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Infinite Jest by D.F. Wallace, WEEK 4
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Right well first thing I've learnt is that I haven't finished this section after all! I thought it finished at the 7th of November but apparently it's the 5th so I'd better sign off and get back to this later.
Finally got some time set aside to finish this part off.Well! Mario definitely knows 'Madame Psychosis', but what I don't know is if he knows that he knows. You know?
Now I can read everyone elses thoughts!
John wrote: "Joelle's story is riveting. The concept of "the Entertainment" seemed almost farcical before, but learning of Joelle's part has cast it in a dark and disturbing light.Oh I agree - that was very very interesting...
John wrote: "I laughed out loud when I saw what the infamous page 223 contained. I was figuring that all out myself anyway, NOW he's going to make it easy for us? haha!..."I felt cheated! I'd put off reading it, was soooo good. And then, that! What a let-down. I'd worked all that out already!
John wrote: "Orin has seemed like a side character up until now, but it looks like he had and/or will have a major part to play.mo..."I haven't thought of him as a side character, I've thought of him as a main character who hasn't had much to do yet. He's waiting in the wings I'm sure of it...
I also noticed something about Orin in that section of Joelle's. Something about him not liking Mario? Or not in the past anyway. In the phone conversation early in the book Orin only spoke to Hal, not to Mario. I noted at the time that Hal seemed reluctant to tell Mario who it was.
Nicola wrote: "What a let-down.Agreed! I am not disliking this book, but I do think that all of the hype builds it up so much that I am feeling disappointment while I read, which is really tempering my enthusiasm.
John wrote: It seems as if she probably survived, as there was someone right outside the bathroom. Maybe she'll end up at Ennet House?
I think she probably will - she seems an interesting character and she's so intertwined with the mysterious 'Infinite Jest' and the also rather mysterious Jim so I'm hoping to find out a lot more about her.
John wrote: "Oh! One thing I don't think we've mentioned yet, just popped into my head: What is the deal with Lyle?? He sits in the weight room and subsists only on the students' sweat? This is one of the most ..."Well I mentioned him in the last section but only to say that his words were a prediction of the bricklayers accident. I'm sure he'll be fleshed out at some point.
John wrote: "I think the "pretty" self-descriptions were Joelle's way of being sardonic.Towards the beginning of her narrative, she described Orin as the "Acid-dodger". So I'm guessing there was some incident..."
Yes I read it as ironic as well.
Interesting thought about the 'acid doger'. It was a phrase I noted as unusual but didn't have an explanation for at the time.
Rosemary wrote: That makes a lot of sense to me!..."
It would certainly explain her change of medium wouldn't it? From Film to Radio.
Linda wrote: "I went back to reread this and it actually said "dodger of flung acid extraordinaire", so I had missperceived what this meant. And what was the acid flung for? Something to do with ANTI ONAN?
Nicola wrote: John wrote: "I laughed out loud when I saw what the infamous page 223 contained. I was figuring that all out myself anyway, NOW he's going to make it easy for us? haha!..."I felt cheated! I'd put off reading it, was soooo good. And then, that! What a let-down. I'd worked all that out already! "
I thought it was pretty funny, but I also think the gusto was taken out of page 223 since we knew there was something of importance on it ahead of time, and then it was made even more important when we were told not to read it ahead of time. I bet it would have been a sigh of relief to those readers of the book shortly after it came out.
Linda wrote: "Rosemary wrote: "I loved the part in this section where somebody (who?) lists all the things you learn in rehab. Some very funny stuff there."I think this was my favorite section of this week's r..."
I liked it but it went on for a bit long for me. I found the snippets of conversation from Dr Pats files to be hilarious.
Otherwise though I think this section of the book a lot grimmer, less comedic relief.
Ami wrote: Yogis, for instance, can reach levels of meditative states so deep and strong, they do not need much else to sustain life; other than the ability to live on belief-I'm not saying he's a yogi, I think he's somebody who is very proficient in something. He was called a guru wasn't he? And he was described as sitting in yoga posture on top of the towel dispenser or something so I thought there couldn't be much doubt.
Ami wrote: "Then there's the aspect of the maddening euphoria Wallace goes on to describe Joelle enduring, after the long self-involved soliloquy, crying while smoking scraps and bits of things laden with resin and acetate (220 & 223). The sense of desperation and agitation was overwhelming, but just so damn poingnant at the same time! It makes you want to scream... Well, it did me.It got to me too. All of DFW's writing get to me - I find him incredibly talented. I presume he excels in conveying what he has himself experienced.
Ami wrote: "I just thought she would have been a little different than the rest...Somebody not plagued by vices. ..."
I think everyone in this book is going to be plagued by vices of some form or another.
Kaycie wrote: "Nicola wrote: "What a let-down.Agreed! I am not disliking this book, but I do think that all of the hype builds it up so much that I am feeling disappointment while I read, which is really temper..."
Oh no no! You've misunderstood me! I meant (in a joking way) that the web site which gave advice about the 'right way' to read the book had hyped up this page and I was so good about resisting reading it ahead of time that when I finally did, I laughed about it :-)
Infinite Jest itself is definitely not a let down. I can't remember the last time a book engaged my every faculty. I love it!
I also meant that with all of the hype leading up to this part, page 223 wasnt what I expected. For me, this is applying to more of the book than just this one page, and the cumulative effect is bringing me down. I'll restrain my jaded views to the self-help thread! Sorry! :-)
Kaycie wrote: "I also meant that with all of the hype leading up to this part, page 223 wasnt what I expected. For me, this is applying to more of the book than just this one page, and the cumulative effect is br..."Oh I see :-)
I haven't heard any hype about the book myself but I don't pay attention to those sorts of things. I didn't even know the book existed until a couple of months ago so that should give you some idea of how useless I am with 'keeping up with what's hot'.
Linda wrote: "I bet it would have been a sigh of relief to those readers of the book shortly after it came out. ..."Can you imagining reading this book completely blind? Having no idea at all what you were getting yourself into.
I would have turned it over in my hands several times looking for inspirational insight from the cover or the back page blurb and gone "W.T.F! am I reading!?"
Nicola wrote: "I haven't heard any hype about the book myself but I don't pay attention to those sorts of things. " I WISH I had gone into this book like that, and I think I would like it much more. I listened to too much of the cult-following praise of the book, and nothing can live up to expectations like that.
I do have a serious issue with ranking books sometimes because when I have no idea what to think of a book and rank it 5 stars, is it really better than a brilliant classic that couldn't live up to its over-extended hype? Maybe I do need to stop "keeping up with that's hot"! :-)
Nicola wrote: "Ami wrote: Yogis, for instance, can reach levels of meditative states so deep and strong, they do not need much else to sustain life; other than the ability to live on belief-I'm not saying he's a ..."It's not meant to be so literal. If you reread that section, you would see that there's something about else about Lyle, he is approached by students because he imparts wisdom...He's a guru of wisdom.
Lyle's ideologies seem to me, definitely influenced by an Eastern belief system, but more so Buddhist (and the Buddha is known to be sitting in full lotus also) in nature because it's never one ideal, or the other, it's more about staying right in between the two...Let not the weight thou wouldst pull to thyself exceed thine own weight(128).
Firstly I finally read the filmography list, (although it was zoomed over and it really should have been gone over with a fine tooth comb) and I saw that the final film was Infinite Jest version 5 or something and that the master copy was supposedly destroyed. I also saw that he had a great deal of collaboration with Madame Psychosis so it’s likely that this woman in known to the family. Mario when he was listening to her on the radio was fantasising about talking to her I remember but I can’t remember if it was positively stated that he knew her or didn’t know her. She is rather a mysterious person at this point in time. There is also I suppose no assurance that they Madame Psychosis who worked with Jim is the same Madame Psychosis who is the star of the radio show.
Secondly this big deal drug that Hal and Co are discussing trying can’t be that much before when Hal heads off to the interview which we see at the start of the book. Is this the ‘something I ate’ which put him into this state? I don't think it is directly but I remember that Hal talked about him going through a 'bad patch' last year or something like that so I'm thinking that that might very well be connected to this.
We see more of the Ennet House crowd as the various bit part players that we’ve meet scattered throughout the book are gathered together as inmates of one sort or other. I had to go search for Don (Dan?) Gately before remembering that he was of the ‘insert toothbrush up rectum’ fame. There are also more mentions of the guy with the snakes in the box. For someone who we haven’t really meet he does keep popping up. It’s clear to see that the connecting threads are being steadily drawn together at this point.
For the Hamlet allusions which I am keeping a weather eye cocked for, I saw it was mentioned that CT’s room was right next to Avrils.
And also one other thing I wanted to mention which stood out in my mind as I passed was the advice given to the people who come to the tennis academy there was mention of keeping a torch by the bed to help with the dreams. That reminded me of a previous section where there was a face in the floor. Why should they have bad dreams? I would normally associate this with drugs. Anyway, now to read what everyone else thinks!