WE ARE OPEN - WEEK EIGHT - PRESIDENTIAL SERIES: LANDSLIDE - January 19 - January 25 - Chapter Seven - No Spoilers, Please

[Peter]

Regarding ads and jingles and so on, I forget where I read it but the Republicans had

"In your heart, you know he's right"

to which the Democrats replied

"In your guts, you know he's nuts".

[Bryan]

LBJ certainly has an interesting personality. The question is did his mood swings affect his performance as president? At first glance, it didn't seem to; it might affect his decision-making. He certainly worked very hard and worked his staff very hard too. I'm surprised there wasn't more burned out staffers. They certainly didn't resign, probably out of loyalty and knowing they are making a big impact on people's lives.

[Michael]

Bentley asked: "1. What are your thoughts about the man and his insecurities after achieving as much as he achieved? Was he so afraid of failure that he really did not know who he was or what he wanted?"

I would apply my comments in msg 100 to this question. I think we are seeing a man in a position of great power. Sitting at the desk where "the buck stops." I think what is being described are perhaps some unguarded moments when LBJ was just too tired to keep the public persona at the forefront. Ultimately he did not act on these feelings and Lady Bird (as many spouses do) helped him to work it through.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Peter wrote: "Regarding ads and jingles and so on, I forget where I read it but the Republicans had

"In your heart, you know he's right"

to which the Democrats replied

"In your guts, you know he's nuts"."

Yes I mentioned that - they were rough back then (smile)

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Michael what happened to you I think is more common than you might think. Stress can be deadly to folks. And he had to hold it together - 24x7. It is good he had a resilient tough minded Lady Bird to keep him on the straight and narrow. And he had a bunch of folks helping him which I think relieved much of the pressure but certainly not all of it. I think the Presidency is really a thankless job and you really have to have a huge ego to even contemplate wanting to take that stress on.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Bryan wrote: "LBJ certainly has an interesting personality. The question is did his mood swings affect his performance as president? At first glance, it didn't seem to; it might affect his decision-making. He..."

I am not sure it did Bryan - remember on Vietnam (and that may be where you are headed with your thinking) - LBJ was the one backtracking initially but all of Kennedy's folks including McNamara and the military were hammering him on the approach he finally adopted. I think most of us would be moody if we had a week of what he was dealing with (smile). But there were those bouts of depression that seem for whatever reason to be part of some of the greatest men's psyche - what did Churchill call it. "Black Dog"

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Michael wrote: "Bentley asked: "1. What are your thoughts about the man and his insecurities after achieving as much as he achieved? Was he so afraid of failure that he really did not know who he was or what he wa..."

Very true Michael - he did not turn away towards alcohol as some do or as much womanizing as his predecessor. It does seem that all of these presidents act out their stress releases in some form or another - sad depressive states, explosive tempers, womanizing, alcohol, excessive exercising, food in excess - the stress has to come out somewhere. And if they were not lucky enough to have the supportive strong structure that Lady Bird provided - then some of the others were unfortunate indeed.

I might add that the stress that the President is under and the lifestyle that ensues in the White House isn't always just resident with the chief executive - sometimes that stress affects the First Lady the same way. Barbara Bush had depression on and off, Betty Ford, Mamie Eisenhower was not often happy, Mrs. Lincoln was also known to have issues, Eleanor Roosevelt took off for distance places, Lady Bird had the businesses to get involved in and had an inner strength to protect her but other first ladies were also subjected to the stress of public scrutiny and sometimes hateful remarks by the public that did not even know them. They have to live in a bubble and folks think they are privileged to do so but they are at work in some capacity 24x7.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Here is a video and a write-up about the Lady Bird Special - The Whistlestop Tour to the South

50th Anniversary of Lady Bird Johnson’s 1964 Whistle Stop Tour of the South


Oct 01, 2014

http://whistlestop.lbjlibrary.org

“I want to go because I am proud of the South and I am proud that I am part of the South.” - Lady Bird Johnson

- See more at: http://www.lbjlibrary.org/press/50th-...

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

The LBJ Library and Selma


A great link from the Lyndon Johnson Presidential Library

Some taped conversations with Johnson and King as well as other media

http://www.lbjlibrary.org/press/selma...

[Katy]

Thank you for all the links, Bentley. So much to learn on this era.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

There is and the links are wonderful examples of being able to "listen in" on the past. The links give you the audio and the visual of the author's examples in this chapter.

You are welcome.

[Helga]

These links have been great. And it was great hearing them. I enjoyed them and learned a lot. Thanks so much.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

You are welcome Helga - which of the campaign ads, jingles or videos stand out for you?

[Helga]

Your Children will be Communists-Barry Goldwater Ad
Sinatra's song "High Hopes" with Jack Kennedy
LBJ Poverty Ad
Medicare Discussion for LBJ
50th Anniversary LadyBird Johnson's 1964 Whistlestop Tour
LBJ Library and Selma

[Teri]

My general comment about the chapter: As I read through the Jenkins "affair", I kept thinking about how this might play out today. I can't imagine that they'd be able to sweep it under the rug with our social media and big news outlets. I think Barry Goldwater acted admirably over it and I think even today, the actual opposing candidate would likely not even discuss a scandal, but the big news media and political committees, lesser candidates, etc. would likely discuss it constantly. During campaign season it seems like we hear about every scandal anyone can dig up on a senator, governor, mayor, etc. Anything one side can use on the other. So ultimately, I was surprised that they didn't make anymore of Jenkins than they did. And bravo to Lady Bird for standing up to LBJ. I suspect she is the only one that could have done that.

As for Johnson and insecurities, I don't think that he was truly insecure. Like others have mentioned, I think it was stress. I see him as being a strong man who had bouts with stress, as any man or woman in that office would have. Most people second guess themselves when they are stressed. I just think that he was too strong willed of a man to be truly insecure.

I am starting to go through the jingles/ad links and find them interesting. Thanks for posting them, Bentley. BTW - the link in msg 52 (the Daisy Ad) doesn't seem to work for me. I did go watch it on YouTube.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Helga wrote: "Your Children will be Communists-Barry Goldwater Ad
Sinatra's song "High Hopes" with Jack Kennedy
LBJ Poverty Ad
Medicare Discussion for LBJ
50th Anniversary LadyBird Johnson's 1964 Whistlestop Tou..."

Some highlights I guess.

[Ann D]

Very interesting Bentley. I remembered the Daisy and mushroom cloud anti-Goldwater ad, but not the jingles or ads you posted. There were really some vicious ads out there - the KKK ad, the ice cream girl/nuclear testing ad , Khrushchev "making" our children Communists, the failed Bay of Pigs invasion being a "dark blot on our national character,etc."

I thought the most effective ads were
1. pro- Johnson
The "Republican" questioning his party's choice for president (although you are right that it would not fly today, given he was an actor and a smoker to boot:-).
2. pro-Goldwater
Ronald Reagan projecting such calm self-assurance and warmth defending his friend Barry. He always sounds so reasonable.

Teri, I think you are right about today's media zeroing in on any scandals and harping on any missteps by the candidates. No wonder we don't have stronger candidates.

I really don't pay attention to campaign ads any more. I find that even those for the candidates I like are not honest.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Teri wrote: "My general comment about the chapter: As I read through the Jenkins "affair", I kept thinking about how this might play out today. I can't imagine that they'd be able to sweep it under the rug wi..."

Thanks Teri I will check it

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Ann wrote: "Very interesting Bentley. I remembered the Daisy and mushroom cloud anti-Goldwater ad, but not the jingles or ads you posted. There were really some vicious ads out there - the KKK ad, the ice cre..."

When we think that campaign ads are getting worse - all you have to do Ann is remember the good ole days of the Goldwater/LBJ race.

[Peter]

Bentley wrote: "When we think that campaign ads are getting worse - all you have to do Ann is remember to the good ole days of the Goldwater/LBJ race"

I read a book (sorry, I can't remember the title at all) that purported to list the nastiest campaigns in US history. The nastiest presidential race was listed as Jefferson-Adams.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

I am not surprised Peter - I think things were a lot rougher then - there was one Barry Goldwater campaign ad on morality (a different one than I posted - which was bad enough) which I could not possibly post EVER on this thread.

It was awful and it was a video - so I can only imagine. I would never have thought due to sensibilities during that era that things like that were ever condoned or tolerated but they were obviously. They were rough!!!

I do not give the Barry Goldwater campaign organization a free pass as much as the author did in this book on what happened to Walter Jenkins even though Goldwater did not want to worsen Jenkin's troubles because his campaign with obviously his knowledge came out with campaign buttons and stickers that said either of the two quips:

'LBJ - Light Bulb Jenkins: No Wonder He Turned the Lights out" and

"All the way with LBJ, but don't go near the YMCA"

The ridicule in both of these is apparent. But without Goldwater holding back personally it could have been a whole lot worse for Jenkins.

[Ann D]

Interesting information on the campaign buttons and stickers, Bentley. Politics sure is a dirty business.

Everyone of those Goldwater videos ends with "In your heart you know he's right." So you aren't supposed to use your brain or what! I can only suppose that they knew how badly Goldwater trailed and they were trying to get people to reconsider by looking into their "hearts" - whatever that means.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Very much so Ann. I know - from the Goldwater viewpoint it has to be your heart and emotionalism doing the thinking - but of course the Democrats changed Goldwater's motto and that sounded much worse (smile).

I think it also meant that when you go into the voting booth - you can finally vote for the person who you really think is right and not go along with the crowd.

[Vincent]

Jill wrote: "I'm not sure they do, Ann. The theatrics, if you will, of those statements are just that....theatrics. All presidents (and presidential candidates) have to develop a theme (which they call policy) ..."

Just a comment about ":no one being poor" - if one lives at the level of $10,000/yr and goes to $15,000/yr - just as a ratio - then they may still be poor but feel much less poor. I think this is the kind of prosperity LBJ may have been thinking towards

[Vincent]

I see all the references to LBJ's mental health. I note pg 198 para 4 when things were going well for LBJ ".......he would start craving things to fear"

Again I am thinking where do these insights into LBJ's thinking originate. How much is editorializing?

I am curious if anyone, not me so far, has read the Caro books on Johnson and if there is any support for the high level of insecurity portrayed in this book so far.

I note too however the lack of loyalty towards Jenkins from LBJ and the opposite from Lady Bird. Lady Bird is becoming a star.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Vince, I think you should listen to the tapes that I have added to these threads - these are primary sources and a lot of them are part of the Lyndon Johnson presidential library - also some of the phone calls did exhibit some of the insecurity.

I have the telephone tape between the two of them and yes she knew how to get things done and how to manage him.

[Vincent]

Thanks

I began but ran out of time - I will get back to it

Thanks

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Vince I think you will enjoy them and I will add more here.

[Dave]

Peter wrote: "One nice thing about the book is that I am learning more about Lady Bird and how fundamentally decent she was."

Not only decent, but strong when it mattered. I'd read about how LBJ was borderline (if not crossing the border sometimes) abusive to her, and that she seemed to meekly take it like a good wifey of the 50s would. But she apparently had a strong moral compass and was not afraid to stand up to LBJ when she felt it was needed.

[Dave]

1) My biggest impression from this chapter is how little we knew Lady Bird. More often than not, we didn't hear much from or about First Ladies until the 1970s. There were exceptions, of course. Jackie Kennedy, Eleanor Roosevelt. But I think it was Betty Ford who followed in Eleanor's footsteps and really made it okay for a First Lady to be a real person, with ideas, personality and flaws. Other than "Keep America Beautiful" - a good cause, to be sure - we just didn't learn much about Lady Bird from the News.

2) Wow! In some ways, we've come a long way. For homosexuality to be so threatening just by association reminds us of the changes we've lived through. Of course I know that it wasn't just homosexuality that brought down Jenkins, but the location and circumstances. Still, when Anthony Weiner was caught in similar circumstances, it brought him down - not any associates.

3) I had no idea that Reagan was so influential in national politics at that early date. I used to think, "Where did he come from so quickly" when he challenged Jerry Ford for the nomination in 1976. Now I can see that the groundwork was being laid long before.

[Bryan]

Great comments, Dave, thank you.

You do forget that Reagan had a longer political history and this book is good at drawing this out.

First Ladies: it is interesting, part of it might be personality and what the president would endorse, too. Jackie and Eleanor were great examples, and now the role is evolving.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Good comments Dave - I echo what Bryan posted.

[Ann D]

Vince wrote:"I am curious if anyone, not me so far, has read the Caro books on Johnson and if there is any support for the high level of insecurity portrayed in this book so far.

Here are some quotes from Caro's The Passage of Power. In this part of the book. Caro is discussing the election of 1960 and Johnson's insecurities.

...as the men who had worked with him longest knew, failure - the dread of it, the fear of losing, that is a factor in the equation that makes up the personality of many men, perhaps most men - was a factor possessed of a particularly heavy weight in the very complex equation that was the personality of Lyndon Johnson. (location 650 - sorry, no page numbers in the Kindle version))

Caro, quoting Bobby Baker: "Johnson feared losing"...He had a deep "fear of being defeated. He was always petrified by that notion." He was, Baker says "haunted by fears of failure."

Caro again: "Petrified. Haunted." Strong words - and other men who had known Lyndon Johnson a long time use words equally strong." (location 659).

Here are some remarks about Johnson's very intense moods, which everyone around him recognized.

"Lyndon Johnson's changes in mood had always been violent, veering from his sad, silent spells to the periods of almost frenzied euphoria that his aides called "highs." (location 12312)

by Robert A. Caro

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Great quotes and good use of sources.

[Vincent]

Ann wrote: "Vince wrote:"I am curious if anyone, not me so far, has read the Caro books on Johnson and if there is any support for the high level of insecurity portrayed in this book so far.

Here are some quo..."

Thanks Ann

[Ann D]

Vince,
I had some of the same questions that you did, so I enjoyed looking further.

[Sera]

So would LBJ be diagnosed as bi-polar today?

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

No I do not think he was bi polar.

[Lewis]

One does wonder if LBJ was bipolar...certainly had big swings. He almost seemed paranoid (page 198) of the sky falling in even when things were looking very bright.

[Lewis]

Another example of alarmism (page 214) by Goldwater. May have some effect in the short run, but it damages credibility over the long run... I remember quite clearly some folks saying that if Obama was elected, our country would collapse and would become a Muslim state...

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

He did not exhibit risky behavior - I think he was just a man who had a huge fear of failure because of his father.

I think folks like to label folks with these misdiagnoses.

We really did discuss this at length earlier and I don't thing folks are going to revisit it but you never know (smile). I think LBJ looked at things as the glass being half empty.

[Lewis]

One wonders at times (page 214 bottom) whether politicians actually believe their own words..."for the first time in man's history..."

[Lewis]

Page 219 highlights RR at his best...all positive and optimistic. Amazing how an emotion or a perception can influence people so strongly...

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

I think that is true - Reagan delivered a performance which folks bought into but it was not the real Reagan - it was the packaged one. I think in terms of the speeches - you have to ignore the hyperbole.

[Bryan]

Agree, it usually isn't about the issues, but how a candidate makes you feel. Reagan was the master.

[Ann D]

Very true Bryan. It's very discouraging.

[Michael]

Ann, Bryan and Bentley, I think this is a universal trait of politicians regardless of party line. They will do their best to give us what we want to hear particularly in an election year. It would be refreshing to see a candidate run for office that gives it to the people straight. The problem lies in the fact that the majority of Americans (I will even say North Americans (he, he,) are too comfortable to make the sacrifices that are really needed. People running for office give us the messages that are going to win votes.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

So true Michael - so both the candidate and the voters shoot themselves in the foot before they even get to the ballot box.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Sera we have already moved on with the discussion of this. This is getting like a conspiracy theory (smile) - I have placed your link since it is not a discussion - just blog post in the glossary.

Let us discuss the chapter. here - there is always the glossary thread for something like this.