Historical Romance Book Club discussion
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2022 BOTM FEEDBACK
Mod
I think three books is great. If there is a book that I have already read or it is in a genre (or by an author) that I don't like, I have the option of reading the other 2. I do read a lot of books, so more often than not I read all three.
If we had 'western' as a theme one month - then even if there are three books, it is unlikely I would read them. However, if the trope was 'humour' or 'secret love' - among the three there might be a mix of medieval, western and regency - so something for everyone.
I do have one peeve......often there is a book that gets dozens of votes and is BOTM1, but then there are very few comments. I think if you are going to vote you should make an attempt to contribute to the conversation. We are not all confident with chatting online, but just a 'I thought it was great' would be enough.
I agree with Susan and Darbella. The current tropes are good ones. 3 books a month is a great idea too.Thanks to all the moderators.
Its been wonderful to be a part of this group:)
Mod
I agree the author limitation does have us searching out hidden gems, but on the flip side the group rarely gets outside the Regency/Victorian era comfort zone.
One thing we also discuss was including some of our more popular tropes like Marriage of Convenience in the list. And if we don't want to have ones listed we can remove.
Another thing that has been challenging with the tropes is the lists for suggestions. I've stopped including them because they have tended to spark a fair amount of disagreement because the list captures books that don't fit.
Mod
Mod
What is "tropes"?
I like the 3 book for BOTM but I don't like when it's a book, for instance, the #4 of a serie, because then I have to read the all other first and don't contribute for the BOTM because when I finished reading all the previous books the month it's over, that's not really a problem it's just that I don't like reading only the BOTM book if it has previous books on the serie
Sandra wrote: "I'm pretty new to the group, so I don't know if I can question the way things are done. I like how it works so far. What is "tropes"?
I like the 3 book for BOTM but I don't like when it's a boo..."
Tropes are essentially common plot arcs that come up in romance: enemies to lovers, friends to lover, hidden identity, marriage of convenience etc.
What we're doing now is a more general, but very common , Duke as love interest trope for example.
While I like "tropes" of all shades, I don't particularly enjoy trope hunting to nominate books. I always end up nominating things I've read before, and then I'm one of the people who does that thing where they do not participate.
I'm pretty flexible. I do like the "no author within the past two years limitation" b/c otherwise it has seemed that the same group of popular authors always seemed to win. But, to be fair, if a lesser known author wins, it doesn't necessarily mean I would read the book just for that reason. I go on a case-by-case basis as to whether I participate. (But I do have a rule for myself that if I vote for a book and it wins then I do have to participate.) So anyway if others would prefer to do away w/ the author restriction b/c maybe more people would read and participate, I'm okay w/ that.
I do like the possibility of a paranormal category (as long as it's not contemporary of course) for the reason that I don't like paranormal, and so this would force me to read one probably, lol. Tho' I guess I might turn around and "dnf" it midstream. But who knows? maybe I'd start liking them! (or maybe this category includes the subcategory of time travel, which I do like & read...?)
I also love the idea of a bingo card if you decide to off-load some tropes/themes but want to find another way for us to keep them in our HR reading.
Mods are doing a great job w/ this group and I appreciate your asking for feedback. Thanks! Newsletter is also very well-done.
I would be good with the changes. I try to read at least one of the BOTM and make a point of writing out my views on the book as I enjoy comparing thoughts with others even if differing ones. Plus any book that I recommend I do read with the group as I think that if I suggest it, I want to enjoy it with others. I usually read 1 or 2 BOTM depending on what my library has on hand. I would not continue to do the Romance across the ages as I think the new style BOTM would replace it for me.
I am not familiar with the BINGO reading card.
Plus I also want to add the MODS due a fantastic job that is much appreciated by me!
Cath wrote: "I'm pretty flexible. I do like the "no author within the past two years limitation" b/c otherwise it has seemed that the same group of popular authors always seemed to win. But, to be fair, if a ..."
Oh yes, I see paranormal/fantasy/time travel-it's a big bucket. Anything outside the normal / grounded science.
Bingos can be really fun and wacky! It's essentially just making cards for things that may occur in your reading journey-only one bed, free space is HEA, a kid in romance, consent cleverness. It can be any little element. This one is just a challenge, not one we'd intend ppl to find specific books for
I like the tropes and rules we have now. I would like that after our trope nominations are in they be put in categories of era before voting. So you can only vote one Regency one Victorian ect. Does that make sense? Unfortunately, that's more work and I see many problems. I do like the Around the world for one trope. So you get different places but not pigeon held to the same era/genre for three books. I am also excited about the BINGO idea.
Mod
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
At a minimum, there are tropes that could be broadened/combined.
For example, there is both “disguise” and “heroine in pants”. Could be combined, and “heroine in pants” is one that is too specific and hard to research, IMO.
Epistolary (a personal favorite) has been an option a few times and never selected. It also doesn’t necessarily have a wide selection of nominatable options. So it probably should be removed.
Huge family was one that had quite a bit discussion in nominations thread on what counts. It was hard define what it meant as a trope.
Modifications are needed, to what degree we’d like to determine through discussion.
Personally, I would like to alternate month to month from something theme/tropey to something geographical/time period.
We could, as Lauren suggested, have categories/restrictions based on time periods each month, but that would take more work and would likely need volunteers. I like that option but not sure if we want to go there.
I love the troops we have. However some of the ones you mentioned I would read also such as - All's Fair in Love and War
- Scottish / Highlander
- LGBTQ+.
I definitely think we should add Scottish hero as that would open up a butt load of reading for us. I think the all fair in Love and War kind of falls in the same line as enemies though so that seems kinda redundant to me. There are some troupes that we have that I don't read but then the book might sound OK.
I thought the challenge Romance across the ages looked cool, but it would not work for me as I do not read anything HR time period tho but Regency. I love the idea of challenges because that's what keeps me from participating as much as I would like to.
You could open up the above categories & just see which ones get a bunch of votes & which ones get no votes. Just a suggestion. But I'm fine if we stick to the ones we have.
I do not know what BIPOC means tho.
Other than that, I especially agree with those above about participation. I try to participate when I can and I'm very excited about a book. I try do the same thing as Cath & Darbella about any book that I have nominated & voted for as 1st or 2nd place wins. My problem is we nominate & vote on books 2 months ahead of reading & by the time the BOTM comes around, that book may not fit in with my challenges at the moment. I'm not sure how the rules go if it's last month's book or not so I've only done that a couple of times where I read the book a month later.
I would suggest adding in to those voting to only vote for a book you want to read and this is not a popularity contest. One thing one of my other groups has done is they give the three strikes you're out rule as far as voting goes. Once you have voted & your book has won but you have not participated three times in a row your vote no longer counts. It really makes you consider if you want to vote for that book or not.
I love this group because you bring out books either I haven't thought about in a while or I have been wanting to read but haven't got a chance along with books I didn't even know about. Even though they may be a more well-known author. I had stepped away from HR for quite a while and I'm just getting back into it in the last couple of years. I also love the BOTM mods along with members that respond to every comment & do not make you feel over-looked or left out.
I do not know what BIPOC means tho.Black, Indigenous, and people of color.
It sounds like we've got plenty of interest in BINGO. Do you all have preferences on timing? Joanna & I have discussed every other month, seasons, etc. I think the ideas would need to be tailored to timing.
Partners/teams? We can start a separate thread on that as well.
It sounds like people really enjoy the tropes. We will definitely do polling but Joanna and I were trying to resolve what we saw as a challenge and thought maybe it would help to open up subject matter.
I'm not terribly willing to have a 3 strikes or requirements bc my reading habits and buddy reading especially are the most sensitive thing to my mood. in other words, I would have trouble with a punitive system for something we want people to enjoy and I think can relate to people's moods. Buddy reads require more concentration & effort on my part so I want to respect that the snapshot of voting might not be how everything plays out.
I see that this is a theme in the responses so far though, so I'm trying to think of a good way to gently guide members that way.
Also related, I'm going to be perfectly honest, there's authors I want to be promoted! For example, I knew even if I couldn't reread Rose Lerner's book this year when I nominated it, I think she's brilliant and thought the group would enjoy True Pretenses. I love seeing the same type of noms from other members, but if I'm in the minority I think it's worth brainstorming how to deal with this mismatch in votes and participation better.
Still interested in hearing more thoughts!!
Sam (AMNReader) wrote: "I do not know what BIPOC means tho.Black, Indigenous, and people of color.
It sounds like we've got plenty of interest in BINGO. Do you all have preferences on timing? Joanna & I have discussed..."
Thank you, idk that. I know alot more historical have come about with people of color besides Native American here recently. Or I've just noticed them recently. I have some on my TBR by Beverly Jenkins but haven't read them yet.
I can certainly understand that. A reminder in bold script along along with the link and bolded in newsletter might help then.
Then what about having an extra book that is an Author of the month. I know that would be 4 books instead of 3, but at least that would give them some exposure & us an opportunity to read them without having to give up a vote for something we know we want to read? Ya'll could either have an extra vote on books only by that author, or pick the books as the Mod that you think would be the best?
Sam (AMNReader) wrote: "I do not know what BIPOC means tho.Black, Indigenous, and people of color.
It sounds like we've got plenty of interest in BINGO. Do you all have preferences on timing? Joanna & I have discussed..."
Partners! Or if you do have teams, no more than 3 or 4 on the team so we would also be able to get to know each other a little better.
Personally I like that people can nominate books they would like to share. Even if the book is not picked I can read it on my own and discover new authors.
Mod
Yea, it becomes a good list of suggestions!
Mod
Black, Indigenous, and people of color.
It sounds like we've got plenty of interest in BINGO. Do you all have preferences on timing? J..."
Partners / teams sound fun!
Appreciate the feedback thus far! Hope to respond more later.
First I second the yay to our mods. We appreciate everything you do :)I quite like the current tropes, but I agree it can be an issue that sometimes the trope of the month has really great authors who aren't eligible that month. Maybe two books a month rather than three might be better so that authors come around quicker again? As mods I guess you have more of an idea about how many people are actually reading the three books each month.
I like that we now have a novella option. Maybe the third book has to be a novella or else no third book. And the author of the novella could be eligible again sooner or something? (Just throwing out ideas here LOL).
I second Susan and Darbella's comments ... I do have one peeve......often there is a book that gets dozens of votes and is BOTM1, but then there are very few comments. This annoys me too, that people vote on a book cos they like it but it seems like they have no intention of joining in the discussion. I think it's hard to avoid this, except to appeal to voters to vote on books they actually want/intend to read as BOTM.
I don't mind the idea of bingo. Could be fun and encourage us to read different books we may not otherwise try.
I actually don't mind the suggestion of themes/eras, as in the RATA challenge it has really made me read some different and terrific books. I guess it might be a problem for BOTM if people don't like an era so skip those months, but as was said, this can happen with current tropes too.
I only vote for book of the month if I own it or can find it to buy. Some books I would like to read. But can not find a copy. So there is no point in voting for it. I like the idea of theme or ire’s, as I enjoy reading about pirates, Viking, highlanders etc. Which would make a change from always voting for Regency, Victoria , books
I definitely do NOT want to cut our choices down from 3 books.
Are the new themes being added to the original list. So we have more themes on the voting list .
Mod
No, they were suggested as replacements, though we didn’t intend the suggested list to be a full list, necessarily.
I think at this point we’re discussing a combined list or modified trope list, but I really don’t want a longer list. I would prefer it be shorter. We will feed the current trope list into a BINGO-type challenge.
Shaz wrote: "I only vote for book of the month if I own it or can find it to buy. Some books I would like to read. But can not find a copy. So there is no point in voting for it."Good point Shaz. Sometimes a book just isn't easily available, so yeah, you're right. Not worth voting for in that case.
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Joanna Loves Reading, Bluestocking of HR novels
(last edited Sep 16, 2021 05:02PM)
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https://forms.gle/63TAY4PrNK2wEJb76
The survey is a participation measure for each theme - 1 being the least likely to participate and 5 being the most likely to participate. That way we can move forward with the themes that should get a good amount of participation. Most of the ones we didn't include were hard to define or had a low amount of selection. A few we didn't include are really standard-fair for the BOTM that we didn't think it necessary to have a separate category. However, there is a comment box that allows you to make suggestions or provide further feedback.
Each theme has a definition. If anything isn't clear or you think should be modified somehow, please let us know in this thread.
We won't share the results in the same we do the BOTM voting, but we will compile and provide a summary of the results. You are still required to put your GR name, but it will just be Sam and I that can see that so we can verify against membership / duplicate votes. However, it will be more anonymous than the BOTM voting.
*applauds* A round of applause for our spectacular mods! Thanks for all that you do for this group! (I wish I was proficient at creating Google Forms.)
I agree. The mods really make all a lot of fun. Thank you!
Mod
I did mean to mention that if any of the themes overlap with the RAA challenge, we can make sure the months match up. I think there were some comments on that. We can discuss further too for other ideas — it’s very dependent on the results of the survey.
Joanna Loves Reading wrote: "Thank you all for the feedback. It's been really helpful in helping to shape how we modify the current list. We spent time looking at the current trope list and looked at which were clearly popular..."
Even though it's Anonymous voting, will we be able to do the results as they come in or do we find out the results once voting is over? Also when is voting over?
See?? I told you I have all the questions.
I think the best way to think of this is a feedback round. We will not be moving top vote getters on, we are really just trying to gauge interest in these categories or something we may have missed. Does that make sense? That's a big part of why we're ranking this 1-5 rather than just straight voting on choices. We would love to hear on this thread or in comments any other feedback.
The mods are precious. Your dedication to making this fun for everyone is amazing. I absolutely love the idea of Bingos. Perhaps we can outline 1 or 2 different year-long bingos (one based on authors, another on tropes, etc.) with 5*5 (25) items.
My absolute favourite tropes are quirky heroine (bluestocking/spinster/realistic/practical/warrior/tomboy, etc.), anti-heroes (club/gambling den owners/disgraced lords, etc.), espionage and marriage of convenience (both simultaneously & mutually exclusively). I adore a ducal romance, especially with class differences.
I love steam & dread clean romances. I like emotional, multidimensional characters.
I'm not very fond of younger heroines (barely adults). When the highlight of a romance is age-gap, I get a little turned off, especially where the hero is an older rake who gets obsessed with an almost child.
Mod
I absolutely love the idea of Bingos. Perhaps we can outline 1 or 2 different year-long bingos (one based on aut..."
Hi Anshi,
Thanks for the feedback. I enjoy many of these as well.
We have captured most of them in some form in the theme survey:
https://forms.gle/63TAY4PrNK2wEJb76
Would be happy to have your input there as well if you get a chance. Thanks!
Anshi wrote: "The mods are precious. Your dedication to making this fun for everyone is amazing. I absolutely love the idea of Bingos. Perhaps we can outline 1 or 2 different year-long bingos (one based on aut..."
Hey Joanna,
Already filled the form.
Mod
I absolutely love the idea of Bingos. Perhaps we can outline 1 or 2 different year-long bingos (on..."
Thanks!
Mod
1. Pregnant Heroines as a theme. Out of the 4 years we've voted on the current list of tropes it was never selected. Most that weren't selected over that timeframe, were not included in this list due to not being very popular. This is also true of "amnesia", "twins" and "love triangles", among others. It also may be too specific. I think this theme can fall under widows or scandal, so it's not excluded just not specifically included.
2. Witty Banter - we just restyled this one as humor, which broadens it some, but most humorous HRs will include witty banter.
3. Matchmaking - we thought this one had a fairly low selection of options and can be hard to find verify, however, maybe we were thinking too specifically and it just needs to be defined better. The commenter mentioned books where the h&h are trying to help each other find a mate then end up together. So, maybe more discussion is needed on this theme?
4. Girlfriend friendships that sticks together. Like the Wallflower series. -- so I love these books, but it might be hard to find / define. I think there's a similar problem with "huge families" which in theory is fun but hard to decide if a book fits. More discussion on this one as well?
5. Virgin or Celibate Hero - when this one came up this year as virgin hero, it was really difficult to verify. Often times this trope is very spoilery, so hard to find in reviews and synopsis. Adding celibate to the mix helps, but probably still difficult to verify. This trope kind of runs into the problem of needing to have read the book before to nominate. That's ok, but it is hard to moderate. It's probably the case that the mods take more note of the "this book doesn't match the trope" comments more so than most, but we are trying to make sure it's simpler to make sure it does.
Let us know if you have more feedback or want to discuss any of these more. Thanks!
I'm not keen on #1 as a theme because if a heroine accidentally falls pregnant, I want to find out as I read the book, not have it as a spoiler going in.
I have just joined this group a month ago and it sounds like you have quite an interesting formula for choosing authors and themes (tropes), for each month. I like the idea for 3 books each month. It gives us the option to read 1 or all of them. With the variety of themes and authors we are experiencing a greater range than we probably would choose on our own. Thanks everyone for your shared opinions and experiences with HR book club.
Mod
Good point. The books I can think of with this theme were definitely spoilery,
I prefer witty banter and I like the pregnant h . No amnesia! Rarely is that done right. Thank you for not using it.
Mod
Thanks for the feedback Maureen! That is definitely part of the goal - to try to get a variety of books as well as exposure to many different authors.
I like the girlfriends theme, matchmaking and the pregnant heroine themes.
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Joanna Loves Reading, Bluestocking of HR novels
(last edited Sep 29, 2021 03:34PM)
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Witty Banter is now called Humor. Please nominate books with witty banter under this theme when it comes up. We can add witty banter to the definition.
How would Girlfriends be defined? Would it be easy to verify / find books that fall under that theme?
Same questions for Matchmaking -- our initial thought was there are not a lot of books that fall under this theme, or perhaps it's too narrowly defined. If you have suggestions, let us know.
If there are any others you are wondering about, let us know. Thanks!
I like the pregnant heroines theme too but I just prefer going into a book without too many plot spoilers so would rather not know about the pregnancy aspect ahead of time.Lauren I agree about amnesia. One of my least fav tropes.
I like the large families one but I guess 'family' would need to be agreed on e.g. 5+ siblings or something like that. May be hard to verify too, although there are some cases where it's obvious like the Mallorens or the Bedwyns.
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Joanna Loves Reading, Bluestocking of HR novels
(last edited Oct 10, 2021 05:17PM)
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https://forms.gle/63TAY4PrNK2wEJb76
A couple more suggestions that came through:
Forced Into Marriage —seems like this one has overlap with Marriage of Convenience and the Kidnapped theme. Is it different? Maybe Kidnapping should be expanded to where it’s Forced Into Marriage?
Irish heroine or hero — not sure if there is much selection on this but certainly definable! Thoughts?
This is really a well thought out group. I'm impressed. I like the idea of having a theme of the month. I am unlikely to read more than one buddy read a month, but how nice to have choices. Humor and mysteries are my favorites so I'm looking forward to those. Mods, you are doing a great job!
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It's that time of year where we need to start planning the next year for the group. Before we get too far into planning, we'd to get some general feedback on the BOTM, but specifically we'd like to get feedback on the BOTM categories before we send out a survey as has been done in recent years. Sam and I have discussed some of the limitations with the tropes and how they can be difficult to verify, define or find selections for. Sometimes they are too narrowly defined or everyone has a slightly different idea of what the trope means. Sometimes the author that made a trope famous is on our list of ineligible authors. These challenges are what is prompting this discussion and potential change.
What we would like to do is have broader themes that follow these guidelines:
1. Has a good selection of nominatable books
2. Themese that we can define and verify without needing to read the book
3. Have a diverse selection of themes where most HR books will fall into multiple categories
Is this a change you would support? Do you have any suggestions or other considerations we should account for?
Here's a list of themes / sub-genres / eras that we started that we think fits these guidelines:
- Around the World (other than Britain or American)
- Western
- Twentieth Century
- All's Fair in Love and War
- Scottish / Highlander
- LGBTQ+
- BIPOC
- Americana / Gilded Age
- Victorian
- Medieval
- Georgian / Regency
- Old Skool / Bodice Ripper (pre-2000)
- Suspense / Mystery
- Humor
- Paranormal
This list is by no means exhaustive or set in stone. That's part of what this thread is for -- to discuss/add/modify.
But what about the lovely long trope list we have? This is part of the discussion as well. We think it would be fun to create a challenge using the tropes. We were thinking this could be a seasonal challenge, perhaps BINGO cards or themes, possibly a group effort or individual. We're open to suggestions! However, a challenge would allow us to cycle through the tropes quicker and give life to those less popular ones.
Another consideration we'd like Feedback on is the number of books we read each month. Is the 3 the right number of books per month?
Any other FEEDBACK?
I plan to post a challenge Feedback thread in a couple weeks as well, but it seemeds important to get feedback for the BOTM first.
Let us know if you have any questions! Thanks!