Julie KS's task - 20.1

[El]

Wait, what book are you saying is not Christian-based in post 163?

[Julie]

Teresa wrote: "The God Cookie A Novel my library lists this as christian fiction, it sounds like a good way for me to branch into this genre, is this okay "

This one sounds really good. I will have to add it to my to-read list.

[Rachel Erin]

I'm planning on reading Quo Vadis which I had picked up a few months ago but hadn't gotten around to finishing. It might work for people who are hesitant about reading something too "preachy"-it's about a group of Christians living in Rome during the reign of Nero. Besides illustrating the difficulties and rewards of being a Christian at that time, it's also a pretty interesting piece of historical fiction with some pretty complex characters, Christian and Roman.

[Julie]

Kate wrote: "Would The Five People You Meet in Heaven by Mitch Albom work for this task?"

I will accept this.

[El]

Julie wrote: "Let me end with this, did anyone question any of the other tasks mainly the Halloween or the homosexual books that we are asked to read?"

Big difference between reading a book about a positive character (homosexual or not) and reading a fiction book about a very specific faith at the exclusion of other faiths. And yes, I commented on the Halloween task in that just because the word "Halloween" is used in the task titles does not mean the books themselves need be Halloween-related.

[Sam]

El wrote: "Wait, what book are you saying is not Christian-based in post 163?"

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, which I never said was Christian-based...I said it was about leading a "faith centered life."

[Petra]

Julie, Abigail's list of books & authors lists Mary Doria Russell's book, The Sparrow. If this book is acceptable for your task, would the sequel, Children of God, also be acceptable? I hadn't thought of The Sparrow for this Task.

[El]

Rachel Erin wrote: "I'm planning on reading Quo Vadis which I had picked up a few months ago but hadn't gotten around to finishing. It might work for people who are hesitant about reading something too ..."

I've heard good things about this one, but haven't read it myself. It's a big book I hear. :)

[Julie]

Greyweather wrote: "Dionisia wrote: "Hello! Christian fiction is not a genre I am very familiar with. I would like to check and make sure that The Sparrow by Mary Doria Russell would fit this task."

I..."

I think his one will work. Good luck with the task.

[Rachel Erin]

It is pretty long, which is why I hadn't gotten very far the first time I read it, even though it was pretty good...Second times the charm!

[Julie]

Rachel wrote: "Kristina wrote: "I'm not Christian, so I'm terribly bad at picking up biblical themes in books...I never even figured out the Narnia connection on my own! (And I read them when I was in college.) E..."

Thank you.

[Julie]

April wrote: "I think I like the idea of expanding my literary world view by reading a Christian fiction book. Also I was wondering if the Book of Job would be considered Christian Fiction? "The Book of Job is s..."

I am going to have to say no to the book of Job, just because it is part of a larger book, not a stand alone novel.

[Julie]

Susanna wrote: "I think that

The Robe, by Lloyd C. Douglass
Ben Hur A Tale of the Christ, by Lew Wallace
The Power and the Glory, by Graham Greene
Christy, ..."

All of these should be fine.

[Julie]

Joy Marie wrote: "Hi everyone...just catching up a little and boy has this task sparked some interesting posts.
Anyway, I have what should be a simple question for Julie KS or whoever else can answer it. Does [b..."

I am not sure about this one. From what I read it does not specify that he leads a Christian life, he simply lives an honorable life. If there is a better description somewhere please direct me to it.

[Cait]

Julie wrote: "Jessica wrote: "The Book of Samson or The Preservationist, both by David Maine should work for this also. (I think) :)"

Both of these would be fine"

Woohoo, thank you! David Maine, here I come!

[Julie]

Sam wrote: "Julie wrote: "they are just showing individuals that if you allow God to take control of your life you can expect change"

That is preachy.

And, yes, someone did question the Harvey Milk challenge."

Could I ask what the question was?

[Lyn (Readinghearts)]

Julie - I hope you had a good day at work. This is probably more work than work was. LOL. Anyway - thanks for getting back to us, I now have several choices that look really good. Thanks for the clarifications. I appreciate it a lot.

[Katie]

Hi Julie, thanks for not running the other way when you saw this thread! I will tell you, I am having a tough time following all the responses to responses to responses, so I'm not clear on some of the books you said no to. Do you know what book this was regarding:

Katie wrote: "Sam wrote: "So...how should an atheist approach this challenge? I'm not, but it seems interesting to me that the directions to read "Christian Fiction" about a "Faith-Centered Life" are not mutuall..."
I am going to have to say no to this one. I can't find any evidence that this is Christian based.

Also, have you ruled on Bunyan, Dante or Tolkein? Thanks.

[Lisa]

I posted a link on message 21 to a Christian book site. It may be helpful to explore all the options on there. There are over 13,000 fiction books, which cover many genres:

Action / Adventure
African American
Allegory
Amish
Biblical
Children
Classic Fiction
Contemporary
Drama
Fantasy / Science Fiction
Historical
Poetry
Prophecy & End Times
Romance
Short Stories
Suspense & Intrigue
Teens
Westerns

It seems with this variety of choices, everyone should be able to find something suitable. I haven't read a lot of Christian fiction, but what I have has been neither preachy or aimed at trying to get the reader to convert. Most of what I've read has either been fictionalized accounts of biblical characters or stories where individuals face moral dilemmas or life changing circumstances. The main difference I see in mainstream literature and Christian fiction is there is less gratuitous sex and violence. Julie has actually given everyone a pretty broad category to choose from, let's not narrow it by being small-minded.

[Lesley]

just wanted to share, i found what sounds like a great book: Vanish
looks like a suspenseful read, i'm looking forward to it.

[Beth F]

Julie wrote: Could I ask what the question was?

This thread: http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/1...

--in message 11 someone mentioned some discomfort because they didn't know where they stood on the issue.

Wendy's (the task writer) response was: "You don't have to be a proponent of an issue to read about it. So try Boy Meets Boy and David Leviathan will make you laugh. It's a fun read and not preachy. The audio is especially fun."

I think there may have been a couple others who said they weren't overly comfortable with it either but it stayed relatively mild.

I think this thread may have exploded a bit hotter though. People can be touchy about defending their personal beliefs. :)

[Katie]

Lisa wrote: "I posted a link on message 21 to a Christian book site. It may be helpful to explore all the options on there. There are over 13,000 fiction books, which cover many genres:

Action / Adventure
Af..."

Well, I certainly don't want to be small-minded. I don't know much about the genre, having only read The Shack. I read the task and checked out the Goodreads lists on Christian fiction, and it didn't seem like a clear-cut genre, so I had some questions. I wasn't trying to limit the genre, just trying to clarify it.

You're probably right that most Christian fiction isn't preachy. Again, I'm no expert. However, the task, which stated that the book had to "Demonstrate The Importance Of Living A Faith Centered Life" and that that faith had to be Christianity, suggested to me (and perhaps others) that the book we chose should tout the importance of living a Christian life. That is kind of the definition of preachy, IMO.

I probably misinterpreted that, but I think my interpretation was valid, at least without clarification. When I read The Lion, The Witch, and the Wardrobe, I never once thought about Christianity or the importance of living a faith-centered life, so I didn't think it would qualify for this task. Clearly, I was wrong about that.

Hopefully, Julie's rulings will help us to clarify her intentions to decide how we want to approach the task.

[Julia]

I think it has been mentioned once or twice already (including in the task itself) but Janette Oke's Love Comes Softly books were good. Not overly preachy but there were mentions of God. Nothing that hit me over the head. To me it just seemed like historical context being set in the frontier, but I could see how other could look deeper and find more parallels in their lives.

My point is they are Christianesque, short but long enough to cover the challenge, and enjoyable. I liked the Hallmark movies and that led me to this. Sometimes I rolled my eyes a bit but they are a genuine enjoyable read.

I for one am going to read The Red Tent and am super excited that it was approved for this task since it has been sitting in my "want" column on my spreadsheet.

[April]

Jamie, I think it's the semantics of the whole entire task. I think if it was just left at read a Christian fiction book, there wouldn't be as much complaint, but then we add in the second part "The Book Has To Demonstrate The Importance Of Living A Faith Centered Life." Some may see that as proselytizing, as perhaps the intent of the task is to make me see that living a Christian-faith-based life is important, when in reality, I don't know that I agree with that. The difference with the Peace Accord task was that, it wasn't really centered around the creator's personal belief. Basically, Wendy wanted people to read two books which had positive Jewish characters and positive Islam characters, not books proclaiming the joy of letting God take over your life.
Also, I don't know I feel about the whole aren't being forced thing, because I think that if you want to pick a task for the winter challenge, then you obviously intend to finish the challenge, so hence you are forced. Let's face it, picking a task is really, really awesome!

[Tammy AZ]

Donna Jo wrote: "*This is a Soapbox message. Do not read if you are of tender sensibilities*
And just to throw a little more fat on the fire, just remember for those of you who are uncomfortable or even offended ..."

I agree with you. Look at the stats from the Summer Challenge - some of the categories were completed by fewer than 40 people and the most popular tasks were completed by less than 2/3rds of the group. It's not my usual genre (actually it's never my genre) but I think I can find something interesting that will work.

[Leslie]

Julie wrote: "Greyweather wrote: "Dionisia wrote: "Hello! Christian fiction is not a genre I am very familiar with. I would like to check and make sure that The Sparrow by Mary Doria Russell woul..."

Oh sweet! I absolutely loved The Sparrow. It's a fascinating and suspenseful book about a team of scientists and Jesuit priests being the first group from Earth to visit another planet - without giving anything away, one of the priest's faith is severely tested due to what they experience on the planet. I'm a little fuzzy on how it ended, but from what I remember it seems like it would be a good fit for this task. I've been meaning to read the sequel, so I'm excited that it sounds like it will work.

[Lyn (Readinghearts)]

April - I agree. Especially since Julie's clarifications seem to lean in the direction of any Christian Fiction. Even though the second part did not bother me, it did confuse me. I wasn't sure exactly what importance that had to the task. I agree that if the task was just Read a Christian Fiction book, or read a book that has a posative Christian main character, I would not have had any questions at all.

Plus - I have had clarification questions regarding many of the tasks. I hope that does not lead people to think that I was complaining about the task. Look at the amount of questions that Nicole got about rhyming words. We all want to do the best on this challenge that we can, otherwise we would not be doing the challenge. Therefore it is not strange to want to have your choices verified.

[Jamie (The Perpetual Page-Turner)]

Lyn wrote: "April - I agree. Especially since Julie's clarifications seem to lean in the direction of any Christian Fiction. Even though the second part did not bother me, it did confuse me. I wasn't sure e..."

I agree. I don't think clarifying a task is a problem or means you are complaining. I mean..I feel like I always check to make sure mine are ok..because I don't want to read it and then not have it count for the task.

[Katerina]

Wow. Quite the debate going on.

I'm not a Christian..and I'm not offended by the task. I've never participated in one of these challenges before but this will be my first and i just kind of thought that the point was to be challenged. It WILL be a challenge for me to pick up a christian fiction..I'll embrace it and then move on to my next book. I don't know..maybe the wording is getting people or something.

Anyways..I think a good think to remember is that..(and not just with this task..but others that I've seen browsing the threads.. (the rhyming one comes to mind)..) the time it takes to bitch about a challenge or challenge it..is valuable reading time that is being taken away from the actual challenge.

and I'm not saying that mean or maliciously..fyi.

[Krista]

Julie wrote: "Krista wrote: "I'd love to get a ruling from Julie about using any of these three books. I think a couple of them have been mentioned in this thread, but I haven't seen a response yet. Thanks!
..."

Okay thanks, I'll pencil in The Sparrow for this task. (Unless I see something else that sparks my interest on this interesting discussion.)

Thanks Julie!

[Lisa]

I agree. I don't see any problem asking for clarification, but some comments were getting rather mean-spirited. I think in fairness to Julie and any member who has created a task, we should be patient in allowing them to respond to our questions rather than continue to beleaguer an issue. I see where the second part of the task could be interpreted to be preachy, but I don't think it was intentional, just a poor choice of wording. I just hated to see this thread degenerating before Julie had a chance to respond.

[Teresa]

Abigail wrote: "Julie, I feel for you. This is quite a tome to get through after a long day in the classroom! And since I needed a break from thinking too much -- and, I admit, a selfish desire to truly understand..."

thanks for doing this : ) so if my answer doesnt work this should make it easy to find something else

[Rita]

Cait wrote: "Melissa wrote: "If you don't want anything that is too preachy, you may be interested in The Red Tent. It's the story of Dinah who is mentioned in the book of Genesis. I loved it. It c..."

I have this book as well, so this is what I will use for this one.

[Joy Marie]

Julie wrote: "Joy Marie wrote: "Hi everyone...just catching up a little and boy has this task sparked some interesting posts.
Anyway, I have what should be a simple question for Julie KS or whoever else can a..."

That's ok, I knew it was a little of a stretch. I'll just read Left Behind which has also been sitting on my shelf. Thanks!

[Nicole]

El wrote: "Joy Marie wrote: "A simple yes or no will be fine. :)"

Joy Marie, aww, where's the fun in that!? :)


Nicole, I think your rhyme task has been officially forgotten at the moment! :)"
I am ALL ABOUT THAT! lol

[Nicole]

Julie wrote: "Let me clarify a little further. This is Christian Fiction and that does not include mythology. I understand that this task will make some people uncomfortable, but you have two choices here, and..."

Yes. People did state they might be uncomfortable. But I don't think any of us need to compromise what matters to us just to make a task everyone will love (that might not even be possible).

Julie- don't feel attacked (although I know I would). I think people are trying to understand the genre. And others may feel uncomfortable. But none of that means your task is not good. I never read Christian fiction (like the kind my MIL reads) so I would like to try it! I have read many books that are religious though- and about many religions. I think it's interesting. You don't have to subscribe to a belief or a lifestyle to read it.

[Nicole]

El wrote: "Julie wrote: "Let me end with this, did anyone question any of the other tasks mainly the Halloween or the homosexual books that we are asked to read?"

Big difference between reading a book about ..."

I am not sure what the difference is (this is asked curiously- no attitude lol)?

We were asked to read books about the Jewish and Muslim faith. I expect as readers we come across a lot of values or belief systems that are not our own. Religious or not.

Can I say I am enjoying this debate and I don't think anyone is on the attack just expressing intellectual views? As a teacher, I think discussion like this is a necessary part of life. Wish I could get my students to think this deeply (but not about religion- we teachers tread lightly on that unless we work in a religious school).

[Julie]

Good Morning everyone. I am posting this morning before I get the kids up. Just in case other questions come up this morning I will answer them as quick as I can. Sometimes I can from school, but not always. There are many different forms of Christian Fiction, someone posted a list of the different types which included sience fiction and western themes. Many of the books are not intented to "preach" to the masses but they are used to convey a message of faithfulness to God. If you like chick lit then check out The Spa Girl series by Kristen Billerbeck, it is funny. Or even The Yada Yada Prayer Group books there are 7 of them and you will love the characters, they are real people.

Some of the books mentioned were manuscripts and these probably won't work, but if you are set on reading one then let me know so I can check it out.

I will approve the Chicken Soup for the Soul books, there are about a million of them now.

Good luck today and Happy reading.

[El]

Nicole wrote: "I am not sure what the difference is (this is asked curiously- no attitude lol)?

We were asked to read books about the Jewish and Muslim faith. I expect as readers we come across a lot of values or belief systems that are not our own. Religious or not."

Nicole, if you look back through the thread I (and perhaps a couple other people) explained the differences between the Peace Accord task and this one. There's no point in continuing the discussion (I'm not being snippy, I promise!) here unless you or anyone else wants to PM me (I'm always open to good debate).

The initial discussion started solely because I for one (and clearly many others) wanted clarification, which, once Julie came on last night, we received. I was not complaining about the task, nor do I think anyone else was either, which is probably why the discussion remained so mild as far as religious discussions go.

There are a wide variety of books apparently that are considered Christian fiction. This was apparent to me the moment Rora posted the link covering the science fiction/fantasy genres and I saw Ray Bradbury's Something Wicked This Way Comes is considered Christian fiction. I would love to know if Julie feels the same - I know several Christians who would be appalled at the idea, but several others who would embrace that. I do feel the task would be different if it were open to reading theological texts, or non-fiction in general about the Christian faith. As it is just limited to fiction, it leads to a lot of questions, particularly when the task was phrased the way it was. And as I stated before, any time religion comes up this way, there will always be a discussion. If ones faith is as strong as one claims, there should be no issue with discussion. No one was attacked here, on either side.

I just wanted to clarify that just because someone shows interest in asking for more information about a task, or shows a spark of debate does not necessarily mean the idea is a bad one, or that a complaint is being made. This is what it means to have different beliefs, and it's great everyone managed to not get derogatory here.

I think it was Lisa who made the comment that we shouldn't be so "small-minded" in our thinking when it comes to this task. I agree, but again until we received clarification there was no way of knowing just how broad our thinking could be, and that was what was the issue to begin with. If I'm being told I can only read Dee Henderson or Janette Oke, then that would be very small-minded. If you look at the Goodreads Christian fiction listopia, you will find many of the same authors, without much variation. Personally I would love to find something that is not in the norm, if for no other reason than to show others that this is a genre with a lot more depth than many may realize.

And, cripes, I'm chatty this morning. Apologies.

[El]

Oh, and the proverbial horse is now officially dead.

[Rachel Lee]

Jessica wrote: "I want to seek out a thoroughly Christian fiction book (which I'm defining as one written and marketed as such) in an effort to be open to the full idea of the challenge. It's not my cup of tea, s..."


Tim Lahaye actually wrote another series that is pretty different from the Left Behind Series. It is kind of an Indiana Jones style series with the adventures having to do with biblical stories. They are good but not near as intense as the Left Behind Series. The first is Babylon Rising The Secret on Ararat. It is, however, definitely more clear cut with Christian themes than the Narnia series or any other allegories.

[Rachel Lee]

Julie,

I didn't see an answer to my original question and it may have gotten lost in this thread. :)

Would the The Vanishing Sculptor A Novel be ok?

Thanks so much,

Rachel

[Julie]

Rachel Lee wrote: "Julie,

I didn't see an answer to my original question and it may have gotten lost in this thread. :)

Would the The Vanishing Sculptor A Novel be ok?

As far as I can tell that would be okay.
Thanks so much,

Rachel"

[Julie]

Tim LaHaye and Jerry B. Jenkins also wrote another series call The Jesus Chronicles. Which takes you through the lives of John Mark and Luke. I don't think he has written one for Matthew yet.

I am currently reading Luke Story and it telling about his young adult life and how he became a follow of Christ.

[Katie]

Leslie wrote: "Julie wrote: "Greyweather wrote: "Dionisia wrote: "Hello! Christian fiction is not a genre I am very familiar with. I would like to check and make sure that The Sparrow by Mary Dori..."

That does sound interesting, Leslie. I might have to check that out.

[Jamie (The Perpetual Page-Turner)]

Lisa wrote: "I agree. I don't see any problem asking for clarification, but some comments were getting rather mean-spirited. I think in fairness to Julie and any member who has created a task, we should be pa..."

Agreed. I hope that the comments remain of the "clarification" area and not debating the task or the "problem" with it or snapping at others who disagree. I think she has given a pretty good range of things for people to use..so all those who are wary of the task can find something that won't make them feel uncomfortable. I just think that maybe the wording is getting people.

[Sara ♥]

WHEW! Dang, there's been some good discussion since I got on yesterday! (Computer problems... *waves an angry fist at Vista*)

I'm really glad that people seem appeased. I was starting to get worried! (Both for the blood vessels in people's foreheads and for Julie...)

I wanted to say that I was initially worried about reading Christian Fiction, too... and I'm a really religious Christian. (I even teach a before-school Bible-study class every morning for the teenagers at my church.) But honestly, it's because the Christian Fiction genre... has a certain reputation about it... you know? Cheesy and preachy. And while I love cheese, even I don't want to read preachy stuff!

BUT, I also wanted to say that I try to live my life in accordance with my own personal beliefs. If someone has a question about my beliefs, I will happily answer them (after all, I'm Mormon, and people never get the facts straight about us—people don't even think we're Christian half the time). But I try very hard not to be preachy. EVER... (Well, except during class, of course... ;) ) And I'm sure there are lots of Christian fiction books that are the same way—they depict someone who happens to have strong Christian beliefs just living their life the best way they know how and try to be a good person... and not necessarily sitting around 24/7 talking about Jesus. ;)

I hope everyone can find a book in this genre that will be good and non-offensive! :) Happy reading!

[Erin]

Sara wrote: "WHEW! Dang, there's been some good discussion since I got on yesterday! (Computer problems... *waves an angry fist at Vista*)

I'm really glad that people seem appeased. I was starting to get wo..."

Sara - I attended those same before school Bible-study classes when I was in high school and always hated those kids in other areas who had release-time!! Anyways, I agree with what you said about Christian fiction and feel the same way about living my life in accordance with my own personal beliefs (that just happen to be the same as yours!), but I figured I'd give it a whirl and chose "The Shack" which everyone seems to be raving about. I truly beleive that there are numerous good books out there that we can all learn from.

I wasn't that excited about the Harvey Milk challenge, but I figured this must be something the person who chose the challenge felt strongly about and I would support her in her choice, whether or not I share the same views. I don't have to read a book if I don't want - finishing this challenge is not going to make or break my life.

Anyways, this has all been said before, but thank you Julie KS for chosing a task that got everyone going!

[Kim]

Erin wrote: "Sara wrote: "WHEW! Dang, there's been some good discussion since I got on yesterday! (Computer problems... *waves an angry fist at Vista*)

I'm really glad that people seem appeased. I was sta..."

I was one of those kids who had release time! :) But now I am going to pay for it because I have 5 kids that will be doing the early morning classes. That's a lot of years of getting up really early! :)

[Sara ♥]

I was wary about the Harvey Milk challenge, too... But people didn't complain TOO much about my task in the Spring Challenge (except Jon.. ;) ), so I'll suck it up and support Wendy! Plus, the whole point of this challenge for me is to branch out and read new things, so... here goes nothing... ;)

Ah, Kim... You release-time people! ;) My class in high school was at 5:50 AM.... This one is at 7:00, which is late enough that I can't complain without feeling like a whiner-baby. I'm just glad I didn't have to teach Old Testament! EEK! (Last year was New Testament and this year is Book of Mormon, so I got the best two years, IMO!)