Glens Falls (NY) Online Book Discussion Group discussion
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ABOUT BOOKS AND READING
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What are you reading these days? (Part ELEVEN (2015) ongoing thread for 2015
message 251:
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Nina
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Mar 28, 2015 02:35PM
Good review, Jim. Doesn't sound like my kind of book but interesting to read your review.
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Not fussy, practical. Don't you feel Stephen King's books are plot oriented?
Nina wrote: "Not fussy, practical. Don't you feel Stephen King's books are plot oriented?"I've never read a book by Stephen King. Too unpleasant. I need a lot of "pleasantness". I guess I go for light but interesting plots... although there have been some more serious novels which drew me in, in spite of myself. Water for Elephants comes to mind. Also , see all of the books on my "favorite book" shelf at: https://www.goodreads.com/review/list...
Joy H. wrote: "Jim, nice of you to give Koryta the benefit of the doubt in your rating of 3. Apropos to your review, I hate it when writers repeat themselves too much in one story. I also hate long, boring descri..."Well, his descriptions tend to be a bit longer than I'd like, but they're not too bad. It's repeating certain facts & feelings that bothered me.
Nina, I quit reading Stephen King years ago because his descriptions are far too long & involved for me. IMO, there is no need to dwell on ordinary items, but he does. His earlier work was a lot better.
Yes. I agree Stephen King's books were better early on, with the exception of the one last year with the theme concerning Kennedy's assignation. It was really a page turner. If it was too descriptive I never noticed as I was too busy getting on with "And then What happened?" I might have read Bel Canto. I'll check it out. I loved, "Water for Elephants," and now read that they are no longer going to use elephants at the circus.
I checked. I haven't read, "Bell Canto," but will put in on my to be read list. Thanks for mentioning it. And liked reading your favorits. Some of them were mine also.
I'm with Jim on early S King, he was fantastic. Then he wanted to be 'literary' over entertaining, good for him but not for me, we have long since parted ways.
I am reading an article by Mark Oppenheimer in the NYT today regarding the author, Evan Connell. He was the author among other books, of "Mrs. Bridge" and "Mr. Bridge." and perhaps you remember Paul Newman and Joanne Woodward starred in the movie, "Mr. and Mrs. Bridge." In the article he made a serious mistake. Evan Connell book was depicting a rich, lonely widow in prejudiced society in the Kansas City, MO area. The writer of the article said that Evan Connell had gone to school in Kansas City, KS and he despaired over the cliques in the school. First of all he lived in MO and not KS and as far as I know there was no school at that time in KCK that would have had cliques. However, there would have been in the school that Evan attended. Oh well, as I said before no one ever checks for errors if the writer is well known.
Nina, it's interesting that you've discovered those discrepancies. I didn't read Mrs. Bridge but I saw the movie adaptation which you mentioned. See my review at the following link:https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
I read you review. I really liked the books as I said and the movie was good, I thought. But, it's been so long since I've read the books and I can't remember the movie ending. I should read the books and see the movie one more time. Paul Newman and his wife were great guests of our city. They were kind to shopkeepers and restaurant workers and to the people in the hotels here. All the citizens fell in love with them. Maybe that's why I liked the movie.
Today I finished reading The Alchemist by Paulo Coelho. I can't see why it got so much praise. I got nothing out of it. It's filled with vague terms like realizing one's "Personal Legend". Perhaps that means something like following one's bliss. There's nothing new about that!At any rate, the main character, a shepherd named Santiago, goes in search of some sort of treasure and along the way he meets people who give him all sorts of vague advice about life and omens. The book uses annoying general terms (like "Soul of the World") It never gets specific enough to make itself understood. There is no real character development. At one point the boy wants to become the wind. Huh? What does that mean? The sun, the wind, and the desert talk to the boy. It's all too ridiculous.
I was determined to finish the book just in case it ever started to make sense. It never did. Even if one allows for imagery and symbolism, the book was too vague. There were no deep ideas, just banal expressions pretending to be deep thoughts. An example: "Love is the falcon's flight over your sands." (p.144 in my edition)
As for the Goodreads reviews, there are 56,820 ONE STAR reviews (out of a total of 1,432,664 GR reviews). I'm going to add one more ONE STAR review!
PS-It never became clear to me why the idea of an alchemist was important to this story. Another vague symbol? Or perhaps it just sounds good! The story seems to simply meander around vague philosophic ideas, most of them painfully sophomoric.
PPS-Some readers put this book on a "fantasy" shelf. Just because it may be a fantasy, doesn't necessarily give it great meaning.
SEE OTHER MESSAGES BELOW ABOUT THIS BOOK, ESPECIALLY MESSAGE #278.
PPPS-An interesting point of view about _The Alchemist_ comes from one of my favorite GR reviewers:"The message of the fable is communicated in 'fortune cookie-like' aphorisms, philosophical 'sound bites' that were both charming and thought-provoking. There is a profundity in the simple messages within the books and I found myself dog-earring and underlining many passages."
FROM: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
Being a collector of quotations, I had heard most of these "aphorisms" in one form or another over the years. Perhaps that's why the book made little impact on me.
Like with every genre, not all Fantasy is good, nor is it supposed to have great meaning just because it's fantasy. For me, Fantasy is an adventure, nothing more. I had The Alchemist on my TBR list but I can see it's not for me. I dislike this kind of thing. I want an adventure but this sounds like inner soul searching. Blah. Thanks for letting us know. It is now off my list.
Jackie wrote: "Like with every genre, not all Fantasy is good, nor is it supposed to have great meaning just because it's fantasy. For me, Fantasy is an adventure, nothing more. I had The Alchemist on my TBR lis..."By calling _The Alchemist_ a fantasy, one might excuse the ridiculous idea of the boy wanting to change himself into the wind, as though anything in a fantasy makes sense. I don't buy that idea.
Here are a couple of "aphorisms" from _The Alchemist_. They give you the "flavor" of the book:"Everything in life is an omen." (p. 70)(said by the Englishman)
"There's no such thing as coincidence". (p. 72)(said by the Englishman)
Crazy ideas, IMO.
I don't buy "anything in fantasy makes sense" either and I can see why you didn't like it. Fantasy can allow for things that don't normally happen in our world but for me it has to have a logical progression of ideas or events.
Jackie, I can understand your idea of fantasy being an adventure. In a fantasy adventure one can suspend disbelief. However, in a book like _The Alchemist_ which seems to want to do serious "inner soul searching", as you so aptly put it, we don't want to suspend disbelief. That's why calling the book a fantasy seems a cop-out to me. It excuses the ridiculousness of the many sophomoric statements and happenings in the book.
It sounds like two conflicting ideas. I think a lot of authors are choosing to couch their mainstream books in Fantasy since the genre has gained great popularity. I find it a cheat. If the author wants to do a serious mainstream book then do it, don't hide it in SF/F. I read a book like that, The Lost Girl, it sounded like it would be cool scifi but it was really a chick-lit romance and the idea of what it means to be oneself. Bored me to tears! It's the old 'bait and switch' routine and I find it a lot in SF and F. Or maybe I just expect to read SF or F when it's listed as SF/F, so silly of me! lol
Jackie, your views on SF and Fantasy are interesting. I like your idea that SF & F should have "a logical progression of ideas or events". It really challenges fantasy writers to be logical. That makes their job harder, doesn't it?
I don't think so, every great SF/F book I've read is logical in some way or another. Maybe it'll challenge the mediocre authors to be better at their jobs because it's sheer laziness or lack of imagination that doesn't provide logical explanations. Books can't be willy-nilly, anything thrown in, then it's garbage and not worth my time. Just like every genre, there is good and bad in SF/F.
Jackie, I understand your point of view about the need for quality in fantasy and SF."Quality is never an accident. It is always the result of intelligent effort." -John Ruskin
I agree with the quote, Joy. Also, I found myself also agreeing with you as I had the same reaction to the Alchemist as you. I got through it but got nothing out of it.
Not fantasy but the writing in "All the Light That Fails," is hard to beat. Makes other books mediochre.
Thanks for your comments, Nina. _The Alchemist_ would probably be meaningful to a younger person who has never heard all its trite philosophic meanderings before. In fact, the book is from our public library's "Teen" section. That tells us something about the book. It's more like a fairytale about a young boy's adventures in which he meets different people and hears various observations about life, whether wrong or right. I suppose the fantasy part is there to keep the reader interested. There's just something about the vague expressions which make it hard to grasp the ideas. Those vague expressions don't help the book, IMO.
As I said, you describe how I think of the theme perfectly.
Nina wrote: "Not fantasy but the writing in "All the Light That Fails," is hard to beat. Makes other books mediochre."What book is that, Nina? Is it All the Light We Cannot See, about blind French girl and a German boy? I read the book but found it disappointing. It was too fragmented and the ending was a let-down because the boy and girl hardly interacted with one another. I had expected more interaction between them. Instead it's a story of their parallel lives and (view spoiler)
My review is here: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
4/1/15 - I would like to mention an important quotation from _The Alchemist_. I think it was touching quotes like this one, which made people love the book:********************************
"...he learned the most important part of the language that all the world spoke. The language that everyone on earth was capable of understanding in their heart. It was love. Something older than humanity, more ancient than the desert. Something that exerted the same force whenever two pairs of eyes met... She smiled, and that was certainly an omen. ... It was the pure language of the world ... the universal language." -Paulo Coelho, The Alchemist (ellipses are mine)
FROM: https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes...
**********************************************
NOTE: See my original reference to _The Alchemist_ at Message #262 above.
I have started a Facebook Book Club. You may take a look at:As the Page Turns".
Joy H. wrote: "Nina wrote: "Not fantasy but the writing in "All the Light That Fails," is hard to beat. Makes other books mediochre."What book is that, Nina? Is it All the Light We Cannot See, a..."Yes, it was titled, "The Light You Cannot See," sorry I missed the right title. I left a comment on your review.
Katherine wrote: "I have started a Facebook Book Club. You may take a look at:As the Page Turns"."Katherine, where is it? Can you give us a link?
There are lots of groups with the same title!
Is it a Goodreads group? If it's actually a Facebook thing, I'm disenchanted with Facebook. The navigating is no fun at all.
Dead Men Do Tell Tales: The Strange and Fascinating Cases of a Forensic Anthropologist by William R. Maples was a 4 star read on the subject. He delved into some very interesting cases including the Romanovs'. My review is here:https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
Jim wrote: "Dead Men Do Tell Tales: The Strange and Fascinating Cases of a Forensic Anthropologist by William R. Maples was a 4 star read on the subject..."I always loved the story of Anastasia, as told in the movie starring Ingrid Bergman. An interesting case indeed! - "Anastasia" (1956): http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0048947/?...
I loved that movie also. Perfect actress for the starring role.
My favorite movie with Ingrid Bergman is "Indiscreet" (1958) with Cary Grant. It is a precious comedy!http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0051773/?...
http://dvd.netflix.com/Movie/60021262...
"Wealthy American diplomat Philip (Cary Grant) and famous actress Anne (Ingrid Bergman) meet just as Anne has decided that all the best men in the world are taken. Although Philip is indeed married, Anne can't resist their instant attraction and electricity, and they begin a passionate affair. But an unexpected secret Philip hides from his new love threatens to spoil everything. Stanley Donen directed this sparkling romantic comedy."
I can't think of any movie I have seen of Cary Grant that I didn't like. I probably have seen this one but it won't hurt to watch it again. Thanks for the reminder. Once when it was my father's birthday I pointed out to my children he was the same aga as Cary Grant. And one of them looked up at her grandfather and said, "I didn't know he was that old."
Cary Grant kept his good looks right to the end. An amazing career. He had a certain charm that's hard to define. Most kids nowadays have never heard of him!
You hit the nail on the head, the key word Cary Grant had was "charm."
Nina, be sure to watch "Indiscreet" with Cary Grant and Ingrid Bergman. You won't be sorry! They are so cute together!
Nina, I wish I could watch it with you. It's such an amusing plot and the acting is wonderful.
Ever since I read and reviewed The Last Stratiote by my Goodreads friend LeAnn Neal Reilly, I've been wanting to read some more of her work. Finally, I got started this morning on another of her novels, Saint Sebastian's Head. Unlike the first one I read, this isn't a free review copy --I bought a copy of this one!
I finished Rithmatist, it was good but for a younger audience. I started The Forever King but so far it's a dud. It's supposed to be Arthurian but so far nothing Arthurian except a kid named Arthur. I hope it gets better, I have the next 2 books in the series.
That's almost funny, Jackie. Only thing about the book is a kid named Arthur.
Werner and Jackie, thanks for posting about the books you've been reading. I have several books half-way read and am slowly going through them. Also, I've been listening to an audio version of Thomas Jefferson: The Art of Power by Jon Meacham. There are quite a few discs. The book gives a good picture of the real Thomas Jefferson, as well as a history of our country in its early days.
I think I'd like to read, "At the Water's Edge," by Sarah Gruen, author of "Water for Elephant's."
Nina wrote: "I think I'd like to read, "At the Water's Edge," by Sarah Gruen, author of "Water for Elephant's.""Nina, I'll have to look into that one. I'll keep it in mind.
At the Water's Edge by Sara Gruen
Barb and I finally bailed on our read of Forging the Darksword, since neither of us was getting into it. I posted more of an explanation for this here: www.goodreads.com/review/show/1217232393 .In its place, we've started another fantasy series opener as our "car book": The Gilded Chain, the first volume of Dave Duncan's King's Blades series. Barb gave me that one for Christmas in 1998, the year it came out (our last Christmas in BC faculty housing, before we moved to this house the next year), which conveys an idea of how long some books sit in my TBR piles. :-( So I thought it was high time to read it!
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