Fantasy Aficionados discussion
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A Song of Ice and Fire
Good Lord! I may have to start watching Oxygen and WE... Just kidding. I don't go in for excessive torture of the protagonist as well. There are a few scenes which could bring a tear to the eye in MBotF (Memories of Ice - Book #3 - comes to mind). But it's not in the same spectrum as ASoIaF as far as I'm concerned.I guess it's difficult to judge who will like any particular tale until a sample has been read. But I wouldn't make up your mind solely on Gardens of the Moon (Book 1). If you do give MBotF a shot, wait until Deadhouse Gates (Book 2) before deciding on devoting your time and reading energy to the entire epic. The two books, read back to back, will give you a good idea of what to expect from the rest of the series.
Clay wrote: "Good Lord! I may have to start watching Oxygen and WE... Just kidding. I don't go in for excessive torture of the protagonist as well. There are a few scenes which could bring a tear to the eye in ..."You laugh but a running joke with my friends is that the Women's Entertainment channel shows more women being abused, killed, beaten and raped than regular network TV (as if that is possible).
Oh I'm very much aware of the odd subject matter on much of "women's TV". I suppose you could say a majority of that is simply morbid curiosity ... but it still seems excessive doesn't it?
Very much so.
I was thinking about how to explain Malazan to someone who isnt familiar with it, and I found an interview with Erikson where someone asked him about his writing process, and he made this statement in there:"They need to resonate right back through the reader's experience of all that has gone before. How is that achieved? For me, it's indulging in the exercise of dragging characters through hell, mostly, and thereby dragging the readers through hell with them. It's this ordeal that can give the smallest gestures vast impact at the story's end."
He does put people through hell, and brings the reader right with them....it just makes for a very INTENSE ride...
Clay wrote: "I guess it's difficult to judge who will like any particular tale until a sample has been read. But I wouldn't make up your mind solely on Gardens of the Moon (Book 1)." All this Erikson talk is really making me start to crave continuing on with the Malazan series. I read the first book, Gardens of the Moon, about a year or two ago. I enjoyed it, but it didn't seem like anything special. I have yet to read Deadhouse Gates.
I own it, though. And as I said, all this Erikson talk is making me want to dig in and see what everyone who loves it sees. I even took out my copy of Deadhouse Gates from my TBR bookshelf and put it on my dresser. It's staring at me with a cocked eyebrow. Questioning...tempting...
LOL! I might grab a copy of Gardens of the Moon from Kobo or someone, just to see how I like it. That way if I hate it, I can get rid of Memories of Ice. I pick random books up (on sale!) if I think I'll might read the series...
As a huge fan of GRRM, I was drawn to Erikson's Gardens of the Moon.I'm like you about it, Jason. I think I enjoyed it, I certainly don't have bad memories of it so I think I'll probably read it again and see how I feel the second time round, maybe read Deadhouse Gate soon after.
if your memories of ice is a trade paperback you can probably make some good money off it!
I loved GRRMs storyline, and now I'm starting "Gardens of the Moon, tough to get into, that's for sure. GRRM has a way of gragging the reader and taking them for a ride, and in Gardens, I find myself working my way through as if in deep snow. I am starting to become engrossed. Time will tell.
Thank you Clay for the sugestion. I must admit the Malazan series is near the top of my list for books that interest me. I think i want to read a stand alone book next so i'm going to read American Gods by Neil Gaiman. I loved his Sandman work but have never read a book by him.
After that two series stick out for me the Malazan series you mentioned, and Janny Wurts War of Lights and Shadow. I ordered Janny's To Ride Hell's Chasm and I think I will read that after American Gods. If I like it I may read War of Lights & Shadow. I am kind of leaning that way because i saw she is going to be at Dragon Con in Atlanta this year. I typicaly go to that and it would be cool to know her work and hear her talk. Who knows though as all this talk about Malazan does make me want to rethink my plan.
A bit back towards topic though have you all read the the Dunk & Egg tales: The Hedge Knight, The Sworn Sword, and The Mystery Knight?
I have the first two in Legend's I and Legends II the two collections put together by Robert Silverberg but I have not read them yet. I think i'm saving them for over the summer when i know i'll be craving more GRRM again. I heard they were good.
I just recently read The Hedge Knight graphic novel, it was cute and left me with a hankering to re-read Ice and Fire... I haven't read the actual short stories, but I have them and they are definitely on my list!
Like Dawn, I haven't read any of GRRM's shorts either. In fact, the only thing of his that I've read is ASoIaF. I wonder if his sluggishness in completing A Dance With Dragons has subconsciously soured his work in my mind ... who knows. But having loved ASoIaF as much as I did, I may now need to put his short stories in my TBR list.Dave, you can't go wrong with Gaiman. I thoroughly enjoyed American Gods - and Anansi Boys too, for that matter (though many did not). Another fantastic work of his (which he co-wrote with Terry Pratchett is Good Omens. One cool thing about Gaiman is that he seems to avoid the series. He excells at the standalone novel and it shines through. That's not to say series' aren't fun. A Song of Ice and Fire is amazing BECAUSE of it's depth and far-reaching plot. But many time a palate cleanser is needed between epics. :)
I have a few other of Martin's books in my TBR shelf, but have yet to get to them. I keep meaning to, because Martin is such an awesome author.
Ah I love the Dunk and Egg stories....I'd actually really love to see more of them in the future...though AFTER the completion of the series ;)
Even though Song of Ice and Fire is his most well known series, but Wild Cards is where I think he shines.
MrsJoseph wrote: "I would offer you my copy of a Storm of Swords...but I'm going to try to read AGoT One. More. Time. After that, I'm giving up!"I often feel alone in my opinion of AGoT. I tried and tried to like them and just couldn't. There are some series that I just grit my teeth and finish just to get to the end of the story. I don't know why I do it because I have never felt any sense of satisfaction.
Kevin I actually just looked into the Wild Cards the other day. It seems like an interesting concept.Jesslyn at least you gave it a chance! You can't ask any more then that. :)
I was checking out Neil Gaiman's blog and he reposted his "George RR Martin is Not Your Bitch" blog entry. I guess every year during his blog's anniversary month he lets readers write in to request a repost of an old post and this year it was the one about George RR Martin. Pretty interesting read if you have not seen it before: http://www.neilgaiman.com/
I know I’d love for George to finish the book sooner then later but ultimately i want it to be good too. Though I really can’t complain I still have 100 pages to go on my first read through so I have not been waiting as so many others have.
Huh, that is an interesting blog. Well thought out and not offensive at all.But - and here's the thing - if I'm a GRRM fan, then he IS my bitch.
It's like this, if GRRM writes a book and no one reads it, is GRRM an author? That could be debated all day. What can't be debated is that if a writer wants to make money in their career they have to bow to the wishes of their patrons.
I don't think that I have the right to harass GRRM - but his silly self shouldn't have a blog, either. That way no one can complain if he's spending all his time eating cheeseburgers - they wouldn't know.
GRRM and Neil Gaiman should get on their knees and thank their lucky stars that people like their work enough to care what they are doing. There are a million and one authors who would kill to be in that same position.
The moment when they feel I don't have the right to be upset about their lack of delivery is the moment they don't have the right to be upset that I don't purchase their works.
It’s a two way street and I have all the money.
@MrsJoseph I agree. While I'm not waiting on the next GRRM, I AM waiting on the last book from Jean Auel. I poo-poo all the WoT fans; I've been waiting since 1980 for this dang story to be finished.I think that writers should realize that it really, really sucks a lot of enjoyment out of the experience to have to wait this long. Anyone understands that real life interferes, sometimes you need a break, etc, but I think that once you start a series there is a certain obligation to your audience. I mean come on, if you are not writing for us, then who? If its yourself, then you needn't bother to publish in the first place.
And it is insulting to blithely detail all the stuff(other than finishing the series) that you're doing.
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I never read Gaiman, though. I always get him mixed up with the OTHER guy who bites off fairy tales. He's not the guy who did Wicked, is he?
Okay, I now totally appreciate the 80s/early 90s when I was in love with Stephen King.
Okay, now I'm a little hesitant to start this series lol. I'm okay with waiting for a book, I can be patient, but I hate when I start to get that feeling that its never going to be finished.Jesslyn - Oh MAN do I hear you about the Jean Auel novels. I started reading those when I was in high school ten years ago and it still isn't finished.
I've also been waiting forever for the third book in the Exiles trilogy by Melanie Rawn. It's been over ten years since the 2nd book was published and all of the storylines have just been left unfinished. I loved the books but it's a big ol' mess if you ask me.
Should I start A Game of Thrones? Or should I wait until he finishes the series? I just don't want to get sucked in and then left there haha
It is just like the Rawn series katieI personally am not getting myself anxious over it anymore, as I refuse to read any until it is finished.
@Katie, while you're deciding, the last book for Jean Auel's series comes out next month.The Land of Painted Caves
Oh man! I do not do well with incomplete series. That's just not my thing. If I start reading a series and I realize it is nowhere near complete, I stop and I don't start again until it's finished. I was reading Spirit Gate and stopped midway through when I realized it was incomplete. I read the first three of Jean Auel's Earth Children series when I was in high school. You guys are telling me she still isn't finished with this?! I'm not picking up the rest of them - but I have to admit its because I was sick to death of Ayla by book two. I felt like, What is she going to discover next? The secret of life?
Speaking of AGoT, I think I'm not even going to try to read this again. Especially since GRRM is not going to finish before I have grandchildren. I'm going to get rid of my HB copy of A Storm of Swords.
@MrsJoseph, you may have come up with a new discussion thread? Im sure that there are a lot of opinions on series length, time to completion, etc.
Jesslyn wrote: "@MrsJoseph, you may have come up with a new discussion thread? Im sure that there are a lot of opinions on series length, time to completion, etc.":-) Only thing is, what if we get a bunch of authors in here yelling at us? lol
MrsJoseph wrote: "Oh man! I do not do well with incomplete series. That's just not my thing. If I start reading a series and I realize it is nowhere near complete, I stop and I don't start again until it's finish..."Hey at least she is finally coming out with a new book next month, The Land of Painted Caves, not like Martin, who knows when the last five chapters of A Dance with Dragons is going to be done, then come out.
Kevin wrote: "Hey at least she is finally coming out with a new book next month, The Land of Painted Caves, not like Martin, who knows when the last five chapters of A Dance with Dragons is going to be done, then come out...."The more I think about it the more I realize that there were HUGE parts of the series that I didn't like and I had a frown the whole time I read the last book. That whole virgin ceremony struck me as stupid (really, really stupid).
Anyway, I'm going to get the last book because I want to know the whole story. My fingers are crossed that I won't have to hold my nose thru it. Since I read on a Kindle, I don't have the option of throwing the book across the room everytime it irritates me.
Umm, yeah, I'm not going to tell you how old I am, but let's just say that I read the first 3 books over 10 years ago. I think I've past that point in my life and moved on. :)Plus, I really got annoyed with Ayla. If she discovered one more thing I might discover murder, lol.
I read them as they were published. I was two years out of high school. I am forcing myself to read what were my favorite two books - The Valley of Horses & The Mammoth Hunters. If I can't get thru those, not sure what I'll do.I took the whole discovery thing as examples of how the human race discovered things and not like Ayla did. I was more irritated with the sex scenes. They disrupted the whole flow of the books for me. But that's me. If the sex is not integral to the story and doesn't advance it, I just don't understand the purpose.
Maggie - UGH. Great. If it's just like the Rawn books I really don't want to start. I'm going to hang on to the book and just keep an ear open for him finishing the series. Is there *any* kind of time line for this or is it all just up in the air? I don't care if authors come in and yell at us haha. I'm shelling out my money for your books. I also don't care if it takes you 5 months or 5 years to finish the next book just pick a deadline and *stick to it*! lol It's not like these major authors have dayjobs...writing is all they do. Why shouldn't I expect my books on time?
Jesslyn - Thanks for the heads up! Haha I had no idea she was finally publishing the last novel. I had stopped paying attention. I'll probably read it just bc I did read all of the other books and I'd like to see where she ends it. It won't be my first priority though.
Amazon STILL has the 2008 release date on there if you can beleive that! I guess they are even sick of changing it. I am guessing late 2012 at the earliest. It is just to frustrating to think too much about when there is no end in sight.
I just finished Feast for Crows. I'm offcially on the clock waiting with everyone else now.. :(
haha dave, I know how you feel. At this stage, I couldn't even tell you what happens in Feast of Crows. Long time ago. I half believe we will never know how the series ends, I mean if it takes him this long for a Dance with Dragons, are we talking 20 more years before we finish the series? gah!!!
A Dance With Dragons firm publication date of July 12th 2011. :)
A-yep. Dave is correct. I was just notified by Tor.com. July 12th, 2011 is confirmed:http://www.tor.com/blogs/2011/03/set-...
I will beleive it when it hits the stores! lol
Oh, Maggie ... have a little faith! :)j.k. I share your healthy skepticism!
I had faith it was going to come out in 2006 Clay :)
Accord to an interview GRRM did with Entertainment Weekly, it is really done and off. So it looks for reals this time!
Please Please PLEASE let it be true!!! LOL
I actually lost sleep last night over the dilemma of "Should I start reading the series soon or do I wait until the entire thing is finished???"So sleepy now, zzzzzzzz....
I'm going to have to start rereading again! Since I reread the first a couple months ago, I'm going to start with Clash of Kings.
excellent, now you'll be able to enjoy the awesome jackassery that is Theon Greyjoy all over again. go, theon! my favorite character to see fail.
i just got The Art of George R. R. Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire.it sure is great. but i felt incredibly dorky buying it. almost felt like i should have bought something by nabakov or james joyce to balance it out.
Fantasy Aficionados
Books mentioned in this topic
A Dance with Dragons (other topics)Ulysses (other topics)
The World of Robert Jordan's the Wheel of Time (other topics)
The Valley of Horses (other topics)
The Mammoth Hunters (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
Terry Pratchett (other topics)Steven Erikson (other topics)
The thing that makes it so good is that it is such a 'huge' world. A really well thought out, complex world.