Jane Austen discussion
General Discussion
>
Though it is obvious why Lydia wants to run off with Wickham, why does Wickham run off with Lydia?
date
newest »
newest »
Maybe after Wickham "tore Lydia's muslin gown" he thought that she wouldn't be able keep it to herself, that she was bound to tell someone, and decided to leave town -- with the added benefit of getting away from his creditors in Brighton; Lydia would probably be hanging around him a lot, and realizing that he wouldn't be able to leave town without her just brought her along under the pretense of eloping.
I must look out for JS in Hornblower and Cranford when they are next repeated! Juan - I can't recall the bit about the gown tearing. Why would that trigger taking off with Lydia. Is it a euphemaism (as in, how her gown got torn?)
Perhaps one of the reasons he took her is that she just wouldn't give up on him and it was easier to let her cling on than trying to peel her off?? Lydia could never tell the difference between 'kicking up a lark' and serious stuff (like fleeing creditors...)
Beth-In-UK wrote: "Juan - I can't recall the bit about the gown tearing. Why would that trigger taking off with Lydia."I learned about the double meaning of torn muslin (unlike Henry Tilney, I know nothing about muslin) in Jillian Heydt-Stevenson's book Austen's Unbecoming Conjunctions, a book that gathers tons of such double entendres and erudite dirty jokes and metaphors that appear in Jane Austen's novels. In Pride and Prejudice, the muslin gown appears in Ch. 47, in a note to Harriet Forster, Colonel Forster's wife:
You will laugh when you know where I am gone, and I cannot help laughing myself at your surprise to-morrow morning, as soon as I am missed. I am going to Gretna Green, and if you cannot guess with who, I shall think you a simpleton, for there is but one man in the world I love, and he is an angel. I should never be happy without him, so think it no harm to be off. You need not send them word at Longbourn of my going, if you do not like it, for it will make the surprise the greater when I write to them and sign my name Lydia Wickham. What a good joke it will be! I can hardly write for laughing. Pray make my excuses to Pratt, for not keeping my engagement and dancing with him to night. Tell him I hope he will excuse me when he knows all, and tell him I will dance with him at the next ball we meet, with great pleasure. I shall send for my clothes when I get to Longbourn; but I wish you would tell Sally to mend a great slit in my worked muslin gown before they are packed up. Good bye. Give my love to Colonel Forster. I hope you will drink to our good journey.
The tear in her gown is of course a hint that Lydia and Wickham had sex. What I was saying is that Lydia being so indisreet, she might have said something that would compromise Wickham, who would get in trouble with the colonel of his regiment. If also Wickham couldn't get away from Lydia, it might have made sense to him to bring her along saying that they were eloping.
Hmm, well, not entirely convinced, but on the other hand, why put that into the letter because it doesn't related to anything else she's saying, so unless it does have that sub-text connotation why mention it at all??Neverthless, it's still a bit odd, at the very least. Austen doesn't shy away in her novels from mentioning things like females being sexually and sociallky ruined, from Brandon's ward ruined by Willoughby, to Maria Bertram etc.
I guess, if Lydia and Wickam did have sex before they bolted from Brighton, (one always wonders 'where and when' given the constraints on female freedom then!), then it does give some impetus to why Wickham bothered to take her with him (though I think ridding himself of a clinging, determined Lydia would require take some doing!).
When Lydia and Wickham come to Longbourn as a married couple, and Elizabeth observes their behavior, she sees that Lydia's affection for her husband is greater than Wickham's for Lydia. Elizabeth wonders "why, without violently caring for her, he chose to elope with her at all", and concludes that "his flight was rendered necessary by distress of circumstances" [his debts] " and if that were the case, he was not the young man to resist the opportunity of having a companion."
Ah, well that's Austen spelling it out - thank you.
I have always thought that Wickham did it because he knows the family will soon have a connection with the Bingleys and so in some way, he will be related to a rich family. It may also be because of revenge. Wickham obviously liked Elizabeth and maybe he found out some way that Mr. Darcy was eyeing her. He knows that running away with Lydia would damage the Bennets and might also affect Mr. Darcy's prospects on marrying Lizzy with her scandalous family; therefore, somehow Wickham is pissing him off. Lastly, it might be a virgin conquest. Poor Lydia. I hope they would eventually grow happier and more mature along the way.
I'm not sure about wanting a connection with the Bingleys, or, rather, relying on it? If Jane had already been married or betrothed to Bingley, then possibly??Revenge vicariously on Darcy is a definite possiiblity, if he twigged Darcy was keen on Lizzy, so seducing Lizzy's sister would make marrying her impossible.
As for hoping he and Lydia might mature....I doubt it! I'm not sure there's hope for either of them. Best thing is to pack them off somewhere where they won't cost Darcy too much more, and can't cause a fuss or scandal. They are doomed to be the 'unwelcome relations' and a nuisance for the rest of their lives I suspect.
I really do not know why Wickham ran off with Lydia, because she is not even that rich. I think that he, at first, intended to just mess with her, not marry her.
Thank you for telling us about the existence of "Unbecoming Conjunctions!" Thank sounds terribly intriguing! Going to go look for a copy…I always wondered that same question. Wickham clearly isn't really into Lydia all that much. The idea that he needed to leave town, and it was simply easier to take her along than to scrape her off makes sense. Although if he was running away in the middle of the night, he didn't need to go fetch her. Fear of her blabbing something also makes sense.
The topic would make a really fun short story contest!
I do feel it's a bit of a plot failure. Jane Austen 'had' to make Lydia elope very unsuitably with Wickham, because it creates the disaster that Darcy then saves her from, and redeems himself in her eyes. But it's not very plausible that Wickham should have landed himself with Lydia specifically.
Unless, as said, she just 'clung' to him and it was easier to take her with him as he fled, rather than cut her loose.
If Darcy hadn't bribed him to marry her, he never would have. He'd have abandoned her a 'ruined woman' and never looked back.
I think he enjoyed 'forcing' Darcy to fork out for him, as he felt 'cheated' (!) of Darcy's rich sister....
Jane Austen
Books mentioned in this topic
Horatio Hornblower 1 - 11 (other topics)Cranford (other topics)
A tribute to an accomplished actress to play such differen..."
She's brilliant. She is also in Horatio Hornblower 1 - 11. and has a very tiny role in Cranford as the daughter of Captain Brown (Jim Carter aka Mr. Carson from Downton Abbey).