The Phantom of the Opera The Phantom of the Opera discussion


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She should have chosen the phantom

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message 1: by Arie (new)

Arie Am I alone in this belief? I think that Christine chose completely the wrong person, the phantom and her had a special relationship that was dark and full of chemistry. I was heart broken that she did not choose him in the end.


message 2: by Tabor (new)

Tabor When watching the movie, I thought she belonged with Raoul but when I read the book she seemed to be doing more of a favor for Raoul then actually being in love with him.


Gemma I'm of the opinion that Christine and Erik were made for each other--and that Christine and Raoul deserve each other: She's insane for leaving Erik, and he's delusional in his love for her (he's in love with who she used to be, not who she is!). I burst into tears whenever I read the book or watch the movie. Doesn't Erik deserve to be happy?


Sandi *~The Pirate Wench~* So true Gemma! I actually like some of the sequels as Erik finds happiness in these..but alas a piece of his heart is always with Christine...


Paisley Stewart IMO, the true bonds between Christine and the Phantom in Leroux are formed through their love of music. For them, music is like a secret language of spirit. In Leroux's classic it is not sexual attraction, but music that brings Christine back to him each time. Through his music she begins to love his soul.

She and Raoul do not share that passion.


Sandi *~The Pirate Wench~* You are so right Paisley..no matter what other books are written, what Erik & Christine share is a true bond between them in spirit that cant be shared with another person..its theirs alone.


Gemma Paisley wrote: "IMO, the true bonds between Christine and the Phantom in Leroux are formed through their love of music. For them, music is like a secret language of spirit. In Leroux's classic it is not sexual a..."

I agree wholeheartedly, Paisley. Their bond is such a deep one that transcends all earthly ties you can't help but envy it (even if disaster springs from it). She can't hope to have such a connection with Raoul.


Paisley Stewart Agreed. I just don't think Leroux's Raoul is deep enough to understand that connection. He just can't figure out why Christine keeps going back to the Phantom when he is so ugly. I think Raoul truly does lover her, but his love for her is based on an image he has of her that is not the real Christine. The real Christine is much more complex than he can imagine.


Gemma Exactly!


message 10: by Susan (new)

Susan Hatler Although I completely ache with the pain the Phantom's feeling, he's, uh, kind of a murderer. I think he'd need some serious mental rehabilitation before he'd make a suitable boyfriend for Christine. ;) I haven't seen the second one yet although I really want to!


Gemma True, but you can hardly hold it against him. The world made him what he is. While he's not what you'd call the "appropriate" match for Christine, he's better for her than Raoul.


Paisley Stewart But I think the Phantom, even as written in Leroux is not hopelessly lost. I've always thought the name Christine was chosen because of the "Christ" in the name. I believe that Christine is the instrument of the Phantom's redemption, as we see in the final lair scene when he lets Raoul and the Persian go free. Still, I don't think the Leroux Phantom is capable of having a "normal" male female relationship, even after he undergoes his spiritual transformation. I believe the damage done to his psyche is just too much for any young woman to deal with.


Sandi *~The Pirate Wench~* Paisley & Gemma..you both have really good points!
I must say I love reading "sequel's" weather its Christine & Erik..or Erik & "someone else" I just like to see Erik happy...Now I know Sharon will "gasp" here..but I didnt care for the Leroux Phantom..threw the play, movie, and other authors books I found the telling of the story & characters much more to my liking..Im a romantic..what can I say...


Gemma I'm with you there, Sandi. While I love Leroux, ALW's version appeals to my romantic nature.


Alice (; I never really thought of that... I've grown up listening to the musical version and when I read the book, I just expected and wanted Christine to be with Raoul. However you do bring up a very good point. I guess it's just another Bella-Edward-Jacob situation.


message 16: by [deleted user] (new)

When I read the book, and even Susan Kay's novel, Phantom, I felt that Christine was such a ditzy, foolish girl who honestly didn't deserve Erik's attentions. I couldn't stand her, and I really wanted him to kill her, too.


Sandi *~The Pirate Wench~* Carlin wrote: "When I read the book, and even Susan Kay's novel, Phantom, I felt that Christine was such a ditzy, foolish girl who honestly didn't deserve Erik's attentions. I couldn't stand her, and I really wan..."

I felt Christine was that way in Susan Kay's novel as well Carlin, but if you read a few of the "sequel" novels our authors here have,she's put in a "kinder" light..and Erik finds "happiness" as well. But Im glad I read the "original as that gives us the "true Christine & Erik..its just fun to read there is a maybe HEA for them after that.


Gabrielle She's seduced by the dark and evilness of the Phantom that but she is in love with Raoul. The Phantom represents evil while Raoul represents good, how can she not choose goodness over evil? I do LOVE the Phantom and wish she'd gone with him but she didn't love him she was just obsessed and infatuated with his beautiful voice and the darkness of him.


Sandi *~The Pirate Wench~* Gabrielle wrote: "She's seduced by the dark and evilness of the Phantom that but she is in love with Raoul. The Phantom represents evil while Raoul represents good, how can she not choose goodness over evil? I do LO..."

So true Gabrielle.. and its what makes the tragic/love story so special,You cant help but feel something for all the characters..


message 21: by Lily (new) - rated it 3 stars

Lily You all touch on good stuff -- much of it close to the issues of creating sustaining, healthy (non-abusive) relationships -- which may or may not be with our "soul mates."

Many view Leroux's novel as problematic in structure. I haven't looked at it closely enough to comment intelligently.


Gracia I can't agree more with you, Arie. I read until the end of the book just to see they ended up together, which I was wrong. At the end of the story, I kept questioning, "What is the point of building up the chemistry between the Phantom and Christine. Was it all for nothing?"


Katie I'm sorry, but Erik is an abusive, manipulative *murder*. "You can hardly hold it against him"? Really? REALLY? Did you people read the same book that I did? Erik is absolutely a complex and interesting character, more complex and interesting than Raoul in many ways (although, to be fair, we don't get to know Raoul nearly as well, so maybe he has lots of depth that we simply don't get to see in the context of the novel), but I would never wish his attentions on any woman. If Christine *had* chosen him I'd have wondered if she had some kind of major screw loose.

Just because someone is flattering and intriguing because of their obsessive, tortured nature does not make them desirable. In fact, those are generally not good qualities to look for - those are often qualities of possessive, abusive partners, which Erik shows *ABSOLUTELY EVERY SINGLE INDICATION* of being! Erik needs a really good therapist and maybe a teddy bear and a padded room. Christine was absolutely right to choose something that was good for her, even if it meant leaving him behind. That was not a good situation to be in, no matter how much "chemistry" there may have been.


Andrea I agree, Katie!! Maybe if Erik was a BIT more docile, I would think differently...but alas, he's still the same old passioante murderer. :(


Melissa Katie wrote: "I'm sorry, but Erik is an abusive, manipulative *murder*. "You can hardly hold it against him"? Really? REALLY? Did you people read the same book that I did? Erik is absolutely a complex and i..."

I think your comment is brilliant. Yes i did read the same book! People just see how the poor Erik was, thats the reason why they understand Christine should choosed him. I woulndt like to have a maniac in love with me! Come on people he was a killer. I do pity him but im not that extreme to fall for him.

I dont think they had even chemistry, she thought he was the angel of music and loved his voice! just that, nothing more.


Natasha i agree with a few of the comments. i think in the film it showed that christine really wanted the ohantom a lot more than raoul, but in the book- as many have already said- she was just in love his voice because she believed him to be the ghost of her father or someone sent from her father, but the truth is that she was scared, terrified of him!! of course it would have been romantically nice if she did end up with, but people, he was a psycho!!!! i mean in the book the persian even talks about when the phantom actually made torture tools and enjoyed watching people in them!! i mean that's just disturbed! yes i know that he would never of hurt christine, but how can you love or even live with someone like that?? and anyway there's a scene in the book when she takes raoul- is it up on the terrace?- somewhere- can't remember well- and tells him how creeped out she is by the phantom and how she's trying to protect raoul, she feels sorry for the phantom, loves raoul and that's it!


message 27: by Mr.B (new) - rated it 3 stars

Mr.B It's a bit of a "Beauty and the Beast" story, isn't it? Except Christine is not just saving her "beast" from the curse of ugliness, is she? She and Erik eventually realize that her love for Erik is based on pity, which is not a good basis for a romantic relationship. It is possible for a woman to love more than one man at the same time, isn't it? Her relationship with Raoul is romantic and wins out in the end. I don't think she can "rescue" a serial killer and obsessive stalker like Erik with her love. That notion has led to serious trouble for too many girls.


Tasha Alice wrote: "I never really thought of that... I've grown up listening to the musical version and when I read the book, I just expected and wanted Christine to be with Raoul. However you do bring up a very good..."

Totally agree! :)

Yes Christine and Erik have a level of understanding and passion. Yet there is a connection that Raoul and Christine have also.

But honestly, do you really want Christine to spend the rest of her life with a violent, hot tempered murderer? One wrong word from Christine and he snaps!
Don't get me wrong, I want to see Erik happy and loved, but he has some issues. Raoul is the more healthy choice for Christine.


Sandi *~The Pirate Wench~* Mr.B wrote: "It's a bit of a "Beauty and the Beast" story, isn't it? Except Christine is not just saving her "beast" from the curse of ugliness, is she? She and Erik eventually realize that her love for Erik is..."

Some very good points you have there Mr.B


Melissa Mr.B wrote: "It's a bit of a "Beauty and the Beast" story, isn't it? Except Christine is not just saving her "beast" from the curse of ugliness, is she? She and Erik eventually realize that her love for Erik is..."

That´s right. I agree she didnt love Erik. But i wonder sometimes if Christine would loved the beast if he was as beautiful as Raoul. There is a part where Raoul asked her that.


Christina Williams Natasha wrote: "i agree with a few of the comments. i think in the film it showed that christine really wanted the ohantom a lot more than raoul, but in the book- as many have already said- she was just in love hi..."

I totally agree! I also found the sexual overtones of the book kind of creepy when you consider Christine thought the Phantom was her father...ewww...


message 32: by Gwen (new) - rated it 3 stars

Gwen Gardner I'm going to go out on a limb here and disagree with most of you. Yeah, Erik/the Phantom was certainly the most intriguing character in the novel. But that Christine should have ended up with him? No Way! He murder's whoever gets in his way, he manipulates not just Christine, but everyone in the opera house, he extorts money, he spies on everyone, he kidnaps Christine and plays mind games with her, he's jealous and tries to kill Raoul, according to the Persian he is a master strangulator. And I haven't even finished the book yet! Christine should end up with Raoul: they are both naive and child-like.


message 33: by Anna (new) - rated it 2 stars

Anna Lady wrote: "I'm going to go out on a limb here and disagree with most of you. Yeah, Erik/the Phantom was certainly the most intriguing character in the novel. But that Christine should have ended up with him? ..."

I completely and totally agree with you Lady. Raoul was perfect for Christine and even though she did like the phantom (seriously I don't know why) she still belonged to her boyfriend Raoul.


Angie No one is perfect, but what I can't take is someone forcing others to love him/her. That's one of Erik's faults in the novel.

Maybe Christine loved him, but in a romantical way, an ideal representing her late father's promise. She had a more tangible love for Raoul due to know each other during their childhood.

One-side relationships are not real relationships at all. The only way to solve it was that Christine needed to make the real decision, she was feeling divided in what she really wanted and her father's memory and duty as good daughter. In the end, she chose Raoul.


message 35: by Michelle (new) - added it

Michelle Wardhaugh I saw the musical before reading the book. In the musical I saw the choice between Erik and Raoul as a choice between career and marriage. As a modern woman, I thought it a pity she had to end up married. However, the book did not have that element. It was written much closer to the period it depicted, and such questions weren't even questions to be seriously entertained. In the book, Erik was still to be pitied, but much more to be feared. Christine and Raoul did have a past history together, and though I don't think the relationship was perfect to my sensibilities, he could provide her with a future any woman of the time might envy.


Sandi *~The Pirate Wench~* Angie & Michelle..you both have really good points..and in truth Christine made the right choice,even tho Raoul may not have been THE best choice..Im just a romantic and love the sequels our authors here write on Erik who has his"redemption" and has a HEA..I guess Id like to think they all have that long after the book closes.:)


Olivia Rose Cairns where can i get the book? and ive only seen the movie and i think that raoul and christine belong together forever


Olivia Rose Cairns where can i get the book? and ive only seen the movie and i think that raoul and christine belong together forever


Audrey Lee I don't know if Christine should have ended up with Raoul or Erik but in every story that i've read as a sequel (including "Love Never Dies" by Andrew Lloyd Webber), Christine's child is actually Erik's. And that's enough for me. :) (And I'm sorry if I just ruined it for some of you)


Melissa Olivia wrote: "where can i get the book? and ive only seen the movie and i think that raoul and christine belong together forever"

Well the movie is Ok but if you really liked it, you will LOVE the book. You can buy it at amazon at a low price in case you want to order it. But is a classic so if i were you ill check first the library near you.
Wont be hard to find.


Angie Audrey wrote: "I don't know if Christine should have ended up with Raoul or Erik but in every story that i've read as a sequel (including "Love Never Dies" by Andrew Lloyd Webber), Christine's child is actually E..."

I read the plot in wikipedia, and my point of view is that the plot was favouring Erik. Raoul's personality has been declining, his relationship with Christine too, and Erik wouldn't be alone anymore.


Melissa Angie wrote: "Audrey wrote: "I don't know if Christine should have ended up with Raoul or Erik but in every story that i've read as a sequel (including "Love Never Dies" by Andrew Lloyd Webber), Christine's chil..."

You really need to read the book. Christine was scare around Erick!


Angie Melissa wrote: "You really need to read the book. Christine was scare around Erick!"

My comment was about the sequel "Love Never Dies"



message 44: by Angie (last edited Oct 13, 2011 12:31PM) (new) - rated it 3 stars

Angie There are many results and posibilities about what would have happened if Christine had chosen Erick or what happened after Christine chose Raoul.

And I think that the idea about Christine ending happy ever after is a very romantical idea in both sides: either with Erick or Raoul.

Love and passion never last forever, and what it can prevail, unfourtunately or not, is the economical support and stability, even though you deny it and say that money is not important and you are stubborn to admit that there is not the same passion as before.

Using "the common sense", one can think that marrying Raoul could bring her more stability in her life.


message 45: by Mimi (new) - rated it 3 stars

Mimi imo, she chose raoul based on his looks because it would be more acceptable in society or whatever. it's justified because the phantom murdered people and she said she couldn't handle it. Maybe she could, maybe she couldn't, but i never got the impression that was THE reason she rejected erick. so i think logically and lawfully she chose the right person, but not for those reasons at all. which was dumb of her.


Melissa Angie wrote: "There are many results and posibilities about what would have happened if Christine had chosen Erick or what happened after Christine chose Raoul.

And I think that the idea about Christine endi..."


I understand your point, but love and passion can last forever.


Melissa Marilyn wrote: "imo, she chose raoul based on his looks because it would be more acceptable in society or whatever. it's justified because the phantom murdered people and she said she couldn't handle it. Maybe she..."

I think she really loved Raoul. At first she was confused about the phantom, she thought he was the angel of music or her dad. When she got to see the real Erick she wanted to run away.

YOU JUST DONT RUN AWAY FROM SOMEONE YOU MIGHT LOVE OR REALLY CARE ABOUT. She was so afraid that she protected Raoul. Oh! i almost forgot, she tried to kill herself when the phantom trapped her. She hated being with Erick.

I really love this book. I wish to see a movie attached to it.


message 48: by Mimi (last edited Oct 14, 2011 09:38PM) (new) - rated it 3 stars

Mimi Melissa wrote: "Marilyn wrote: "imo, she chose raoul based on his looks because it would be more acceptable in society or whatever. it's justified because the phantom murdered people and she said she couldn't hand..."

Lol, not sure caps lock was necessary but YES, WHAT YOU SAID MAKES SENSE. :) Yu don't generally run away from someone yu care about but I think that's hardly always true. Anyway I'm not really sure christine's mind was totally grounded in reality (what with her being confused about the phantom possibly being the completely fictional angel of music or possibly her really dead dad) so I guess nobody should presume to know what's really going on in that pretty little head of hers (IMO) ... I think the fact that she ended up with raoul definitely counts for something, but I also don't think she wasn't a little crazy, so I just can't account for anything lol.


Melissa Marilyn wrote: "Melissa wrote: "Marilyn wrote: "imo, she chose raoul based on his looks because it would be more acceptable in society or whatever. it's justified because the phantom murdered people and she said s..."

I think you are right saying that Christine was a little crazy. I mean Putting everything you said and among other stuff maybe more than a little crazy.

Do you think the story is real? (of course with some fiction of the author)

PS. I almost felt from my chair lol with you comment about the caps lock.


message 50: by Mimi (new) - rated it 3 stars

Mimi Melissa wrote: "Marilyn wrote: "Melissa wrote: "Marilyn wrote: "imo, she chose raoul based on his looks because it would be more acceptable in society or whatever. it's justified because the phantom murdered peopl..."

Lol I hope I didn't seem mean but it's hard to pass up some things. I don't think the story is real. I think it may have been based off a single event but it wasn't like the story at all, or nearly as long of an ordeal. I think leroux was so tired of everyone hating his books that he said it was real to get ppl to buy.


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