The World of the Others Series - Bishop [Jan 15, 2022]

[Nirkatze]

OOoh, all the evil ideas!--re: Iain's evil (view spoiler)[cassandra sangue--and depending on how much control they had over their abilities, could be really difficult to catch. Though I guess the same would go for Intuits... (hide spoiler)]

@Emily, I wonder what an evil (view spoiler)[terra indigene would be like? I have a hard time thinking of them as evil in the traditional Bishop sense--ie: power hungry/greedy. But maybe want-to-wipe-out-all-mankind or even wipe out all cassandra sangue or something--get rid of a threat? So like, evil actions but a "for the greater good" attitude? Or just lost in grief, kind of like Virgil, but unable to control it? (hide spoiler)]

And @Emily, re: Joshua (view spoiler)[he's gotta be at least cassandra sangue adjacent. Maybe something they haven't categorized yet--he does have some prophecy-like moments, like naming the bad Simple Life man as a marsh. Maybe males just don't work the same way? Or are CSs related to Intuits somehow? Definitely curious to see how this develops! (hide spoiler)]

Formula for quotes: [people group], can't live with 'em, can't [random horrible murder method].

[people who inspire FOMO], can't life with 'em, can't [consign them to death by a million papercuts.]

[Nirkatze]

Narilka wrote: "@Emily, re Abigail [spoilers removed]

Wild Country, through Ch 18 [spoilers removed]"

I'm right there with you & Emily on the Skippies. (view spoiler)[I also really appreciate how Bishop highlights the capabilities of her Skippy characters--like that Becky is the only human who can tell the difference between Virgil and Kane.

It's nice to see the opposite of a Joshua, and the tension it stirs up, and a gay couple and the tension that stirs up with the unfitting Simple Life folk. I'm glad they have Jana to stand up for them and make sure the family stays together. Lots of heads are going to need crackin'.

Also enjoying Jana's interaction with the Wolf police force. She deals with them pretty well so far, though maybe she could use Joshua's pointers in how to deal with alpha Wolfgards too. (hide spoiler)]

re: family (view spoiler)[That's true, Bishop does have a tendency to create annoyingly stupid-and-greedy bad guys, and these seem somewhat more competent and aware than normal. Toss me down as another person looking forward to the inevitable violent comeuppance. But man, Bishop knows how to make readers squirm. (hide spoiler)]

I also really like how everyone in this universe loves books.

[Narilka]

Nirkatze, that quote formula is hilariously spot on!

I'm not sure I ever want to encounter an evil other.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Aren't (view spoiler)[Harvesters (hide spoiler)]the closest the world has to evil Others?... (view spoiler)[since they can't really control their abilities when angry, and can kill Others... blink and you're dead (hide spoiler)]

But Bishop even humanizes them...

[Tonari no Emily]

The two (view spoiler)[ Harvesters we've seen already try to control that though. I guess the one's who have no qualms with wiping out populations might count.. (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "The two [spoilers removed]"

Bishop repeats over and over that they're an exception to the rule... sounds lonely tho... wonder how many there are... and how they reproduce?... or are they just immortal like Elementals, basically?...

[Tonari no Emily]

That's true.. But I want a POV for one of the non-exceptions.
Definitely never thought about the reproduction aspect of those types haha

[Nirkatze]

And are Harvesters immune to their own power?

On bad guy note--I feel one thing Bishop's bad guys have in common is a lack of empathy and remorse.

Just finished Chapter 19. (view spoiler)[And that's why I'm worried that Abigail is going to turn out to be another bad guy--even though she finally came clean to someone about her past, she has yet to show care or concern for anyone other than herself. Which is really a shame--if she actually loved Kelley, think what a great pair the jeweler and the stone Intuit would make. (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

OMG. Chapter 20 moment had me doing roflcopters:
(view spoiler)[Tolya looked around and realized one of them was still missing.



Just. So. Cute!!! I am now Becky's #1 fan. I hope she uses pink bows. (hide spoiler)]

Also slapping my forehead with a big d'oh! for why I didn't realize that (view spoiler)[the people made of black stones in Hope's drawings were the Blackstone clan. *facepalm* I was looking for all deeper meaning than just swapping the words around... (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

Re Ch 19 - So agree! That would be an amazing combo. Such a waste.

[Nirkatze]

I keep thinking about the level of technology in the books. It feels very... mm... early 90s to me. There's cellphones and emails, but it takes time for a picture to download, and there doesn't seem to be searchable internet--and no texting. Distance orders are made with catalogues. DVDs but no streaming. Interesting choice that feels pretty nostalgic.

I haven't read a lot of high fantasy worlds with high technology--and I do think of Others as high fantasy, even though it's an alternate earth, it's pretty heavy on the alternate, so I don't quite slot it in low fantasy or urban. Have y'all read any other high fantasy (non-earth) books with high tech (as in, 90s~ present day tech, not steampunk)? The only series I can think of is Crescent City by Sarah J. Maas.

[Nirkatze]

Narilka wrote: "Wild Country, through Ch 30. I went on a reading binge :)"

Re: Jesse & Tolya, Jana (view spoiler)[It was nice to see a friendly mature relationship without the emotional baggage that often accompanies Bishop books--two adults who know what they want, communicate well, and don't try to second guess things.

Also really glad that Jana listened to Tobias and realized she was wrong--and was adult enough to apologize.

Has Jana lived all her life with Others? I got the impression her first meeting with terra indigene was when she went to Lakeside for the job fair--we know she went to the Academy in Hubb NE, and her foster parents were human, somewhere near the Adirondak mountains. (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 32. (view spoiler)[Poor Kelley. Even his rebound girl is a jerk. The guy can't get a break. (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

Finished! I had fun clicking through everyone's spoiler tags.

Same tear-jerker moment. Same glad they have made-families. Same love for the sign.

There always seems to be more humans with that horrible arrogance. You'd think they killed them all, but nooo.

Definitely hope we see more of Bennet in future books.

[Tonari no Emily]

Oh I forgot, one thing I wanted to bring up was the disjunct between progression of this world and ours.. Technology is around 90s ish like you said Nirkatze, but the views towards gender roles are very much earlier than that... Jana seemed to be described as the first policewoman like.. ever?

[Nirkatze]

Very true! It's a little hard to gauge social growth, since you've got two different groups--the "good" guys, who are generally more open minded, and the "bad" guys who are all close-minded mysogynist racist bigots.

Like, how about LGBT? There's the (view spoiler)[one gay couple, and the Others don't care, but the Simple Life folk do--but only the ones who don't fit. (hide spoiler)] What is life like for such couples in the general populace? We don't know. Is skin color and race even an issue, or has that totally been pushed onto the Other population as a stand-in? I can't say I noticed anything particular.

We have sweet Becky (view spoiler)[to show us that the general populace is at the very least socially unaccepting of those differently abled, while the Others just see them as different, needing protection, and a part of life. (hide spoiler)]

Then the Others have the whole alpha-dominance & mates thing, and there's the whole male-female tension ramped up by romance novel tendencies--but still, (view spoiler)[they were more willing to accept Jana at face value than her own species. Again, it is less that she is a woman, and more that she is human which dictates her tasks and usefulness. (hide spoiler)] It was refreshing in this book to see a little more shake-ups of the gender roles than in previous books--though really it's only Jana & Ed. Elsewise, women do women jobs, men do men jobs, and there's not much discussion--among people or Other.

I would love to see how a non-binary character would fit into Bishop's male-female dominated world.

[Tonari no Emily]

Yay Crowbones is out! I'm gonna start early because I need my next audio... Seems like we're back with Vicky at the Jumble
(view spoiler)[ Already got some humorous moments.. Costumes meeting no-pee approval. Wondering if a Crowgaurd wandered on set of the tv show.. haha (hide spoiler)]

Crowbones (view spoiler)[ Something is gonna happen with the crows in this one.. wonder what it'll be and who the baddy is.. (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

Cool! It's going to be my next book when I finish my current one.

[Soo]

I was excited about Crowbones and then remembered that I don't like the narrator. XD

Still excited about the story though!

[Tonari no Emily]

Soo wrote: "I was excited about Crowbones and then remembered that I don't like the narrator. XD

Still excited about the story though!"

Shes def not my favorite.. makes a lot of the women sound super whiny. But shes not interolable so oh well haha

[Soo]

She has a terrible fake southern accent. XD

Speeding up the audio helps. That's how I listened to her before. I just keep forgetting that I'm not a fan. hahaha

[Tonari no Emily]

Oh yeah 100% lol

[Tonari no Emily]

Through chapter 10(view spoiler)[Haha Trickster night as Halloween. I like the things Bishop throws into these novels from the real world..

I'm glad we get to Crowbones so early in the book. It seems to be a Crow legend.. taking Crows that do "bad" things. I wonder what is "bad" to Crows.. It actually seems to be some sort of Terra Indigene thing unless humans have figured out a way to actually scare the Others that much. I'm intrigued.. Do we have a true Terra Indigene villain?? (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

I'm starting Crowbones tonight :)

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

I'll get to it, in the next few days, when I finish Wisdom of Crows and Master of Djinn...

[Narilka]

Emily wrote: "Through chapter 10..."

I liked that too. (view spoiler)[Though had to wonder what they'd consider scary costumes considering they live in wild country...

The part about the costumes being "not-pee" scary had me laughing out loud.

Whoever wanted a "bad" Others book, this might be it. Seems there is something very odd going on. (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

I may have binge read.

Through Ch 30 (view spoiler)[Is that an Elder assassin???

I'm actually getting a little Black Jewels vibe here with Others that have gone "wrong" like thinking that associating with humans made the Others unclean or something.

I also do NOT like those professors. Perhaps it's an Intuit gone bad again and somehow convinced an Other to help or something? Or can corrupt Others? That's a weird ability not seen so far. I think we have some more candidates to get eaten by the end :D

The town on elemental lock down yet Vicki still wanting to go run errands alone /facepalm. WTF woman!! It's like shes trying to be a horror movie victim. If I had a nice resort with protection from Others and Others on staff, I'd have one of them with me at all times!!! Cougar seems like a great candidate to scare off any potential human trouble and a lot of terra indegene trouble too. (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

Ch 31 (view spoiler)[Woah! There's some truth behind the Crowbones myth!! I wasn't expecting that. Pretty cool :) (hide spoiler)]

[Tammie]

I'll be joining you all for Crowbones. I'll most likely be starting it tomorrow.

[Narilka]

Ch 36 (view spoiler)[I thought the 5 that came in for books were Elementals, not Elders? Am I misremembering? (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

Ch 43 (view spoiler)[I think I might have mad a bad assumption on the 5 being elementals because of the human forms they took. They definitely aren't elementals!

Random thought. The person or whatever is helping out Crowbones. Think it's a skippy? (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

Finished. That was enjoyable. There's something about these books that make them bingeable for me :) I hope Bishop writes more in the world. I'm looking forward to reading everyone's thoughts.

[Tammie]

I just stopped at chapter 26 in Crowbones. I agree with you, Emily and Narilka that- (view spoiler)[the no-pee costume thing was very funny. Also the part with the fox eating the bit-o-mouse. My husband wanted to know what I was laughing about. (hide spoiler)]

The parts from the perspective of Them and the unknown crow were a little confusing at first, just trying to figure out what was going on, but it became clearer as I read on.

I really like the short chapters in these books. It makes the reading seem to go faster. It's also been a while since I read a book I didn't want to put down.

[Narilka]

I like the short chapters too and for the same reason.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

It feels like this one is answering the questions we had in the past 2 books, about bad Others? (view spoiler)[corrupted by eating Bad Humans? (hide spoiler)]

All in all, I'm loving being back in this world, with these characters, and I've read like half the book in a very short time...

Even if some of the people's identities are confusing, as was mentioned above...

I'll read all the comments and respond, once I finish...

I just read the part with the bookshop visit...

[Tonari no Emily]

Narilka wrote: "I may have binge read.

."

Vicky (view spoiler)[ Right?? I'm pretty sure at some point she even brings up horror movie victim too... (hide spoiler)]

[Tonari no Emily]

Narilka wrote: "Ch 36 [spoilers removed]"

The five (view spoiler)[ I didn't know they were Elders, but I'm pretty sure it never said they were elementals.. I thought they were connected to the Sproingers somehow though... (hide spoiler)]

[Tonari no Emily]

Narilka wrote: "Ch 43 ."


(view spoiler)[ I guess Nikolai is almost considered a skippy now, but due to brain damage or some sort... I like how Crowbones and him adopted eachother.. And that makes me think we might go back to the Courtyard at some point? We actually got a Meg call in this one xD (hide spoiler)]

[Tonari no Emily]

I enjoyed this one a lot! I think it's the favorite out of the three.
Bad guys/Them (view spoiler)[ Yay more food for the Others! lol.. I wonder if the brother/sister duo/rivalry had a little more to them than just using psychology to talk people into doing things. Almost like a intuit but in reverse?
I also like how we talked about "bad" Others and we got them in this book.. even if it was instigated by humans. (hide spoiler)]
Vicky (view spoiler)[ She was still a bit of a frustrating character, but I did like all the humor she brought! I was laughing a bit at some of her lines and also found her thinking she would take on Grimshaw characteristics due to the transfusion kinda funny (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

Bad Guys/Them (view spoiler)[Yeah I had wondered that too. The ride with Grimshaw and the woman at the end though... could someone really get under the skin that fast? Seems plausible. (hide spoiler)]

I agree about Vicki (view spoiler)[She's not my favorite character and doesn't make a good lead IMO. The books structure only put her chapters the first person but hers isn't the dominant POV so it didn't overwhelm or unbalance the story. There's a pretty good POV blend. (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "Through chapter 10..."

Loved that, too... always interesting seeing what parallels Bishop draws... (view spoiler)[Crowbones seems like a Terra Indigine boogeyman... (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "Soo wrote: "I was excited about Crowbones and then remembered that I don't like the narrator. XD

Still excited about the story though!"

Shes def not my favorite.. makes a lot of the women sound ..."

It was either this book or Master of Djinn, this week, where the narrator pronounced forte like fort... I don't think that's right, unless it's another word that can be pronounced either way... threw me for a second, as possible errors like that always do...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Narilka wrote: "Emily wrote: "Through chapter 10..."..."

OBVIOUSLY, (view spoiler)[scary costumes are Exploding Fluffballs and Frying Pan Woman ;)

All the ways the human females "scare" the Terra Indigine when they get defensive of the kids :D (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Narilka wrote: "Ch 31 [spoilers removed]"

Right?

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Narilka wrote: "Ch 43..."

Spoiler for later, but in response, (view spoiler)[the Sanguinati helping... didn't he lose part of himself to the smoke form weakness, where you can trap some smoke and lose body parts?... kinda turned him into a skippy... or less made for human interaction, anyway... (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Narilka wrote: "Finished. That was enjoyable. There's something about these books that make them bingeable for me :) I hope Bishop writes more in the world. I'm looking forward to reading everyone's thoughts."

As long as Bishop maintains the quality... don't want Others going the way of the Black Jewels revival...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "Narilka wrote: "Ch 36 [spoilers removed]"

The five [spoilers removed]"

(view spoiler)[For all we know, they ARE the Sproingers... altho, that would have to be something the main Terra Indigine are unaware of, considering how much they worry about seeing Elders, as much as they worry about nice humans seeing them basically... (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "Narilka wrote: "Ch 43 ."


[spoilers removed]"

Definitely sounds like the next book could be (view spoiler)[a Meg book (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Emily wrote: "I enjoyed this one a lot! I think it's the favorite out of the three.
Bad guys/Them Yay more food for the Others! lol.. I wonder if the brother/sister duo/rivalry had a little more to them than ju..."

Definitely like them dentist/doctor's office videos online... (view spoiler)[where people say weird stuff or reveal secrets while high on the anesthesia... (hide spoiler)]

[Narilka]

Timelord Iain wrote: "As long as Bishop maintains the quality... don't want Others going the way of the Black Jewels revival..."

So far the Others is holding up much better than Black Jewels long term. I think I'm about done with Black Jewels. I am not excited by this latest book at all. Likely going to attempt to finish and not DNF though. I am hoping she switches back to the cast from Wild Country next if there is another book.

[Tonari no Emily]

Timelord Iain wrote: "Emily wrote: "Soo wrote: "I was excited about Crowbones and then remembered that I don't like the narrator. XD

Still excited about the story though!"

Shes def not my favorite.. makes a lot of th..."
That threw me off too! Makes me question whether I'm pronouncing things right lol. I think both might be right