Why Shoot a Butler? June 2022 Spoilers Thread

[Critterbee❇]

This is the thread for final conclusions, reactions and general Why Shoot a Butler? spoilers.

This is my first read through of the book, so I will not be returning here until I have finished.

What did you think?

Here we go!

[Barb in Maryland]

Where to start?
This is really a 2 star book.
It's pretty terrible.
The plot is riddled with large holes; Frank and Shirley are not in the least bit likable. It's a good thing they end up together as that spares anyone else from having them in their lives.
The wonderful Mrs Matthews is about the only character that makes it barely readable.
Bleh!!

[Susan in NC]

Barb in Maryland wrote: "Where to start?
This is really a 2 star book.
It's pretty terrible.
The plot is riddled with large holes; Frank and Shirley are not in the least bit likable. It's a good thing they end up together ..."

Totally agree on all points! Yet somehow, I’ve made myself read it four times, last time, last year with the Detectives Group. Much too soon for a revisit, so I’ll be skipping this one this time, and see everyone in July for Sylvester. Enjoy!

[mark]

I read this one last year. Not my favorite Heyer (is it anyone's?). But I enjoyed it well enough, due to a couple of the supporting characters and especially because of the incredibly obnoxious hero Frank. That guy constantly made me smile, he was such a self-amused jerk. Also liked the abrupt ending which I should have realized was very Heyer, but still took me aback, in a good way.

[Jackie]

Just started and I'll be back when I finish again, but I started out disliking this book decades ago and it's grown on me over the years.

I can't disagree with anyone who says both Frank and Shirley are unlikeable but, basically, I've just gotten used to it and can enjoy the rest.

[Teresa]

This was my first read. Frank certainly was obnoxious at the best of times and Shirley was a bit of a pain but even with that I really liked it! The mystery was good. I was between two who I thought might be the killer. Chapters seventeen and eighteen were all action and I was completely absorbed.
I never read crime novels of any type until I joined the Christie group and also started reading the Heyer crime books with this group. I'm enjoying them all very much.

[Jackie]

She was at once anxious to shift her burden of worry onto shoulders that seemed to her eminently capable of bearing it, and nervous of the result. She could never quite forget that painful grasp on her wrist beside the dead man’s car on the Pittingly Road.

Not only is Frank rude, he literally leaves Shirley with bruises the first time they meet. I recently re-read Madam, Will You Talk? where another heroine falls in love with a man who is rough enough to leave a mark the first time they meet so I was struck by that.

And there is the love for a big, fast car The Bentley, and an exciting car chase although Mary Stewart's heroine is the opposite of the passive victim waiting to be rescued.

[Jackie]

I just accept that Frank is rude and Shirley is surly and move on. I am now able to enjoy the action and, especially, the other characters like Aunt Marion. and the humor! often at the expense of poor Sargeant Gubbins.

There has been a process with all Heyer's mysteries which I disliked back on first read (decades ago!) just because they are not her romances.

the characters are much more hardboiled and the slang is less fun and more silly, as in Shirley telling Mark

She said fiercely: ‘Yes, it’s your affair, and you leave me to do the work. All right, I’ll do it, but you’ll keep out of it! See?’ which sounds like a bad gangster movie to me.

since then I've grown to like them all except Penhallow so I suppose I should re-read that one.

[Teresa]

I agree Jackie. Very well put.

[Julie]

Barb in Maryland wrote: "Where to start?
This is really a 2 star book.
It's pretty terrible.
The plot is riddled with large holes; Frank and Shirley are not in the least bit likable. It's a good thing they end up together ..."

Nicely put, Barb. This was a first read for me, and that pretty much sums it up! I thought Lady Matthews and the car chase were its only redeeming features.

[Jackie]

posting in the nonspoilers thread reminds me, was there ever a more dramatic rescue? Shirley can barely keep her head above water!

[Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂]

I really hated this book the first time I read it & should have given it 1★. I liked it better this time, but it is still only a 2★ read for me. Easily her worst mystery for me - although Footsteps in the Dark is mediocre at best.

I liked Shirley better this time around, but I still can't stand Frank! He was arrogant & often needlessly rude!

There was also only one possible suspect for the second murder.

At least this time around I picked up on the reason for the endless car chase! (missed on my first read)

I really liked Lady M & the Sergeant. I think GH did as well - they got the best lines.

My second & final read of this one I'm afraid.

[Barb in Maryland]

Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ wrote: "I really hated this book the first time I read it & should have given it 1★. I liked it better this time, but it is still only a 2★ read for me. Easily her worst mystery for me - although Foo..."</i>

It is interesting to note that this book and 'Footsteps' were the first two 'modern' mysteries that she wrote. By her third ([book:The Unfinished Clue) she had definitely figured out the genre--indeed, it's my favorite of her mysteries.

[Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂]

The Unfinished Clue is my favourite as well - & I have only read the once. I'll definitely be ready for a reread by next year!

[Rebekah]

I disagree with virtually everyone! This is my absolute favorite Heyer mystery. I loved Frank's obnoxiousness! He is no more obnoxious than most of the mark 1 regency heroes, which he forcefully reminded me of. Shirley was a true original. there is no one else like her in any of the Heyer ouvre, except possibly Beulah in another mystery. Lady Mathews is possibly my favorite secondary character in Heyer. A defiant 5 stars!

[Barb in Maryland]

Rebekah wrote: "I disagree with virtually everyone! This is my absolute favorite Heyer mystery. I loved Frank's obnoxiousness! He is no more obnoxious than most of the mark 1 regency heroes, which he forcefully re..."

That's the great thing about GH's books--her audience is vast and everyone can find a book (or twelve) to love. I'm happy to see that this book has a champion in you.

[Rebekah]

Thanks Barb. If Lady Mathews likes Frank, how can I not? I do admit the mystery is not very mysterious though.

[Jackie]

Rebekah wrote: "Thanks Barb. If Lady Mathews likes Frank, how can I not? I do admit the mystery is not very mysterious though."

in my 20s, I would have shook my head at how wrong you are. I'm 60 now and I think it's great you like the book. And also Duplicate Death, apparently.
are there any of her mysteries you don't like?

[Rebekah]

I dont like Penhallow or Footsteps. Detection Unlimited is not a favorite but it's OK

[Teresa]

Rebekah wrote: "I dont like Penhallow or Footsteps. Detection Unlimited is not a favorite but it's OK"

It was my first read Rebekah and I enjoyed it. A lot!!

[QNPoohBear]

I had a hard time getting into it. The bruises turned me off too. It picked up in the second half and I couldn't put it down. I have no memories of the plot whatsoever from my first reading, making me doubt I ever did read it. I thought for sure the murderer was Corky or whatever his name is, Joan's fiancé. Basil was too obvious.

Frank is obnoxious and arrogant. He doesn't HELP the police, he withholds evidence and then sets out to solve the whole thing by himself. Granted the Inspector is a bit of an idiot.

Shirley is unlikable as well but I feel sorry for her. Having Mark for a brother isn't easy and she's stressed out about what he may have done, is going to do, did - until he is murdered. THEN she should have confided in someone. I figured out who they were right away.

Lady Matthews is charming and I'd read more scenes with her. She's way smarter than all the men give her credit for.

Both the butler, Dawson and the valet, Collins were unpleasant and nasty yes but they probably felt they had no choice. I'm not justifying their actions, just explaining their mindset. The whole plan was half baked and really stupid. All Shirley and Mark had to do was go to the police or even say "We don't want it! He can have it all!" especially after seeing the gloomy manor.

This isn't her best mystery but it's not her worst either. I think she was attempting hard-boiled when her niche was really more comedy. The Inspector H and H books are much funnier.

[Teresa]

One thing kept going through my mind when reading it, could you imagine talking to or treating the police today like he did? He was completely obnoxious!

[Gretchen]

I agree Frank is completely obnoxious.
The servants well they do have a tendency to be standoffish and rude anyway but yeah still ...
I agree when Mark got drunk the first time she should have tried to find someone she could trust but I can see where she is coming from she is really in a jam the people she thought she could trust failed her and anyone else may be have it in for her how was she to know?

I love the Lady Matthews character she puts on this act like she has no idea what is going on but then you find out that she knows alot more than people think.

Overall I liked it.

[Emma]

This isn't one of my favourites of Heyer's crime novels, but I re-read it yesterday and found myself enjoying it more than I'd expected. Frank is arrogant and certainly thinks he's cleverer than anyone else around him (mostly justified, unfortunately), and I could have done without his lengthy recapping of how he'd come to discover what was going on and what all his actions were. I liked Shirley a lot more this time round, too - I thought she was very believable, in that probably for most of her adult life she's had to rely on herself (she certainly can't rely on her brother, and her father doesn't sound as though he was much of a parent), so I don't think it's ridiculous that she doesn't trust Frank sooner.

The problem with this one is that Heyer doesn't play at all fair with the reader, since she withholds information from us, and not in a clever way, by misdirecting our attention, but actually not giving us the information that Frank has. That said, Lady Matthews is delightful, and I love the way that Felicity takes no guff from her autocratic cousin. Do we assume that Aunt Marion is Frank's father's sister? She makes some unflattering reference to him being just like his father.