Muggie Maggie, by Beverly Cleary / Cursive vs. Print Writing

[Cheryl, Host of Miscellaneous and Newbery Clubs]

Muggie Maggie is about a girl who thinks that printing neatly and typing on the computer are enough enough - that she doesn't need to learn cursive. The principal and teachers conspire to get her to admit that cursive is important.

My questions, especially for teachers, are:

1. Is cursive still considered important?

2. Why?

3. If you've read the book, do you approve of the tricky strategy used on the girl?

My answers are
1. slightly
2. can help you take notes faster sometimes
3. no

I'm a mom, with a 4 yr B.S. in Elem. Education, 47 years old, and I forget most of the cursive I've learned and almost never use it. My 14 yo was taught cursive, but his teacher was not able to persuade us of the importance of it.

[Tricia]

As a teacher of 30 years, mostly teaching in third grade where we do expect cursive to be learned, I do see that it is still an important skill at this age level. Not only are the children excited to learn a new form of writing, but as I tell them, they can write faster and take notes better as they get older. (The more you learn, the more you grow as I tell them.) The teachers in the upper grades at our school write in cursive on the board, overheads, assignments, etc. and therefore, if the children are not fluent in crusive by third grade, not only will their speed of reading be cut, but their "translation" of the material into their mind will take longer. Cursive is a more formal style of writing which, unfortunately with the computer technology we use today, is being used less and less. I still feel it is something to be learned as a part of growing older and learning other ways to communicate. Will we still have to learn to read even though most of what we now hear is on audio tapes, CDs, or just plain verbal? Of course! The more fluent we are in language, the further and higher we will be able to communicate and learn!

[Lisa]

I would think it would still be taught if only so children would be able to use it in their signature. The kids around me are still learning it in third grade.

[Suzanne]

They are still learning cursive in the third grade in my school district here in CA. That is a good point, Lisa. How do they learn to write their own signatures?

[Cheryl, Host of Miscellaneous and Newbery Clubs]

Thanks for your thoughts so far, all - I'd love to hear more; maybe you can ask friends?

[Cheryl, Host of Miscellaneous and Newbery Clubs]

Oh very cool suggestion! (msg 8). It reminds me that in 6th grade in Carson City the kids learn to 'write' their names in Egyptian hieroglyphics. Well, if they could do that, certainly they could learn to write their cursive signature during a 'formerly useful aesthetically pleasing crafts' unit!

Of course, show of hands, who has a legibly cursive signature now? Not me!

Now, if we could get the school boards to agree....

[Cheryl, Host of Miscellaneous and Newbery Clubs]

I like tha,t "He also used to show it off to girls at parties!!" Maybe teachers could motivate the boys to use better cursive to make their love notes more romantic.

[Manybooks, Fiction Club host]

I have a completely different story. I started school in Germany, and we actually never learned to print, we had to use cursive script right away. My problems started in grade four when we moved to Canada. Not only was my cursive script a bit different because I had learned it in Germany, but I did not know how to print legibly. And, even today, I write better and faster using cursive writing, printing has always been hard (well, I actually had to teach myself how to print, as the teachers in grade four did not really believe me when I pointed out that I could not print, I learned it, but it looks terrible, come to think of it, so does my cursive writing, no one can ever read my notes).

[Wilhelmina]

Cheryl wrote: "I like tha,t "He also used to show it off to girls at parties!!" Maybe teachers could motivate the boys to use better cursive to make their love notes more romantic."

I think they just text now. Not romantic at all.

[Manybooks, Fiction Club host]

Wilhelmina wrote: "Cheryl wrote: "I like tha,t "He also used to show it off to girls at parties!!" Maybe teachers could motivate the boys to use better cursive to make their love notes more romantic."

I think they ..."

I would agree, and I would not at all be trilled to receive a love note on my cell phone, really does destroy the romance of it all.

[Cheryl, Host of Miscellaneous and Newbery Clubs]

Well I guess the boys who take the time to write a note, even if in manuscript, would be more likely to make the girls swoon. Teach that trick to your sons, nephews, students! :)

[Bernadette]

There's been some research - I wish I could find it now - that many people actually write faster in print. When I read this , I timed my own writing and yes, I was faster writing in print than cursive. (But my cursive is horrible!)I'd suggest timing students and see which one is better/faster for them.

When I taught Grades 3/4, I taught D'Nealian style print and cursive because I like the way the letters were formed and moved easily from the print to the joined letters. I never liked Zaner-Bloser cursive letters.

Teaching cursive to students with special needs - with fine motor, visual, and other writing struggles - can be a very useful tool.

[Manybooks, Fiction Club host]

I wonder if some of the "speed" of writing is related to what writing style you learned first. I write faster in cursive writing (not very legibly, but, my printing is pretty unreadable as well), which might be because, as I mentioned, I learned cursive writing right from the start, and never actually was taught how to print. I actually have always had pretty lousy penmanship, and not due to lack of trying. In Germany, one of our report card marks was for penmanship (our writing style), and I always had pretty horrible marks. But, I've also recently discovered that I might actually be left-handed, and was likely forced to become right-handed when I started school. I wonder sometimes, if students having problems with learning cursive writing (or printing) might have similar issues, or, as Bernadette stated, fine motor problems (I know that I have always had major struggles with fine motor control).

[Lisa]

My handwriting is really bad. I, without thinking about it, stopped using cursive, except to sign my name, because I think I thought my cursive was probably even more illegible than my print. Therefore, I believe it's faster for me to print, though I can still write in cursive, and occasionally do. Unfortunately, the slower I print, the more legible it is. I'm one of those writers who really appreciate the internet, email, and word processing programs.

In fifth grade my teacher would give needy students extra materials. We all wanted all of them. The only one I ever got was something to improve handwriting. (It didn't work.)

I always blamed it on being left handed, but there are plenty of lefties who have good writing so that's probably not it.

[Suzanne]

I am much faster at cursive writing so I hardly ever print unless I have to for some reason. I use writing also as a form of expressing myself in journal writing. I don't know if texting would give me the same flow of consciousness.

I do, however, work with children with special needs who have fine motor control issues. We allow them to use the computer for much of their written work because they can get there thoughts and ideas out easier and faster. It seems to really help them with the content of what they are writing.

[Meg]

There are actually teachers who argue that beginning with cursive writing is more appropriate particularly for children with disabilities, since it is harder to reverse letters. However, I also know that some children have a great deal of difficulty reading cursive.

Personally, I find printing so much easier that I have only used cursive when it was mandated (back in third to sixth grades). Probably this is because I hold my pencil incorrectly, so forming the letters in cursive is tricky and not flowing the way it is supposed to be. Which may be an argument for teaching it to children.

[Brenda]

Gundula wrote."I might actually be left-handed, and was likely forced to become right-handed when I started school. I wonder sometimes, if students having problems with learning cursive writing (or printing) might have similar issues.."

My son had a similar problem. He started out ambidextrous but favored the left more. Then he was forced into picking one hand by his Kindergarten teacher. The emphasis was placed on using his right hand for printing. It made it so hard for so long because in my mind he was still "wired" for using both hands that he naturally switched back and forth while writing. The confusion came in when he had to use one hand and we started to see alot of letter and number reversals. It is sorted out now but was hard at first.

[Cheryl, Host of Miscellaneous and Newbery Clubs]

I'm so glad that left-handed children are seldom forced, any longer, to switch. A child who is ambidextrous should be celebrated!

I like [laying with the computer fonts that look like cursive writing - anybody ever use those?

Bumping an old question: Chandra, or anybody who lives in a district where cursive is no longer taught, how do the children learn how to write their signatures?

[Lisa]

Lisa wrote: "I would think it would still be taught if only so children would be able to use it in their signature. The kids around me are still learning it in third grade."

(the old question ;-) )

[Lisa]

My answer: I guess when my kids were about 8, I'd teach them cursive, or at least teach them to write their names using cursive.

[Manybooks, Fiction Club host]

One of the beneficial things about children learning to read and write cursive script is that it exposes them to a type of writing that is slightly different than printed Latin letters. There are many different types of scripts in the world and by exposing a child to a script that's slightly different than printed letters, it might make it easier for them to recognise and/or learn languages that use scripts and alphabets different from our own (like Greek or Russian, for example) or to read handwriting samples or handwritten manuscripts (which is often not easy).

[Cheryl, Host of Miscellaneous and Newbery Clubs]

That's an interesting theory Gundula, that being able to read cursive might help one to be able to learn other scripts. Quite plausible.