The History Book Club discussion
NAPOLEONIC WARS
>
11. HF - MASTER AND COMMANDER - CHAPTER 11 (373 - 420) (07/12/10 - 07/18/10) ~ No spoilers, please
date
newest »
newest »
Have to take son to swimming and a doctor's appointment this morning, so I won't get the summary up 'til this afternoon. But the discussion is open, so feel free to jump in with your thoughts any time!
After the triumph of catching the Cacafuego, Jack and his crew return to Mahon. Jack feels a lot of sadness at loosing Dillon and Ellis, but some real pride at gaining such a victory. Suddenly everything is well with Molly again, and Jack spends a lot of time with her. However, Lord Keith is away and Jack reports to Captain Harte. Harte is not happy with Jack's relationship with Molly, or with the troubles to his finances caused by young Ellis' death. He does all he can to make things difficult for Jack. At first things seem balanced by the extra help and accolades given by other captains and men. But the Sophie is sent to Malta, and when they return Harte says their cruising time is over and assigns them a boring convoy mission.
During the convoy mission they are under strict orders to not take the time to attack other ships, but Jack can't resist firing some merchants. However, that attracts the attention of several French ships-of-the-line, led by a rear-admiral. The French chase the Sophie down. Despite trying every trick in the book (throwing the guns and supplies overboard, intricate manouvers), the Sophie is overtaken and has its sails and rigging destroyed. Jack surrenders.
Okay, there is some definite tension at the end of these last chapters. Death of Dillon last week, surrender of the Sophie this week. Wow. I think it seems even more intense because there wasn't as much in earlier chapters.I'm also impressed by how much Dillon was a part of the success of the Sophie. There are a lot of references in the chapter to the men knowing and following Jack's commands ahead of time, thanks to Dillon's training and expectations. Poor Dalziel seems a little lost. But then Dalziel is the admiral's cousin, and maybe doesn't need to be as good to get promotions.
Dalziel always had an uphill battle to fight, even more so as the crew had hoped Thomas Pullings would be made lieutenant.An intriguing chapter it has been. Jack having the wind taken out of sails, pardon my pun, by Captain Harte. By putting the success of his action against the Cacafuego down to his "prodigious luck". Jack's indiscretion with Molly Harte hit's home with full force here I think.
Talking about Mrs Harte I love the line in the book where Stephen talk to Jack about hiswound. ‘It is a wound, if you wish. But not from our battle with the Cacafuego. Some lady of your acquaintance has been too liberal with her favours. Too universally kind.' I must say I love the use of language in this book.
Combining these two parts of the chapter, do we think the Author is making a morale statement?
Michael, I think clearly the author is making a morale statement. Dangerous relationships and actions have consequences. It would seem to me that the author is showing the results of lacking discipline in both Jack's professional and personal life has lead him to the failure he's about to face.He has played too loose with a lot of things and now it appears that others will have to pay for his transgressions.
It also hit me hard when Jack said to strike the colors. For anyone who has been in or involved with the military, the concept of surrender is the most demoralizing thing you can can imagine.
The description of Jack's wound was definitely fun, Michael. There were a lot of things like that in this chapter for me.I agree that the author is making a moral statement. I do think there are several ways to read it. The first thing that came to my mind was "You can't have your cake and eat it too." Or, Jack can't have an affair with a man's wife and then expect that man to give him the respect he may have earned professionally. In general I think the book is written such that our sympathies are with Jack and the crew. Jack is the protagonist, the hero of the book. And the crew certainly had nothing to do with Jack's philandering. I guess Harte is so vindictive that it is hard to feel any sympathy for him as the Wronged Spouse.
I also keep thinking of Women as Jack's tragic flaw. We've seen and talked about his abilities as a captain. And, yes, he has other weaknesses (e.g. drink), but Women seem to be the one that pulls him down.
The striking of the colors was a huge emotional pull in this book, Rodney. For so much of the book there wasn't that much emotional depth. Perhaps O'Brian was taking the time to gently engage us in his characters. I felt some pride earlier when Jack roused his men to board the Cacafuego. Dillon's (and Ellis') death was certainly heartbreaking, but not as deeply felt as the surrender of the Sophie. At least not for me. Perhaps because Dillon's death was balanced by the triumph of winning. And the death was something of a quick surprise without the dread of anticipation. Not to mention the surrender involves all the people we've grown to love in the book.
Michael wrote: "Dalziel always had an uphill battle to fight, even more so as the crew had hoped Thomas Pullings would be made lieutenant.An intriguing chapter it has been. Jack having the wind taken out of sa..."
I also loved that section from the book where Stephen talks to Jack about his wound, very funny. Another bit from the book that I enjoyed was from the page just prior to that:
"...'It was she as set her bonnet at him!' Cried Mrs Williams, who had never yet let her husband finish a sentence since his 'I will' at Trinity Church, Plymouth Dock, in 1782."
I am really enjoying the humour in this book a great deal :)
Here are a couple of my favorite funnies from this chapter.At the concert, Stephen shows up "powdered, respectable apart from having forgotten his shirt" (page 388). Minor detail, of course.
And Stephen's way of putting things often makes me giggle. When he is fixing up Jack, he says, "We shall soon have you on your feet again.... you will certainly be in a state to ruin your health, prospects, reason, features and happiness again by the time we raise Cape Mola" (page 389). And how well Stephen now knows Jack!
When Jack is frustrated over how long his expected promotion is taking, he looks at who has been made post-captain and realizes "he would be junior to them for ever. Time lost; and these disturbing rumours of peace" (page 398).
Welcome to the historical fiction discussion of Master and Commander by Patrick O'Brian.
This is the reading assignment for week eleven - (July 12th, 2010 to July 18th, 2010)
This is the second historical fiction group selected book.
We will open up a thread for each week's reading. Please make sure to post in the particular thread dedicated to those specific chapters and page numbers to avoid spoilers if you are catching up.
This book was kicked off on May 3rd.
This discussion is being led by assisting moderator of historical fiction - Elizabeth S.
We always enjoy the participation of all group members. Amazon, Barnes and Noble and other noted on line booksellers do have copies of the book and shipment can be expedited. The book can also be obtained easily at your local library, or on your Kindle.
This thread opens up Monday, July 12th for discussion. This is a non spoiler thread.
Welcome,
~Bentley
TO ALWAYS SEE ALL WEEKS' THREADS SELECT VIEW ALL