The Sword and Laser discussion
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World War Z
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WWZ: What is your zombie apocalypse contingency plan?
The right sailboat can keep a family long enough for the zombies to be beaten back, or stave themselves out. I've yet to see a story where zombies swim in the ocean.
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Hint... beware of the shallows. They don't need to breathe.
I'd be the nerdy, selfish kid of the group, so I'd be among the first to die.
It's all about first come first serve. Even the best plan falls apart if you aren't executing it right away. Sure, Costco sounds like a great place to board yourself up in, what with all the food, clothing, and exercise equipment, but if you aren't the first one there, don't count on getting in. Same thing with weapons. Chances are that you won't be at the weapons store before everyone else. Then you have zombies and desperate, paranoid people with sharpened blades and loaded firearms to contend with. It's best, in my opinion, to have some type of weapon with sufficient ammo that you're proficient in already in your possession before the outbreak gets bad. If you can't find a place to board up in, you don't really have a choice but to stay on the move. Grab a car and drive away from heavily populated areas. If the zombies are the lumbering kind, you can probably risk sneaking into small towns for gas and supplies. If they're the fast kind, you better hope that you keep running into middle-of-nowhere gas stations and that you know how to live off the land.
Preferably, you can do all this with a very small group of people. 2 others max. It's best to stay away from as many people as you can, but you're gonna need some help. Someone's gonna have to keep watch while you sleep or siphon gas or collect food.
Shotgun blast to the head.Sorry, but anyone who thinks they can survive the zombiepocalypse is deluding themselves. When the dead rise, many will suffer more due to the false hope they get from people like Max Brooks.
Abandon all hope and hope they have jacuzzis in Hell, that's my motto.
Cameron wrote: "It's all about first come first serve. Even the best plan falls apart if you aren't executing it right away. Sure, Costco sounds like a great place to board yourself up in, what with all the food, ..."Speaking of living off the land, Taverncast had a great show back in 2008 about how to survive. Matthew Stein, author of When Technology Fails (Revised & Expanded): A Manual for Self-Reliance, Sustainability, and Surviving the Long Emergency, was on the show and seemed to really know his stuff.
I've been meaning to pick it up and read it, but I can't believe the world will end before the last Harry Potter movie comes out. If World War Z makes me sufficiently paranoid, though, I might bump it up in my to read list.
Cameron wrote: "It's all about first come first serve. Even the best plan falls apart if you aren't executing it right away. Sure, Costco sounds like a great place to board yourself up in, what with all the food, ..."I recommend viewing the classic film, Panic in Year Zero. It's about a nuclear war, not the zombiepocalypse, but many of its lessons are applicable to any end-of-the-world scenario. It's about a typical 1950s American family who are leaving town on a camping trip when WWIII starts.
First thing Dad, a real Ward Cleaver type, does is leave the highway and find a grocery store in a small town and stocks up on extra food before the grocer can find out what's going down. It's very important that you don't tell anyone what's going on if they don't know, especially store keepers -- if they know, they might jack up prices, or worse keep the supplies for their own survival. (Greedy bastards!)
Next, Dad heads over to the hardware store, where he learns an important lesson -- the three day waiting period on handguns has no exemption for the end of civilization. You have to make sure you have weapons stockpiled in advance, otherwise you're going to have to beat up the poor schmuck at the store and hope he doesn't have his own gun handy.
Then he stops for gas, only to find the gas station attendant has raised the price to $3/gallon (this was the 1950s, so figure $30/gallon in adjusted dollars). Capitalism makes no allownaces for armageddon either, so make sure you have enough cash for the price gougers, or else have your guns ready to go.
Then finally the family holes up in a forest, making sure to destroy a bridge behind them so no one else can get in, and then camouflage their camper. The mother objects, but Dad knows his stuff -- you don't want other survivors horning in on your territory, taking away resources and stealing your stuff.
Eventually other people do settle in the area, including the post-apocalyptic bikers who are looking for women to join their harem (as much as this can actually be shown in a movie of the 1950s). This is of course the most important lesson for surviving the apocalypse -- you need to keep your women safe and you need lots of them. As the famous 1964 study, conducted by Dr. Werner Strangelove showed, the ideal ratio is 10 women per 1 man. It'll be tough work, men, but it's up to you to repopulate the world!
I don't believe we would survive in the area of the country I am in. Infrastructure is very poor, lots of trees which would offer superior concealment to the zombies, and not a lot of farm land to raise your own food supply.We do have a restaurant where the patio is on the edge of a cliff. This would be where could create a last stand before the inevitable wave of zombies would devour us.
I play L4D1/2 for practice on my zombie killing, I just hope its a virus infection not a blood or im totality screwed
Sean wrote: "I recommend viewing the classic film, Panic in Year Zero. It's about a nuclear war, not the zombiepocalypse, but many of its lessons are applicable to any end-of-the-world scenario. It's about a typical 1950s American family who are leaving town on a camping trip when WWIII starts."Sounds like me and Panic in Year Zero have similar apocalypse plans. I'll check it out.
Ix wrote: "I've been meaning to pick it up and read it, but I can't believe the world will end before the last Harry Potter movie comes out. If World War Z makes me sufficiently paranoid, though, I might bump it up in my to read list."
At least if the world does end before the last Harry Potter film, it'll also end before the last Twilight movie. So there's that.
lol me and my family have literally come up with a plan to survive. we live on either side of the u.s. (me and my cuz) so we have the lat and long of where we would meet, and have stocked supplies. lol its also a plan for nuclear meltdown lol :)
Cameron wrote: "At least if the world does end before the last Harry Potter film, it'll also end before the last Twilight movie. So there's that."The fact that the world couldn't end before the Lord of the Rings movies finished got me through a few good years.
Now that you've pointed out a positive to the world ending, I'll have to buy the book tonight and learn to carry bread yeast and live on tree bark.
I am heading above the snowline. I can make fire and wear insulation to keep myself from freezing. Show me a zombie with the same skills! Anything below 32 degrees F and the buggars start to freeze up. The living is harsh but can be done, and has been done for centuries in places like Greenland and far northern Alaska.
Rick wrote: "I am heading above the snowline. I can make fire and wear insulation to keep myself from freezing. Show me a zombie with the same skills! Anything below 32 degrees F and the buggars start to fre..."World War Z shows us why this is a bad plan.
I guess one last kiss during the last picnic together and off to find out what the plan should had been, since such war will be for the first time. :)
Sean wrote: World War Z shows us why this is a bad planCan't just drive your RV to the snow and hope for the best. You have to be all in for the hunter gatherer life. No need to go north if your notions of food begin and end with the grocery store, or your idea of sleep requires 4 hard walls, a roof, a bed, and heat. Its the freakin zombiepocolypse! Some discomfort is to be expected!! Plus I am guessing the polar bears might just take a dislike to any undead wandering through their territory and put an end to them.
Rick wrote: "Plus I am guessing the polar bears might just take a dislike to any undead wandering through their territory and put an end to them. "Yeah, but: Zombie polar bears.
aldenoneil wrote: "Rick wrote: "Plus I am guessing the polar bears might just take a dislike to any undead wandering through their territory and put an end to them. "Yeah, but: Zombie polar bears."
Mmmmm, zombie polar bear stew!
Have you all watched The Colony on Discovery Chanel? I highly recommend that show (only 8 episodes, I think). Great training tips on rebuilding a society and the psychological/resource pitfalls groups encounter in post-apocalyptic situations.It has to be said:
I, for one, would welcome our zombie flesh-eating overlords.
(I would pull the Bill Murray and pretend to be a Zombie whenever I need to go shopping or want to visit a park. Rule #1, baby!)
Veronica wrote: "Hint... beware of the shallows. They don't need to breathe."That's why I'd avoid any of the small islands on the coast for the first few months at least. Ideally I'd grab a boat like the Hinckley Sou'Wester 71. It holds 600 gallons of fresh water and draws over 16' with the board down. So not really a boat for the shallows.
I did get an image of "Waterworld" with Zombies now though. *shiver*
Rick wrote: "Sean wrote: World War Z shows us why this is a bad planCan't just drive your RV to the snow and hope for the best. You have to be all in for the hunter gatherer life. No need to go north if y..."
And then everyone else has the same idea, and the next thing you know, all the deer are gone and you're reduced to eating squirrels.
Or you could take a cue from the zombies. I mean, if you're serious about survival, you have to stake out your territory and defend it from interlopers. And there's no sense in letting good meat go to waste.
my plan would be to become a zombie and hold a S & L meetup so I could eat YOUR brains
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Veronica wrote: "If (and when) the zombie apocalypse hits, do you have a plan of action?
There are a lot of factors, of course (are they fast zombies, or lumberers?). Luckily, our featured author also has writt..."
Somehow an isolated farm at the foot of a mountain in Romania sounds like a bad place to be, if just for the cinematic qualities. It begs for that apocalyptic cut scene treatment. You know, pretty farm and mountain, framed against a multi-hued sky. A happy family sits down for dinner. Enter the wave of zombies, and cut back to the main characters.
I loved many of the rules in Zombieland, especially:1. Cardio
2. Double tap
7. Travel light.
I imagine a lot of traveling until I find a good property (easily defendable) whose owners have (hopefully) disappeared/fallen to the zombies.
I have a problem taking zombies seriously. In my opinion they can be a bit of fun BUT this is not scifi or fantasy but cheesy horror. Zombies are boring. Zombies are cliché, I justs cannot really immerse myself in Zombie stories, I just don't really get Zombies I guess, they belong in hackneyed horror films, not serious literature. (ducks for cover now)
Ok, first off you all should be prepared, zombies or not. Both my daughters live and work in NYC. I bought them each a small survivors kit for Christmas. Nothing fancy but enough to help them get out of the city in case of any disaster. You can get them at Costco, btw. I included some gold and silver coins, but could not think of a legal(or safe), way to include a gun. They thought dad had really gone over the edge. Then they read WWZ and they got it. We were recently all together at a family wedding and they both thanked me. I am still working on the gun problem, but thinking a couple of ice axes might be appropriate for gifts this christmas. Perfect zombie weapons, but even better for moving over rough terrain and personal defense. So if you made it this far, and don't think I am nuts, I will restate my original point. BE PREPARED, regardless. Being prepared is not a one time task, but a continuous process. Read One Second After if the WWZ does not get you motivated.
First step, draw up a plan that fits your specific scenario. Do you need to evac or can you stay put? If you stay put, do you have enough food and water to last? What about meds, do you have enough of the ones you need? Can you defend yourself (and your supplies)? Do you have the right form of currency to survive in a devastated economy, either barter or hard assets. It becomes a thought exercise after a while. Also totally agreed the being fully prepared does not guarantee survival, just gives you a lot more options that you will need. Better to have some choices then none at all.
I am not being paranoid here, just being prepared. Given the current world we find ourselves in there are so many real threats out there that using the model of a zombie apocalypse ends up making some sense. After I read Max Brooks books, I was kind of surprised at how popular these books became. Perhaps a reflection of where we all are at today.
Ix wrote:Speaking of living off the land, Taverncast had a great show back in 2008 about how to survive. Matthew Stein, author of When Technology Fails (Revised & Expanded): A Manual for Self-Reliance, Sustainability, and Surviving the Long Emergency, was on the show and seemed to really know his stuff.
I was curious so I looked this up on amazon. Could definitely be helpful and I see there's a kindle edition.
Wait! How long does the battery on a kindle last?
Curt wrote: "I am still working on the gun problem, but thinking a couple of ice axes might be appropriate for gifts this christmas."Melee weapons are a pretty bad idea as a primary means of protection in a zombie apocalypse situation. For one, melee weapons require that you get in close. Not a good idea with zombies.
For two, let's assume that whatever cause zombiefication is transported through bodily fluids. Chances are that you're going to get a few scrapes and cuts during your quest for survival. If you attack a zombie with a melee weapon like a sword or an axe, blood will be spilt...on you. Which means every open wound is a possible entry point. Now you're infected.
I don't mean to say that melee weapons are useless, but it's best to use ranged weapons. That being said, a melee weapon is probably a pretty good idea for any non zombie related apocalypse. You know, the ones way more likely to happen.
I'd try my hand at zombie training. How hard could it be? "Fire is your friend!"
Aeryn98 wrote: "I was curious so I looked this up on amazon. Could definitely be helpful and I see there's a kindle edition.Wait! How long does the battery on a kindle last? "
Yeah, I'd think this is probably the one book you'd want in hardcopy. There are a variety of lists on how long to treat water, how to eat tree bark, and how to get wheat grains that will last 150 years.
I just listened to this podcast again, and I recommend it. You can download it here: http://dl.affiliates.futureus.com/tav.... The first hour is the hosts talking about how prepared they are if things went down. If you want to skip the banter and go right to the author, the interview starts at 1 hour 17 minutes.
Best quote from the banter: "If power's off for more than 15 minutes, I automatically conclude zombie apocalypse."
Curt wrote: "Ok, first off you all should be prepared, zombies or not. Both my daughters live and work in NYC. I bought them each a small survivors kit for Christmas. Nothing fancy but enough to help them get o..."Please tell me this guy is joking or being amusingly ironic.
Changed my mind about Zombies courtesy of Plants v Zombies on my Ipad. Just finished the campaign and been charmed by the ending credits. Altogether now ' there's a zombie on your lawn, ther's a zombie on your lawn'.
If they're all female Zombies I'll just ask them out on a date; that should scare them off. Hopefully the dude Zombies would follow them and leave my succulent brains alone.If that doesn't work I always have my laser beam eyes.
Noel wrote: "Please tell me this guy is joking or being amusingly ironic. "In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with a little preparation. Procrastination is the only thing that's kept me from having something concrete in place. If you have a survivor pack and never need it, great. At least he's not killing off his neighbors and seizing their land in preparation for the New Curt Order (I hope).
The gamut of needing a survival plan runs from zombie apocalypse(very unlikely), through invasion (Wolverines!), long term power outages, debilitating natural disasters, economic collapse, viral outbreak, or simple social upheaval.
If you believe that you'll have the same drive to your job everyday and that John Roberts will continue to greet your mornings on CNN for the rest of your life, that's great. I have a natural tendency to believe that things in the future will continue to progress as they have in the past; thus I continue to have life insurance and invest in my company's 401k rather than live in the woods and eat squirrel stew. However, if you think that life will continue without being interrupted by any of the above list, even if it's a short interruption, then you have more blind faith than me.
If the world ends in 2012, then my 401k would have been better spent on entertainment, charity and alcohol (maybe not that order). If society collapses, my investments would have been better spent on bullets and grain. Just do what gives you confidence that your future and the future of your loved ones is assured. For some it's life insurance and a sizable estate. For others, it's raising John Conner as a survivalist. And for some, it's a bit of all these. Just don't become involved with someone that John Cusack's romantically interested in. Automatic death sentence, no matter the event that occurs.
Ix wrote: "Noel wrote: "Please tell me this guy is joking or being amusingly ironic. "In my opinion, there's nothing wrong with a little preparation. Procrastination is the only thing that's kept me from h..."
You could be right. I'm just not one of nature's planners. I even hate to book my holidays months in advance as it all seems so distant, then suddenly it's July and all the good hotels are booked!!
I never learn.
While I don't really plan for a zombie invasion, I am a prepper like Curt. I have my bug out bag (or Zombie survival kit if you want to call it that) in the car at all times. Ironically I am the guy people turn to at the family reunion because i have all my preps in the car. I have yet to fail to have what someone needed in my car. yesterday at a funeral, we needed bugspray and insect salve. I saved the day. for any of you really interested in preparing for the zombie invasion, listen to the Survivor podcast. Well not really zombies, but its all good info.
I live in Texas. Those poor zombies will never have a chance.
But will they find the brains there sufficiently nourishing?
My Zombie Apocalypse Plan:Supplies:
1) 3 month supply of MREs and water purification tablets per person.
2) Long Range rifle, handgun, 2 machete, and long iron prod per person. Plenty of ammo and tools to make additional ammunition if/when necessary
3) Camping gear including tent, rope, large heavy duty pack, portable facilities, etc.
4) Shipping containers and welding tools and plenty of steel plate and/or explosives (and explosives expert.)
The Plan:
Take all supplies and pack into shipping container with self and weld shut with steel plate. If multiple people weld several containers together with steel plate and weld completely shut.
This plan is safe for small groups (<5) people but large groups will have to find alternative means. Perhaps climbing to the upper stairs of a large office building and blowing the stairs and lower floors.
Either way this is only a temporary measure while the inevitable die-off occurs. After that, the best option is to remain mobile in small groups (4-6) and away from urban areas.
Travelling light and quick to avoid any concentrations of the undead, and luring small groups into traps to kill them off. Slowly the undead will all die, or you will. Hopefully taking as many of them as possible with you.
Noel wrote: "But will they find the brains there sufficiently nourishing?"Easy there, pilgrim. Don't mess with Texas ;0)
Noel wrote: "Curt wrote: "Ok, first off you all should be prepared, zombies or not. Both my daughters live and work in NYC. I bought them each a small survivors kit for Christmas. Nothing fancy but enough to he..."Noel - Not a joke, very serious about this, but I am not even close to being a "survivalist" killing off my neighbors for the 'New Curt Order' (have to admit the sound of that is compelling thought - just kidding Noel). Just look at Katrina or any other disaster scenario. The human race has an ugly tendency to slip into madness when a large mass of people suddenly have their comfortable life taken from them, even for just a few days. How much footage of empty shelves in grocery stores with the threat of oncoming storms do you have to see to maybe stock a few extra cans of soup or have a a couple gallons on bottled water on hand?
As I said, being prepared is simply a matter of giving yourself a few more choices when the poop hits the fan.
Cameron wrote: Melee weapons are a pretty bad idea as a primary means of prot..."Cameron - Agreed, but there is an interesting line the book takes on this if you have not read yet.
Philip wrote: "Noel wrote: "But will they find the brains there sufficiently nourishing?"Easy there, pilgrim. Don't mess with Texas ;0)"
I'm in Texas also. We're immune from zombies and brain slugs for the same reason; yet strongly susceptible to the hypno-toads.
The thing that worries me about Texas zombies is that shooting a gun is very nearly muscle memory around here. We'd be the part of the country where zombies drive pickups and have shotgun racks.
Curt wrote: "the 'New Curt Order' (have to admit the sound of that is compelling though "Just remember where the idea came from when it's time to appoint cabinet positions.
Down here in Florida it is always a good idea to be prepared for zombies, hurricanes, or both. Besides backing up data madly and scanning and storing important documents online (that is for hurricanes rather than zombies), I have several backpacks with various degrees of "survivabilitiness". Also, a good book on all this stuff is When All Hell Breaks Loose by Cody Lundin -- very practical, e.g. what kind of food is best to store. Of course, it needs to be supplemented with the The Zombie Survival Guide: Complete Protection From the Living Dead. Now if only there were a way to survive politicians and oil...
My plan is just to disbelieve them. Poof! Problem solved. :-D
Ix wrote: I'm in Texas also. We're immune from zombies and brain ..."Too funny! I didn't consider how particularly aggressive Lone Star zombies would be. "pickups and shotgun racks" - nice!
The Sword and Laser
Books mentioned in this topic
Lucifer's Hammer (other topics)The Zombie Survival Guide: Complete Protection from the Living Dead (other topics)
When All Hell Breaks Loose: Stuff You Need to Survive When Disaster Strikes (other topics)
One Second After (other topics)
When Technology Fails (Revised & Expanded): A Manual for Self-Reliance, Sustainability, and Surviving the Long Emergency: A Manual for Self-Reliance, Sustainability, ... Surviving the Long Emergency, 2nd Edition (other topics)
More...
There are a lot of factors, of course (are they fast zombies, or lumberers?). Luckily, our featured author also has written a guide for us, called The Zombie Survival Guide: Complete Protection From the Living Dead.
This is not required reading, but it does have some good tips. What would YOU do if the zombies attacked?