TOB 2020 Shortlist

[Ellen]

Just finished Red Pill. Boy, it wasn't what I expected and I'm sorry now that I chose it to win the play-in. I found a lot of it truly tiresome. I much preferred The Down Days. I haven't read The Resisters yet, but I'm not expecting much out of it. Huh.

[Lauren]

Ellen wrote: "Just finished Red Pill. Boy, it wasn't what I expected and I'm sorry now that I chose it to win the play-in. I found a lot of it truly tiresome. I much preferred The Down Days. I haven't read The R..."

That's too bad; I'm about to start Red Pill. It's not too late to change your prediction in the spreadsheet though.

[Michelle]

I just finished Red Pill this past weekend. It was my least favorite of the play-in round books. My favorite was the Resisters with The Down Days a close second. So I will be happy if either of those books advances.

[Kyle]

Whew, I'm like 60 pages into Shuggie, and it's both wonderfully written and incredibly bleak.

[Isaac]

I read Red Pill today (after a several-week reading break) and I found it pretty meh, too. I am glad that none of the books I've read on the short list so far have made me ask "Why does this exist?" like last year's Overthrow, but there was little in Red Pill that drew my interest. The protagonist does nothing, and the antagonist is an uncompelling straw man. I'm reading The Resisters now and I'm enjoying it, but for now my play-in favorite is the entertaining and incredibly-timely Down Days.

[Isaac]

Of course I would say "none of the books I've read on the short list so far have made me ask 'Why does this exist?' like last year's Overthrow" on the day I start reading Tender Is the Flesh. I'm sorry, but as technically good as it may be, I can't get past the fact that I could go to any Burger King right now and get an Impossible Whopper made with 100% plant protein, one of many such products readily available. Does this not make all of the ugliness of this novel completely unnecessary? One of the major problems I had with Overthrow was its lack of timeliness and connection to our current world. I can't imagine any world in which cannibalism would become so readily normalized like this, and I refuse to be forced to by this awful book.

[Lark]

Isaac wrote: "Of course I would say "none of the books I've read on the short list so far have made me ask 'Why does this exist?' like last year's Overthrow" on the day I start reading Tender Is the Flesh..."

I agree with everything you wrote Isaac. I guess on top of your objections is the feeling I had that the only dramatic tension for me was a question that was up-and-down, yes-or-no, with no nuance whatsoever--"is marcos going to rise above his milieu and treat his lover like a human, or as meat?" -- usually I like books that have more nuance in the dramatic question they pose to readers. That said I'm still kind of on "Team Tender" because of its power to shock, which is its purpose.

[Alison]

lark wrote: "...the only dramatic tension for me was a question that was up-and-down, yes-or-no, with no nuance whatsoever--"is marcos going to rise above his milieu and treat his lover like a human, or as meat?"..."

I'm at this point in the novel and it's my sticking point. This isn't a relationship. There is no consent possible on the part of the woman and I'm not sure whether to characterize what's going on as rape or as bestiality. Both probably. I'm finding how this is being framed as more disturbing than the whole killing-and-eating-people thing.

[Jenny (Reading Envy)]

Alison wrote: "I'm at this point in the novel and it's my sticking point. This isn't a relationship. There is no consent possible on the part of the woman and I'm not sure whether to characterize what's going on as rape or as bestiality. Both probably. I'm finding how this is being framed as more disturbing than the whole killing-and-eating-people thing."

I know this is outside of discussion of this novel but I do think this is the point the author is making - if we are willing to xy, then surely you can see we also will do z. That if we don't staunch cruelty in this form, what stops it in the other? The danger of not having moral or ethical boundaries.

(Which doesn't improve the book, in my opinion, it's a point she hammers on to my opinion.)

[Alison]

Honestly, I was just glad to finish it. Sermons do not make good novels.

[Isaac]

I don’t think it’s a sermon. I don’t think there really is a point about animal rights or human nature. I think it’s just porn.Deeply mysoginistic vore/cannibalism erotica with delusions of literary merit, to be more precise, but porn all the same. Of course it’s unnuanced. Of course the narration is flat and affectless. Of course it ends the way it does. It couldn’t fit within its genre otherwise. The only reason that this book has any shock value at all is that the book is labeled for readers as dystopian/satirical horror instead of what it really is. Without that, it has no real value whatsoever.

[Bretnie]

I'm about halfway through Shuggie Bain and Breasts and Eggs, my last two I intend to read from the shortlist.

Dang, I am going to need to read something funny and/or light after this shortlist and maybe tournament. So much alcoholism, physical and sexual abuse, awful parenting, and general/literal end of the world in this tournament!

[Audra]

I'm half way through Telephone and then I will be DONE.
And will have to figure out the spread sheet.

[C]

Bretnie wrote: "I'm about halfway through Shuggie Bain and Breasts and Eggs, my last two I intend to read from the shortlist.

Dang, I am going to need to read something funny and/or light after this shortlist an..."

I know what you mean, Bertnie! But honestly I think all the swimming in negative of the last year that the world has been doing is probably making the misery in books stand out more. I looked at the short lists for the last few years and there is a fair share of misery there. I guess most books need that conflict to actually BE a book. There is something sad in most books, I guess.

[Nadine in California]

Bretnie wrote: "Dang, I am going to need to read something funny and/or light after this shortlist and maybe tournament. So much alcoholism, physical and sexual abuse, awful parenting, and general/literal end of the world in this tournament!."

Me too - I'm starting The House in the Cerulean Sea tonight as an antidote.

[Peggy]

Audra wrote: "I'm half way through Telephone and then I will be DONE.
And will have to figure out the spread sheet."

Congratulations, Audra! (Am jealous!)

[Elizabeth]

Nadine wrote: " I'm starting The House in the Cerulean Sea tonight as an antidote...."

I got this on hold from the library last week, and completely couldn't remember why I'd placed the hold. When I saw it, I thought I must have reserved it for my 10yo daughter, but then I read it's more of an adult fairy tale and may not be suitable for kids. And I typically don't like adult fairy tales...so what on earth was I thinking when I put this on hold? Haha. Do you like it? Should I read it? Should my daughter? Should I read it to my daughter? Or just shrug and give it back?

[Nadine in California]

Elizabeth wrote: "Nadine wrote: " I'm starting The House in the Cerulean Sea tonight as an antidote...."

I got this on hold from the library last week, and completely couldn't remember why I'd placed the hold. When..."

I had the same thought you did when my hold came in :) I'm not a fan of adult fairy tales either and considered quitting early on, but the book is a fast read (even at 400 pages) and it's charming enough that I'm at the halfway point and I'll finish it. It's my palate cleanser after a string of heavy books. It feels a little bit preachy about inclusivity sometimes, but not in a heavy-handed way, and the characters are cute enough to keep me in. I'm not a good judge of whether it's suitable for kids, but it's got the feel of the first Harry Potter book, which seemed aimed at younger readers. The first 70 pages or so revolve around a nebbishy 40 year old man who inspects orphanages for magical kids, so even though the writing is cute, it might bore a 10 year old, although after he arrives at the orphanage for magical kids it picks up a lot.

[Elizabeth]

Nadine wrote: "Elizabeth wrote: "Nadine wrote: " I'm starting The House in the Cerulean Sea tonight as an antidote...."

I got this on hold from the library last week, and completely couldn't remember why I'd pla..."

Thank you! I wonder if someone recommended it here? I'll often trust the praise of people here enough to put a book on hold without hardly looking. It's never steered me wrong before. :)

I think I'll try reading it out loud to my daughter, and see how we both like it.

[Nadine in California]

Elizabeth wrote: "Nadine wrote: "I think I'll try reading it out loud to my daughter, and see how we both like it...."

Let me know how it goes, I'm curious to see what a 10 year old girl thinks of it!

[Kyle]

I also have a light read after this - V.E. Schwab's "The Invisible Life of Addie LaRue." Should be a nice pick-me-up after Shuggie.

[Bretnie]

Kyle wrote: "I also have a light read after this - V.E. Schwab's "The Invisible Life of Addie LaRue." Should be a nice pick-me-up after Shuggie."

That's next on my list too after Shuggie Kyle!

[Nadine in California]

For me, Down Days qualified as a light read. ymmv

[Jan]

We just got power back in my Portland suburb after almost six days with no heat or electricity, no WiFi and only spotty cellular service. I’m reading mysteries for a few more days to soothe my soul, and then just need to listen to Breasts & Eggs to be complete (except for Tender is the Flesh, which I’m skipping). My favorite is still the Deacon, who I’ll be revisiting for my IRL book group this month. I’ve enjoyed a bunch of the others...most recently Telephone and We Ride Upon Sticks. Hope you guys are all safe and warm!

[Alison]

Jan wrote: "We just got power back in my Portland suburb after almost six days with no heat or electricity, no WiFi and only spotty cellular service. I’m reading mysteries for a few more days to soothe my soul..."

Glad you've got your power back and made it through!

Skipping Tender is the Flesh is a solid decision.

[Lauren]

Jan wrote: "We just got power back in my Portland suburb after almost six days with no heat or electricity, no WiFi and only spotty cellular service. I’m reading mysteries for a few more days to soothe my soul..."

Oh no, we're in a similar situation in Texas (we still don't have water, but finally have heat and internet today). I didn't know it was happening in Portland too. Glad things are looking up for you - stay warm!

I'm also now done with all short list books except Tender. I'm going to try reading it by skipping a page each times there's something too much. We'll see how that goes. ;)

[Isaac]

While I most highly recommend skipping Tender Is the Flesh altogether, if you want to read the less disturbing parts of it I would give a miss to any scenes involving the place where the narrator works, especially the tour, the Spanel butcher shop, the zoo, and the hunters. You will still encounter disturbing levels of misogyny, violence, cruelty, and other bad stuff away from those places, but that’s where they’re most concentrated.

[Jenny (Reading Envy)]

I've finished except the play-in books, possibly erroneously assuming Red Pill will win that trio.

I don't think my feelings align with many but here are my rankings:

5-star
Memorial
Sharks in the Time of Saviors
Telephone

4-star reads that I think will do well in the tournament anyway
Deacon King Kong
Shuggie Bain
We Ride Upon Sticks

Other 4-star reads
Breasts and Eggs
Luster
Red Pill
Transcendent Kingdom
The Vanishing Half

3-star reads
A Children's Bible
Interior Chinatown
Leave the World Behind
Piranesi

2-star reads
Tender is the Flesh

Holding out to see if it makes the play-in round
The Down Days
The Resisters

[Lauren]

Isaac wrote: "While I most highly recommend skipping Tender Is the Flesh altogether, if you want to read the less disturbing parts of it I would give a miss to any scenes involving the place where the narrator w..."

Thanks for the heads up - that should help!

[Audra]

I finished Telephone last night so I am a completist!

[Kyle]

I still want to see if I can get Leave the World Behind and Memorial finished before the tournament starts, but I'm happy with what I've covered so far:

5 Stars:
Deacon
Transcendent
Shuggie
Sharks
Piranesi

4 Stars:
Interior Chinatown
We Ride Upon Sticks
A Children's Bible
The Vanishing Half

3 Stars:
Telephone

[Bob]

I think Telephone will be my last read or listen. The Republic of Consciousness longlist just came out and I'm pretty amped for that.

5 Stars:
Shuggie Bain
Tender is the Flesh
Transcendent Kingdom
Deacon King Kong

4 Stars:
Sharks in the Time of Saviors
Interior Chinatown
Children's Bible
Piranesi
Breasts and Eggs
Vanishing Half
Memorial
Down Days

3 Stars:
Leave the World Behind
Luster

[Alison]

So interesting to see people's rankings. There's going to be some conversation during the tournament!

Like Jenny, I'm skipping two of the play-in round and will be ready to go - I'm reading The Vanishing Half now (my library hold came in finally) and We Ride Upon Sticks which is far better than I thought it would be -- all I knew about it going in was that it was set at school, something about witchcraft and also the field hockey sticks on the cover, so I figured it was some sort of Harry Potter fan fiction and I was not going to read it at all. I'm very glad to be wrong!

[Lark]

This is a weird year where I really don't care for some of the books that I think are "great enough to win" in a general sense vs. my own idiosyncratic preferences.

I'd love to see Shuggie Bain, Interior Chinatown, Breasts and Eggs, Deacon King Kong, Leave the World Behind, Telephone, The Vanishing Half or We Ride Upon Sticks take the Rooster, even if I've personally rated these between 2 and 5 stars.

[C]

Awesome job and congrats, completeists! I'm on the ninth book and there aren't any books that I wouldn't mind taking the Rooster so far (still planning on skipping 'Tender'), so I consider this a great crew of books.

Top three so far: Luster, Sharks, Piranesi
Closely behind them: Transcendent Kingdom and The Vanishing Half
Still on the stacks: Deacon King Kong, Red Pill, We Ride Upon Sticks. I feel like I might be the biggest champion of A Children's Bible so I'm saving that for near last.

I'm sad I didn't get my hands on a copy of Down Days since I suggested it early on for the ToB. But I'm very glad to hear the majority of you have been enjoying it!

[Bryn]

I’m reading We Ride Upon Sticks now. It’s my second to last of the TOB. This is the first time I will be a completist! Yay! Except—— I can’t get my hands on a copy of Breasts and Eggs. I may end up reading it on my phone which is ok.

[Alison]

Bryn wrote: "I’m reading We Ride Upon Sticks now. It’s my second to last of the TOB. This is the first time I will be a completist! Yay! Except—— I can’t get my hands on a copy of Breasts and Eggs. I may end up..."

Do you have access to Hoopla through your library system? Breasts and Eggs is available there.

[Bryn]

Yes. I have it on hold with Libby which is what my library has. Available in 15 weeks🤷‍♀️. So I’ll buy it from Apple Books one of these days. Gotta read my book group books first!

[Heidi]

After finishing Sharks this morning, I’m a completist the second year in a row! Wahoo. Here are my ratings, vaguely ordered by preference within each rating:

5 Stars *****
Luster
The Vanishing Half
Piranesi
Red Pill

4 Stars ****
Transcendent Kingdom
Shuggie Bain
Sharks in the Time of Saviors
We Ride Upon Sticks
A Children's Bible
Telephone
Deacon King Kong
Interior Chinatown
Breasts and Eggs
Memorial

3 Stars ***
The Resisters
The Down Days
Leave the World Behind

2 Stars **
Tender is the Flesh

I can’t believe we’re so close to the start of the tournament! Now I gotta go fill out my bracket predictions.

[Lauren]

Bryn wrote: "Yes. I have it on hold with Libby which is what my library has. Available in 15 weeks🤷‍♀️. So I’ll buy it from Apple Books one of these days. Gotta read my book group books first!"

If you check Hoopla, there's no wait time through that service (compared to Libby). If your library has the book on Hoopla, you can check it out immediately. I enjoyed the audio version of Breasts and Eggs. :)

[Jan]

@Lauren and @ Alison, thanks for sympathizing about the weather-related disruptions. Our WiFi is still out after 10 days, but that’s small potatoes compared to what many others are going through. Good wishes to you and your family, Lauren! I’m still lacking my normal enthusiasm for lit fiction and ToB reading, but I figure I can do another mystery or two before tackling Breasts & Eggs and still finish it in time for the judging, since it’s in the right side of the brackets. Cheers!

[Heather]

Like Kyle and Bretnie, I am currently reading The Invisible Life of Addie LaRue (for me, concurrently with Telephone and Shuggie Bain, my last two Tournament reads). It's been a much-needed balm, and I'm really enjoying it.

[Kip]

I read Addie and really enjoyed it, immediately got it for my sister. I was finding it difficult to truly immerse myself in ToB so I am currently at 8, but will likely get to 10 over this last week or so.

I have 5 starred 5 reads:
Sharks
Deacon
Interior
Piranesi
Children's Bible

The only one I have read that I don't love is Leave the World Behind but it seems like others are getting a lot of out of a reread so perhaps if it goes far enough I will do a reread.

Also, I read War and Peace this month, it could have used an editor!

[Bretnie]

Heather wrote: "Like Kyle and Bretnie, I am currently reading The Invisible Life of Addie LaRue (for me, concurrently with Telephone and Shuggie Bain, my last two Tournament reads). It's been a much-needed balm, a..."

I started it this weekend and couldn't put it down! Plowed through almost half of it!

[Kyle]

I finished it, and then my son decided to write his name in the back of it.

...it was a library book.

[Jenny (Reading Envy)]

C wrote: "Awesome job and congrats, completeists! I'm on the ninth book and there aren't any books that I wouldn't mind taking the Rooster so far (still planning on skipping 'Tender'), so I consider this a g..."

Maybe the store will have ToB Completist swag. Just a note to any mods who might read this thread - not everyone wears t-shirts but they might buy coffee mugs or tote bags (me! I'm not everyone!)

[Bretnie]

Kyle wrote: "I finished it, and then my son decided to write his name in the back of it.

...it was a library book."

Ha, given the emphasis on saying/writing your name, that's so funny. :) Hopefully your library will find the humor in it, heh.

[Bryn]

Lauren and Allison thanks for your suggestions about getting Breasts and Eggs through library ebooks. Like I said the service I usually use, Libby, had a 15 week wait. I called the library and they helped me with the other service they have which is called Cloud Library and the book was immediately available. The young man who helped me also told me a hack for getting access to Hoopla at another library. My library is too cheap to subscribe to hoopla. Yay. My last book.

[Alison]

Bryn wrote: "Lauren and Allison thanks for your suggestions about getting Breasts and Eggs through library ebooks. Like I said the service I usually use, Libby, had a 15 week wait. I called the library and they..."

That's very good news. And a reminder that it's almost always a good idea to just ask a librarian.

[Lark]

(the lull before the storm...)