The Exorcist? Or pet Sematary? Those are the two which made me sleep with the lights on :) I agree IT is not one of those types of stories. But it does not diminish it's ..."
Pet Cemetery is the one book that freaked me out so much, I had to put it down for awhile. IT has some good thrills though. Though Henry Bowers was really the scariest one in the book!
mrbooks wrote: "Your at a good spot this is where Bev comes into her own as they say. Lessons need to be re learned but not in the way he envisioned, who learned the lesson..."I was listening to both at the same time (borrowing them from the library, so only getting each for two weeks at a time and rotating them when each was available). Finished IT and have about 14 hours left of The Stand. Can't believe I never ready either since I had seen the mini-series of each on TV and didn't think I needed to bother! So dumb.
We all make those kind of mistakes, but we do learn from them and have a tendency to do it all over again LOL.
Mod
I finished the book earlier this month and I'm so happy that it's finally off my TBR list. Really is a must read, not just for horror or Stephen King fans, but in general. Great story, well rounded characters and some really creepy scenes.
I'm finishing this up so I can watch the miniseries before the movie comes out. It's one of my favorites and every reread (especially with Steven Webber doing the audio) is heartbreaking and wonderful.ETA: Quick question. I know Tom (view spoiler). When did that happen?
Hello guys, I'm reading this wonderful book for the fifth time, but for the first time in english (not my language) and I'm finding it more beautiful than ever. I was wondering, especially for those of you who live in USA, if you can find book-related stuff, such as Derry maps or souvenirs or tour guide, Castle rock maps/guide...where I am there's no such things and I was just curious. :)
Just go to Google and Type Derry Maine Maps and you will get all kinds of results.
Maria wrote: "I love LONG books. I read The Stand-Uncut, then read IT. I read some shorter ones after that, like 'Salem's Lot, The Shining, Dr. Sleep, On Writing (which I LOVED!). I am now tackling the DT Seri..."
Hi Maria - A lover of long books myself, I was a little surprised at myself for just how many of my favorite books of King's were his longest ones. Do check out, if you haven't already: Duma Key, Bag of Bones, Insomnia, The Tommyknockers, and Desperation.
I haven't read through all (!!) the posts in this thread, so forgive me if this has been brought up already. I just found, today a map of Derry as it is depicted in It, and I'm excited to embark on a rereading of the book with this map in hand. I remember, in my initial reading(s) of the book, struggling to maintain some kind of coherent "cognitive map" of the world in which this wondrous novel takes place, and now I feel I don't need to struggle to do this as I read, and can focus more fully on the descriptions of characters and events, and the dialog. Even the descriptions of places, I feel, are potentially enhanced because I can focus on the details that "flesh out" those places and not have to worry about locations of places in relation to other places.I'm curious about how others feel with respect to this issue in general. Some people, I know, have a more "purist" attitude and feel that the author's descriptions should be enough, and the rest should be left to our original imaginations. While I agree with this attitude in the abstract, I believe that it needs to be "relaxed" in the case of spatial "mapworthy" information, where there actually is a "right" and a "wrong" way to imagine things being depicted and described.
Anyway, if it were me, I would like to have had a copy of the book It that had this map, or something like it, enclosed.
Jerry it is up to you how you read the book if you are happy to have a map to hand to make a visual reference to the book then go for it. There is no right way and only one wrong way to read the book. The wrong way is not to read the book.
Jerry wrote: "I haven't read through all (!!) the posts in this thread, so forgive me if this has been brought up already. I just found, today a map of Derry as it is depicted in It, and I'm excited to embark on..."I'm a fan of maps, family trees, or any other supporting information. I think of reading as engaging with a book (almost like having a conversation) rather than passively consuming words, and it's the back and forth (highlighting, taking notes, using supporting information) that makes it fun.
As another King-related example, there are a few great maps out there for the DT universe. Those helped so much with understanding the geography and characters' movements, and I'd have lost some richness if I hadn't referred to them. Read in the way that works best for you!
Jerry wrote: "I haven't read through all (!!) the posts in this thread, so forgive me if this has been brought up already. I just found, today a map of Derry as it is depicted in It, and I'm excited to embark on..."
I love maps in books. They help me visualize and grasp the world an author is trying to create, especially if it is vast and complex world. Since Derry is such a thoroughly imagined town I wouldn't have a problem if a map was added.
I love maps in books. They help me visualize and grasp the world an author is trying to create, especially if it is vast and complex world. Since Derry is such a thoroughly imagined town I wouldn't have a problem if a map was added.
*~Lan Lan~* wrote: "...I love maps in books. They help me visualize and grasp the world an author is trying to create, especially if it is vast and complex world.... "Lan Lan, I agree COMPLETELY. When I read fiction, I really try to immerse myself as thoroughly as possible in the environment through which the characters are moving. So, with It, as I read about Neibolt Street, or Main Street, or the Standpipe, or the Barrens, I'm furiously trying to picture where these things are in relation to Witcham Street, or the drugstore, or the library, ad infinitum (it seems). So, OK, I can't resist. Here it is: I love this kind of stuff! Makes me want to start rereading the book right now!
Esse wrote: "...I'm a fan of maps, family trees, or any other supporting information. I think of reading as engaging with a book (almost like having a conversation) rather than passively consuming words..."Hi Esse, sorry but I missed your post first time around, and I just caught it. So I want also to underline (!) your comments on this. Too few of us, and sometimes I think, fewer and fewer as time goes on, have truly learned to engage with books in anything like the way you describe. To do this as a young person (e.g. in school), I think it's absolutely critical for the reader to have selected the book him- or herself. I mean, why would I try to deepen my connection to a book that I don't care to be connected to at all in the first place? This line of thought, to me, is a strong argument for the importance of self-selected reading materials in schools. But I'll save the soapbox for now.
If there is a map supplied I will peruse it but it isn't necessary to put me in the book.
Stephen King Fans
Books mentioned in this topic
It (other topics)It (other topics)
It (other topics)
Mile 81 (other topics)
The Bazaar of Bad Dreams (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
Stephen King (other topics)Robert McCammon (other topics)
Seth Grahame-Smith (other topics)
The book really hasn't held up well for me. It just seems overly long and bloated and now as an adult that scene at the end repulses me to no end.
I would have rated as one of fav King books prior to the re-listen but now its definitely near the bottom.