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Jude the Obscure
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Archived Group Reads 2020 > Jude the Obscure: Week 1: Part First - At Marygreen

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message 1: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
Here is the discussion folder for the first week. I'm not quite ready to post a synopsis as I've had company for the past five days. Please feel free to get the discussion rolling. I will join you as soon as I can :-)


message 2: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
Here is a short synopsis of the first part:

When we first meet Jude Fawley he is an eleven-year-old orphan who watches his teacher leave. Jude likes to read books and hopes to some day become a learned man, but in the little obscure hamlet of Marygreen his prospects are slim.

In this first part we follow Jude as he grows to the age of nineteen and marriage. For some years he helps his great aunt Drusilla in her bakery and makes deliveries to outlying residents. It gives him time to read the Greco-Roman classics he loves between stops. Ultimately he decides to apprentice as a mason.

During his apprenticeship he only comes home on the weekends, and one day on a lark he changes up his normal route and meets Arabella Donn. Up to this point he had mostly lived in his head, and the fairer sex hadn't lured him much. For the first time he takes a closer look and is quite taken. To him Arabella, despite her female charms, is only a diversion, or so he tells himself. Arabella has other plans. She traps him quite ruthlessly by lying about being pregnant. They marry and it is a disaster. After a spat she returns to her family who is planning to leave for Australia. He lets her go.

Jude had always dreamed of going to Christminster, and he resolves to fulfill his dream after he finishes his apprenticeship.


message 3: by Kerstin, Moderator (last edited Jan 07, 2020 07:01PM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
This is my first time reading it, and before I even read the first sentence, I wondered about the title, Jude the Obscure .

What is obscure about Jude? It is a rather odd title. We normally don't use this word to describe persons. A person is a living being, and beings are not ambiguous, vague, unclear, or uncertain - to list a few synonyms - a being is very real and tangible.

We may describe a town in the middle of nowhere obscure, for few have ever heard of it or come into contact with its residents. And the residents' lives pass mostly unnoticed by the world at large. So Marygreen is certainly obscure from this perspective.

To give Jude the title "obscure" makes him from the beginning somewhat impersonal, as if his life is not fully lived, and we already get glimpses of it.

1) His great-aunt says he should have died just like his parents
2) He has no boy-hood friends or companions
3) He is an odd duck who reads books
4) Arabella uses him shamelessly only to drop him like a hot potato

So I wonder, is this going to be a theme?


Peggy | 24 comments The descriptions of the courtship, except for the pig offal, were sweet. Jude’s determination and plans to reach his goal make you wish he would succeed, but the general feeling I have is that Jude will never get there.

The section when he realizes there’s no need to try to hold onto his wife and that their lives were ruined struck me. It all seems hopeless. Maybe just my post holiday/seasonal blues talking?


message 5: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
Peggy wrote: "The section when he realizes there’s no need to try to hold onto his wife and that their lives were ruined struck me. It all seems hopeless. Maybe just my post holiday/seasonal blues talking? "

It is pretty bleak. Despite Arabella's desertion he is still married to her. I bet once she arrives in Australia she'll remarry and nobody is the wiser. He has no such "out", and I don't know what legal recourse would even be available to him. Probably none given he is poor.

I get the post Christmas blues too! Looks like we have a dreary book for a dreary season...


message 6: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
What is your impression of Arabella?


message 7: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
What does Jude's love for the Greco-Roman classics say about him?


Theresa (theresas) | 9 comments Apparently Jude didn’t even think about the legal aspect of the marriage when he learned she planned to leave. But despite his naïveté, he knew he had been played in the most significant way. His years of trying to better himself appear wasted.

Arabella just seems like a selfish girl grasping for anything to her advantage, but not really malevolent.


Lily (joy1) | 1289 comments One of the things that bugs me about this story is why did Hardy choose the set-up of characters that he did. I haven't explored what the critics have said through the years, but I am interested if other astute readers such as those here have an opinion. (I guess I probably have more strong "feelings" than cogent thoughts about this book. Which is a rather strange and uncomfortable place for me -- I want things to be "logical" or at least "purposeful." Maybe Hardy is saying "get off that" and see what is as it is? But is he "realistic" then about what he portrays? Or does it reflect a bias about what is possible with lives given their circumstances?)


message 10: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
Lily wrote: "But is he "realistic" then about what he portrays? Or does it reflect a bias about what is possible with lives given their circumstances?"

Here is what I see:

Hardy grew up in the country, so I trust him in his depictions of country life.

What is perhaps a little subtle, at least so far, is that there is a hierarchy among the residents of Marygreen. Drusilla, Jude's great-aunt, runs a bakery. That's central and indispensable to any community, she is one of the "betters" along with other shopkeepers. By extension so is Jude. He is also her potential heir. For a while they even have a horse and wagon for Jude to deliver bakery goods to outlying areas.

Now, lets look at Arabella. She is the daughter of a pig keeper. Pigs stink. They live outside of town, outside the hub of the community. They don't associate in the same circles as is demonstrated with the girlfriends she has and the company her family keeps for Sunday dinner. Jude doesn't really know any of these people. Arabella's step-mother agrees to leave the house with her father so she can seriously dally with Jude. Why would her step-mother do that? Isn't it understood that this can lead a good girl to ruin? The conversation with her girlfriends demonstrates that given their circumstances taking greater risks is justified if it means to get a "great catch."

In the stratified society we have, Jude could have easily dismissed Arabella and washed himself of all wrong-doing. She's a loose girl, end of story. Later we find out Drusilla had warned Jude not to marry her. He does it anyway out of honor and obligation. It is a step down. They end up living in a hut, not under Drusilla's roof.


Charlotte (charlottecph) | 271 comments I am usually very critical towards whether the plot and the characters are realistic, but I am surprised with my self this time. I can accept the meetings that Jude encounters just for the fun of it. It is like a fairy tale and “what if... happened...”. I don’t know why... Perhaps because I liked “Far from the Madding Crowd” so much.


message 12: by Lily (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lily (joy1) | 1289 comments Charlotte wrote: "...I can accept the meetings that Jude encounters just for the fun of it. It is like a fairy tale and “what if... happened...”. I don’t know why... Perhaps because I liked “Far from the Madding Crowd” so much...."

Thank you for your comments, Charlotte. My f2f book group celebrated today that the first meeting of the group was thirty years ago. While only two of us have been members since that day, others have been with us over twenty years. (Another of the original group remains on our email distributions, and she keeps us at least loosely linked to others who have long since moved to Florida!) We were talking a bit about some of the differences in the approaches we each bring to responding to a text. You added to that conversation for me with your comments.

(view spoiler)


Jackie | 8 comments This is my first time reading "Jude the Obscure" and my second Thomas Hardy novel (I have previously read Tess of the d'Ubervilles). This is a tragic story of Jude. I feel like it is somewhat similar to Tess.. since he is not in a higher class but longs to be. He tries to get accepted to a university, before being seduced by Arabella.

Jude seems to be a very genuine, honorable man--the fact that he would marry Arabella even though she is a lower class because he thinks she is having his child.... Just how tragic how is story ends in Part 1. I am curious how it continues and hope he will find some sort of happiness. I can already see a theme on class and how its difficult to rise above your class/station in life. It seems like for Jude things were getting in the way of this-- Or should I say Arabella was getting in the way of this. Just interesting how one poor choice/relationship can damage the outcome of one's life.


message 14: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
Jackie wrote: "Jude seems to be a very genuine, honorable man..."

I got that impression too.


message 15: by ConnieD (new)

ConnieD (bookwithcat) | 37 comments This read is tough going for me.


message 16: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
ConnieD wrote: "This read is tough going for me."

LOL! I hear you, Connie! Hardy is a good writer when it comes to setting the mood, describing a place and setting a scene. One can just picture walking through Marygreen. How he lived with himself creating these maudlin characters is a mystery to me.


message 17: by Renee, Moderator (new) - rated it 5 stars

Renee M | 2642 comments Mod
I have a like/dislike (perhaps “like” is too strong a word) relationship with Arabella. One the one hand, she is coarse and manipulative; on the other hand, she also wants to better her station in life with limited means to do so. Even her parents colluded to get her a good husband at any cost, so it seems part of the mindset with which she has been raised. I think there was some naïveté on her part as well... that she would just be accepted into his world (Drusilla was having none of it) or the Jude would fit into hers. The fact that he resoundingly does not brings much of their conflict.


Peggy | 24 comments Although Arabella’s manipulative and coarse she’s the least annoying in my opinion.


message 19: by Kerstin, Moderator (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kerstin | 703 comments Mod
Renee wrote: "One the one hand, she is coarse and manipulative; on the other hand, she also wants to better her station in life with limited means to do so."

It is the perennial Cinderalla story. Here the picture isn't as pretty as the Grimm's Fairy Tale. We have an unflattering picture of the lower classes in their coarse existence, and whatever means will get you ahead will do. I find it interesting though, that by herself Arabella doesn't think of tricking Jude until it is suggested to her. So she has an inner core of decency.


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