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The Man Without Qualities
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The Man Without Qualities by R. Musil
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Sam
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Nov 03, 2022 08:56AM
I will post when I finish Michael Kohlhaas.
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I enjoyed Michael Kohlhaas more in the first half than second. I think my translation did not catch the subtleties of the legal and ethical tussle and much of the second half seemed redundant but neither in a humorous or ironic way. Glad I read it though and can see the influence on Kafka.
Sam wrote: "I enjoyed Michael Kohlhaas..."
Nice to read you review, Sam. After Musil's prose works, I read three novellas by Richard (von) Schaukal: Mimi Lynx (1904), Die Sängerin (The Singer, 1906) and Dionys-bácsi (1922). From Musil's letters and friends, we know that Schaukal – even more than other better known writers of the time – was his literary model in the early 1900s, at the time of Törless (1906) and at least until Unions (1911). Personally, I found that the most striking similarities are with Unions and with the themes of The Man Without Qualities, and not so much with Törless. On a side note, Schaukal was from Brno, where Musil also lived, and worked in Mährisch-Weißkirchen, where and when (1894-97) Musil attended the local military college – location and events connected with the story narrated in Törless.
Nice to read you review, Sam. After Musil's prose works, I read three novellas by Richard (von) Schaukal: Mimi Lynx (1904), Die Sängerin (The Singer, 1906) and Dionys-bácsi (1922). From Musil's letters and friends, we know that Schaukal – even more than other better known writers of the time – was his literary model in the early 1900s, at the time of Törless (1906) and at least until Unions (1911). Personally, I found that the most striking similarities are with Unions and with the themes of The Man Without Qualities, and not so much with Törless. On a side note, Schaukal was from Brno, where Musil also lived, and worked in Mährisch-Weißkirchen, where and when (1894-97) Musil attended the local military college – location and events connected with the story narrated in Törless.
In 1903 Rilke wrote: «Of all my books just a few are indispensable to me, and two even are always among my things, wherever I am. They are about me here too: the Bible, and the books of the great Danish writer, Jens Peter Jacobsen.»
Musil, Mann, Kafka, Zweig, Sigmund Freud – they all considered him a major influence. When you think Jacobsen died at 38...
I'm beggining from his short proses, Mogens and Other Stories (1882), then approaching the two novels, Marie Grubbe (1876) and Niels Lyhne (1880).
Musil, Mann, Kafka, Zweig, Sigmund Freud – they all considered him a major influence. When you think Jacobsen died at 38...
I'm beggining from his short proses, Mogens and Other Stories (1882), then approaching the two novels, Marie Grubbe (1876) and Niels Lyhne (1880).
Fed wrote: "In 1903 Rielke wrote: «... and the books of the great Danish writer, Jens Peter Jacobsen..."Thank you for the hint. I admit I've never heard of Jacobson before. ... another author on my to-read list *sigh*
Fed wrote: "In 1903 Rielke wrote: «Of all my books just a few are indispensable to me, and two even are always among my things, wherever I am. They are about me here too: the Bible, and the books of the great ..."I will read a couple of stories,but don't know if I have time for a novel. I am going to try and squeeze a Huysmans in as well along with some more Musil. I have been trying to let Torless sort out in my thoughts before posting on it. I will put my thoughts up tomorrow on the Torless buddy read.
sabagrey wrote: "Fed wrote: "In 1903 Rielke wrote: «... and the books of the great Danish writer, Jens Peter Jacobsen..."Thank you for the hint. I admit I've never heard of Jacobson before. ... another author on ..."
On mine too, since I read the Rilke book. :) Also nominated it before, but it wasn´t well received. Perhaps I´ll join this read too, as there are several I want to read. :)
Sam wrote: "I will read a couple of stories,but don't know if I have time for a novel. I am going to try and squeeze a Huysmans in as well along with some more Musil. I have been trying to let Torless sort out in my thoughts before posting on it. I will put my thoughts up tomorrow on the Torless buddy read.."
Jacobsen: Of the six stories, "Mogens" (1872) is 40 pages long and the other five stories (1875-1882) together make 50 pages. Interestingly, there's also a fragment of a "Doktor Faust", 3 pages, that in 1912 was illustrated and printed, Gothic type on parchment, in one single copy by Kristian Kongstad, now in the Royal Library of Copenhagen – breathtaking! ... I've just read "Mogens": reminescent of "Kohlhaas", poetic, very hard to define (both realism and symbolism). I read Jacobsen wrote just a few lines a day, aiming for stylistic perfection.
Huysmans: I've just finished reading his seven major novels, including "le Roman de Durtal", the four-novel cycle mirroring Huysmans's gradual conversion to Catholicism culminating in his monastic experiences. I preferred the earlier works: Drifting (1882, the shortest), Against Nature (1884, the bestest) and The Damned (1891, perhaps the best known, because of the graphic depictions of occultist/satanic fin-de-siecle Paris; slightly overrated, I'd say).
Törless: Looking forward to your comments!
sabagrey wrote: " ... another author on my to-read list *sigh*"
Haha! I know...
Jacobsen: Of the six stories, "Mogens" (1872) is 40 pages long and the other five stories (1875-1882) together make 50 pages. Interestingly, there's also a fragment of a "Doktor Faust", 3 pages, that in 1912 was illustrated and printed, Gothic type on parchment, in one single copy by Kristian Kongstad, now in the Royal Library of Copenhagen – breathtaking! ... I've just read "Mogens": reminescent of "Kohlhaas", poetic, very hard to define (both realism and symbolism). I read Jacobsen wrote just a few lines a day, aiming for stylistic perfection.
Huysmans: I've just finished reading his seven major novels, including "le Roman de Durtal", the four-novel cycle mirroring Huysmans's gradual conversion to Catholicism culminating in his monastic experiences. I preferred the earlier works: Drifting (1882, the shortest), Against Nature (1884, the bestest) and The Damned (1891, perhaps the best known, because of the graphic depictions of occultist/satanic fin-de-siecle Paris; slightly overrated, I'd say).
Törless: Looking forward to your comments!
sabagrey wrote: " ... another author on my to-read list *sigh*"
Haha! I know...
P.S. On Huysmans: Drifting contains themes relevant to The Man Without Qualities, but is not emblematic of the new style "invented" later by the author and subsequently developed by the modernists: the novel-essay. Huysmans's next mayor novel, Against Nature, is considered the first example of novel-essay and is discussed in Ercolino's study on this genre. Against Nature might also be the most emblematic of Huysmans's works: in the "Preface written twenty years after the novel" (or equivalent title) the author explains how this one work already contained all the elements of his later ones, including the "seed" of his conversion to Catholicism. This later "Preface" is worth reading, if you read the novel.
★ This is the thread for the January-March 2023 read of The Man Without Qualities by Robert Musil. The discussion contains spoilers. Please include chapter numbers at the start of your comment, thank you.
Are you going to be on board?
What are your plans like?
Are you going to be on board?
What are your plans like?
I'll be there. Going to start Jan 1 so I can use it for one of my challenges that disallows starting before 2023.Wondering which Parts people plan to read. I think Parts 1 and 2 for me, but not sure yet.
Klowey wrote: "Wondering which Parts people plan to read. I think Parts 1 and 2 for me..."
The novel is in three "tomes", published between 1930-33 (during the author's lifetime); these are in the region of 1100-1300 pages in total. Then there are some 22-or-so additional chapters that were ready for publishing but somehow were left out, and these might be worth reading, I think. The remaining 9K pages of additional material, well...
I'll be starting this weekend and finishing it in 2-3 weeks.
The novel is in three "tomes", published between 1930-33 (during the author's lifetime); these are in the region of 1100-1300 pages in total. Then there are some 22-or-so additional chapters that were ready for publishing but somehow were left out, and these might be worth reading, I think. The remaining 9K pages of additional material, well...
I'll be starting this weekend and finishing it in 2-3 weeks.
I'll start in January 2023. One edition from our library has 1084 pages, and then there are two volumes, 1200 pages in total. Which is better?
Darya Silman wrote: "I'll start in January 2023. One edition from our library has 1084 pages, and then there are two volumes, 1200 pages in total. Which is better?"
Welcome on board, Darya! I'm not sure I'm understanding your question correctly, but I guess those might be two equivalent editions of the same work. Either would be fine; just a matter of choosing your translation and critical material included.
Welcome on board, Darya! I'm not sure I'm understanding your question correctly, but I guess those might be two equivalent editions of the same work. Either would be fine; just a matter of choosing your translation and critical material included.
I will also be starting in January on the 2nd and intend to finish the first part and and my progress through the second parts will depend on on the density of the material and how much googling I have to do, and I will be slowed by having to use a print copy with audio accompaniment unless i find an ecopy. When reading Anniversaries: From a Year in the Life of Gesine Cresspahl, Uwe Johnson I took a break from it after the first half since the side reading became draining rather than exciting. The shorts of Musil have not engaged me as much as Torless so I cannot predict from them. I have two more to go before commenting. I wish we had done a side read on Huysmans since I am enjoying Against Nature. I will finish it tomorrow or Thursday. (I read several books concurrently so as not to be bored.) Fed, I will drop another note on Torless in that topic a little later if you care to comment. I wish we had more participation in the buddy read. So far I have been enjoying the books a lot and thank Fed for getting this going,
The novel is conveniently organised in 175 chapters of 6 pages each (on average), each with a descriptive title. I'm finding this structure really helpful to navigate the complexity of style and the density of content: most sentences taste like aphorisms, beautifully crafted and packed with meaning, not without a general tongue-in-cheek academic flavour.
I think I might post a few comments as I read: mostly personal and random impressions, as the Web is already full of summaries.
§§ 1-25. Just one-hundred pages and already a maze of characters, almost all equally complex, organised along several somewhat independent themes: the change of times around the turn of the century (§8), Ulrich's new awareness of being a man without qualities (§13), Diotima and the Committee (§25). It seems to me the complexity of the characters, which makes it difficult if not impossible to picture them with clarity and to assign them a 'type', is deliberate and functional to conveying a sense of this critical time in history, characterised by the loss of long-time-established political, social, cultural and psychological identity. The distance between the time of the events (1913) and the time of the narration (1930-33) reminds me of The Sleepwalkers (1930-32).
I think I might post a few comments as I read: mostly personal and random impressions, as the Web is already full of summaries.
§§ 1-25. Just one-hundred pages and already a maze of characters, almost all equally complex, organised along several somewhat independent themes: the change of times around the turn of the century (§8), Ulrich's new awareness of being a man without qualities (§13), Diotima and the Committee (§25). It seems to me the complexity of the characters, which makes it difficult if not impossible to picture them with clarity and to assign them a 'type', is deliberate and functional to conveying a sense of this critical time in history, characterised by the loss of long-time-established political, social, cultural and psychological identity. The distance between the time of the events (1913) and the time of the narration (1930-33) reminds me of The Sleepwalkers (1930-32).
When is the end of this buddy read? asking for a friend :) I got the book in Russian
Darya Silman wrote: "When is the end of this buddy read?"
It was planned as three months, Jan-Mar, but the thread will stay open indefinitely.
It was planned as three months, Jan-Mar, but the thread will stay open indefinitely.
§§ 26-50. The early days of the Parallel Campaign and the mysterious character of Arnheim provide material to describe the "tyranny of the the reason" (§26) at the expense of the hard-to-define soul (§46). Also discussed: love as a "state" (§32, perhaps the most poetic chapter); the difference between objectively right action and individually right action, and the conflict at the level of decisions and actions (§39); the resulting disgregation of the I (§40, a central chapter); the temptation to seek refuge in the past (§42); collective action as a tool of "redemption" (§44, "redemption" is also discussed in the last volume of Broch's The Sleepwalkers); even art remains silent and unable to portray the desired "unity of life and its inner order" (§49). Often, the style is a stream of consciousness in disguise (particularly evident in §34). For the vague and contradictory character of all situations: Mysteries (1892; in Musil's diaries); for the narrative style: Musil's The temptations of quiet Veronica (in "Unions", 1911).
I am going to move this up a few days since am almost caught up on other reading.
§§ 51-75. So many themes! It seems to me that the reflection on morality and freewill might be the red thread connecting all these chapters together. Single characters and parallel stories, quickly alternating in an apparently arbitrary way, offer opportunities to explore the many facets of the problem thought different lenses and in different environments: Fanatism and antisemitism (§ 51, 73), crime and justice (§ 53, 74), politics and bureaucracy (§ 56, cf. Michael Kohlhaas), mental sanity and diversity (§ 59), the spirit and the Whole (§ 54, 59, 72), scientific thought and the intrinsic nature of evil (§ 72, central in the discussion). The «utopia of the exact life» – characterised by an experimental attitude subjected to the spirit, mirrored in literature by the "utopia of the essay", or essaism (§ 60-62) – is the author's proposal to overcome the crisis of his time. The frequent references of my annotated edition to Musil's diaries and essays, with extracts, are proving really helpful.
§§ 76-100.
I really enjoyed this group of chapters, varied in the themes and often resorting to the use of satire. Every now then I have to read a sentence twice, and my daily intake settled at about 50 pages/day, two to three times less than I would normally read. The temptation to classify with clarity characters (all very complex) and themes (alternating in a seemingly unpredictable way) can potentially lead to some frustration; I'm trying to allow the author to take me where he sees fit each time, instead of finding my own way into his work and mind, if that makes sense. This seems to help quite a bit, in particular when the narrative becomes sightly unclear (as we deal with subjects like "the other state" and madness) and I'm ready to accept this as the author's [deliberate] intention.
The discussion of art and literature is quite central here: §84 on art and reality; §91 (particularly interesting) on the attitude of modern avid readers (cf. Musil's 1926 essay on books and reading), §§ 95-96 on writing; §100 on the utopia of a map of knowledge.
Hinting to the theme of "the other state", central in the third part of the novel, §85 discusses the unity of contrasts (science and soul), with occasional references to Plato's theory of ideas; §86 the unity of thought and action (includes a long quote from "The temptation of quiet Veronika", from "Unions"); love as an unknown factor in the rationality-soul equation; §87 "union" and the struggle to identify a possible way in between states (the conscious and the one characterised by the "exit from the self"); §§ 89-90 both inner (thought and character) and outer world contribute to the making of man; §§ 84(?),100 on order (the creation of "many orders", one in each branch of knowledge, goes against the creation or realization of the one universal order; extreme order as death).
Continues the reflection on modern times: §89-90 present vs past; §98 State, nation and political identity; §99 satire of the young generation.
In this section (§§ 86, 89-90), Arnheim seems to propose an attitude towards life which is the opposite of the one expressed by Ulrich in the previous group of chapters. The union of matter-of-fact "virile" rationality and of the dreaming idealism more characteristic of youth (when the individual is in direct contact with the "spirit") should be combined under the direction of rationality, not of the spirit (as Ulrich proposed instead). This is my understanding. What's yours?
I really enjoyed this group of chapters, varied in the themes and often resorting to the use of satire. Every now then I have to read a sentence twice, and my daily intake settled at about 50 pages/day, two to three times less than I would normally read. The temptation to classify with clarity characters (all very complex) and themes (alternating in a seemingly unpredictable way) can potentially lead to some frustration; I'm trying to allow the author to take me where he sees fit each time, instead of finding my own way into his work and mind, if that makes sense. This seems to help quite a bit, in particular when the narrative becomes sightly unclear (as we deal with subjects like "the other state" and madness) and I'm ready to accept this as the author's [deliberate] intention.
The discussion of art and literature is quite central here: §84 on art and reality; §91 (particularly interesting) on the attitude of modern avid readers (cf. Musil's 1926 essay on books and reading), §§ 95-96 on writing; §100 on the utopia of a map of knowledge.
Hinting to the theme of "the other state", central in the third part of the novel, §85 discusses the unity of contrasts (science and soul), with occasional references to Plato's theory of ideas; §86 the unity of thought and action (includes a long quote from "The temptation of quiet Veronika", from "Unions"); love as an unknown factor in the rationality-soul equation; §87 "union" and the struggle to identify a possible way in between states (the conscious and the one characterised by the "exit from the self"); §§ 89-90 both inner (thought and character) and outer world contribute to the making of man; §§ 84(?),100 on order (the creation of "many orders", one in each branch of knowledge, goes against the creation or realization of the one universal order; extreme order as death).
Continues the reflection on modern times: §89-90 present vs past; §98 State, nation and political identity; §99 satire of the young generation.
In this section (§§ 86, 89-90), Arnheim seems to propose an attitude towards life which is the opposite of the one expressed by Ulrich in the previous group of chapters. The union of matter-of-fact "virile" rationality and of the dreaming idealism more characteristic of youth (when the individual is in direct contact with the "spirit") should be combined under the direction of rationality, not of the spirit (as Ulrich proposed instead). This is my understanding. What's yours?
My plans for moving things up were spoiled when I drove off forgetting I had left my reading tablet on the roof of my vehicle. It was a goner. I expect a replace ment on the 3rd or 4th.. Meanwhile, I will start the novel but doubt I can read much as the text is too small in my hard copy. I am looking forward to it from your notes.
Sam wrote: "...I drove off forgetting I had left my reading tablet on the roof of my vehicle..."
Sorry to hear that, Sam! ...I'm really looking forward to your comments :) And apologies for these monologues; I know that, unless I write and post them now, they would never get done.
The incipit is really nice and witty; hope you like it.
Sorry to hear that, Sam! ...I'm really looking forward to your comments :) And apologies for these monologues; I know that, unless I write and post them now, they would never get done.
The incipit is really nice and witty; hope you like it.
§§ 101-113
Awesome again! Chapters become a bit longer, and will be significantly longer in the next group (§§ 114-123) leading to the end of the second tome (and of volume I).
We start to understand Ulrich a bit better. In §101 he's seen through Diotima's eyes and against Arnheim: Ulrich is the "man of the (im)possible", Arnheim the matter-of-fact, "modern man", whose actions entirely rest upon "responsibility" (cf. §105). Later, in §112 Ulrich is seen through Arnheim's eyes, and for the latter this is again a matter of thought vs action. Significantly, Arnheim answers, in the affirmative, the question I asked when reviewing the previous block of chapters: unlike Arnheim, Ulrich believes life should be directed by the spirit (which doesn't exclude the instrumental contribution of rationality). In §113 we see Ulrich against Hans Sepp: nearly a monologue, where Ulrich abandons his usual skepticism and irony, and takes a clear stance, with an intense and poetic moment when he defines "the sublime".
§103 and §113, combined, add detail to another stinking aspect, perhaps the most striking, of Ulrich's character: like the protagonist of Knut Hamsun's novel "Mysteries", read by young Musil (as we learn from his diaries), Ulrich almost encourages people to have a negative opinion of him. He doesn't hide his frequent contradictions and the many grey areas in his thought, and always tries to explore subjects from all perspectives, avoiding all too quick conclusions. On the other hand, the young generation – «avid of a goal, an ideal, a programme, absolutes», torn between rigour and sentiment – is not aware of falling victim to the "polarization of the truth". Even "negative" characters like Hans Sepp occasionally convey, in their own words, the author's thought (§113) – a quite unusual, fascinating narrative resource!
Noteworthy bits and pieces:
• § 101. The "problem of the cause": indetermination between activity and passivity. Who initiates our feelings, desires and actions – the "I" or others? Resulting loss of meaning of the "I". The example of the criminal.
• §102. On the nature of progress. Unavoidable, it is the sum of all single efforts, therefore different from what each single person initially imagined (hence intrinsically disappointing). Every particular progress can also be read as regress. §103. Progress as the movement of an average (statistics).
• §104. Love can produce the awakening to a new state of consciousness. §106. The temporary experience of love "tempts" Arnheim to give up "rationalised existence".
• §109. Knowledge and all disciplines involve an initial element of faith (central idea in Musil's thought). §113. Decline of religion and affirmation of a new need for a more "fundamental experience of mystical ecstasy".
• §105. No real happiness is possible in a world without limitations (moral, social..). §109. On the balance between individual and collective happiness.
• §113. Hans Sepp promotes the radical rejection of the reason in order to embrace the spirit (combined with fanatical nationalism).
• §108. Again on "redemption": absent from the personal vocabulary, the term is used at national and political level; just before WWI, the idea of "redemption on an epoque" (cf. Broch) starts circulating among intellectuals, together with the hope in the advent of a new "messiah".
Awesome again! Chapters become a bit longer, and will be significantly longer in the next group (§§ 114-123) leading to the end of the second tome (and of volume I).
We start to understand Ulrich a bit better. In §101 he's seen through Diotima's eyes and against Arnheim: Ulrich is the "man of the (im)possible", Arnheim the matter-of-fact, "modern man", whose actions entirely rest upon "responsibility" (cf. §105). Later, in §112 Ulrich is seen through Arnheim's eyes, and for the latter this is again a matter of thought vs action. Significantly, Arnheim answers, in the affirmative, the question I asked when reviewing the previous block of chapters: unlike Arnheim, Ulrich believes life should be directed by the spirit (which doesn't exclude the instrumental contribution of rationality). In §113 we see Ulrich against Hans Sepp: nearly a monologue, where Ulrich abandons his usual skepticism and irony, and takes a clear stance, with an intense and poetic moment when he defines "the sublime".
§103 and §113, combined, add detail to another stinking aspect, perhaps the most striking, of Ulrich's character: like the protagonist of Knut Hamsun's novel "Mysteries", read by young Musil (as we learn from his diaries), Ulrich almost encourages people to have a negative opinion of him. He doesn't hide his frequent contradictions and the many grey areas in his thought, and always tries to explore subjects from all perspectives, avoiding all too quick conclusions. On the other hand, the young generation – «avid of a goal, an ideal, a programme, absolutes», torn between rigour and sentiment – is not aware of falling victim to the "polarization of the truth". Even "negative" characters like Hans Sepp occasionally convey, in their own words, the author's thought (§113) – a quite unusual, fascinating narrative resource!
Noteworthy bits and pieces:
• § 101. The "problem of the cause": indetermination between activity and passivity. Who initiates our feelings, desires and actions – the "I" or others? Resulting loss of meaning of the "I". The example of the criminal.
• §102. On the nature of progress. Unavoidable, it is the sum of all single efforts, therefore different from what each single person initially imagined (hence intrinsically disappointing). Every particular progress can also be read as regress. §103. Progress as the movement of an average (statistics).
• §104. Love can produce the awakening to a new state of consciousness. §106. The temporary experience of love "tempts" Arnheim to give up "rationalised existence".
• §109. Knowledge and all disciplines involve an initial element of faith (central idea in Musil's thought). §113. Decline of religion and affirmation of a new need for a more "fundamental experience of mystical ecstasy".
• §105. No real happiness is possible in a world without limitations (moral, social..). §109. On the balance between individual and collective happiness.
• §113. Hans Sepp promotes the radical rejection of the reason in order to embrace the spirit (combined with fanatical nationalism).
• §108. Again on "redemption": absent from the personal vocabulary, the term is used at national and political level; just before WWI, the idea of "redemption on an epoque" (cf. Broch) starts circulating among intellectuals, together with the hope in the advent of a new "messiah".
§§ 1=19 First Part -- initial thoughtsFed wrote:
"The novel is conveniently organised in 175 chapters of 6 pages each (on average), each with a descriptive title. I'm finding this structure really helpful to navigate the complexity of style and the density of content: most sentences taste like aphorisms, beautifully crafted and packed with meaning, not without a general tongue-in-cheek academic flavour."
I have begun and just wanted to echo Fed's remarks since his several key remarks reflect my thoughts. (complexity, density, aphorisms, beautifully crafted, meaning, tongue-in-cheek) I will be moving through this novel slowly since it is a first read and I would need a second read to add anything coherent other than impressions. Each chapter deserves individual discussion IMO but that would be overkill for this group. I am feeling the lack of annotations for this read. If someone finds a site of annotations for the book, let me know. I will add a later post with more thoughts as they come to me. Lots of influences are apparent. I wish I had a better background in Freud and Nietzsche as they seem prominent.
Musil's voice is far more developed than earlier work and though rich in abstraction is solid concrete prose so far, much more show than tell, which makes the writing far more stimulating. Many of these chapters could stand alone, i.e. §18 Moosbbruger.
Anyone know if Clarisse and Walter allude to the Schumanns?
No time now but I will add more and respond to Fed's post on the Torless thread.
Sam wrote: §§ 1=19
Thank you for sharing, Sam! I totally agree: you could have a whole discussion on every single chapter! Same as you again: definitely a work I'd like to read a second time later in life.
Sam wrote: Anyone know if Clarisse and Walter allude to the Schumanns?..."
Hmm, do you mean the real people behind the names?
Inspiration for the characters.
• Walter was inspired by Gustav Donath (childhood friend of Musil), and Clarisse by Alice Charlemont (Donath's wife). Bonadea by actress Paula Ulmann (Musil's lover in Brünn > Törless), Agathe (much later in the novel) by Martha (Musil's "wife-sister", as he called her), Arnheim by Rathenau (German politician killed in 1922).
• A poignant comment in the introduction of my edition warns against taking these basic equivalences too literally. The novel is «a structure in constant movement», deliberately lending itself to multiple interpretations depending the direction of each approach. Therefore, such structure, with its ever changing elements, rejects every objective codification and "figurative" value.
Thank you for sharing, Sam! I totally agree: you could have a whole discussion on every single chapter! Same as you again: definitely a work I'd like to read a second time later in life.
Sam wrote: Anyone know if Clarisse and Walter allude to the Schumanns?..."
Hmm, do you mean the real people behind the names?
Inspiration for the characters.
• Walter was inspired by Gustav Donath (childhood friend of Musil), and Clarisse by Alice Charlemont (Donath's wife). Bonadea by actress Paula Ulmann (Musil's lover in Brünn > Törless), Agathe (much later in the novel) by Martha (Musil's "wife-sister", as he called her), Arnheim by Rathenau (German politician killed in 1922).
• A poignant comment in the introduction of my edition warns against taking these basic equivalences too literally. The novel is «a structure in constant movement», deliberately lending itself to multiple interpretations depending the direction of each approach. Therefore, such structure, with its ever changing elements, rejects every objective codification and "figurative" value.
§§114-123. End of volume I (tomes I-II).
Reading gets easier: as we head towards the end of volume I, the author slowly reveals his views. Volume I (I-II tomes) was published in 1930, volume II (III tome) in 1933.
§114. All categories of thought carry an intrinsic imprecision: no particular dog is identical to the ideal dog; likewise, our understanding of "right" is intrinsically impaired: we always aim a bit too high or too low. Ulrich's proposed attitude – ... at least on this occasion– is to allow each situation to unfold and to determine itself. In order to rediscover the "unlimited feelings" children are capable of, we should give up the attitude of compromise that paints everything grey.
§115. The examination of the two opposed, or parallel, modes of relating with reality, "truth" (typical of the rational state) and "analogy" (typical of the "other state" and of dreams), began early in Musil's life (cf. his doctoral dissertation on Mach's theory, "Beitrag zur Beurteilung der Lehren Machs", 1908). In §115 and for the first time in the novel, we find a detailed, clear exposition of Musil's views: Humans split the original condition of life – "metaphor" – in the two opposites of «the compact matter of reality and truth» on one side, and «the transparent atmosphere of intuition, faith and art» on the other. Instinctive people [like Arnheim's father], «without too much thinking», easily succeed in their endeavours.
§116. Continues the reflection on the tense relationship between literature and reality, metaphor and truth, attitudes as old as humanity. Truth is the language of rationality: we need it in order to impart a univocal interpretation to the facts of life, thus creating some order, essential for life, among the chaos. Metaphor is «the slippery logic of the soul», reigning over intuition, art, religion, and the traits of our personality. What has already been defined by intellectuals as «superior humanity» is nothing but the effort to merge these two halves of life, truth and metaphor.
§117. The gatherings taking place at Diotima's are referred to as «[...]the long, fruitless meetings of the men of the spirit». I suddenly wonder: Is the novel a utopia portraying the troublesome birth of the spirit?
I find §§121-123 a striking, beautifully crafted finale, each chapter having its own function and very distinct atmosphere.
§121. The "intellectual" climax of Volume I: Ulrich and Arnheim talk face to face. Some breadcrumbs of though:
• Difficulty of action, epitomised by the psychological, moral and juridical complexity of Roosbrugger's case, where Ulrich withdraws his judgement («frankly I don't know what I would do»). In a wrong world, it might be difficult to act as one understands to be right. Our times witness a «scission of moral consciousness» (not feeling responsible for extreme acts like the death penalty). This comes together with the annihilation of the individual personality caused by its fragmentation. In the essay "Die Nation", Musil writes: «[our] action is the symbol of the indirect relationship between [national] State and individual – it is odourless, tasteless life». Example: some people (a court) judge a person guilty; a different person pushes the button and nothing else, so that we might be allowed to think that no one is "fully" responsible for what happened. We have our steak, but need someone to kill the calf.
• once again, unexpectedly, Musil's position is in Arnheim's mouth: it's necessary «to use the intellect even in matters of the soul» (essay "Europe left to itself"). Again: in this novel, most characters can be read in multiple ways and voice a complex multitude of potentially contradicting ideas, all concurring to describing this experience called life.
• Ulrich, man without qualities for his friends, for Arnheim might be an appetible ally because of his "human qualities" (supposedly, the peculiar restlessness of the man who would be able to hug the devil, which I interpret as embracing the world of metaphor).
§122. A solitary night walk. The narrative of life, the simple succession of experiences along a line is the thread of our story, the very thread of life: our source of tranquility, our protection amidst the chaos. This strongly reminded me of the solution – to the experience of human suffering and the perceived meaninglessness of life – offered by Proust in the seventh and last part of his novel (published in 1927): writing, recounting is the answer. [And I leave it here, ha.]
§123. If I called §121 the "intellectual climax" of the volume, this chapter might be its "metaphorical" climax. A combination of events – the tumultous day, the solitary walk, tiredness, the news of his father's death, the intense meeting with Clarisse – all together bring Ulrich to the experience of a different state of perception, one known to him from the time of his only real love story and never experienced again thereafter.
:) Hope you liked Volume I.
Reading gets easier: as we head towards the end of volume I, the author slowly reveals his views. Volume I (I-II tomes) was published in 1930, volume II (III tome) in 1933.
§114. All categories of thought carry an intrinsic imprecision: no particular dog is identical to the ideal dog; likewise, our understanding of "right" is intrinsically impaired: we always aim a bit too high or too low. Ulrich's proposed attitude – ... at least on this occasion– is to allow each situation to unfold and to determine itself. In order to rediscover the "unlimited feelings" children are capable of, we should give up the attitude of compromise that paints everything grey.
§115. The examination of the two opposed, or parallel, modes of relating with reality, "truth" (typical of the rational state) and "analogy" (typical of the "other state" and of dreams), began early in Musil's life (cf. his doctoral dissertation on Mach's theory, "Beitrag zur Beurteilung der Lehren Machs", 1908). In §115 and for the first time in the novel, we find a detailed, clear exposition of Musil's views: Humans split the original condition of life – "metaphor" – in the two opposites of «the compact matter of reality and truth» on one side, and «the transparent atmosphere of intuition, faith and art» on the other. Instinctive people [like Arnheim's father], «without too much thinking», easily succeed in their endeavours.
§116. Continues the reflection on the tense relationship between literature and reality, metaphor and truth, attitudes as old as humanity. Truth is the language of rationality: we need it in order to impart a univocal interpretation to the facts of life, thus creating some order, essential for life, among the chaos. Metaphor is «the slippery logic of the soul», reigning over intuition, art, religion, and the traits of our personality. What has already been defined by intellectuals as «superior humanity» is nothing but the effort to merge these two halves of life, truth and metaphor.
§117. The gatherings taking place at Diotima's are referred to as «[...]the long, fruitless meetings of the men of the spirit». I suddenly wonder: Is the novel a utopia portraying the troublesome birth of the spirit?
I find §§121-123 a striking, beautifully crafted finale, each chapter having its own function and very distinct atmosphere.
§121. The "intellectual" climax of Volume I: Ulrich and Arnheim talk face to face. Some breadcrumbs of though:
• Difficulty of action, epitomised by the psychological, moral and juridical complexity of Roosbrugger's case, where Ulrich withdraws his judgement («frankly I don't know what I would do»). In a wrong world, it might be difficult to act as one understands to be right. Our times witness a «scission of moral consciousness» (not feeling responsible for extreme acts like the death penalty). This comes together with the annihilation of the individual personality caused by its fragmentation. In the essay "Die Nation", Musil writes: «[our] action is the symbol of the indirect relationship between [national] State and individual – it is odourless, tasteless life». Example: some people (a court) judge a person guilty; a different person pushes the button and nothing else, so that we might be allowed to think that no one is "fully" responsible for what happened. We have our steak, but need someone to kill the calf.
• once again, unexpectedly, Musil's position is in Arnheim's mouth: it's necessary «to use the intellect even in matters of the soul» (essay "Europe left to itself"). Again: in this novel, most characters can be read in multiple ways and voice a complex multitude of potentially contradicting ideas, all concurring to describing this experience called life.
• Ulrich, man without qualities for his friends, for Arnheim might be an appetible ally because of his "human qualities" (supposedly, the peculiar restlessness of the man who would be able to hug the devil, which I interpret as embracing the world of metaphor).
§122. A solitary night walk. The narrative of life, the simple succession of experiences along a line is the thread of our story, the very thread of life: our source of tranquility, our protection amidst the chaos. This strongly reminded me of the solution – to the experience of human suffering and the perceived meaninglessness of life – offered by Proust in the seventh and last part of his novel (published in 1927): writing, recounting is the answer. [And I leave it here, ha.]
§123. If I called §121 the "intellectual climax" of the volume, this chapter might be its "metaphorical" climax. A combination of events – the tumultous day, the solitary walk, tiredness, the news of his father's death, the intense meeting with Clarisse – all together bring Ulrich to the experience of a different state of perception, one known to him from the time of his only real love story and never experienced again thereafter.
:) Hope you liked Volume I.
Fed wrote: "P.S. On Huysmans: Drifting contains themes relevant to The Man Without Qualities, but is not emblematic of the new style "invented" later by the author and subsequently developed by..."Drifting sounds really interesting. One of the reviewers said (in Spanish) that this was inspired by Arthur Schopenhauer. Do you happen to know if that is true?
Klowey wrote: "Drifting sounds really interesting. One of the reviewers said (in Spanish) that this was inspired by Arthur Schopenhauer. Do you happen to know if that is true?"
I didn't find any particularly explicit reference to Schopenhauer (not even in the introduction), or at least not above the average ubiquitousness of Schopenhauer's and Nietzsche's thought at this time in the cultural history of continental Europe. I remember you like Kafka, Klowey, so I think you might like this novella as well; it definitely tastes proto-Kafka.
I think it should be read in relation with, and part of Huysmans' distancing himself from Zola's naturalism. That would be the main underlying reference.
I didn't find any particularly explicit reference to Schopenhauer (not even in the introduction), or at least not above the average ubiquitousness of Schopenhauer's and Nietzsche's thought at this time in the cultural history of continental Europe. I remember you like Kafka, Klowey, so I think you might like this novella as well; it definitely tastes proto-Kafka.
I think it should be read in relation with, and part of Huysmans' distancing himself from Zola's naturalism. That would be the main underlying reference.
The reception of the novel (own notes)
• Double level of fragmentation: (1) the novel is unfinished; (2) the unity and coherence of its message must be found beyond the surface of the text. This has been an obstacle to the notoriety of the novel among critics.
• The "rediscovery" of the novel starts with the publication of the 1948 article by Adolf Frisé, followed by a new publication of the novel in 1952, accompanied by years of very lively debates among critics, concerning both the novel and the hypothetical reconstruction of "Volume III" based on existing fragments.
• Problematic for the critics was «the extreme and deliberate intrinsic mobility of its narrative structure». The publication of volume I in 1930 met the praise of critics and received many reviews, whereas volume II (1933) was received with indifference occasionally punctuated by disappointment or delusion for the lack of a clear solution to the problems of the present.
• In 1968, satirical magazine 'Pardon' sent one chapter of the novel to 46 German publishers and critics presenting it as the work of a young author seeking publication; of the 33 who answered, no one recognised it or expressed any interest towards a possible publication.
• The fortune of the novel started in 1980, on the occasion of the centenary of Musil's birth, when critics started reconsidering his work.
• Soon after the first publication, critics were split across three different positions, seeing the novel as:
(1) a satire;
(2) a Zeit-roman, a description of modernity;
(3) the dissolution of reality into utopia.
• Presently, the novel as utopia is the most actively investigated thesis. «A description of modern times? Yes and no. A description of constitutive relationships. Not actual, but on a deeper level. Not skin, but ligaments.» – said Musil of his novel; and about utopia: «not as a goal but as a direction».
>>> Musil on his formal approach to style: «Proust and Joyce, as far as I know, gave in to the dissolution [of traditional narrative] with an associative style by the blurred contours. My effort, instead, might be defined as constructive and synthetic.»
• Double level of fragmentation: (1) the novel is unfinished; (2) the unity and coherence of its message must be found beyond the surface of the text. This has been an obstacle to the notoriety of the novel among critics.
• The "rediscovery" of the novel starts with the publication of the 1948 article by Adolf Frisé, followed by a new publication of the novel in 1952, accompanied by years of very lively debates among critics, concerning both the novel and the hypothetical reconstruction of "Volume III" based on existing fragments.
• Problematic for the critics was «the extreme and deliberate intrinsic mobility of its narrative structure». The publication of volume I in 1930 met the praise of critics and received many reviews, whereas volume II (1933) was received with indifference occasionally punctuated by disappointment or delusion for the lack of a clear solution to the problems of the present.
• In 1968, satirical magazine 'Pardon' sent one chapter of the novel to 46 German publishers and critics presenting it as the work of a young author seeking publication; of the 33 who answered, no one recognised it or expressed any interest towards a possible publication.
• The fortune of the novel started in 1980, on the occasion of the centenary of Musil's birth, when critics started reconsidering his work.
• Soon after the first publication, critics were split across three different positions, seeing the novel as:
(1) a satire;
(2) a Zeit-roman, a description of modernity;
(3) the dissolution of reality into utopia.
• Presently, the novel as utopia is the most actively investigated thesis. «A description of modern times? Yes and no. A description of constitutive relationships. Not actual, but on a deeper level. Not skin, but ligaments.» – said Musil of his novel; and about utopia: «not as a goal but as a direction».
>>> Musil on his formal approach to style: «Proust and Joyce, as far as I know, gave in to the dissolution [of traditional narrative] with an associative style by the blurred contours. My effort, instead, might be defined as constructive and synthetic.»
History of Volume II (own notes)
• 1932: against Musil's intentions, the publisher insists on splitting volume II in two parts (tomes) in order to publish the first one as soon as possible.
• 1933. The political situation worsens and in January Hitler gains power. In march, the 38 chapters of volume II are published. The publisher stops all previously agreed regular payments that would have allowed Musil to complete volume II with tome II. From now and until his death, Musil and his wife face financial difficulties and move several times, which has a heavily negative impact on Musil's mental and physical health, making it difficult for him to find the right conditions to work uninterruptedly on tome II.
• 1937. Musil completes twenty new chapters, ready for publishing when the publisher, forced to move to Stockholm, suspends the publication and sends the galley proofs back to Musil.
• 1938. The publication and sale of all works by Musil in forbidden in the entire Reich.
• 1939. By now, the 20 chapters published as galley proofs have been reworked at least twenty times and «only the bare skeleton» of the original remains.
• 1942. In January, Musil writes a draft ending («Ulrich's postscript») and, with moderate optimism, foresees a tome II about twice as long as tome I (letter to Henry Church). Dies suddenly on 15 April.
• 1932: against Musil's intentions, the publisher insists on splitting volume II in two parts (tomes) in order to publish the first one as soon as possible.
• 1933. The political situation worsens and in January Hitler gains power. In march, the 38 chapters of volume II are published. The publisher stops all previously agreed regular payments that would have allowed Musil to complete volume II with tome II. From now and until his death, Musil and his wife face financial difficulties and move several times, which has a heavily negative impact on Musil's mental and physical health, making it difficult for him to find the right conditions to work uninterruptedly on tome II.
• 1937. Musil completes twenty new chapters, ready for publishing when the publisher, forced to move to Stockholm, suspends the publication and sends the galley proofs back to Musil.
• 1938. The publication and sale of all works by Musil in forbidden in the entire Reich.
• 1939. By now, the 20 chapters published as galley proofs have been reworked at least twenty times and «only the bare skeleton» of the original remains.
• 1942. In January, Musil writes a draft ending («Ulrich's postscript») and, with moderate optimism, foresees a tome II about twice as long as tome I (letter to Henry Church). Dies suddenly on 15 April.
For Volume II, containing the third (also last) part of the novel, I extend the progressive chapter numbers started in Volume I, so that §§124-161 correspond to §§1-38 of volume II.
§§124-135.
It comes easy to me to isolate this group of chapters from the rest, considering the setting and the recurring characters and themes. These chapters display a clear narrative change from Volume I, where themes and situations varied greatly from chapter to chapter.
Three years separate the publication of volume I from volume II, but the gap in the story is of just 24 hours.
• §§124-129: Father's death
Agathe soon appears as a significant new presence in Ulrich's life and a dominant theme in the story. In 1926 Musil had announced the imminent publication of volume II with the title "The twin sister", later changed. Models for Agathe are Else, Musil's sister who died 9 months old (recurring in Musil's diaries and thoughts), and Martha Marcovaldi, Musil's wife.
The frequent irrelevance of events and facts narrated in relation with the system within which they manifest themselves (the social or semantic context of the conversation; particularly noticeable in places of §125) is a constant in Musil's thought. This can be traced back to Mach's "functionalism" and to Nietzsche's theories: «facts do not exist; there are only interpretations» (in "Posthumous fragments 1885-1887").
The other dominant theme of volume II, «the other state» (in volume I examined and defined only tentatively), appears – to stay – in §126.
When Ulrich's childhood memories spontaneously emerge, it's hard not to remember the very similar style of Proust's final volume (pub. 1927).
It's been said that there's an "autistic" component in Ulrich's relationship with his sister: little Ulrich sees the sister and desires to be a girl (introjection of the object of desire).
At the end of §129 Ulrich [incorrectly] realises he's «alone in the world». This group of chapters concerning the death of Ulrich's father comes to a close the way it started: with the recollection of the telegram announcing the death.
• §§130-135: Agathe
A markedly female component takes over, first through Clarisse's letter (§130), then with a series of familiar dialogues between Ulrich and Agathe, during which the sister takes up the role of a co-protagonist, perhaps a complementary part of Ulrich, certainly someone with a more instinctive and less intellectual approach to life, less general and more personal in her interest, but equally curious and unconventional.
Preliminary to the return of more philosophical matters, §131 is an investigation of the shifting of the «I» into «collective I» (or "we"), accompanied by criticism of the institution of the family (frequent in Musil's diaries) and an examination of the relationship between personal effort and collective progress (cf. §103). Niels Lyhne by Jacobsen, one of Musil's favourite authors, is quoted.
A group of four chapters with recurring themes and settings – the first two outdoors, the second two indoors – completes this section.
§§132-133. An excursion with Agathe sparks a conversation and a long discourse on morals and progress, both ultimately verging on whether it might be possible to establish some form of order in life of a non-systematic or non-restrictive nature. Few notes: (1) today morals are thought as a means towards an end (measurable results, power, civilization, splendour); (2) the dynamism of our times stems from our own hollowness; (3) easier to act than to impart meaning to our actions; (4) we use action (even immoral action) to ground ourselves; (5) fragmentation is the signature of our times (cf. Nietzsche and Musil's novella Tonka).
§§134-135. The «sacred dialogues» between Ulrich and Agathe constitute the climax of this first group of chapters. Deepening the discussion started during their excursion, moving from the field of morality thorough that of mystics, the siblings finally confront their experiences and understanding of the «other state», reaching a sound working definition. Few notes: (1) Morals are inadequate and one-hundred years behind; technical and scientific advancements are not matched by a corresponding «growth of sentiments»; (2) for the valid option represented by a holy way of life see: Huysmans, Hofmannsthal's The Lord Chandos Letter and Martin Buber; (3) mystics (called an "unknown adventure") as opposed to rationality (or practical advancements); (4) on secularised mystics, or "mystics without God" see: Musil's 1923 essay and the play The Enthusiasts); (5) Agathe experienced the other state as love; (6) Ulrich defines «a second state» available to men, more ancient than any religion and recognisable in all religions.
In his book The Inner Citadel, philosopher Pierre Hadot exposed the hidden structure of Marcus Aurelius's collection of thoughts: a practical exercise of meditation on the three tenets of Stoic philosophy. My feeling is that Musil's work too might be read as a meditation of few recurring core concepts each time seen through the ever changing light of life events and outer circumstances.
Hope you liked this part of the novel!
§§124-135.
It comes easy to me to isolate this group of chapters from the rest, considering the setting and the recurring characters and themes. These chapters display a clear narrative change from Volume I, where themes and situations varied greatly from chapter to chapter.
Three years separate the publication of volume I from volume II, but the gap in the story is of just 24 hours.
• §§124-129: Father's death
Agathe soon appears as a significant new presence in Ulrich's life and a dominant theme in the story. In 1926 Musil had announced the imminent publication of volume II with the title "The twin sister", later changed. Models for Agathe are Else, Musil's sister who died 9 months old (recurring in Musil's diaries and thoughts), and Martha Marcovaldi, Musil's wife.
The frequent irrelevance of events and facts narrated in relation with the system within which they manifest themselves (the social or semantic context of the conversation; particularly noticeable in places of §125) is a constant in Musil's thought. This can be traced back to Mach's "functionalism" and to Nietzsche's theories: «facts do not exist; there are only interpretations» (in "Posthumous fragments 1885-1887").
The other dominant theme of volume II, «the other state» (in volume I examined and defined only tentatively), appears – to stay – in §126.
When Ulrich's childhood memories spontaneously emerge, it's hard not to remember the very similar style of Proust's final volume (pub. 1927).
It's been said that there's an "autistic" component in Ulrich's relationship with his sister: little Ulrich sees the sister and desires to be a girl (introjection of the object of desire).
At the end of §129 Ulrich [incorrectly] realises he's «alone in the world». This group of chapters concerning the death of Ulrich's father comes to a close the way it started: with the recollection of the telegram announcing the death.
• §§130-135: Agathe
A markedly female component takes over, first through Clarisse's letter (§130), then with a series of familiar dialogues between Ulrich and Agathe, during which the sister takes up the role of a co-protagonist, perhaps a complementary part of Ulrich, certainly someone with a more instinctive and less intellectual approach to life, less general and more personal in her interest, but equally curious and unconventional.
Preliminary to the return of more philosophical matters, §131 is an investigation of the shifting of the «I» into «collective I» (or "we"), accompanied by criticism of the institution of the family (frequent in Musil's diaries) and an examination of the relationship between personal effort and collective progress (cf. §103). Niels Lyhne by Jacobsen, one of Musil's favourite authors, is quoted.
A group of four chapters with recurring themes and settings – the first two outdoors, the second two indoors – completes this section.
§§132-133. An excursion with Agathe sparks a conversation and a long discourse on morals and progress, both ultimately verging on whether it might be possible to establish some form of order in life of a non-systematic or non-restrictive nature. Few notes: (1) today morals are thought as a means towards an end (measurable results, power, civilization, splendour); (2) the dynamism of our times stems from our own hollowness; (3) easier to act than to impart meaning to our actions; (4) we use action (even immoral action) to ground ourselves; (5) fragmentation is the signature of our times (cf. Nietzsche and Musil's novella Tonka).
§§134-135. The «sacred dialogues» between Ulrich and Agathe constitute the climax of this first group of chapters. Deepening the discussion started during their excursion, moving from the field of morality thorough that of mystics, the siblings finally confront their experiences and understanding of the «other state», reaching a sound working definition. Few notes: (1) Morals are inadequate and one-hundred years behind; technical and scientific advancements are not matched by a corresponding «growth of sentiments»; (2) for the valid option represented by a holy way of life see: Huysmans, Hofmannsthal's The Lord Chandos Letter and Martin Buber; (3) mystics (called an "unknown adventure") as opposed to rationality (or practical advancements); (4) on secularised mystics, or "mystics without God" see: Musil's 1923 essay and the play The Enthusiasts); (5) Agathe experienced the other state as love; (6) Ulrich defines «a second state» available to men, more ancient than any religion and recognisable in all religions.
In his book The Inner Citadel, philosopher Pierre Hadot exposed the hidden structure of Marcus Aurelius's collection of thoughts: a practical exercise of meditation on the three tenets of Stoic philosophy. My feeling is that Musil's work too might be read as a meditation of few recurring core concepts each time seen through the ever changing light of life events and outer circumstances.
Hope you liked this part of the novel!
@Aubrey, @Sabagrey
Still interested?
Still interested?
I just started Vol 1, so I have 123 chapters to be going at :oDmy plan is to read to roughly half-way by end of Jan, then latter half in Feb...
Darren wrote: "I just started Vol 1..."
Hi Darren, hope you enjoy it! I think I vaguely remember your being perhaps a bit hesitant? If I may express my experience with Vol.1, and in order to encourage potential readers, I'd say:
• narrative, eventful parts and more reflective, philosophical ones alternate all the way through, so, if you came across a challenging, dense passage, be confident that things will soon start moving faster again;
• Musil often uses a narrative technique consisting in the insertion of events and facts that are somewhat irrelevant to the context where they appear. This "destabilising" strategy borrows from Nietzsche's theories («facts do not exist; there are only interpretations»). If sometimes you feel like things don't make perfect sense, that might well be the author's intention.
Hope this helps. Looking forward to your impressions!
Hi Darren, hope you enjoy it! I think I vaguely remember your being perhaps a bit hesitant? If I may express my experience with Vol.1, and in order to encourage potential readers, I'd say:
• narrative, eventful parts and more reflective, philosophical ones alternate all the way through, so, if you came across a challenging, dense passage, be confident that things will soon start moving faster again;
• Musil often uses a narrative technique consisting in the insertion of events and facts that are somewhat irrelevant to the context where they appear. This "destabilising" strategy borrows from Nietzsche's theories («facts do not exist; there are only interpretations»). If sometimes you feel like things don't make perfect sense, that might well be the author's intention.
Hope this helps. Looking forward to your impressions!
Fed wrote: "@Aubrey, @SabagreyStill interested?"
yes ... but I don't feel quite up to a mammoth read right now; I'm trying to pick up courage!
sabagrey wrote: "...I'm trying to pick up courage!"
I think I know what you mean!
Page 1 makes an enticing start :)
I think I know what you mean!
Page 1 makes an enticing start :)
I just read the first 16 pages, and it's great so far ;o)
§§ 20=50. Moving along. These next chapters still felt like introductory material hence I will keep this brief. I am trying to get a rhythm that feels satisfactory and yet will allow me to finish the first book by the end of February. I am comfortable with reads of approximately five chapters. Beyond that, I begin to lose too much. I also like to give jt some time to reflect before I start another five chapters, so this will take me awhile. I am not finding the material too dense but am wishing I had read more of the philosophy sources. I felt also a little ignorant regarding the political history, but Musil pretty much clearly spells it out.
My biggest takeway is that this is a very humorous read although one has to have a dark sense to appreciate it. Since I am reading the English translation, I am curious if ones gets that sense as much from the original German.
I'm still in. Trying to finish up a couple other readings, but will continue with TMWOQ as well.I'm really liking your summaries and impressions Fed!
Sam wrote: "I am not finding the material too dense but am wishing I had read more of the philosophy sources."
Nice to read your comments, Sam! A quick note on complementary reads. I find frequent references to Musil's 1923 essay "The German as Symptom" (now available in Precision and Soul), which I've read only as extracts and found very investing, and to Musil's play The Enthusiasts (1921): this is a very quick, enjoyable read, written at the time when preliminary material for the novel was starting to build up on Musil's desk; the play contains a seminal compact version of many of the themes of the novel.
Klowey wrote: "I'm really liking your summaries and impressions Fed!"
Thank you, Klowey! I'm looking forward to yours! ... There are four complex, very interesting female characters in volume I, but the appearance of Agathe in volume II – the missing half of the protagonist of volume I – makes such a change!
Nice to read your comments, Sam! A quick note on complementary reads. I find frequent references to Musil's 1923 essay "The German as Symptom" (now available in Precision and Soul), which I've read only as extracts and found very investing, and to Musil's play The Enthusiasts (1921): this is a very quick, enjoyable read, written at the time when preliminary material for the novel was starting to build up on Musil's desk; the play contains a seminal compact version of many of the themes of the novel.
Klowey wrote: "I'm really liking your summaries and impressions Fed!"
Thank you, Klowey! I'm looking forward to yours! ... There are four complex, very interesting female characters in volume I, but the appearance of Agathe in volume II – the missing half of the protagonist of volume I – makes such a change!
Fed wrote: "sabagrey wrote: "...I'm trying to pick up courage!"I think I know what you mean!
Page 1 makes an enticing start :)"
Page 1 is one of the most beautiful pieces of German prose I have ever read ... and I've got the image just right, living in that city myself.
sabagrey wrote: "Page 1 is one of the most beautiful pieces of German prose I have ever read ... and I've got the image just right, living in that city myself.
Haha! I'm really happy to hear that. I also loved it! :)
Haha! I'm really happy to hear that. I also loved it! :)
§§136-146.
The days going from Ulrich and Agathe's temporary separation to their reunion. I read these chapters as a parenthesis, a suspension of time and events, a narrative divertissement with moments of lucid reflection, culminating with what might be Ulrich's first strong deliberation.
§136, a sort of "hinge" and summary of all the encounters that will take place in the following chapters of the section, could lead us to think that several things have changed while Ulrich was away but, by the time Agathe is about to join Ulrich again, we've already realised that nothing new has really happened. New combinations of characters are explored dialogically, thus offering us the time to recall and revisit the many threads and complex themes met earlier in the novel.
§137. Knowledge, intuition and faith. Faith: the region between the certitude of knowledge and the mists of intuition. The same theme returns in §141: between knowledge and imagination is faith (later: «conscious intuition»), understood not the traditional way but as «the other», the alternative to knowledge and intuition, true «experimental life». On this subject, critics find extensive similarities between Musil and Wittgenstein (cf. his Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus).
§138. In his final diaries, speaking of himself Musil writes: «Impeccable in daily things and, beyond those, of superior immorality». Ulrich often speaks of the intrinsic, contradictory nature of morality without ever theorising a need to transgress it, whereas Agathe displays a mixture of innocence and criminal attitude as she transgresses the rules with the utmost spontaneity. The two cultivate the prospect of an «hermitic» life and the utopia of «the Millenary Kingdom». Later (§141), Ulrich realises that Agathe is the person who can translate his theories into reality.
§142. (1) The theme of redemption comes back, something predictable if we remember that, at some point, «The redeemer» was the working title of the novel. It seems that Musil might be skeptical about the actual possibility of a redeemer, unlikely Herman Broch but like Max Weber («the redeemer, or prophet does not exist»; cf. his 1917 lecture "Science as a Vocation"). (2) Meingast's thought – based on elements drawn from Nietzsche, philosopher Ludwig Klages and poet Stephan George – is a prefiguration of Nazi theses: violence as the way to create a new hierarchy of values.
§§144-145. A diptych. (1) Agathe, like a mystic and unlike the fragmentation reigning everywhere else in the novel, is characterised by «unity of consciousness» (later «unity of consciousness and the senses») through a literary style and precise images found in Unions (1911). She becomes aware of an inner shift: the world of feelings (and senses) is now complemented by the world of perceptions (soul); her brother's words start making sense without having to recur to thinking and, without believing, she can feel the proximity of God; this then must be what Ulrich wittily called «The Millenary Kingdom». (References to 13th c. Persian mystic Farîd od-Dîn ‘Attâr.) (2) Ulrich, using his trademark inquisitive, intellectual approach, moving from an investigation of the collective role of the arts (people want to be moved, to live an experience), eventually also questions himself on the nature of this Millenary Kingdom.
§146. A sexual climax introduces the narrative climax of this section, as well as an apparently crucial moment in the entire novel: Ulrich, brought by a free association of childhood memories and thoughts to a new understanding of human desires and struggles, has a vision accompanied by a new, clear act of volition.
The days going from Ulrich and Agathe's temporary separation to their reunion. I read these chapters as a parenthesis, a suspension of time and events, a narrative divertissement with moments of lucid reflection, culminating with what might be Ulrich's first strong deliberation.
§136, a sort of "hinge" and summary of all the encounters that will take place in the following chapters of the section, could lead us to think that several things have changed while Ulrich was away but, by the time Agathe is about to join Ulrich again, we've already realised that nothing new has really happened. New combinations of characters are explored dialogically, thus offering us the time to recall and revisit the many threads and complex themes met earlier in the novel.
§137. Knowledge, intuition and faith. Faith: the region between the certitude of knowledge and the mists of intuition. The same theme returns in §141: between knowledge and imagination is faith (later: «conscious intuition»), understood not the traditional way but as «the other», the alternative to knowledge and intuition, true «experimental life». On this subject, critics find extensive similarities between Musil and Wittgenstein (cf. his Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus).
§138. In his final diaries, speaking of himself Musil writes: «Impeccable in daily things and, beyond those, of superior immorality». Ulrich often speaks of the intrinsic, contradictory nature of morality without ever theorising a need to transgress it, whereas Agathe displays a mixture of innocence and criminal attitude as she transgresses the rules with the utmost spontaneity. The two cultivate the prospect of an «hermitic» life and the utopia of «the Millenary Kingdom». Later (§141), Ulrich realises that Agathe is the person who can translate his theories into reality.
§142. (1) The theme of redemption comes back, something predictable if we remember that, at some point, «The redeemer» was the working title of the novel. It seems that Musil might be skeptical about the actual possibility of a redeemer, unlikely Herman Broch but like Max Weber («the redeemer, or prophet does not exist»; cf. his 1917 lecture "Science as a Vocation"). (2) Meingast's thought – based on elements drawn from Nietzsche, philosopher Ludwig Klages and poet Stephan George – is a prefiguration of Nazi theses: violence as the way to create a new hierarchy of values.
§§144-145. A diptych. (1) Agathe, like a mystic and unlike the fragmentation reigning everywhere else in the novel, is characterised by «unity of consciousness» (later «unity of consciousness and the senses») through a literary style and precise images found in Unions (1911). She becomes aware of an inner shift: the world of feelings (and senses) is now complemented by the world of perceptions (soul); her brother's words start making sense without having to recur to thinking and, without believing, she can feel the proximity of God; this then must be what Ulrich wittily called «The Millenary Kingdom». (References to 13th c. Persian mystic Farîd od-Dîn ‘Attâr.) (2) Ulrich, using his trademark inquisitive, intellectual approach, moving from an investigation of the collective role of the arts (people want to be moved, to live an experience), eventually also questions himself on the nature of this Millenary Kingdom.
§146. A sexual climax introduces the narrative climax of this section, as well as an apparently crucial moment in the entire novel: Ulrich, brought by a free association of childhood memories and thoughts to a new understanding of human desires and struggles, has a vision accompanied by a new, clear act of volition.
I bought a copy of volume 1 and 2, not to read (at this point), but to have on my bookshelf as a motivating factor for my upcoming read of Infinite Jest."Look, it could be worse. You could have chosen ME!"
Though it probably will make its way on to my TBR eventually. I do like my annual Doorstop Challenge.
Squire wrote: "I bought a copy of volume 1 and 2, not to read (at this point)...
Phew, I feel less guilty for reading it without having bought a copy: in the great scheme of things, everything balances out :)
Phew, I feel less guilty for reading it without having bought a copy: in the great scheme of things, everything balances out :)
§§147-156.
From Agathe's reunion with Ulrich to the day of the important meeting at Diotima's.
In a note about volume II, Musil points out that the novel has been gradually gathering around the topic of ethics and «the problem of righteous living»; nothing will happen in volume II (other than, perhaps, the start of the war), and the intent is that of portraying «the void in European morals».
"How should I live?", wonders Ulrich, as he and Agathe think about the [never materialised] possibility of organising their shared home (§147).
«Nothing is "present" anymore the way it was during childhood» (§148): the drama of growing up, acquiring the sense of the "I" or individuality, and getting lost in the mist of egoism. I find strong parallels between the thesis discussed here and the groundbreaking theories of Niels Bohr (the "observer effect"; Nobel in 1922) and Werner Heisenberg (the "uncertainty principle", pub.1927; Nobel in 1932): a system is disturbed by the act of observation.
Recurring to Plato's myth of the Androgynous (in "Symposium") offered by Agathe, Ulrich describes the collective mirage represented by the belief that "union" can be achieved through the couple relationship and, when this hope fails, through the equally doomed institution of the family. Cf. Musil's poem «Isis und Osiris» (1923), later defined by the author as «the kernel of the novel». Again on this in §151: Love, true love, is – almost by definition – an exception to the normal functioning of reality; thus it cannot become the model for daily life.
§149 continues Musil's criticism of the concept of redemption as the solution to the problems afflicting Europe.
In §153 the focus is on morality. The categories of "moral" and "immoral" are ultimately equivalent and superficial, as they change with the trends and fashions of the times.
Extensive drafts for §156 date back to the early 20s. Characters and dialogues draw very closely from the visit of Musil and his wife to the Rome madhouse in 1913.
From Agathe's reunion with Ulrich to the day of the important meeting at Diotima's.
In a note about volume II, Musil points out that the novel has been gradually gathering around the topic of ethics and «the problem of righteous living»; nothing will happen in volume II (other than, perhaps, the start of the war), and the intent is that of portraying «the void in European morals».
"How should I live?", wonders Ulrich, as he and Agathe think about the [never materialised] possibility of organising their shared home (§147).
«Nothing is "present" anymore the way it was during childhood» (§148): the drama of growing up, acquiring the sense of the "I" or individuality, and getting lost in the mist of egoism. I find strong parallels between the thesis discussed here and the groundbreaking theories of Niels Bohr (the "observer effect"; Nobel in 1922) and Werner Heisenberg (the "uncertainty principle", pub.1927; Nobel in 1932): a system is disturbed by the act of observation.
Recurring to Plato's myth of the Androgynous (in "Symposium") offered by Agathe, Ulrich describes the collective mirage represented by the belief that "union" can be achieved through the couple relationship and, when this hope fails, through the equally doomed institution of the family. Cf. Musil's poem «Isis und Osiris» (1923), later defined by the author as «the kernel of the novel». Again on this in §151: Love, true love, is – almost by definition – an exception to the normal functioning of reality; thus it cannot become the model for daily life.
§149 continues Musil's criticism of the concept of redemption as the solution to the problems afflicting Europe.
In §153 the focus is on morality. The categories of "moral" and "immoral" are ultimately equivalent and superficial, as they change with the trends and fashions of the times.
Extensive drafts for §156 date back to the early 20s. Characters and dialogues draw very closely from the visit of Musil and his wife to the Rome madhouse in 1913.
§§157-161.
The final section of volume II is designed as a carnival of conflicting opinions and theories: a portray of «the spirit of the times» with its set of isms: pacifism, racism, conservatism, militarism, liberalism and socialism.
On Musil's plans for the prosecution of volume II, see message #83: "History of volume II".
«"I told you. In a moment everything will be over without anything having happend."» (§159) It is the voice of Ulrich referring to the evening meeting as Diotima's; of Musil referring to the moral fragmentation of the times; of the reader realising the intended architecture of an uneventful volume II (and novel altogether, perhaps).
The discussions on morality and sanity finally and explicitly converge in §160, with the analogy between the perpetual shifts of the world and a case of individual mental deficiency (cf. §156). The definitions of sanity and insanity become blurred too: whereas the insane has one illness, the sane has them all so that they balance out. Likewise, morality is the sum of the insanity of each end every individual, resulting in an overall apparently stable system. In connection with this, Ulrich defines modern life as a «war of religion».
The utopia of «hermitic love» also reveals its weaknesses (§161), easily attacked both from the outside (Agathe meets Lindner) and from the inside (jealousy and misunderstandings between the siblings).
The final gathering in Diotima's kitchen sees Ulrich proposing a new definition of morality as «the order and unity of sentiment».
The final section of volume II is designed as a carnival of conflicting opinions and theories: a portray of «the spirit of the times» with its set of isms: pacifism, racism, conservatism, militarism, liberalism and socialism.
On Musil's plans for the prosecution of volume II, see message #83: "History of volume II".
«"I told you. In a moment everything will be over without anything having happend."» (§159) It is the voice of Ulrich referring to the evening meeting as Diotima's; of Musil referring to the moral fragmentation of the times; of the reader realising the intended architecture of an uneventful volume II (and novel altogether, perhaps).
The discussions on morality and sanity finally and explicitly converge in §160, with the analogy between the perpetual shifts of the world and a case of individual mental deficiency (cf. §156). The definitions of sanity and insanity become blurred too: whereas the insane has one illness, the sane has them all so that they balance out. Likewise, morality is the sum of the insanity of each end every individual, resulting in an overall apparently stable system. In connection with this, Ulrich defines modern life as a «war of religion».
The utopia of «hermitic love» also reveals its weaknesses (§161), easily attacked both from the outside (Agathe meets Lindner) and from the inside (jealousy and misunderstandings between the siblings).
The final gathering in Diotima's kitchen sees Ulrich proposing a new definition of morality as «the order and unity of sentiment».
Catching up on Classics (and lots more!)
Books mentioned in this topic
The Magic Mountain (other topics)The Sleepwalkers (other topics)
Fin-de-Siècle Vienna: Politics and Culture (other topics)
The Radetzky March (other topics)
The Magic Mountain (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
Uwe Johnson (other topics)Robert Musil (other topics)
Jens Peter Jacobsen (other topics)
Thomas Mann (other topics)
August Strindberg (other topics)
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