Allegiant
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After reading Allegiant I felt..........
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Aneesha
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rated it 5 stars
Oct 12, 2014 04:02PM
HORRIFIED. I mean why does the main character die
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Because the author has messed up views of selflessness and sacrifice, and wanted to differentiate from other YA novels that sound similar to The Hunger Games.
Aneesha wrote: "HORRIFIED. I mean why does the main character die"well....... if you love someone you need to die. also it is the most 'realistic' ending that could happen to any character in a dystopian novel or otherwise.
I threw my book across the room and sobbed for a long long time... I mean it might have been OK if there was only one book so you wouldn't be as attached to the character when she died.
I almost fell into a nervous breakdown. After reading the part where Tris died, I was weeping and couldn't stop until the last page of the book. It took me all my strength to actually finish the book then afterwards, I wanted to hurl the book against the wall but I remembered my sister gave it to me as a present, so I didn't.
I cried for days, but still feeling quite amazed such a story could ever exist.
Depressing that (view spoiler) and (view spoiler) and (view spoiler) DIED!!!!!Very, very sad....
Ugh, the ending of this book changed my view on Divergent and Insurgent. I loved those 2 books and couldn't wait to read Allegiant. Blah. But I guess, the book was realistic to the point that nobody lasts forever especially given the situations they were faced with.
I hate Allegiant! That ending broke my heart and I literally cried for hours. It's so unpredictable, I did not see Tris' death coming.
Matthew wrote: "Because the author has messed up views of selflessness and sacrifice, and wanted to differentiate from other YA novels that sound similar to The Hunger Games."Maybe that's true in a lot of dystopian novels but in this one I don't think it was realistic at all. I think that the Roth knew she wanted to kill Tris and that she forced it to happen. What I mean by forced is that it seemed like she wanted it to happen so she made it happen without thinking too much about how it went with the book and the character. I thought Tris' death was a disgrace and an insult to the character.
Denise wrote: "Depressing that [spoilers removed] and [spoilers removed] and [spoilers removed] DIED!!!!!Very, very sad....
Ugh, the ending of this book changed my view on Divergent and Insurgent. I loved those..."
I feel the same way as you did. I felt that the second death you've listed was disrespectful to the character. By the time the death actually happened it felt detached from emotion the way it was written and the character deserved more than that. I also think that Tris' death was a disgrace and Roth forced it to happen even though I don't think it went, but I'm not the author so this is just my opinion.
Also, the only way I can think any pleasant thoughts towards this trilogy is to pretend Allegiant didn't happen. Which is still difficult because in some way it tainted the other two.
i would have accepted tris's death had that David guy been brought to justice.
I also cried... (And I don't usually cry a lot in books!)I didn't get very attached to Tris, but to Four. I identified myself more with him (although I am perfectly aware my name in Dauntless would be "Thousand") and imagined losing my boyfriend... That was painful…
But now that I come to think about it... Four is single! I am going to Chicago. Now. (LOL)
I wondered at the beginning of Alegiant why the author started switching narrators. Tris was the only narrator up to that point. Then at the end of the book I realized that if it was only Tris narrating she could not give an account of the aftermath of her death, ie, how the other characters reacted to her death and what happened to each of them afterwards. It is a bummer that David could not be brought to justice because his memory had been erased of everything, including his part in Tris' death.
John wrote: "I wondered at the beginning of Alegiant why the author started switching narrators. Tris was the only narrator up to that point. Then at the end of the book I realized that if it was only Tris narr..."For me, Tobias's point of view gave the game away, along with the author's declaration that Harry Potter should have died in Deathly Hallows. While shocking, Tris's death wasn't surprising.
Matthew wrote: "John wrote: "I wondered at the beginning of Alegiant why the author started switching narrators. Tris was the only narrator up to that point. Then at the end of the book I realized that if it was o..."I completely agree.
The Ravenously wrote: "I almost fell into a nervous breakdown. After reading the part where Tris died, I was weeping and couldn't stop until the last page of the book. It took me all my strength to actually finish the bo..."I agree I almost just stopped reading the book after that. I was so upset, I had grown very fond of Tris. I loved the relationship between Tobias and Tris. I have to say though, the way Veronica went about spreading her ashes could not have been better.
Danielle wrote: "The Ravenously wrote: "I almost fell into a nervous breakdown. After reading the part where Tris died, I was weeping and couldn't stop until the last page of the book. It took me all my strength to..."I agree with you. I think that is the only justice left after Tris' death...to spread her ashes all over the city since Tris practically owns it by saving it. :)
I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suicide than sacrifice. Also, I felt this book didn't connect with the others. The factions that were the main point in the series were abandoned here and were replaced with the pure thing. I was so disappointed, this is one of the worst books I've read.
Angélica wrote: "I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suicide than sacrifice. Also, I felt this book didn't connect..."
I know right? To explain the existence of the factions through another silly governmental experiment is simply repulsive.
Angélica wrote: "I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suicide than sacrifice. Also, I felt this book didn't connect..."
I feel the same way about Tris' death. It was completely unnecessary and I think betrayed the character.
About your comment about the factions, I also agree. This book introduced new characters and a plot line separate from the other two books that I couldn't take seriously so late in the trilogy.
The Ravenously wrote: "Angélica wrote: "I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suicide than sacrifice. Also, I felt this bo..."
At first I didnt like the whole governmental experiment thing , but it makes sense. It was a really good twist in this trilogy. It showed them that there really is no such thing a GP (Genetically Pure) and that you cant control people the way they were trying to do. I think that the message Edith Prior left had more meaning then even the characters realized. There was a war that needed their help it just wasnt the type of "war" they were expecting.
I have to say that even though I really hate that Tris died and I didnt get the whole governmental experiment thing at first, this was a good and entertaining trilogy.
Danielle wrote: "The Ravenously wrote: "Angélica wrote: "I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suicide than sacrifice..."The whole thing was a last-minute retcon and came off ridiculously obviously as such. The messages and lessons that we were meant to take away from this book were hard to care about (read: impossible to care about) because the issues were only just introduced in this book and had nothing whatsoever to do with any of the ideas and themes in the rest of the series. It's obvious Roth had no idea where to take the story after the first two books and no idea how to resolve things, so she just tossed it aside and made up a whole new story and pretended that this, boys and girls, was what all that was about all along when it's plainly obvious that she just made it up on the spot. (Of course, it didn't help that her last-minute idea didn't even make any sense in and of itself, but that's another topic.)
Brittany wrote: Maybe that's true in a lot of dystopian novels but in this one I don't think it was realistic at all. I think that the Roth knew she wanted to kill Tris and that she forced it to happen. What I mean by forced is that it seemed like she wanted it to happen so she made it happen without thinking too much about how it went with the book and the character.That's exactly it. The death of the main character is something no one wants and it's not what I would have preferred, but I would have appreciated the story and lauded Roth for doing something so powerful and epic if it MADE SENSE. But I could not take it seriously. The storyline leading up to it made no sense. It was just too obvious that the entire situation existed for no reason other than to be an excuse for Tris to sacrifice herself. How convenient that Tris's "brilliant" idea to stop the Bureau, which happens to be the one and only idea that they bother to think of even though they had a 48-hour warning on which they had to act, involved breaking into a room that just so happened to be booby-trapped with freaking death serum. Give me a break. None of that made any sense, none of it was necessary, none of it was believable as something the characters would actually decide to do and none of it had any point to the plot. It was nothing more than a contrivance to force Tris to offer herself to die.
I get that Roth intended for this series to end with Tris's death. A lot of angry readers think the death was just her attempt at being edgy, or that she didn't know how else to end the story so she decided to just kill the protagonist and be done with it, etc. I don't believe that. I believe that this was part of an overarching (albeit completely contrived) character arc and that this was her plan all along. The problem is that the story, particularly at the end here, is actually written like this was the plan all along. It was too obvious that everything was happening just to make that ending happen. She made it too contrived to be believable. It is in fact possible to write a story for the purpose of leading to a particular ending without making it obvious that everything in the story exists just to force that ending to happen. I really don't think it's that difficult to execute. I've read plenty of books where the author obviously had an ending decided, where you get to the end and you realize that this was clearly where the story was headed the entire time, but it works because the story led to that ending organically. When you write a story AROUND the ending, where everything happens just to force the ending to happen, it's contrived and hard to take seriously. Roth, I think, was either too inexperienced or too rushed to write this book, or both, to pull this off properly.
Lauren wrote: "Danielle wrote: "The Ravenously wrote: "Angélica wrote: "I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suici..."Yeah I can see that because it did come out of nowhere. I remember reading that part in the book and feeling extremely confused.
Lauren wrote: "Brittany wrote: Maybe that's true in a lot of dystopian novels but in this one I don't think it was realistic at all. I think that the Roth knew she wanted to kill Tris and that she forced it to ha..."Wow this is a great explanation.
Lauren wrote: "Brittany wrote: Maybe that's true in a lot of dystopian novels but in this one I don't think it was realistic at all. I think that the Roth knew she wanted to kill Tris and that she forced it to ha..."Very well said. :)
Danielle wrote: "The Ravenously wrote: "Angélica wrote: "I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suicide than sacrifice..."I'm glad you enjoyed the trilogy.:) I did too. In fact, I loved the first two books, but I just could never say the same for the third. :(
I cried for so long, I'm still not over it and I read it like, the day it came out. I wanted to cry and scream when she died but, I didn't because, it was the middle of the night and I didn't want my parents thinking a murder had gone on... oh wait, one did. Then I read Tobias's reaction, I died.
Aletheia wrote: "I hate Allegiant! That ending broke my heart and I literally cried for hours. It's so unpredictable, I did not see Tris' death coming."You shouldn't hate a book just because the ending was unpredictable, sorry if that seems harsh. I just wanted to say that.
Angélica wrote: "I really liked the other two books, but this one was... horrible! The reasons for Tris dying were so stupid. It looked to me more like suicide than sacrifice. Also, I felt this book didn't connect..."
I don't think that the reasons for Tris dying were stupid. If my brother was going to his death I would try to save him, even if I was mad at him, of he had done something like Caleb had done.
If you don't want your brother to die, then simply stop him from doing the thing that will kill him. You don't have to die in his place unless someone HAD to die, you or him, and the part I could not get over is that it was plainly obvious that no one had to die for any of this at all. Caleb: No, Tris, I have to do it.
Tris: No, Caleb, I have to do it.
Me: Why does ANYONE have to do anything, you idiots??!?!!
Couldn't really take the moment seriously when I was still trying to figure out why, exactly, they were doing this in the first place. The logic in the situation's urgency was nonexistent.
Lauren wrote: "If you don't want your brother to die, then simply stop him from doing the thing that will kill him. You don't have to die in his place unless someone HAD to die, you or him, and the part I could n..."If someone had to die, it should have been Caleb. It was the only way to redeem his character for all the crap he did. The whole plot in this book took away from what had been built up in the first two, and this scene was supposed to be really dramatic and tragic and I just wanted to pull my hair out from the stupidity.
I actually agree that Caleb dying the way he would have died, for the reasons he said he was doing it, would not have been real redemption. Sacrificing yourself out of guilt and a subconscious death wish isn't a real sacrifice and it doesn't bring redemption. That's not to say that I'm glad he didn't die, but I honestly would not have cared either way. That's the problem with using Caleb as one of the plot devices (the fake importance of their idiotic reset plan being the other) to lead Tris to "real" sacrifice. No one cares about Caleb. No one cares if he lives or dies. And not because we necessarily want him to die, but because we literally don't care. So it was hard to appreciate Tris's big move for her brother when no one actually gave a damn about him one way or the other. Indeed, it was very disconcerting that Tris's big moment, this big finale, was in fact coming down to a poorly developed minor character no one cared about.But he was just a plot device. Tris needed to recognize that true sacrifice was about necessity and love. We have the completely contrived necessity in the completely preposterous "mission," so Caleb needed to step in and fulfill the "love" part of the equation. And for maximum dramatic effect, we'll have Tris come to this "love" conclusion after a whole bunch of fake drama that was obviously exaggerated just for the sake of this epiphany. See, the whole Caleb/betrayal thing in Insurgent was a neat plot twist, but it really wasn't addressed very much in that book. It really wasn't built up as something that was supposed to have a lasting impact on anyone or anything. It was pretty much dropped by the end of the book. So when we start Allegiant and we're all "Caleb is a big jerk and I hate him" on every other page, I was like, "Oh, we're still on that?" Because there was none of that over-the-top anger in the previous book. I was spoiled on the ending and already knew Tris would die, so it didn't take me long to figure out that we were playing up the Tris Hates Caleb thing because she would end up dying for him somehow, spending the whole book hating him just so she could conveniently love him again at precisely the right moment. Even if I hadn't known Tris would die it was still fairly obvious that the drama between them was all a setup, and then the ending gave itself away the moment Caleb opened his mouth to volunteer for the suicide mission. (Veronica Roth really should learn how to construct a plot without telegraphing every single plot point miles in advance. You give away Situation B when Situation A is so obviously contrived to set it up.) So I really, really couldn't take seriously this big choice of Tris's, her "beautiful" sacrifice on behalf of the brother she loved, when even that part of it was so manipulated and orchestrated. When she made her "epiphany" to take Caleb's place, I just rolled my eyes. There was not a single part of this sacrifice that wasn't forced and contrived.
I was depressed for a week. I was also disappointed and angry with Veronica it's not that I just hated the ending, didn't like the writing or the explanation of the world .
Sarah wrote: "I was depressed for a week. I was also disappointed and angry with Veronica it's not that I just hated the ending, didn't like the writing or the explanation of the world ."I totally agree with you. I am so glad I didn't bother buying or reading the last book. I rather come up with my own ending and leave it at that.
Betsy wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I was depressed for a week. I was also disappointed and angry with Veronica it's not that I just hated the ending, didn't like the writing or the explanation of the world ."I total..."
Read the fan fiction Determinant, by Windchimed, if you want an alternate story! You can find it on fanfiction.net or doing a quick Google for "determinant one choice will change everything." It's a full-length story, and this writer's ideas are ten times better than the lazy nonsense Veronica came up with.
Sarah wrote: "I was depressed for a week. I was also disappointed and angry with Veronica it's not that I just hated the ending, didn't like the writing or the explanation of the world ."I had the same problem. I was relieved over the fact that Four's POV was written fine but as whole I thought it was written more like fanfiction then a real book. Also, I thought that the whole concept of the new world was stupid because it was introduced so late that it gave us no reason to care about the story.
Lauren wrote: "Betsy wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I was depressed for a week. I was also disappointed and angry with Veronica it's not that I just hated the ending, didn't like the writing or the explanation of the wo..."I will look it up it sounds good. I think ill enjoy it more then I did allegiant .
Brittany wrote: "Sarah wrote: "I was depressed for a week. I was also disappointed and angry with Veronica it's not that I just hated the ending, didn't like the writing or the explanation of the world ."I had t..."
Yes, yes, YES. I totally agree. She didnt know the answers to the questions when she started divergent or insurgent so when she had to write an end she didn't know what to do. The story was so dumb and I know for sure she didn't know how to end the series because if she had know from the beginning she wouldn't have wrote divergent she would have started the story with allegiant. I hope that made sense.
Ladies, and gentlemen-my feels.
(courtesy of White Chicks) ;)
Molly wrote: "Ladies, and gentlemen-my feels.(courtesy of White Chicks) ;)"
I love White Chicks. You totally made my day.
I couldn't stop thinking about it for days everytime I would look at my bookshelf and see the book I become depressed but nevertheless I still loved the book
one word .. "empty"
Besides Tris dying which i cried for like 45 minutes when it happened couldn't they have like toxic waste all over the planet or something instead of the government and a civil war like that doesn't fit into the other books at all
When I started the book, I immediately knew Tris was going to die. You can't write from beyond the grave. (Well, you don't really see that unless that's the theme of the story, which didn't seem to be a Roth-ish thing. I know that's become popular as of late, but until very recently, it wasn't done. There may be some exceptions to the rule, but I can't think of any at the moment.) Regardless of some of my questions about the setup to get there, it only made sense for Tris to sacrifice herself. Even as early as Divergent, the theme of sacrificing oneself as a way of showing love comes up multiple times. Also, Tris talks about redeeming herself when she first questions (Divergent/Insurgent) and then believes (Allegiant) that she can be forgiven by a higher power. And as Caleb wasn't truly repentant, the Abnegation in Tris couldn't let him die.
And yes... I cried and was very depressed (in the non-clinical sense) for about 1-2 weeks. I've not had that type of impact before from a book/series. I joke that after reading through Harry Potter, I had "Post Potter-um Depression." (I read them all back-to-back for the first time a few summers ago.) But, because Harry lived, I wasn't as upset.
Overall, I don't think that Roth could have ended the series any other way. As much it broke my heart to see Tris die, especially after re-reading the series, there were hints from the start. For better or for worse, there aren't always happy endings in life. The important thing is how we deal with the aftermath. And. as you all know, she wrote that part, too.
Lauren wrote: "I actually agree that Caleb dying the way he would have died, for the reasons he said he was doing it, would not have been real redemption. Sacrificing yourself out of guilt and a subconscious deat..."i totally agree.
I didn't even care. I didn't like the two POVs as I kept forgetting I was supposed to be reading from Tobias's after reading all 3 books in short succession.Also I noticed the standard of writing wasn't amazing, which I think I overlooked in the first two (especially the first one) as the story was more gripping in Divergent and Insurgent.
But then I also loved The Hunger Games, liked Catching Fire and didn't really care about Mockingjay.
angry...depressed and than angry all over againI wish somebody could erase my memory about this book. :/
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