What are we reading? 8th June 2022

[Berkley]

scarletnoir wrote: "Thanks to all for their Muriel Spark recommendations - I'll very likely read one sometime in 2022.


Thanks also for the responses re. the mountain climbing expedition - I didn't expect such detailed replies! In all honesty, I expected short answers to the question ..."

Especially when you consider how difficult it must be to type while scaling cliff faces, dodging avalanches, hammering in those spikes, and so on ...

[Robert]

I'm remembering a book I discovered in high school:
No Heaven for Gunga Din
A unique 1940s fantasy, not published until the 1960s. A group of British and American officers, killed in the Harvesting-Living-War (World War III), march through the afterlife, looking for Heaven, with Gunga Din, their servant, "in their behind."
Fantastic episodes, down-to-earth dialogue, flashes of humor. (Paradise is guarded by Heaven MPs, who become targets of the former soldiers.)
The author was a Persian. During World War II, British, Soviet, and American forces occupied Iran. Like the "Gunga Din" character in his story, the author worked as a servant for occupation officers. He wrote the novel, partly to practice his English, partly to explore religious issues, partly out of mischief. ("You drank these officers' beer, and told them that the bottles broke on the ice.")
Author: Ali Mirdrekvandi
I have posted a picture of the original cover.

[Veufveuve]

scarletnoir wrote: "Georg wrote: "I struggle with the word "preachy" because I don't know what exactly you mean by it."

I'm not going to respond to your points specific to Steinbeck, because - as I said in my origina..."

No need to feel guilty @SN! I'm very happy to provide recommendations when I have some kind of modest expertise. And if you don't want to follow up then someone else might. Short answer (that I didn't give before): they didn't know what they were doing and, in any case, had very limited materials with which to work. They did understand layering however.

In case I seemed kind of ambivalent yesterday, I really enjoyed the Henry Green and will certainly go on to read the other two I have.

[Robert]

scarletnoir wrote: "Gpfr wrote: "Recently I listened to an old Backlisted podcast on The Plague and I by Betty MacDonald. The Plague and I is based on her experiences in a sanatorium when she had TB in 1938..."

Haha!..."

The title was a reference to MacDonald's earlier book "The Egg and I," her adventures in operating a farm.

[Robert]

Georg wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: Steinbeck... tried 'The Grapes of Wrath' and didn't care for it, much - too long ago to be sure why... it may be that it was too 'preachy' for my taste - I don't like it when aut..."

Steinbeck painted in strong solid colors. The Grapes of Wrath was certainly an advocate's book, but was also based on the author's journalistic research. Steinbeck published Their Blood is Strong, an account of the migrant camps in California. Even William Randolph Hearst had some sympathy with this view, instructing his editors that the migrants were American stock down on their luck, and shouldn't be so harshly criticized in the papers.

[Gpfr]

Robert wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: "Gpfr wrote: "Recently I listened to an old Backlisted podcast on The Plague and I by Betty MacDonald"

"The title was a reference to MacDonald's earlier book "The Egg and I,"..."

I heard this on Backlisted, but as they said it doesn't work so well if you pronounce 'plague' /pleig/.

[Georg]

scarletnoir wrote(#48) As for the evils of capitalism - I'd think that the fairly obvious examples from real life would be both more timely (when well reported) and more powerful, than depictions in fiction.

In October 1936 Steinbeck published seven articles on the plight of the migrant workers in California ("The Harvest Gypsies"). Complemented with (by?) photographs by Dorothea Lange they were, in 1938, republished in the form of a pamphlet "Their blood is strong". 10,000 copies were sold at 25c each.

TGoW was published, very timely, in 1939. It became an instant bestseller, 430,000 copies were sold in that year alone.

That is the first point in my argument that, imo, fiction can be much more powerful than reportage.

The second is: the majority of books ever banned and/or burned were works of fiction.

Good reportage can give a face to the faceless, a voice to the voiceless. But it can only throw a spotlight, because, unlike fiction, it is limited in length.

And reportage is shortlived. Works of art aren't. Over 80 years on TGoW (book and/or film), the photographs of Dorothea Lange, Margaret Bourke-White, Walker Evans still move us.

Re people being forced to rely on foodbanks:

I've read numerous good, even excellent, articles on the cruelty the Tories have unleashed on the most vulnerable. What sticks in my mind though is a work of art epitomizing it: Ken Loach's 'I, Daniel Blake'.

[AB76]

scarletnoir wrote: "Georg wrote: "I struggle with the word "preachy" because I don't know what exactly you mean by it."

I'm not going to respond to your points specific to Steinbeck, because - as I said in my origina..."

Foodbanks supporting in the in-work poor is a neo-liberal dream, replace the state with volunteers and move the welfare support intrinsic in the social contact over to the vol sec, while lowering taxes. (NB> right now some taxes have gone up which makes the spectacle of a neo-liberal chancellor, Sunak, being attacked by his own mob rather unusual...".lower them taxes" Rishi, they chant)

[AB76]

The Tsar's Foreign Faiths: Toleration and the Fate of Religious Freedom in Imperial Russia has introduced me o some fascinating off shoots of Protestantism in Russia, plus various other non-Orthodox groups which comprised the complex mosiac of faiths under Imperial Russia.

One i had never heard of with Pashkovites, a group of Evangelical Protestants who while numerically small had quite a large influence due to numbers within court circles and the capital, St Petersburg. (Once freedom of religion was enshrined in 1905, there was a wave of conversions back from Orthodoxy to their original faiths, the majority were Catholics but within the Protestant re-conversions, Baptists and Pashkovites were significant)

The aggressive eradication of the Uniate church by the Tsarist regime from the 1760s to 1880s doesnt seem to have created much re-conversion, which suprised me

I have really enjoyed my month of reading this i'm in the last 30 pages now, its so refreshing to read about faith and religion in such detail

[[deleted user]]

@Scarlet, @Robert, @Berkley - Thank you recommending the film Laura. I watched it last night and it was very, very good. Beautifully complicated and yet completely clear. Great noir-ish atmosphere – most interior scenes were shot in shadowy light from lamps, with characters moving slowly about, thinking their thoughts, and whenever anyone went out into the street it was always black night, with the snow blowing, or the rain siling down (a Lincolnshire expression).

The story came from a novel by Vera Caspary. Has anyone tried any of hers? She wrote a lot.

Will now try In a Lonely Place.

[Veufveuve]

I've very much enjoyed Colm Tóibín's "The Heather Blazing" over the last couple of days. As I said in an earlier post, it has a tremendous quietness. Not much happens except just the ordinary stuff of life, but in its directness and simplicity it feels heartfelt and sincere. To sketch it very briefly, a middle-aged Irish High Court judge spends several summers at the same house where all his childhood summers were also spent. That's about it. But something I can't quite put my finger on yet got under my skin.

I think I've read only one other Tóibín, "Nora Webster." I've seen the film version of Brooklyn twice but am pretty sure I've not read the book.

[MK]

Berkley wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: "Thanks to all for their Muriel Spark recommendations - I'll very likely read one sometime in 2022.


Thanks also for the responses re. the mountain climbing expedition - I didn'..."

A different take on mountains - The Fallen Man . The book centers on Ship Rock mountain which is sacred to the Navajo nation and the mystery of the man who disappeared 11 years ago only to be found on a ledge on Ship Rock - how and when (important!!!) did he fall?

I'm an especial fan of mysteries that are set in a different time or place. This series also includes a different way of life, one that I could easily adhere to - harmony is the key word.

[Bill]

Russell wrote: "The story came from a novel by Vera Caspary. Has anyone tried any of hers? She wrote a lot."

I’ve read Laura and Bedelia, as well as a long story by Caspary in Troubled Daughters, Twisted Wives: Stories from the Trailblazers of Domestic Suspense; I found all to be entertaining thrillers.

The novel of Laura is told across four long chapters with three different narrators, and includes an interesting scene, not in the film, that foreshadows both murderer and motive. The soundtrack of Laura by David Raskin is interesting in that it consists entirely of varied arrangements of a single song; the only other film score I know of that uses this approach is John Williams’ The Long Goodbye.

Still unread on my shelves is The Man Who Loved His Wife. The title reminds me that years ago there was a marital therapy in the US called “Marriage Encounter” – some who had (presumably) successfully completed the program displayed a bumper sticker proclaiming “I ❤ My Wife”.

The movie is very good, but I think the novel of In a Lonely Place, on which the screenplay is only loosely based, is superior.

[MK]

Another for my TBR pile (what's the tallest book pile in the world?) -

Scarface and the Untouchable: Al Capone, Eliot Ness, and the Battle for Chicago .

Note -Max Allan Colllins is often published by Hard Case Crime.

[MK]

Time on your hands? Here's a link to Harvard Book Store's video archive - https://www.harvard.com/events/hbs_ch...

For the poetry lovers among us, I noticed at least a couple of talks you might enjoy.

[[deleted user]]

Bill wrote: "Russell wrote: "The story came from a novel by Vera Caspary. Has anyone tried any of hers? She wrote a lot."

I’ve read Laura and Bedelia, as well as a long story..."

Thanks, Bill. That is all very interesting. I think I will try all of them, and will read the book before watching In a Lonely Place.

[Bill]

Russell wrote: "That is all very interesting. I think I will try all of them, and will read the book before watching In a Lonely Place."

In the past, I've gone on binges where I read novels (some of which are pretty obscure as novels) and then watch the film adaptations. I've done this with many Hitchcock movies as well as a number of films noir. I've accumulated a number of novels with an eye to similar projects for Kubrick and mid-century SF films.

[scarletnoir]

Georg wrote: "scarletnoir wrote(#48) As for the evils of capitalism - I'd think that the fairly obvious examples from real life would be both more timely (when well reported) and more powerful, than depictions i..."

You provide excellent arguments, as I would expect of you.

It comes as no surprise to learn that Steinbeck wrote articles on the subject before the book, and of course I knew it was a bestseller. It would be interesting to know if either the articles or the book led to any significant changes in government policy. (That would IMO prove to be an interesting subject for a PhD study.)

It seems to me that government U-turns in my lifetime have in the main been the result of reports either initiated or publicised by the newspapers or TV etc. and then picked up by opposition parties and used as sticks with which to beat government ministers. Of course, there needs to be near-unanimity for this to happen - the crazy 'send them to Rwanda' policy will survive so long as the xenophobic Daily Mail is on board. So - journalistic reportage is more likely to bring about change - IMO - though in the absence of a PhD study I can't prove it. (Maybe there is one out there? Who knows?)

On the other hand, if we are talking about the effect on an individual's moral perceptions, then of course I agree with all your other comments regarding the power of fiction, book-burning and the durability of the argument... though here it seems to me that in many (not all) cases, those arguments need to be aired as promptly as possible to bring about change. (Some issues recur frequently and so novels can certainly be brought into action to support arguments relating to those.)

A final point - far more people access news through TV, newspaper articles or the Internet than do so via novels, so again I'd suggest that those media are more likely to be effective in the short term.

[scarletnoir]

AB76 wrote: "The Tsar's Foreign Faiths: Toleration and the Fate of Religious Freedom in Imperial Russia [bookcover:The Tsar's Foreign Faiths: Toleration and the Fate of Religious Freedom in Impe..."

Hi AB...

I won't pretend this is a special interest of mine - except insofar as it impinges on my understanding of Dostoyevsky.

Some time ago I read somewhere that he was an 'Old Believer', though I never completely understood what they believed! (I am not certain that the assertion was correct.) I also got the impression that his (or maybe a character's) POV was that 'god' was in fact the devil and that he believed in Christ as the fount of all goodness. I don't know if you can clarify either of these points...

This is a link to an article which touches on those issues:

https://providencemag.com/2019/08/fyo...

[Lljones]

Greetings, all!  Lots going on, chez 'CoolJ. I do read all the posts everyday, but haven't managed much in the way of posting for awhile; my apologies.  

I'm working on a update that even includes some books I've enjoyed since my last post. I'll try to get it loaded up later today or tomorrow.  In the meantime, Happy Flag Day!

[[deleted user]]

These Old Shades – Georgette Heyer (1926)

A lively page-turner, set mainly in the Paris of Louis XV, featuring several historical persons such as Madame du Deffand, and with a well-worked dénouement. For me, though, this early novel is not among her very best. The plot was too fantastical. For central figures, there is a satanic English Duke, an evil French Comte, and an outspoken innocent of uncertain background. The extravagance of the clothes and the settings - salons, hôtels, Versailles - seems unrelenting. I prefer her more sober tales.

[scarletnoir]

Russell wrote: "@Scarlet, @Robert, @Berkley - Thank you recommending the film Laura. I watched it last night and it was very, very good. Beautifully complicated and yet completely clear. Great noir-ish atmosphere ..."

Glad you enjoyed 'Laura'... let us know how you get on with 'In a lonely place' - I don't recall seeing it.

Your comments on the film's style are interesting, as one of the reasons I don't much care for 'The Maltese Falcon' has to do with the fact that it looks like a filmed play - very static. Despite the interiors, was more use made of editing and/or different camera angles in 'Laura'?

Am currently reading a film-related novel - The Snares of Memory by Juan Marsé - and will comment here when I finish, but will post a couple of interim thoughts in the Film sub-topic.

[scarletnoir]

MK wrote: "A different take on mountains - The Fallen Man The Fallen Man (Leaphorn & Chee, #12) by Tony Hillerman . The book centers on Ship Rock mountain which is sacred to the Navajo nation and the mystery of the man who disappeared 11 years ago only to be found on a ledge on Ship Rock - how and when (important!!!) did he fall?"

Thanks for that - I read one by Hillerman a while ago, and quite liked it without being bowled over. I'd have read more, I think, but - then, anyway - the books were not available in electronic form and I was disappointed by the very cheaply produced paperback I received. I may well give the series another go though.

[scarletnoir]

MK wrote: "Another for my TBR pile (what's the tallest book pile in the world?) -."


Haha! Well, I had already been thinking of writing about piles of books - you have pushed me into it.

I am definitely a terrible man. Only very recently, my wife asked me to get rid of some books (I have yet to do so). The Guardian recently, in their 'You be the Judge' column, asked whether a reader should be obliged to get rid of some of her books:

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandst...

Needless to say, I voted that she should keep them.

But... I am a terrible man. I look around the living room, and what do I see? 15 books in 5 piles of various sizes (there may be more lurking under the newspaper), plus the e-reader (220 titles). Behind my back, a full bookshelf containing a 1911 Britannica and many other ancient reference works, mainly bought by my grandfather around 100 years ago or more. I could get rid of those - I suppose - but it sort of goes against the grain.

Anyway - I'll tidy up the coffee table later on. It'll look better, and I'll feel just ever so slightly virtuous...

[scarletnoir]

Lljones wrote: "In the meantime, Happy Flag Day!"

Beautiful iris photo...

What on earth is 'flag day'?

[AB76]

scarletnoir wrote: "AB76 wrote: "The Tsar's Foreign Faiths: Toleration and the Fate of Religious Freedom in Imperial Russia [bookcover:The Tsar's Foreign Faiths: Toleration and the Fate of Religious Fr..."

Hi Scarlet

The "Old Believers" were Orthodox Christians who split off from the Orthodox Church in the 17c, they were traditionalists who resisted reforms of the church. Numerically they were only 2% of the population in 1897 and faced repression from the established Orthodox Church.

As far as i know about Dostoy, for most of his life he was a traditional conservative Orthodox Christian(rather than an Old Believer) looking east rather than west, unlike Tolstoy who fell foul of the Orthodox Church and was ex-communicated in 1901. In later life i would consider that Dostoy became even more conservative and was probably an Old Believer in theory(a bit like Anglo-Catholics in the Anglican Church).

In terms of differences between the liturgy ands ritual they seem small by todays standards but involved different ways of making a cross and slightly different texts used and most importantly they turned their backs on the established church system and laws

The Russians seemed pretty smug in the 1760-1860 period that they avoided the violent religious strife of the west but i feel thats pretty inaccurate, they did not tolerate dissent, eradicated the Uniate Church in the western borderlands, disdained catholics, distrusted Muslims and defamed Old Believers.

My book has now reached 1905-17, where the tolerance is better, conversions allowed but still an ambitious seven point plan for religious freedom failed to pass the four sittings of the Duma before WW1.

[scarletnoir]

AB76 wrote: "As far as i know about Dostoy, for most of his life he was a traditional conservative Orthodox Christian(rather than an Old Believer) looking east rather than west, unlike Tolstoy who fell foul of the Orthodox Church and was ex-communicated in 1901. In later life i would consider that Dostoy became even more conservative and was probably an Old Believer in theory(a bit like Anglo-Catholics in the Anglican Church)."

Thank you very much for that information - very helpful - as is the parallel with Anglo-Catholics. Much appreciated.

[Lljones]

scarletnoir wrote: "Lljones wrote: "In the meantime, Happy Flag Day!"

Beautiful iris photo...

What on earth is 'flag day'?"

Flag Day is literally a day to honor US flag; June 14th became a national holiday in 1950.

I'd much rather honor irises than the star-spangled banner. Are irises known as flags in your part of the world, or is that just a US thing?

[Georg]

scarletnoir wrote: "Lljones wrote: "In the meantime, Happy Flag Day!"

Beautiful iris photo...

What on earth is 'flag day'?"

Just a guess: I think the photo shows a flag iris (Iris versicolor), native to North America.

[Paul]

Lljones wrote: "Greetings, all!  Lots going on, chez 'CoolJ. I do read all the posts everyday, but haven't managed much in the way of posting for awhile; my apologies.  

I'm working on a update that even includes..."

Ah, it's good to hear from you.

[scarletnoir]

I have just started - and am hugely enjoying - The Snares of Memory by Juan Marsé - very many thanks to AB76, who recommended this. With only two ratings on Amazon and no reviews, I'd never have found it but for you... something about your review made me feel that I'd enjoy it - contrary to my usual practice, I bought the e-book without even sampling - and my instinct was right.

Great stuff - more later.

[scarletnoir]

Lljones wrote: "Are irises known as flags in your part of the world, or is that just a US thing?"

Thanks for that - we don't have a 'flag day' in the UK - AFAIK anyway. Is that why Americans take their flag - and flag burning - so seriously?

As for irises - I have never heard them called 'flags' over 'ere, but maybe others more knowledgeable than I am about flowers would know. I always liked irises - we had a few growing in the back when I was a kid - and one wedding present was a set of dessert plates with a beautiful picture of the flower. (The plates survive...edit: so does the marriage! Just thought that might be misleading.)

Edit again: I think Georg has clarified the flag/iris question above. Thanks, Georg!

[[deleted user]]

scarletnoir wrote: "...one of the reasons I don't much care for 'The Maltese Falcon' has to do with the fact that it looks like a filmed play - very static. Despite the interiors, was more use made of editing and/or different camera angles in 'Laura'?"

That’s an interesting question. There are no special edits or fades, no close-ups of a sweating face or a curling lip à la Bogey, no exaggerated lighting or distorted expressionist camera angles à la Orson (though there was a touch towards the end, a lurking figure starkly outlined on a staircase). But it didn’t strike me as stagey at all. Just Otto Preminger doing a smooth professional job, with all the interior scenes nicely varied. It starts with an ageing Clifton Webb being interviewed in his bathtub, bit of a surprise that one. You also have the lovely Gene Tierney to look at, and the camera does linger a bit, what a face.

[FrancesBurgundy]

scarletnoir wrote: "Lljones wrote: "Are irises known as flags in your part of the world, or is that just a US thing?" ..."

I've always called the yellow irises that grow round ponds 'yellow flags'. It's an accepted name in the UK I think, but then again I like to keep the old names going and I always call goosegrass 'herrif' (I think that's how it's spelt) as my Mum used to. I remember Geoffrey Grigson mentioned that in his Wild Flowers in Britain.

But on the subject of British wild flowers I'm thrilled to have two bee orchids appear in the middle of a rough old lawn in Norfolk. Hoping to propagate them I find that the seed can take up to eight years to get to flowering. That the plant although perennial often only flowers once. That each flower has 6000-8000 dust-like seeds. And that it needs mycorrhizal fungus in the soil to grow as there's a symbiotic relationship between the two. So I think this will be a one-off, but a beautiful one-off.

[AB76]

scarletnoir wrote: "I have just started - and am hugely enjoying - The Snares of Memory by Juan Marsé - very many thanks to AB76, who recommended this. With only two ratings on Amazon and no reviews, I..."

love to hear that Scarlet, the peeps here have done the same for me in the past, recommending a book i had never come across and leading me into a great reading experience

[AB76]

scarletnoir wrote: "AB76 wrote: "As far as i know about Dostoy, for most of his life he was a traditional conservative Orthodox Christian(rather than an Old Believer) looking east rather than west, unlike Tolstoy who ..."

the Anglo-Catholics differ slightly in that they were harking back to a more catholic faith, while the Old Believers had never left that original historicalk faith but if you then say the modern Orthodox Church in Russia "reformed" itself from the 1660s, then the comparison is a good one, the Old Believers sought to retain the original un-reformed liturgy of Orthodoxy

[Bill]

Russell wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: "...one of the reasons I don't much care for 'The Maltese Falcon' has to do with the fact that it looks like a filmed play - very static. Despite the interiors, was more use made..."

One thing I like about Laura the film is that the second half of the picture, after Dana Andrews falls asleep in front of Laura's portrait, can be read as the detective's dream.

[Gpfr]

FrancesBurgundy wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: "Lljones wrote: "Are irises known as flags in your part of the world, or is that just a US thing?" ..."

I've always called the yellow irises that grow round ponds 'yellow flags'..."

Just found this:

Why are irises called flags?
The name "flag" is from the middle English word "flagge," meaning rush or reed. Iris flowers are said to symbolize power, with the three parts representing wisdom, faith and courage.

Lovely photo, Ll

[AB76]

Having finished my reading on Imperial Russia and its "foreign faiths" my next non fiction read is Midnight in Sicily by Peter Robb.

I originally ignored this book, while i'm fascinated by Italian culture, especially Northern Italy, i am lukewarm on anglo-saxon homilies to Sicilian living and culture. However reviews suggest its not a travel book and is in fact a study of the crime situation on the island from the 1970s to 90s, which resulted in the Mafia killing of Judges Falcone and Borsellino.

I may be wrong and it will be a cooking and culture trip, but i hope not

[[deleted user]]

Bill wrote: "One thing I like about Laura the film is that the second half of the picture, after Dana Andrews falls asleep in front of Laura's portrait, can be read as the detective's dream"

I'm glad you mentioned that. I think it fleetingly crossed my mind and then I forgot about it. Perhaps there's a hint in the book - but don't say! - I will see what I think when I read it.

[MK]

scarletnoir wrote: "MK wrote: "A different take on mountains - The Fallen Man The Fallen Man (Leaphorn & Chee, #12) by Tony Hillerman . The book centers on Ship Rock mountain which is sacred to the Navajo nation and t..."

Truly, everyone is an individual. I often pick up seen-better-days paperbacks. I have yet to see if any of the Margaret Yorke mysteries I found at an Estate sale yesterday are duplicates. But at 25¢ each, I will not go broke if they are.

I still hope to have built a 'Little Free Library' in front of my house. That way I can, hopefully, pass on some of the overflow.

I also hope that you UKrs realize how lucky you are to have those charity shops because there is nothing equivalent here. (I blame the rental costs of storefronts.)

[MK]

scarletnoir wrote: "MK wrote: "Another for my TBR pile (what's the tallest book pile in the world?) -."


Haha! Well, I had already been thinking of writing about piles of books - you have pushed me into it.

I am def..."

This is how bad things are at my house. I have shelving everywhere - all full - and newer additions helter-skelter on their tops. To find space I have begun randomly picking fatter books on these same shelves. My present pick is a Detective Book Club 3-fer from the late 1940s. The first title which I am reading is There is a Tide. I much prefer Miss Marple to M. Poirot; however, he appears rather late in the book, so I am making allowances. The two other titles are 'T' As In Trapped and Borderline Murder.

Of course this whole venture of going after fat books is futile, but it does give my the illusion of progress, especially since this book will not make the re-read cut.

[MK]

AB76 wrote: "Having finished my reading on Imperial Russia and its "foreign faiths" my next non fiction read is Midnight in Sicily by Peter Robb.

I originally ignored this book, while i'm fascinated by Italia..."

It takes so little for my to see if my library has a book. I have just opened a new tab and put this one on hold. Sicily (and Malta) are such interesting islands. I find crossroads where many peoples have spent time so full of history.

Of course I should be reading John Julius Norwich's The Normans in Sicily: The Normans in the South 1016-1130 and the Kingdom in the Sun 1130-1194 instead. Now there is a fat book! If memory serves me, I picked it up in Foyles back when there was a used area (on the top floor?).

[Veufveuve]

Re: the power and impact of novels. Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle" (very much written as an attack on capitalism) led to significant shifts in public opinion but also to substantive policy change. The Meat Inspection act (1906) can be traced directly to the novel, and other subsequent developments (including the FDA) have at least some of their roots in Sinclair's book.

[AB76]

MK wrote: "AB76 wrote: "Having finished my reading on Imperial Russia and its "foreign faiths" my next non fiction read is Midnight in Sicily by Peter Robb.

I originally ignored this book, while i'm fascinat..."

fascinating mix of cultures in Sicily over the centuries and the Norman influence can be seen in the hair and eye colouring of many Sicilians

just watched the Naples based "Gommorah" on Sky Atlantic, season 5, i though the first episode was brilliant

[[deleted user]]

AB76 wrote: "fascinating mix of cultures in Sicily over the centuries and the Norman influence can be seen in the hair and eye colouring of many Sicilians"

Arabic traits too, as with the dark complexion of my late father-in-law, whose family are all from … Corleone.

[Georg]

Veufveuve wrote: "Re: the power and impact of novels. Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle" (very much written as an attack on capitalism) led to significant shifts in public opinion but also to substantive policy change. T..."

It did indeed. But I wouldn't even call this a Pyrrhic victory. Like Steinbeck he was a journalist-turned-novelist. He had worked undercover in Chicago's meat district.
He did not care about food safety. Only about the inhuman working conditions. And that is where he (was) failed. They didn't change.

"I aimed at the public's heart, and by accident I hit it in the stomach."

[AB76]

Russell wrote: "AB76 wrote: "fascinating mix of cultures in Sicily over the centuries and the Norman influence can be seen in the hair and eye colouring of many Sicilians"

Arabic traits too, as with the dark comp..."

oh yes, of course, italy has so many small ethnic markers accross the southern states. There are Norman, Albanian, Maltese, Arabic and other traces accross the south, plus spanish/catalan regions too.

There are catalan-descent peoples in sardinia when it was part of the Kingdom of Aragon, a famous catalan-italian was PCI leader Enrico Berlinguer from Sassari

Corleone......lol

[AB76]

Georg wrote: "Veufveuve wrote: "Re: the power and impact of novels. Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle" (very much written as an attack on capitalism) led to significant shifts in public opinion but also to substantiv..."

Sinclair took on the oil industry too with "Oil", which i didnt like

Mention should also go to Frank Norris and his novels The Pit and The Octopus and while not related to muck raking, his brilliant "McTeague" is a must read and an early San Francisco classic

[Bill]