Focus on Reading - Week 12 - Discussion Books

[Booknblues]

What makes a good discussion book?

Do you have to like a book?

What are some books you have read in the past that would be good for discussion? Why?

What are some books which you have read recently which would be good for discussion? Why?

[Theresa]

I'll chime in first here - at least in part. I may have to give some thought to answering some parts of the post.

I'm not sure I have a hard and fast definition of what makes a good discussion book. But I do know that I really get into a discussion on books that trigger one or all of the following as I read:

1. taking notes and marking passages
2. has me thinking of other books I have read - making connections
3. has me googling things
4. has themes or characers or even just a location that provoke thought and curiosity
5. I have an intense reaction in some way.
6. Seems to create extreme reactions in readers - adore it or hate it.
7. Something in the book strikes me as off or wrong or even perfect -- often this is an ending.

There may be other things but that is probably as close to a core list of what makes a good discussion book for me.

I do not absolutely have to love a book or even like a book to consider it a great discussion book. In fact, the more 'meh' some books are for me, the better a discussion I have on them. Recent example, the lively discussion in the comments of my review of
'Normal People by Sally Rooney. I would go so far as to say that if everyone loves a book, discussion can be uninspired and shallow.

Also, most non-fiction books do not provoke lively discussion.

Here's a list of other books I have had excellent discussions about in the last couple of years, and most evidence more than one of my criteria (for lack of a better word):

Wolf Hall - mostly because I hated it because the writing was so bad.
The Weight of Ink
Circe
A Brief History of Seven Killings
Black Water Sister
The Invisible Life of Addie LaRue- I could write a dissertation or teach a class around this book!
Rebecca
Mexican Gothic
Bel Canto
The Lacuna
She Who Became the Sun

Many of that list I have read this year ... I'm sure I have more I've read recently that would be good discussions. I'm starting Frankenstein: The 1818 Text for my Feminerdy Book Club and for Popsugar Challenge (and a Fall Flurries Read) over the weekend and I'm sure that will fit the list!

I also think the more broadly and eclectic your reading history has been, the more you find to trigger discussion in books. I relate many books to books I've read in the past - even as far back as college! -- which opens up my reading of the current book. For example, I'm currently reading Becoming George Sand by Rosalind Brackenbury. I was drawn to it in part because I really liked a book I read in 2019 or 2020 by her - The Lost Love Letters of Henri Fournier - and because it incorporates George Sand. Well, I did my senior thesis in college on the political activities and writings of George Sand. Thus I know a lot about Sand and absolutely am understanding what the author is doing in this book, which is about a woman and the different lovers and relationships with men that she has, a woman who sees George Sand as the person whose life can guide her on how to manage it all. I really hope someone else will at some point read this book because it will I think make for a great discussion!

I also recommend The Lost Love Letters of Henri Fournier and hope someone reads that at some point so we can discuss.

There is nothing more frustrating than having a book you think would be a great discussion....and no one bites.

I have an added question for all: Is there a book you thought would make a great discussion but didn't?

Besides non-fiction - for me most recently it was The Left Hand of Darkness. Oh, and the Murderbot Diaries --- those are actually too beloved by all who read them, so I have found discussion ends after we share our favorite moments.

I think the best discussions are where there are differences in opinion on the quality of the book, level of 'liking'.

[Patricia]

What makes a good discussion book?
- I think everyone agrees in that book they discuss.
Do you have to like a book?
- No, If not in your interest.
What are some books you have read in the past that would be good for discussion? Why?
- I think front desk. I'm a fan of Middle-grade books but I think most likely in here in the group likes young adult, Romance, or other genres.
What are some books which you have read recently which would be good for discussion? Why?
- I think the Lemonade war because it is a series and about brotherhood. The first theme is, if you are mean to others it will come back to you and another theme is your anger will slowly fade away, if you work things out.

[Joy D]

What makes a good discussion book?
A good book for discussion would include traits such as:
- it is multi-layered or complex and there are multiple ways to interpret it
- it is multi-cultural
- an ending that is open or hard to figure out
- a book that inspires "love it or hate it" reactions

Do you have to like a book?
No. In fact, I find discussions of books I initially do not like can lead me to a better appreciation for it, and possibly even change a dislike into a like.

What are some books ... that would be good for discussion? Why?
Bel Canto by Ann Patchett (the ending!)
The Door by Magda Szabó (complex behavior to analyze)
The Robber Bride (good discussion of why men get away with behaving in ways we despise in women)
Three Daughters of Eve (multi-cultural)
The Glass Hotel (love it or hate it)
A Tale for the Time Being (multiple interpretations possible)

I am sure there are many books that would make for a great discussion. I like that we can discuss books here at PBT pretty easily by replying to an individual's review!

[Theresa]

@Joy D - we need to discuss Bel Canto, especially the ending! And if you have not read it yet....Mexican Gothic - I see a connection there...or maybe an influence, especially then contrasting with Rebecca!

Could require its own zoom...to discuss those 3 books similarities, differences, etc.

[Holly R W]

What makes a good discussion book?

I think the responses posted above have already answered this quite well. To sum up, I can only say that good discussion books are ones with depth, are interesting and can lend themselves to differing interpretations.

Do you have to like a book?

I would prefer to like the book being discussed, but it isn't necessary. As an example, Little Fires Everywhere is a book that I disliked, yet garnered much praise. I have been fascinated by readers' descriptions of why they love the book.

What are some books you have read in the past that would be good for discussion? Why?

The Dutch House - We did discuss it here and I enjoyed the differing views. The book is multi-layered.

Hillbilly Elegy: A Memoir of a Family and Culture in Crisis - It generated a lot of discussion in my own family. There's a lot to think about in that book.

Exit West - It's so unique and the topics it concerns are so current. We did have a good discussion about it here.

What are some books which you have read recently which would be good for discussion? Why?

The Museum of Modern Love - It's about a controversial performance artist, Marina Abramovic. It's a blend of fiction and nonfiction. Is what she does truly art? What does it say about our society that thousands of people came to see her exhibit, "The Artist is Present"?

There are so many more books that I can list, which would be good to discuss, but I'll stop here.

Theresa posed a question in her earlier post about wishing there would be more discussions around our reviews. Yes, there are times that I post a review and it does not draw any comment. I understand that not everyone is drawn to the books that interest me, as we are all so different. Yet, I always wish for commentary and discussion.

[Joanne]

What makes a good discussion book?
I have to agree with Joy with "love it or hate hit". Meaningful discussion can blossom from opposing views. Then, I have to disagree with Theresa about non-fiction not promoting lively discussion. Just recently Joy, Stephen and I read the Rick Atkinson's The Guns at Last Light: The War in Western Europe, 1944-1945 and had a wonderful buddy read discussion through out. I think that any book that digs up emotion, be it anger or fear or love, can spark discussion worth having.

Do you have to like a book? Probably not, but as I am the queen of DNF if I am not liking a book, I am the wrong person to answer this. I would not have much to add to the conversation ;)

What are some books you have read in the past/recently that would be good for discussion? Why?

The Personal Librarian-because of the all the questions relating to Belle da Costa Greene, and her hiding her heritage.

Empire of Pain: The Secret History of the Sackler Dynasty - For chronic pain sufferers, like myself there were many "pokes" in this book would I think would lead to fabulous interaction, especially between pain sufferers and those who cannot even imagine what that life feels like.

[Booknblues]

What makes a good discussion book?
I think some people have said a love it or hate it book and I agree with that. It is good when people have varying opinions about the book.
A good discussion book needs meat for discussion and a little bit of controversy doesn't hurt.
Relevance is important as well. Is it dealing with something which effects peoples lives or is it something that people are currently concerned with.

Do you have to like a book? I don't think this is important, although as someone said, I might not finish a book, I don't like.

What are some books you have read in the past that would be good for discussion? Why?
Varying responses:
Cold Mountain
Life of Pi
Cutting for Stone

Relevance
The Orphan Master's Son
A Constellation of Vital Phenomena
Exit West

What are some books which you have read recently which would be good for discussion? Why?
Varying Opinion
The Mercies
Wild: From Lost to Found on the Pacific Crest Trail

Meat for discussion
This Thing Between Us

Relevance
Ghost Wall
Bewilderment
Cloud Cuckoo Land
The Pull of the Stars

[Joy D]

Theresa wrote: "@Joy D - we need to discuss Bel Canto, especially the ending! And if you have not read it yet....Mexican Gothic - I see a connection there...or maybe an influence, espec..."
I loved Bel Canto and almost gave it a rare-for-me 5 stars. I have not yet read Mexican Gothic - will see if I can get it from the library. I read Rebecca years ago.

[Joy D]

Regarding non-fiction, they can make for great discussions, as Joanne mentioned. The caveat is that the participants need to want to read whatever non-fiction is selected, and I do not get the sense that PBT is "generally" oriented that way.

One I think could make for a great discussion is:
Educated by Tara Westover

Another one, which I just finished reading is:
Invisible Women: Data Bias in a World Designed for Men by Caroline Criado Pérez

[Peacejanz]

Any book that is likely to have issues that will have at least two sides. Divorce, abortion, etc. We did The Girls of 17 Swann Street about anorexia. I expected everyone to say 1) what nice writing, 2) that disease is so sad. We had barely started when one woman spoke up about her freshman year in college. She lived in a dorm and another person on her hall approached her and said why don't we do something about Jan (using my name - this story is not about me but will be easier to explain with a name). The woman (freshman -17 or 18 yrs. old), said "What about her?" The friend pointed out that she hardly ate anything in the dining hall, never had snacks in her room as most of us did, and always wore big, floppy clothes. Now, when I was 17, I was looking out for good looking men in my classes and never paid attention to what others were wearing. Word got about and many started watching her and urging her to have candy or snacks, or anything to put weight on her. Finally, the group of girls (young women) decided to confront her. It was to occur in this woman's (Jan's) room. They confronted her, she denied that anything was wrong, then they held her down and took off her clothes. She was skin and bones. The whole dorm was now worried about her. Someone went to the dean of students or dorm housemother or somebody and her parents came and got her. The parents also thanked the friends for trying to confront her and help her. They took her home. She came back the next semester, not much better, stayed in a different dorm. By third year, she was not in college, she was dead. It put all of us on our ear - we were still talking about it a couple of hours later. Many of us do not know anyone with anorexia, it is such a hidden disease. We do not talk about it. It was our club's good fortune to have someone who really knew about this. It prompted me to open up about mental health and my only sister's suicide in 1966 when suicide came up in some book. A good discussion about mental health and how we can/should be more open about it. The next year, one of the members asked to speak to me privately - her granddaughter had just completed suicide and she wanted to talk about it. As I write this, I realize that all book groups are not so open. I push myself to talk about controversial issues. I once told a book group, with a black and Spanish woman in it, about an issue that involved me and a black couple who were my friends. (It was related to the book.) After I spoke, the black woman spoke up and thanked me for telling about the situation. Of course, at my age, I am really not afraid of much and I just want us all to learn. So I speak up. I think the choice of books depends upon the trust level in your book group. If people are afraid of speaking out, I don't know what you choose. I know a woman who coordinates a book group and she refuses to have any book with any controversy. I think that is her personality.
My favorite here is The Sense of an Ending. I was shocked when he did not recognize what nasty stuff he had written 50 years earlier. Made me fearful and very thoughtful about what I had written 50 years ago. So depends on the group.

No, you do not have to like the book if you are a thoughtful reader and listener. I always try to listen to the reasons people like books, especially if I hated them. Good reading. peace, janz

[Joanne]

Pacejanz wrote Now, when I was 17, I was looking out for good looking men in my classes and never paid attention to what others were wearing.

I loved the story-but that line, well lady-so was I! LoL

[Peacejanz]

Books that have blown away book group discussions I was in:

Still Alice - by Lisa Genova --- about Alzheimer's Disease

Amos; To Ride a Dead Horse -- about elder folks in a state home

When each of this was announced, people protested --- I don't want to read about AD or old folks in a home - the organizer insisted that each was better than we believed.

Both discussions were outstanding and people learned a lot.
A side note - this will not impair your reading. A woman I hardly knew was sitting just beside me when we discussed Amos. At some point, she said quietly, "just like Jesus Christ." I heard it, don't know how many others did. The conversation did not pick it up or discuss it but it has always stayed with me. She saw the ending in a greater context than I did.
If you have not personally read either of these, you should - spread the word, get your groups to read and discuss them. Each book is heart-rending and wonderful. Expect to cry. peace, janz

[NancyJ]

Theresa wrote: "@Joy D - we need to discuss Bel Canto, especially the ending! And if you have not read it yet....Mexican Gothic - I see a connection there...or maybe an influence, espec..."

Ooh I'm reading that now for a local book club. Unfortunately half the people will be missing. I hope we reschedule.

[Meli]

What makes a good discussion book?

In my experience it is always books that address complicated topics (race, abortion, class, addiction, adoption, etc) or books that people are split on. Out least engaging book club discussions are light reads everyone more or less enjoys because then there just isn't much to talk about.

Do you have to like a book?

I think it is often better if someone doesn't to generate lively debate / discussion.

What are some books you have read in the past that would be good for discussion? Why?

Such a Fun Age and Little Fires Everywhere generated a lot of good discussion in my book club because both address topics that are difficult to talk about (former is racism, and specifically white liberal racism) and controversial topics (latter would be adoption, birth parents vs non, class).

What are some books which you have read recently which would be good for discussion? Why?

My Dark Vanessa could be good for a book club discussion because it deals with consent and viewing past relationships differently as an adult. It deals with questions about whether you can actually consent when you are young and if you can truly consent when there is a power imbalance (teacher & student).

[Peacejanz]

Meli wrote: "What makes a good discussion book?

In my experience it is always books that address complicated topics (race, abortion, class, addiction, adoption, etc) or books that people are split on. Out leas..."

Thanks, Meli. Good points, good suggested books. peace, janz