James Joyce Reading Group discussion
Ulysses
>
Ulysses
message 51:
by
Mae
(new)
Jan 28, 2011 02:13AM
off to the library I go. although, I dont want to use to much help at first... I want to see what my impressions are. dont want to put other people's ideas in my head. I want to see how much I can figure out. So far I love the whole Father/Son, Bloom/Dedalus and the trinity thing.(and I dont mean the college) I read that paragraph like four times... loved it. And the slam poetry! I read it aloud, with and Irish accent without, to music. I am having fun.
reply
|
flag
I agree with your proceed slowly process - that is the word for Joyce. I read it without any helps first and then spent 4 months re-reading it with helps. I strongly recommend Blamires book - New Bloomsbury Book for your help during your re-read. I own about 20 Joyce commentaries, bios, etc and it is the best for Ulysses. Don't bother with Gifford's massive book on the allusions unless you are a Wagnerian type into leif-motifs. Chapters 3. 10 & 14 are particularly difficult and then there is 15 a complete drama and 18 Molly's soliloquy - a classic. Have fun!
It seems I have a lifetime of Joyce ahead of me. I like your recommendation. I am taking notes as I write, then I will compare the helps with my notes. I will try to find Blamires book and I am so not into leif -motifs or anything wagnerian in any way... Oh 10, I just read that one twice, and should be reading 14 tonight. Looking foward to Molly. Walked down Stephen's Green Park, Kildare to Nassau... no trams anymore, but plenty of buses. Walked into a couple of pubs, none of the ones in the book. I am looking for a guide for actual locations. Its an experience... this book.
I have a DVD of the curator of the Joyce museum at the Martello tower and it has a tour of Dublin and not much seemed to remain of Joyce's Dublin. I have never been myself only visited via the book.
Hi group, sorry to have been away so very long ( nearly 2 years). @ Mae I would love to take a Joyce-themed tour of Dublin!
Hi Agri... I have never done it. But I hear that here in Dublin every year on June 16 people come out and take the Ulysses tour. They wear period costumes and stop at some pubs for pints and toasts. I am sure that a lot of the the original is not there. But I can guarantee you that a lot is still there. I know a couple of people who have taken the tour and they say that with a little imagination you go quite far. Readers of Joyce have more than a little imagination!
Today i managed to download all 39 tracks of libravox.org's readings of Ulysses. All of libravox.org's recordings are free and public domain. The performances vary in styles and quality (many done on the fly, with mistakes intact); it is nice though to have it all in one place on my droid phone, to get some Joyce "on the go." They also did Dubliners and The Portrait, which I may also download later.
Agrimorfee wrote: "Today i managed to download all 39 tracks of libravox.org's readings of Ulysses. All of libravox.org's recordings are free and public domain. The performances vary in styles and quality (many done..."
Oh wow. Thanks for pointing that out!
Mod
i have an LP that has milo o'shea and that actress (can't remember her name, dang!) that was in the film doing monologues from ulysses.
i have a cassette with james joyce reading from several of the works, but it's not great - i think he was much older when he did it, and he doesn't sound in good health - his voice is pretty frail.
Libravox relies on volunteers to read the books. These folks i gather are lit fans, lit critics and actors. These are not celebrities, and not all of them are polished readers. They are introduced at the start of each track, and some give a quick plug to their website.Maybe I should mention that I got this from the Audiobooks app via the Google Android Market.
Molly's sololiquoy is a bit hard to really get into...rather than rely on 1 performer, they had like 7 people read, then mixed all of them into one stew of voices, fading them in and out of the central point of hearing for an odd, sometimes disconcerting dreamlike quality. (reminding me of the approach John Cage used in his Roaratorio which incorporated Finnegans Wake and various sounds into a weird sound mix)
I am successfully reading Ulysses all the way through with a book group after many attempts to read it solo. I just finished Circe and I am convinced it was meant to be read aloud in a group. A group that has read the previous 14 chapters of course, because that is the only way one can see how hilarious it is. Brilliant!
Carol wrote: "I am successfully reading Ulysses all the way through with a book group after many attempts to read it solo. I just finished Circe and I am convinced it was meant to be read aloud in a group. A g..."That's great Carol. Your group sounds like fun!
Mod
i staged a few readings of circe - YES! - it's so fun to hear it all read aloud. enjoy your group and the current reading, carol - please feel free to chime in with any thoughts or aHA moments.
Mod
sounds like fun, but i don't twitter.
Recently came across a paper in which Molly's infamy before the Blazes episode was supposedly proven by mention of her touching someone with her 'ring hand'. These words appear in Penelope, but surely someone like Molly would regard her ring hand to be such even before she is married. Most of us would think of our 'ring finger' whether we sported a ring or not. Anyhow, I'm still not convinced that Molly's character can be so pinned down. I think Joyce leaves as much room for seeing the Blazes affair as her first adultery, it makes the action of the book dramatic and corresponds to the deliberate lack of definition which he employs with Molly.
Any comments?
Mod
i think joyce was establishing a sexually liberated woman with molly - she is not trapped by the catholic idea that sex out of wedlock is sinful. she sees it as a natural aspect of humanity. it's clear he was aware of books like madame bovary and anna karenina - and molly's fate is much different than those women.
I agree, he's not condemning her. I suppose I should have put infamy into quotes. What I'm interested in is how balanced the writing of her character is, versus the extreme reactions which she seems to receive.I don't see how any final decision on whether or not she has had numerous affairs, can be reached. I really don't think it matters but I am interested in how people can assume that all the rumours about her are true. She doesn't compare Bloom physically to anyone but Blazes. I think Joyce is playing with our ideas of knowledge acquisition - of epistemology - and possibly referring to Leibniz who believed, rightly, that rumour was the least favourable method of acquiring real knowledge.
In Exiles, Joyce has the husband stand back while his wife is courted and the reasoning given is that he wants her to develop fully by 'falling' if she wants to. He's setting up an Adam and Eve situation for her. I suppose I see the same thing happening in Ulysses - but, perhaps he's varying it in the novel?
Can't wait for the twitters on Ulysses on Thursday buthow about doing our own micro synopsis on Ulysses?
Can I propose for episode one
- Telemachus - '
An English man, an Irish man and an artist, wake up in a martello tower'.
- Scylla and Charybdis -
"Artist avoids condescension by sacrificing pet theory."
- Sirens -"Gold and bronze make our two: mermaids who swim through our word music."
- Lestrygonians-
"You are what you eat."
- Oxen of the Sun -
"Ye whole blessed English language gets born, verily everyone else gets very drunk."
- Circe -
"The witching hour. Psychodrama in four parts played on several strumpets. Ruin of all space and time, or maybe just blacked out."
- Penelope -
"Mollys runon thought there is not break or pause or breath or punctuation considers her suitors how it is that Bloom suits her her breasts all perfume yes heart like mad yes yes I will yes."
Excellent. We're 1/3 there.
How about:
Nestor:
Stephen questions Old Wisdom. Given sustenance for rest of day.
- Aeolus -"EXTRA EXTRA. READ ALL ABOUT IT. BREEZY SLAPDASH BLOWHARD MADLYDASHING JOURNALISTS. BLOOM HOUSE OF KEYS: KEYS. GET IT?"
I like that. You've done this before. Give me a little time to think of something. One more and we're 1/2 way there. Any other helpers?
Proteus -Beyond the rocks on Sandymount shore Steven urinates. Art blooms.
Calypso -
The hours rewind. Bloom has kidneys and moving hams in mind. Molly throws 'rocks' at him.
Kinkajou wrote: "Is anyone going to follow #llyses on Twitter on June 16th? Readers from around the world are "rewriting" Ulysses in 140 character tweets. On the 16th they will be posted."We're half way through the micro synopsis of Ulysses here. It will be interesting to put the 11lysses tweets together with our own. I think the results are going to be wide ranging.
Ithaca:Did Bloom and Stephen unite as father and son? It is not so simple. See Nausicaa for a "happy ending".
Bloomsday poster by Robert Berry, with respect to R. Crumb
Great poster! I saw a wonderful play called Gibraltar last night that Robert Berry brought to Philly from NY. Lines from Ulysses were selected that tell the story of Molly and Bloom.
Happy Bloomsday! I am reading from Nestor today at a public reading of excerpts from Ulysses. How are you celebrating Bloomsday?
Carol wrote: "Happy Bloomsday! I am reading from Nestor today at a public reading of excerpts from Ulysses. How are you celebrating Bloomsday?"I am re-reading Dubliners.
Mod
i saw on facebook that there is a link to a broadway bloomsday production - it's a 12 hour event and streaming live ... i'll see if i can grab the link and post it here.
Hey, I saw this a long time ago:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTEuj4...
The movie of Ulysses from 1967
You can find the other episodes on YouTube
They are all titled
James Joyces Ulysses (1967)_1.avi, James Joyces Ulysses (1967)_2.avi...James Joyces Ulysses (1967)_15.avi (Molly)....
Mod
http://www.facebook.com/SymphonySpace...
it is streaming as we speak ... or type.
Mod
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTEuj4...
The movie of Ulysses from 1967"
yes, i've seen it a few times - it's OK, you can get an idea of the storyline from watching it, and the circe chapter tries hard to capture the hallucinogenic aspect of the text. i don't see milo o'shea as bloom, nor do i think the actor playing stephen works - for me. i did like the woman who plays molly. damn, can't remember her name. i think it works as an introduction to the text, but not much more.
Mod
videocamera on lazy susan captures circular coursing of daily dublin damsels and dudes ... watch for falling coins!
Phillip wrote: "Ed wrote: "Hey, I saw this a long time ago:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTEuj4...
The movie of Ulysses from 1967"
yes, i've seen it a few times - it's OK, you can get an idea of the storylin..."
Prob just go straight to Molly. That part is the most memorable.
Thanks for that link, Phillip, I will try it on my Droid...
Ulysses in four seconds: On June 16, 1904, Leopold Bloom walks through Dublin and goes home to his wife.Ulysses in five minutes: http://infinitezombies.wordpress.com/...
Ulysses in seven hours:
Bloomsday reading at the Rosenbach Museum in Philadelphia
Ulysses in eight months:
Ulysses reading course at the Rosenbach Museum
Ulysses in twenty two years:
http://blog.frankdelaney.com/re-joyce/
I am about to start reading Ulysses and would like to do it as part of a group.Is there anyone in this group ready to read (or re-read) and review it?
Hi Ian, what have you got in mind? A chapter a week sort of thing? I'm reading and re-reading it so you can count me in.
Ann wrote: "Hi Ian, what have you got in mind? A chapter a week sort of thing? I'm reading and re-reading it so you can count me in."Yeah, that sounds pretty achievable for a group.
Good luck you guys. I just re read Ulysses recently or I'd join you.
Okay. I suppose if we jump in then Ed., Philip and Carol might have something to say. I'm at the James Joyce Summer School here this week, but I'm still up for it. (Let me know if you have any questions for Fritz Senn or the other academics. I'll be sitting in a corner being very quiet. )Shall we check in next Monday having read the story?
Many of the chapters involve a shift in style to parody a particular genre that is thematically related to the chapter theme. I suppose the most interesting thing for me from the academics who have infinite time to learn of these things, would be seeing some of the contemporaneous source material that Joyce was parodying. It's not really necessary to have seen them to enjoy the chapter, but it would be interesting. For example, the Aeolus Chapter (god of winds, breezy, windbag etc.) chapter is obviously a parody of newspaper articles, something that can easily be understood by a reader today, although it would be great fun to see typical excerpts from the turn of the century Irish press. However in the Nausicaa chapter, one filled with gushy domestic idealizing, the women's publications which were being parodied were radically different than they are today, so that seeing examples of these would be really interesting. One of my favorite of his styles is the catechistic Ithaca chapter; I was recently gratified to learn that is was one of Joyce's favorites, as well.
By the way, I returned the compliment that Joyce gave his contemporaries by writing a a little Joyce parody (as if Joyce had written the Twilight series). I think you'll get a kick out of it, after you read Ulysses.
Ed, I just skimmed through your parodies...awesome, awesome LOLS.
Agrimorfee wrote: "Ed, I just skimmed through your parodies...awesome, awesome LOLS."The triply nested parenthetical notes in the Proust parody, match up, by the way. :D
Ian - I just saw your post. I have been immersed in "The Pale King"! I just finished "Ulysses" but I plan to read again in the winter without paratexts. I used paratexts (esp. Gifford's "Ulysses Annotated", Blamires' "The New Bloomsday Book", and Gilbert's "Ulysses"), which were helpful but disrupted the flow of the text. I look forward to reading it again straight through. Hope you find some readers, but if not I will be back in the winter.
Ed - your parody is wonderful! Now I feel I must read "Twilight" to get all of your references. Joyce's Everyman would be proud :-)
Thank you, we aim to please.Well, Twilight, it's not great literature. She does portray teen longing and angst well, and she does have imagination.
My hint with Stephanie Meyer, is any time you are stuck in Bella's obsessing over Edward too long, you can start skimming. Not a bad summer read. You can read them at a good clip.
Perhaps I will be a gateway to great literature for teen goth vampire romance fans. :)
Mod
a chapter at a time sounds good - anyone want to comment on the first chapter?
you have a scene at the martello tower with stephen, buck mulligan and haynes (spelling?) an englishman who is visiting the island. right away you have a parallel with the odyssey - here is a modern day ithaca - replete with colonialist (invaders) threatening the stability of our homeland. joyce sets in motion the antagonistic relationship between stephen (the joycean parallel of odysseus' son, telemachus) and buck mulligan, whose stately countenance prepares for a shave and a cup of strong "tay" with mother grogan's milk....
