The World of the Others Series - Bishop [Jan 15, 2022]

[Nirkatze]

Started the book today. Got myself embroiled in three books at the same time, which I don't normally do, but I've had a tough week at work and needed me a good dose of comeuppance.

Just hit the first Them chapter. And I think I'm going to get my comeuppance real good.

[Nirkatze]

Emily wrote: "Yay Crowbones is out! I'm gonna start early because I need my next audio... Seems like we're back with Vicky at the Jumble
[spoilers removed]

Crowbones [spoilers removed]"

re: Cop show (view spoiler)[I really liked the conversation that inspired in the first chapter! How a Crow could help out a police investigator--and a very good question of whether the placement in the shot was on-purpose or accidental. Can you imagine a Crow Sherlock Holmes? Crowlock Holmes? (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

Emily wrote: "Through chapter 10Haha Trickster night as Halloween. I like the things Bishop throws into these novels from the real world..

I'm glad we get to Crowbones so early in the book. It seems to be a Cr..."

I was wondering the same thing Emily, Narilka! If y'all were wondering, I'm pretty sure I was the one who brought up hoping for (view spoiler)[bad Others (hide spoiler)] since our conversations on book 2. (view spoiler)[After the bad Intuits and Simple Life folk in book 2, I'd been wondering if we'd get to see this side of the Others as well! I'm excited to get our first Other villain (potentially).

And I'm also curious on the same thing Emily--what makes someone "bad" to Crowbones? If he's bad, is it good people? Probably not that simple. Maybe Crows who get too close to humans? Is he a purity police? (hide spoiler)] Looking forward to finding out! I'm only up to Chapter 10.

[Nirkatze]

Them, through Chapter 9. (view spoiler)[Interesting getting evil professors too. This suggests there are two groups of researchers here--one would be the Rodney, who has potential to be the first Them voice, from his arrogance and likely involvement in the fake Crowbones--though I'd expect him to be a little more disconcerted if his accomplice showed up dead post experiment.

I wonder if both groups are going to end up being the evil ambitious type, or if one group is the Them chapter (so far) and the other group is more benign? (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

Timelord Iain wrote: "Narilka wrote: "Emily wrote: "Through chapter 10..."..."

OBVIOUSLY, scary costumes are [spoilers hidden]"

OMG Iain, that's brilliant. Makes me want to reread the main series over again.

I'm up to Chapter 25. Regarding bad folks--(view spoiler)[I was initially a little disappointed when we got a hint of Crowbones, because it didn't seem like she (or the unnamed Crow) were actually "bad" in the sense of Anne Bishop's usual baddies--but now, we get the Crows she's hunting, and the hint of "corruption" among the Crows and the Sanguinati (Kira, I'm assuming), and this is more to taste. The "corruption" also reminds me of the Black Jewels. (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Nirkatze wrote: "Timelord Iain wrote: "Narilka wrote: "Emily wrote: "Through chapter 10..."..."

OBVIOUSLY, scary costumes are [spoilers hidden]"

OMG Iain, that's brilliant. Makes me want to reread the main series..."

Right?... Anne Bishop definitely has a type... I like her books, but her author pic gives me Handmaid's Tale vibes, paired with the subject matter of her books...

[Nirkatze]

Oh, I can totally see that. And now I can never unsee it. >.< lol

Yeah, it's true there is a very specific vibe throughout all of Bishop's books--kind of like mac 'n cheese.

Oh, and speaking of broomstick girl and frying-pan woman... in Chapter 55: (view spoiler)[Vicky thinks: Wishing I’d taken to keeping a baseball bat or a frying pan under the bed in case I had reason to whack someone... I hope she starts keeping a bat under her bed, and so she can become Bat Woman. Or maybe Bat Reader. (hide spoiler)]

This quote in Chapter 68 made me think--well, this quote and also that I just started Scalzi's The Kaiju Preservation Society, which is the first book I've read that mentions COVID--that this book, which was probably also inspired and written during COVID--I wonder how much of the situations folks in the World of the Others are dealing with after the purge is influenced or inspired by life in COVID? Anyway, here's the quote: (view spoiler)[Guests talked about the houses and parties and things they had never actually done as if a couple of generations had passed between Then and Now, when the truth was, we were barely a year past the war that showed humans how little significance they had in the world’s scheme of things.

Considering that the whole village of Sproing is essentially put into lockdown too, and lots of stay-puts except for grocery runs... worries on toilet paper, worries about supply-chain issues and manufacturing bases being shut down... even though the purge event was written several years ago, there's a lot of common ground in the details here. (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

Narilka wrote: "Bad Guys/Them [spoilers removed]

I agree about Vicki [spoilers removed]"

Just finished! I really enjoyed this one. Very bingeable indeed.

Bad Guys/Them (view spoiler)[Thinking all the same thoughts as y'all. Some chapters--especially the early Them chapters--made it seem like a magical talent--which would be really interesting, considering that all the talents so far (Intuits, Cassandra Sangue) have been internal (unless you consider clairvoyance or precognition external), and even the terra indigene may have some magic that effects the physical world, but nothing so far that affects the mental state of others. No mind tricks, basically. Unless you consider the effect of CS blood. So was it only a use of chemical agents applied with psychology? Some of the later chapters, especially one of the last ones that looks at Vickie as a "creature whose spirit had already been broken by an expert in gaslighting and mental abuse" make it seem like it is primarily education. But then the very last bit with Grimshaw in the car brings back that question again. (hide spoiler)]

Vicki & POVs (view spoiler)[I really enjoyed Vicki's chapters. I thought the changes in POV--from the first person Vicki to third person most folks to the vague Them and Crowbones chapters--made for a fun puzzle and fast paced book. I liked Vicki's sense of humor and I think she's grown a decent bit from the first book.

I saw some folks getting upset with her for leaving the cabin to go grocery shopping--if that was the scene when she called for the meeting with Aiden, I guess I saw that a little differently. I thought she told folks she was going shopping because she didn't know who she could trust, but actually went out to contact Aiden. Maybe I'm giving her too much credit? Was she already heading out before Ian stopped by to give her his intuition message?

When she ran out after Aggie, I might have yelled at her a little. But I thought it was well set up--by Osgood's chat with Grimshaw about running out without thinking if Paige was in danger, versus if Pat was in danger, and the similar thoughts about Ilya & Natasha. Vicki feels that way for her employees. Also, Vicki is probably even safer outside than she is inside--outside, where all the terra indigene Elders and Elementals can keep an eye on her. Not that she probably sees it that way. (hide spoiler)]

I was also intrigued by the bits I think were potentially COVID inspired, but I mentioned those in an above post.

Even though I was a little late to the game, it was fun reading through all y'all's spoiler tags!

[Tammie]

Nirkatze wrote: "Narilka wrote: "Bad Guys/Them [spoilers removed]

I agree about Vicki [spoilers removed]"

Just finished! I really enjoyed this one. Very bingeable indeed.

Bad Guys/Them [spoilers removed]

Vicki ..."

I agree with your thoughts on Vicki and the POV changes. I enjoyed it as well, and I liked reading from her POV.

Vicki- (view spoiler)[I did want to yell at Vicki a lot for running out after Kira though. She could easily have sent one of The Others to do that. It frustrates me when characters lose their brains and do stupid things to help advance the plot.

I'm not sure what the running errands thing was about that everyone was referring to either. I didn't think she did anything reckless. (hide spoiler)]

Kira and Viktor- (view spoiler)[I thought they were all a bit too slow in figuring out Kira and Viktor. There were several clues. Ilya had found out that they weren't actually sent there by the Sanguinati. There was the warning that Kira was a honey trap early in the book, and then the whole thing with her voice luring Karol into the warehouse. They should have at least recognized that they were a threat, but they did nothing. (hide spoiler)]

The Five- (view spoiler)[Also, regarding the five. Some of you were wondering if they were Elders. There is a paragraph in chapter 80 that says: "He wondered how long it would take the Five to tell the REST of the Elders that there were humans, and possibly some terra indigene, who posed a risk to the Reader."

Also this bit: "Not when the Five were among the Elders keeping watch."

It seems pretty clear that they are Elders after reading that. (hide spoiler)]

Overall I really loved this book, despite a couple of small issues. What I like the most is the humor and the way the bad guys always get their due. Even if it's sometimes slow in coming, it's always satisfyingly vicious.

[Nirkatze]

re: Kira and Victor--I feel you. (view spoiler)[I think that's another one of the trademarks of an Anne Bishop book--the good guys are usually OverPowered, but are always just a little too slow on the uptake. Either they're distracted by something, or their hands are tied by something, or they're willfully blind for some reason.

I think in this book the distraction was looking for the adults and they were ignoring the children. But yeah, Grimshaw especially had all the pieces and was even wondering about why Kira's voice was on the recording and how Viktor's story didn't match up--and he pretty much just ignored it.

I was sad about Viktor. He hid his nasty better than Kira. I liked him interning at the police station. (hide spoiler)]

One other thing I really liked about this book--and Anne Bishop in general (and we touched on it in the second book), is her inclusion of people with disabilities, people dealing with trauma, and neuro-atypical characters. Just like the message, she doesn't pity them, she gives them a space in her books to be themselves, and to give them support if they need it.

[Narilka]

Nirkatze wrote: "One other thing I really liked about this book--and Anne Bishop in general (and we touched on it in the second book), is her inclusion of people with disabilities, people dealing with trauma, and neuro-atypical characters. Just like the message, she doesn't pity them, she gives them a space in her books to be themselves, and to give them support if they need it. "

Agree with this so much.

@Tammie - My confusion with the 5 were from the first book. I think I made a bad assumption. (view spoiler)[I didn't remember the five being introduced as Elders in Lake Silence. I made an assumption that because of their young girl appearance they were Elementals like we saw in Meg's series. Bishop definitely put that idea to rest in this book! (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

@Narilka fist-bump! And a bow to Bishop-sensei.

I do seem to remember there being something connected to the Sproingers from book 1 too, with sharp teeth... maybe the five...? but I don't remember what it was.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Nirkatze wrote: "re: Kira and Victor--I feel you. I think that's another one of the trademarks of an Anne Bishop book--the good guys are usually OverPowered, but are always just a little too slow on the uptake. Eit..."

That's one of the reasons I love Mistborn Era 2, and Steris (and Wax AND Steris together as the "trilogy" progresses)... the first book of that series seems designed to make the other sister the more obvious match for Wax, but by the 3rd book, when they're studying ledgers on the train to find a couple missing pennies, it's great...

[Nirkatze]

Same! Steris totally grew into my favorite character. I'm really looking forward to the reread and the conclusion later this year.

[Tammie]

That was one thing I liked about Mistborn Era 2 as well. It was so unexpected that I would end up liking Steris so much, and also liking them as a couple.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Tammie wrote: "That was one thing I liked about Mistborn Era 2 as well. It was so unexpected that I would end up liking Steris so much, and also liking them as a couple."

I think she's purposely portrayed almost unlikable in the first book, based on Wax's early impressions... then you get to know her over the following books, and how much she clearly loves Wax in spite of herself, and the ways she weaponizes her idiosyncrasies...

I think there's a moment in the 2nd or 3rd book where Wax needs some obscure item to accomplish something important, and of course Steris has it in her purse, because it was on one of her lists of crazy things that might be needed in an unlikely emergency...

[Tammie]

Timelord Iain wrote: "I think there's a moment in the 2nd or 3rd book where Wax needs some obscure item to accomplish something important, and of course Steris has it in her purse, because it was on one of her lists of crazy things that might be needed in an unlikely emergency......"

Haha, I loved that.

[Nirkatze]

Totally forgot about that and totally looking forward to rereading it. :)

[Tonari no Emily]

Yeah honestly I don't remember those books very well, so I'm very excited to reread and the new release :)

[Nirkatze]

Sadly, we've got to wait another year to find out what the next Anne Bishop is...though now I kinda want to reread the main Others series again...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

To continue the offtopic discussion ;)

Channeled my inner Steris at work last night, for the yearly Inventory/Audit... towards the end, I was calling it problem solving, when I was bringing back sheets that were being triple-checked for large discrepencies... most of the time I found the reason for the extra or missing 40/80/120 units... or 90% of them (small variance is expected, large variance isn't, when dealing with about $12,000,000 in unsold merchandise)...

Apparently I made a good impression on the visiting store managers from nearby stores and the regional manager for the Midwest region (Store Manager's boss's boss)... to the point my store manager mentioned it to me as I was leaving...

Not that I plan to parlay it into anything... I'm happy at the position I'm at... enough stress, at times, without being in a leadership position and getting called by store manager at all hours of the day :)

Still put me in a noticeably chipper mood on the drive home :D

(They also got me on my best behavior... no time for audiobooks ;)

[Nirkatze]

That's awesome Iain! Go inner-Steris!