Hungarian Literature Club discussion
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Harry wrote: "Dear Viktoria,Thanks for the recommendation! I'll put Rejtő Jenő ( P. Howard) on my list.
I'm really grateful for this club. I don't think I'll ever run out of good things to ..."
Oh, absolutely do so! I hope he's translated well, I usually laugh my head off reading his books :) light-hearted adventure/comedy, I would say, and brilliant. (My favourite ones are the 14 carat car and Quarantine in the Grand Hotel.)
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Abigail is probably going to be my next Hungarian book. I'm sure I'll like it.
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Thanks for the recommendation! I'll put Rejtő Jenő ( P. Howard) on my list.
I'm really grateful for this club. I don't think I'll ever run out of g..."
It's going to take me a while to get to Rejto Jeno, for technical reasons, but I'm looking forward to it.
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Again I'm tempted to pontificate about the 'defining quality of Hungarian literature.' Is it a way to deal with loss?
We are experiencing a lot of rain today, as a hurricane passes nearby. I am now re-reading Kafka on the Shore by Haruki Murakami.
I hope you all are well.
Does Hungarian literature have a defining characteristic? Other than the language it’s written in, surely not?Apologies in advance for somewhat disregarding the instruction to avoid politics but I saw this blogpost today and found it relevant to our informal literary appreciation group.
Mór Jókai, Kálmán Mikszáth, Ady Endre & Móricz Zsigmond all get honorable mentions along with some other writers I don’t know. I assume that prime minister Baron Dezső Bánffy de Losonc was related to Count Miklós Bánffy de Losoncz of Trilogy fame.
https://hungarianspectrum.org/2020/06...
I'm persuaded that corruption in all its forms is perhaps the most important theme of Hungarian literature.
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Apologies in advance for somewhat disregarding the instruction to avoid politics but ..."
Dear Stephen,
Thanks for the article. I'll keep it in mind as I read.
Stephen wrote: "Does Hungarian literature have a defining characteristic? Other than the language it’s written in, surely not?Apologies in advance for somewhat disregarding the instruction to avoid politics but ..."
I'm sorry, this article must have skipped my attention. I noticed it just now. I don't have enough time to read it now, but I promise I will. It seems really interesting, but it doesn't cover everything of course. (And I'm sure you know it too. :))
Until then, let me recommend you another book, which has an English translation that seems to do it justice. I wrote a blog post about it yesterday, and shared it here on Goodreads (in Hungarian, sorry). It's Colours and Years by Margit Kaffka, and it's a very fine representation of Hungarian gentry life at the turn of the 19th and 20th century. I've read it once or twice before, but I never realised how much that world looks like ours. Unfortunately.
It's also a psychological novel about an old woman remembering her past, her marriages, her children, the people around her. It was mostly influenced by impressionism and art nouveau.
Of course you’re right Kriszta, corruption is only one of the most important themes in Hungarian literature. Loss I’m sure is another but loss of what exactly?I’m back with Hungary, racing through Mikszáth’s St. Peter’s Umbrella which I’m really enjoying. Plenty of loss and even more corruption here. I feel right at home.
For me Kaffka Margit’s name invokes a sense of empire along with Tóth, Horváth & Szerb etc. Yes Hungary is a linguistic island (rather than an actual island like Great Britain) but it is far from being a cultural island.
In fact it was when I first realised that some places in Europe have multiple names (Bratislava, Pozsony, Pressburg being the first) that I decided to go and live there. It's a very different kind of cosmopolitan to my home town of London but it's cosmopolitan nontheless.
I've forgotten what the article I posted is about, I'll take another look - I hope it wasn't too contentious.
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It's good to hear from you. I'll put Colours and Years on my list.
FYI, in spite of my disinclination to buy books, I put my money down for Celestial Harmonies, on your recommendations. My decision is based on complicated virus-related issues with my library.
I'm sure I will lose myself in it, although I've got a few non-Hungarian books to read first.
Best wishes to all.
Harry wrote: "Dear Kristzina,It's good to hear from you. I'll put Colours and Years on my list.
FYI, in spite of my disinclination to buy books, I put my money down for [book:Celestial Harmonie..."
It's always great to see future fans of Esterházy :)).
Stephen wrote: "Of course you’re right Kriszta, corruption is only one of the most important themes in Hungarian literature. Loss I’m sure is another but loss of what exactly?I’m back with Hungary, racing throug..."
Don't worry about the article, I'm interested in it, whatever it is like. :)
Yes, Kaffka was a representative of the same age as the others, but she died so young she could not be a contemporary of most of these authors as adults. They rather looked up to her as a model or as a master. Miklós Radnóti wrote his doctoral thesis about her.
This book is quite critical of the age (pre-WWI). I like its portrayal of private life as a basis of whatever happens in politics. Everything begins in the kitchen or the bedroom. Also, it is very cleverly written with its unreliable narrator, whose way of talking makes the reader keep a distance from her story and keep thinking who is right and who is wrong. Nobody is just a victim and nobody is fully to blame either.
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Dear Stephen, I'd just read Companion in Exile, so maybe loss was on my mind. But it does seem that Banffy and Szerb seem to be rather nostalgic about a lost time -- maybe Jokai too; Szabo perhaps not so much, based on what little I know so far.
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Stephen wrote: "Of course you’re right Kriszta, corruption is only one of the most important themes in Hungarian literature. Loss I’m sure is another but loss of what exactly?I’m back with Hungary, racing throug..."
I've read the article. Thank you for the insight, really. It's useful to see my country from the outside sometimes.
But it's definitely not about literature. I mean yes, it mentions lots of authors' names and an important trend in Hungarian literature, and it does have a point, but literature is not it. It's politics. Just look at the date of publication.
I'm surprised at the pretty civilised tone of the comments, though. :)
Harry wrote: "PS. I hope my silly search for Hungarian literature's "national characteristics" isn't making you all grind your teeth. In general I have little patience for gross characterizations, and I'm sure t..."Of course not. :)
You already know quite a bit of Hungarian culture, so you're not completely an outsider. :) I can "hear" the voice of someone who is honestly interested in a very different culture. I should say it's an honour. :)
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I'm really enjoying this discussion. It means a lot to me.
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It's been a while since I've posted, partly because I'm chagrined to report that I was unable to enjoy the first pages of Celestial Harmonies and put it aside. I'd been looking forward to reading it for some time. Perhaps it didn't jibe well with the anxious mood of the epidemic. I know that many of you revere the novel, so I'm sorry that I can't share that feeling with you, or at least not yet. I'll try it again later.
Maybe I'll read another Mór Jókai book, when I can get one from the library.
I hope you are all well.
Harry wrote: "Dear Friends,It's been a while since I've posted, partly because I'm chagrined to report that I was unable to enjoy the first pages of Celestial Harmonies and put it aside. I'd been..."
Good luck with anything you choose. :)
The great thing about Celestial Harmonies is that you can begin reading it almost anywhere. At the beginning if you like. If you don't like the beginning, you can start in the middle, with the second part. After finishing it, you can go on to read the first. It will still make sense, I promise you. And the second part is much easier to read.
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Harry wrote: "It occurred to me that non-linear reading was possible. Perhaps I'll try it. :)"It's my cousin's favourite book, and she always recommends this kind of reading. Trust her, she is a teacher, and she knows what makes reading difficult or easy. :)
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Harry wrote: "It's been a while since I've posted. I've been reading a lot of books in my field (Chinese history) and have been struggling with pleasure reading. Now, though, I've started [book:The Man with the ..."I'm so happy. :)
Harry wrote: "It's been a while since I've posted. I've been reading a lot of books in my field (Chinese history) and have been struggling with pleasure reading. Now, though, I've started [book:The Man with the ..."That's a good novel, Harry, I hope you'll enjoy it. Always wanted to see Ada-Kaleh even if that's impossible for some 50 years now.
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I finished the book. What a pleasure it was!
My next Hungarian book will probably be Abigail, though I can't wait for my next Mór Jókai!
Harry wrote: "So Ada-Kaleh is the name of Nobody's Island? I'd like to know more about it.I finished the book. What a pleasure it was!
My next Hungarian book will probably be Abigail, though I..."
I'm so glad you liked it!!! :))) It's such a relief to hear that. :)
Yes, there WAS an island called Ada-Kaleh where Nobody's Island should be, but Jókai never saw it. He never visited that place in person, exactly because he imagined it so vividly. Didn't want to spoil the effect for himself. :)
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I finished the book. What a pleasure it was!
My next Hungarian book will probably be [book:Abigail|43452..."
That's interesting. Arthur Waley (I think), an early translator of Chinese and Japanese, never visited China or Japan for the same reason.
There was once a town on Ada-Kaleh, yes? I wonder if people dive there.
I hope you're well.
Harry wrote: "There was once a town on Ada-Kaleh, yes? I wonder if people dive there.I hope you're well."
I am well, thank you.
There was a town, you can see it here on postcards. I don't know anything else about it, unfortunately.
https://hu.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ada_Kaleh
The English Wiki identifies the island with the one in Jókai's novel, but actually it shouldn't. The connection is not so obvious at all.
I need a copy of Arany Ember, now that I’m back in Budapest perhaps I’ll find one more easily.The island also plays a cameo role in the book that first brought me here.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...
Stephen wrote: "I need a copy of Arany Ember, now that I’m back in Budapest perhaps I’ll find one more easily.The island also plays a cameo role in the book that first brought me here.
https://www.goodreads.com..."
Wow!
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I hope you're well."
I am well, thank you.
There was a town, you can see it here on postcards. I don't know a..."
This kind of thing is fascinating. Whether or not it's the place in the novel, I was wondering if divers had visited and photographed it. (I found nothing after a Google search.) It would make a great documentary.
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The island also plays a cameo role in the book that first brought me here.
https://www.goodreads.com..."
Wow, indeed. Thanks so much for making us aware of this one.
Harry wrote: "This kind of thing is fascinating. Whether or not it's the place in the novel, I was wondering if divers had visited and photographed it. (I found nothing after a Google search.) It would make a great documentary."I can't find anything either, Perhaps if I spoke Romanian. But it doesn't look like anyone is diving there.
I found something equally interesting, though, and pretty uncanny, too. Someone applied photos of Ada Kaleh on photos of the current landscape.
https://dunaiszigetek.blogspot.com/20...
Here's an article in Romanian containing a few photos (Galerie Foto) made just before the island was submerged. It seems that the authorities haven't left much to dive for. According to this article the demolitions were made with the intent to rebuild them on another island for the former Ada-Kalehians but the project was abandoned later, since people moved farther away or even immigrated to Turkey (they were mostly of Turkish origin).https://adevarul.ro/locale/turnu-seve...
Apparently the former inhabitants of the island held a meeting in Bucharest in 2018 and there was a photographic exhibition too but I couldn't find anything more about it.
Here's a video of the island from 2014 when the hydroelectric plant's reservoir was emptied, the island resurfaced again for a short period of time.
https://m.digi24.ro/magazin/timp-libe...
Found another article which talks about the idea of organising mini-submarine trips around the island and that of subaquatic archeological expeditions but it seems that these ideas never materialised and perished at conceptual stage.https://m.adevarul.ro/life-style/trav...
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These pictures are pretty ghostly, and the one with the children and the lamb is very sad.
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After thinking about it, I realized they wouldn't leave all the buildings there. There are a couple of towns in Alabama that moved to other places, buildings and all. As for the video, it was very eerie to see the image of that one foundation, though. The still photo of the island sinking in 1970 is very very sorrowful, like watching a person die.
-- I just saw a sad movie (Paddleton), and now I'm wrecked. Thanks to you and Krisztina, though, for showing me pretty much what I was looking for.
Harry wrote: "fióka wrote: "Here's an article in Romanian containing a few photos (Galerie Foto) made just before the island was submerged. It seems that the authorities haven't left much to dive for. According ..."I have read some more about the effort to move the buildings from Ada Kaleh to Simian Island. One source talks about an academic, a professor, he had the providential idea to save the buildings but when he died in 1968, the whole project was abandoned. So it wasn't the unwillingness of the inhabitants to live on Simion Island that halted the salvage operation, it was, of course, the authorities which didn't care much about it then and aren't really bothered about it now. It is a shame. My mother was lucky enough to have visited the island as a teenager and she always told us how beautiful it was, how alien and how nicely it smelled :)).
Happy to help whenever I can, Harry.
I've looked Paddleton up, it really doesn't have a cheerful topic although a very important one. I have put it on my watchlist, thanks.
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That's great that your mother had that experience!
I think that when a whole village goes underwater, it's like the entirety of life is submerged, all the yards and fences and porches and kitchens and closets, where kids and cats used to play. It's more of a complete loss than a shipwreck, which contains only a narrow part of life.
All right. I'll stop.
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Harry wrote: "Actually, I have a question about the end of the book: Who is the young man who visits Nobody's Island and sees the old man there? When had they met before?"An alter-ego of the writer.
Jókai was born and grew up in Komárom. I don't know if his final note about the story is included in the English translation, but he claimed he had heard the end of the story from an acquaintance, and invented the rest of the story based on that anecdote. It may or may not be true, but it's a good ending.
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the current defeat doesn't seem very Viktorious.
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I've only reached St. Stephen's coronation in 1000, but it seems that the author is trying to prove that 'the Hungarians' are an ethnically diverse people, which I suppose is something that one can say about anybody.
Stephen wrote: "the current defeat doesn't seem very Viktorious."Haha, I would say the other way around: the current defeat seems entirely Viktorious.
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Harry wrote: "OK. I think I finally understand at least the surface of the joke.":))) It has ties to Viktor Orban.
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...though when I read Stephen's comment, my first thought was of Viktoria Freie, from Closely Watched Trains.
Hungarian Literature Club
Books mentioned in this topic
The Hungarian Nabob (other topics)The Corsair King (other topics)
The Corsair King (other topics)
The Slaves of the Padishah (other topics)
Companion in Exile: Notes for an Autobiography (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
Harry Mathews (other topics)Mór Jókai (other topics)
Mór Jókai (other topics)
József Eötvös (other topics)
Walker Percy (other topics)
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And yes, he did it very well, so much recommended. :)
Also, I am listening to The Mirror & the Light, the concluding book to Hilary Mantel's fantastic trilogy about Thomas Cromwell.