Genova, Lisa - Still Alice ; Informal Buddy Read ; Start Date December 16 2014

[Shinjini]

Thoughts after The End:

I really liked this book. Yes it was an emotional rollercoaster but the details and perspective of Alice was written so wonderfully. I am glad I read this book despite the delicate subject matter. It made me cry more than once but I can't say the tears weren't worth it. I couldn't stop reading this book, occasionally sneaking in a chapter while doing other work. Knowing Alice has been a wonderful journey and I am thankful to this book and Lisa Genova for giving me such a clear perspective and some more information about the disease. Alzheimer's doesn't exactly have a happy ending but this book had a relatively happier ending than I had expected and all credit for that goes to Genova that despite the serious subject matter, she could still leave the reader on a happy note.

I am so very glad I read this book and I will be watching the movie as well. And I must check out Lisa Genova's next work. She did a splendid job with this book.

[Margaret]

Shinjini....oh no problem, I personally avoid opening spoiler alerts if I don't know where the person is at and I don't want to be disappointed by reading something. :) my heart does a flip flop if I happen to open one not knowing! :D I have accidently done that before.

[Margaret]

Shinjini wrote: " July 2004

John has now redeemed himself completely. To be so understanding and caring towards Alice when she couldn't find the bathroom, I now have no complaints. He is a good man.

This has be..."


(view spoiler)[exactly! I find that so interesting how we value a person's mental capabilities and our perception, respect and regard goes south when someone loses their mental capacity, what an eye opener this book has been! (hide spoiler)]

[Shinjini]

I do that a lot too! So I usually add the chapter number when I make my post but I keep forgetting to do that when I am on the phone. I'll remember from now on. :)

[Margaret]

Shinjini wrote: "Thoughts after The End:

I really liked this book. Yes it was an emotional rollercoaster but the details and perspective of Alice was written so wonderfully. I am glad I read this book despite the ..."

I can't wait to see the movie as well, I know it will be good. I plan to read more from the author, I think there is one other book that I have heard rave reviews about.

[Shinjini]

That is just what I was thinking. Is it that easy to forget what a person has achieved as soon as he/she shows symptoms of mental disorders?

I think it's called Left Neglected. I will be checking that book out for sure!

[Renee]

I'm glad you both loved the book too.
There is such a stigma around mental illness, mostly because people don't understand and are afraid. I have worked a lot with people with intellectual disabilities, and you see a similar stigma there.

[Srividya]

About 90 pages into the book now and here are my initial thoughts

(view spoiler)[Denial is something that I have also experienced first hand. It usually comes with diseases such as these. My grandfather as well as my husband's grandfather both had Alzheimer's and the first thing we did was to deny it. It is useless, I know but somehow I understand how that happens. However, despite denial being something common, I am not quite liking John's attitude. This is the time when Alice needs him the most and he seems to be going away from her, which I think is not so nice!

As for Alice's relationship with Lydia, I have seen many parents doing that to their children, not letting them achieve their dreams because it is not 'intellectual' enough. Here in India, if its a male child, he HAS to go into engineering or medicine, at least that was the trend until very recently. It was not so much for girls but in some families that existed as well. If a particularly suitable profession was not chosen by the child, parents went into a frenzy, with regard to his or her future prospects both in professional as well as personal life! So, I am not really surprised at Alice's outrage at Lydia's chosen profession. However, given that she is a psychologist by profession, albeit in linguistics, I would have thought that she would be more open minded about it! (hide spoiler)]

[Renee]

Srividya wrote: "About 90 pages into the book now and here are my initial thoughts

Denial is something that I have also experienced first hand. It usually comes with diseases such as these. My grandfather as well ..."

I think you will relate more to this story as you personally know people who have had Alzheimers. I don't know anyone personally, yet this book still had a great impact on me.

[Srividya]

Oh yes Renee. In fact, it is difficult reading this book as it is bringing back a lot of memories!

[Margaret]

Srividya: Oh I can't wait to hear your thoughts about this book. I had three aunts (possibly more) who had the early on-set Alzheimer's but I never had to personally deal with them. Also your thoughts and the initial differences in India just makes me glad that you are reading this book! :)

[Srividya]

Have reached about 62%. Reading September 2004 currently. Some of my thoughts

(view spoiler)[It is painful to read how accurately the author has described some of the symptoms. Just last night, while discussing this book with my parents, I discovered that one of my aunts has also been diagnosed with Alzheimer's. Alice is a lot like her. My aunt started blooming late in life, professionally I mean. Indian women of those times were not allowed to work or study but this lady finished her basic graduation and then when family troubles were insurmountable, she learnt French at the age of 40 and went on to becoming a professor in the University. As I said, she had talent and spunk in spades! To know now that she is going through the same things that Alice is going through is really painful. She remembers my father as a kid but can't connect to his older self today. It is painful isn't it to see a successful and talented person go through something like this?

Social stigma is more common when it occurs to people who are at the height of their careers or are really young, I feel. I never experienced the social stigma that Alice seems to face, when it came to our grandfathers but I can imagine just how cruel people can be when Alzheimer's affects a younger person. So much like it is with kids, the only difference being that kids don't really understand but adults actually do and despite this understanding choose to be cruel! I really don't understand that. It makes me wonder whether my aunt is going through the same thing as Alice and it hurts me more than anything.. I wonder when people will accept that illness or ailment is not something that we opt for out of choice but it is something that happens, something that is beyond our control. And if we can't be helpful in any way, why can't we just shut up and keep quiet?!

Coming back to the book - I am still angry with John! How can he do this to his wife! He doesn't even stop to think about the situation, if it had been the other way round. I can understand that it is painful to deal with it, god knows we have dealt with it so I know just how painful it can be..but to avoid her like this, in her time of need is simply disgusting!

In a relationship, I sincerely believe that the couple has to take predominance over other things, especially profession! Maybe I am naive in thinking that way but isn't that what it is all about when we take our vows at the altar? And isn't John breaking that vow by being indifferent to Alice?

I can understand the children and their worries and inability to accept or deal with the situation. However, i feel out of all the family members, Lydia is the only one dealing with it in a mature way. (hide spoiler)]

PS- Sorry for the initial rant in the spoiler. This book is really affecting me and I just had to get it off my chest!

[Margaret]

lol....rant away! makes for more interesting discussions! This is why I am loving these book reads :D btw, I totally agree with you!

[Srividya]

Same place 65%

(view spoiler)[You know the part about her shouting at Anna that evening. God it feels like yesterday when my husband's grandfather did the same with all of us. We had gone over for a family get together and he didn't recognise us at all! He thought we were there to steal his money and take away his home from him. He screamed and ranted and would not listen to anyone! He only calmed down after he went away and even after that he told his son, who was his primary caregiver, that he (the son) should take care and keep those people (meaning us) away as we are thieves! It was so heart wrenching to witness that moment, especially as he has always been so wonderful to everyone!

Delusions, hallucinations, wanting to leave the house on an imagined schedule, not being able to go far, visual spatial issues - oh the list is endless and I am glad that the author has not really dramatized the whole thing but stayed true to the disease and its various aspects.

I have one question though - till the very end my husband's grandfather, despite forgetting everyone around him, could not forget his son or his daughter in law. Is that because they were his primary caregivers? Does that kind of understanding exist in Alzheimer's patients? Or was it a one off thing? Does anyone know? Hopefully this book will shed some light on that aspect. (hide spoiler)]

[Karen ⊰✿, Fiction Aficionado]

@Srividya
thanks for sharing, I can imagine that this book is having quite an impact on you given your family history.

I'm not sure of the answer to your last question. My husband's grandfather forgot his wife at the end. I guess it is possible that the longer memories are retained longer (so the people you have known for longer)?

[Srividya]

Thanks Karen! Hmm its possible that you do tend to have vague remembrances of people you have known longer.

Just finished Alice's speech in March 2005 chapter, (view spoiler)[where she talks about how it is to live with the disease. I must say that I have goosebumps all over me right now. That was an amazing speech... Am totally in awe of the author for having included this part into the story. It is really touching and so true.

Till now I was kind of in the hating John mode, given how he was reacting to her every problem and how selfish he was. I hope this talk changes his attitude towards her and towards the disease but that final part where she looks at him and sees his love for her in his eyes, well that was partially redeeming. (hide spoiler)]

[Sarah]

I think it is short term memory that can become really effected and then it goes back from there. I work with a lot of patients with Alzheimer's, and it seems that people tend to loose earlier memories last, they remember their younger years and often think people around them are actually people from long ago, but don't remember the people in their current life - i.e. grandchildren, even their own children. They may think their children are still young or they remember siblings and parents. This is just something I have observed.

[Srividya]

I agree Sarah. It is the short term memory that seems to be affected first and then it goes backward until the moment that they don't remember anything at all. I have seen it happen with my husband's grandfather. He used to remember his house and family in the village and kept wanting to go there, despite the fact that no one stays there at present! However, he could not remember his children or other family members.

Finished this book! What an emotional ride this was. End spoilers (view spoiler)[I loved the fact that the author has stayed true to the specifics throughout the book. I guess the lack of dramatization made it more impact worthy than anything else. I have to say that somehow John just didn't redeem himself, even in the end. I question his selfishness. He only thought of himself and his future, without giving any thought to Alice and her needs. It seemed as if he had accepted her as dead, from the moment she told him about her Alzheimer's. Somehow that didn't come across very realistic to me. That is the only issue, if any, that I had with this book.

As my experiences with the disease are personal, where we have always rallied round the ailing person as well as the caretaker, this detached attitude of John truly irks me. However, I would like to believe that the author has had some real life experiences in this regard, which made her create a character like John. Although, I will admit that I am really disheartened to know that such people exist. (hide spoiler)]

[Sarah]

Dec. 2003 (view spoiler)[ At the Christmas party when Alice comes back from the bathroom and sees a woman in a red dress engaging with her colleagues and husband but doesn't recognize her as Dan's wife, that she had just met. Well this will undoubtedly grab somebody's attention, hopefully her husband's. (hide spoiler)]

[Sarah]

My favorite quote - "I don't remember. I have Alzheimer's."

Up to July 2004 (view spoiler)[ Alice just asked where her sister was and was reminded that her sister had died... years ago. But to Alice it is like she is just getting the news. Could you imagine? To have to go through all the fresh emotions of such a great loss that do become much more bearable with the healing of time. This really is such a devastating illness and Alice seems to be deteriorating rather quickly, and so young. (hide spoiler)]

[Sarah]

Srividya - another book dealing with Alzheimer's is We Are Not Ourselves - but in this case I think the spouse is very loyal to her husband who battles with the illness. I thought it was a really good book. And the POV is different.

[Renee]

Sarah wrote: "My favorite quote - "I don't remember. I have Alzheimer's."

Up to July 2004 [spoilers removed]"

That is the point where it was obvious she was deteriorating. It would be awful to relive those experiences.

[Sarah]

August 2004 (view spoiler)[ OMG I was getting so angry with Anna trying to get her mother to remember the time of the play and wanting to try and use her memory more and saying that she was being enabled by using her BlackBerry. Clearly Anna should invest some of her time on learning about dementia. She has a mother with this illness and she clearly is just choosing to be ignorant. It is not going to help anything. (hide spoiler)]

[Sarah]

September 2004 - Didn't think my first set of tears reading this would be (view spoiler)[ when she has to meet with the head of her department at work and go over her evaluations from the students and finally let go of her career and teaching. It is really heartbreaking to lose your autonomy. (hide spoiler)]

[Renee]

Sarah wrote: "September 2004 - Didn't think my first set of tears reading this would be [spoilers removed]"

I cried so much both time I read this. My first tears this time round was about halfway through, not sure which chapter.
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

[Sarah]

Karen wrote: "December 2003
The christmas pudding scene [spoilers removed]February 2004
With the genetic counselor [spoilers removed]"

My mother died of breast cancer when she was 39 years old. I was fifteen - the oldest of five. Now I am almost 39 and just had a mammogram and two tiny tumors removed (very small lumpectomy from my left breast over Thanksgiving - that were not cancerous but had hyperplasia cells, which is a risk factor. The tumors were found to be fibroid tissue only, but I went ahead and got the genetic testing for the breast cancer genes, so it was negative and that is great news for me and my family.

[Srividya]

Thanks Sarah. I have added that one to my TBR.

September 2004 (view spoiler)[I was so moved by that as well, especially as I could see it happening with my aunt. (hide spoiler)]

I don't think I got through this book without tears in my eyes. It was just too much for me.

Sarah - Am glad that you tested negative for breast cancer. Am sure it must have been a relief!

[Sarah]

Srividya - and now onto another uplifting book - Mudbound (total sarcasm). I think this one is going to be even more intense for me. This one is really gonna get my blood boiling - I already know.

Here is a quote I found that Lisa Genova shared at the end of my book I thought was really important:

"In examining disease, we gain wisdom about anatomy and physiology and biology. In examining the person with disease, we gain wisdom about life."
From The Man Who Mistook His Wife for a Hat and Other Clinical Tales by Oliver Sacks

[Karen ⊰✿, Fiction Aficionado]

@Sarah
That is good news. My mother's sister was 34 when diagnosed and my mum was 55. In Australia you need to have 3 female relatives with "early" cancer to get free screening when you are under 40, but as I only have 2 relatives and both were so young, I have been able to access it anyway. So I have mammograms every year and have done so since I was 30. My elder sister refuses which really frustrates me!! When I had my son I got an abscess with breastfeeding and so had to have 6 monthly mamograms and that also gave me access to other specialists which ended up being a good thing because they could access the records and samples taken of my aunt (who thankfully gave consent before she died) and determined that she was a not positive for the current gene mutations they have found. However, the specialists said due to the circumstances in my family it is almost certain there is a gene defect, just one we haven't found yet. But if they do atleast the samples from my family are on file so that may help future generations.
(Sorry that was all a bit long!!)

[Srividya]

Ha ha! Mudbound! Can't wait to start it. I am going in without any prior knowledge or feeling, lets see how it goes.

I loved that quote. I have that book in my TBR, god knows when I will get to that one...

[Sarah]

Me too, even without the BRCA mutation we still have our parents genes and still at increased risk. Knowing I have hyperplasia cells was another risk factor, and insurance won't cover my mammograms at 100% until 40 either, but that will be my next one hopefully. It will be three months late for my forty years - so I am gonna wait the extra three months for my next yearly mammogram, as there hasn't seemed to be any complications with my minor breast surgery.

[Karen ⊰✿, Fiction Aficionado]

Interesting how we have these arbitrary rules about age for screening....

And yes, that was a great quote at the end of the book. This novel really had me thinking, I quite enjoyed it

[Sarah]

Srividya wrote: "Ha ha! Mudbound! Can't wait to start it. I am going in without any prior knowledge or feeling, lets see how it goes.

I loved that quote. I have that book in my TBR, god knows when I will get to th..."

Well I read the first chapter and I am already pissed off and very intrigued.

[Renee]

I'm feeling a bit sad.....I just checked the Coming Soon at all the cinemas near me and none of them will be screening the Still Alice movie :( I knew Darwin was a bit behind, but I didn't think it was this bad! I'll have to wait a bit longer for the DVD release.

[Karen ⊰✿, Fiction Aficionado]

Oh that sucks. From what I can see it is out Jan 29 here

[Margaret]

I can't wait to see it, I'll have to check when it comes to our area. :)

[Sarah]

I read it comes out next week - I wonder if it will be released then in Portland. I watched the trailer last night.

[V_Nerdbooks]

I'm just starting this one, by reading some of the comments I think I may need kleenex !

[Renee]

Definitely V!

[K~Terror]

Haha! I've been meaning to read this one too! It looks good

[K~Terror]

Chapter 1 - I definitely can relate to people who fear public speech more than death. ;)

[K~Terror]

Chapter 2 (view spoiler)[ I kind of agree with John in his supporting Lydia even though it's not a path they would have chosen for her. (hide spoiler)]

[K~Terror]

Chapter 3
(view spoiler)[ at this point, I think I'd go running with my phone & it's gps app! (hide spoiler)]

[V_Nerdbooks]

I feel so bad for her having to tell her kids (view spoiler)[ sitting around the table and just having to look at them and tell them that she probably will end up not knowing who they are, it's heartbreaking!

I wasn't impressed with her daughters attitude though, I understand about being concerned about yourself, but she didn't really didn't empathise with her mother at all! (hide spoiler)]

[V_Nerdbooks]

$285 a day !!!!!!

[K~Terror]

I know! That's crazy!!! I hope I don't get Alzheimer's ~ for a lot of reasons - but, seriously, who can afford it?!

[V_Nerdbooks]

It's ridiculous, how does anyone afford something like that apart from the very rich!

[K~Terror]

Right?!!

Chapter 4 - (view spoiler)[ I loved the night time swim Alice and her husband were able to enjoy. (hide spoiler)].

[K~Terror]

Half way through Chapter 5 - (view spoiler)[ SOBS! (hide spoiler)]

[K~Terror]

End of 5 - justified response IMO. :)