Series: Planetfall by Emma Newman

[Anna]

Since our Planetfall series buddy read thread was turned into the spoiler thread when the book was chosen as the group book for March 2019, here is a new series thread.

Planetfall >> First impressions | Final thoughts

Books in publishing order:
Planetfall
After Atlas
Before Mars
Atlas Alone *

* Atlas Alone continues the story from where After Atlas left off, but with a new protagonist. Do NOT click on Atlas Alone if you haven't read After Atlas, since the blurb spoils the ending of the previous book.

There are a couple of ways you could read the series, more about the reading order on the author's site. Also check out her newsletter for free Planetfall short stories.

Discuss anything related to books 2-4 and the series in general, but please use spoiler tags and tell us which book and chapter you're talking about!

[Cheryl]

Ok, I've finished After Atlas, and all I can say is that I managed to because I love Newman's voice and style. Otherwise it's too dark for me.

But if Planetfall explored (view spoiler)[OCD, hoarding (hide spoiler)], what's the comparable (view spoiler)[flaw or mental illness, what's broken about Carl, what's the new territory that Newman is exploring (hide spoiler)] in After Atlas?

I hope someone can assure me that Before Mars is more akin to the first book than the second....

[Anna]

Before Mars is much less dark than After Atlas! At least if by dark you mean (view spoiler)[ the murdery bits. (hide spoiler)] I didn't love After Atlas as much as Planetfall on the first read, but I've reread it twice since then and really appreciated it much more. With Planetfall it was the dedication that made me sob, and with After Atlas it's the very first sentence. I could relate to it very strongly on my first read when I didn't yet know what it really meant, but not as much during rereads.

I think After Atlas explores (view spoiler)[ loneliness, isolation and dealing with traumatic experiences. I also feel like Carlos has an eating disorder, unless it's just a symptom of his PTSD. (hide spoiler)]

edit: Actually, (view spoiler)[ the problem Carlos has with food could also be a form of OCD. I'm not a mental health professional, and can't diagnose a book character, but what I'm saying is that it's definitely disordered eating, even if it's not an eating disorder. (hide spoiler)]

[Cheryl]

All helpful data and perspective, Anna, thank you! I am convinced to at least start Before Mars (and knowing how mersive Newman's writing is, I bet I'll finish it)!

[Cheryl]

Forgot to say, I actually opine that (view spoiler)[Carlos is remarkably sane, has his act together, considering all the trauma he's experienced. I'm sure Newman's definition of sanity is nuanced, as is ours, but honestly he seems to be coping *so* much better than Ren did. So, what I'm saying is, he doesn't seem flawed. (hide spoiler)]

Re' After Atlas, after finishing reading it.

[Anna]

I hate to be the one hinting about things coming in later books, but we do learn a little bit more about (view spoiler)[ Carlos and what he went through in hothousing (hide spoiler)] in Atlas Alone. I don’t know if Newman had all that already clear in her mind, but it was news to me when I read Atlas Alone.

But yes, Carlos is different from Ren and Anna (Before Mars protag) in that (view spoiler)[ the women have more clearly defined, diagnosable mental health conditions. (hide spoiler)]

The spoilers are just for After Atlas, none for later books.

[Anna]

Also, it’s probably true for many (view spoiler)[ mental health issues, but for Carlos it’s all clearly from his childhood trauma, followed by living in a cult, and then taken as a sex slave, trained in hothousing and ending up indentured practically for life. So it’s not that he had an underlying condition like Ren possibly had. I have OCD, but I can’t say I know what caused it. The same sounds to be true for Ren. I doubt Carlos would have such extreme food issues if he hadn’t been abandoned with a malfunctioning food printer when he was very young. (hide spoiler)]

[Glynis]

Thanks for that list Anna - it stopped me reading my audio copy of Atlas Alone thinking it was next in the series after Planetfall. Phewl!

[Anna]

Glynis, that would've been a mistake indeed! Hope you like After Atlas!

The first three books all have a person's head on the cover, and they're safe to read in any order if you absolutely want to, but the one with only an eye on the cover has to be read last, or at least after the other blue cover. So thank you to whoever thought about color and image coding the covers! The two Atlases are named so confusingly, I wish the last one had a different name.

[Kari]

Question for you all who have read this series: I am "meh" on Planetfall. Really love the individual pieces--characters, mystery, themes, world building--but for some reason it doesn't all quite fit together to make it super interesting for me, and I found it difficult to get through at times. I still would like to look at the rest of the series because of those elements I really liked, though. Do you think it is worth it? Do the rest of the books improve on Planetfall?

[Anna]

After Atlas is very different from Planetfall. If you enjoy detective stories, you might like it better?

[Cheryl]

I totally hear you. And yes, (view spoiler)[ After Atlas is very different, very mystery-suspense, needs content warnings. (hide spoiler)] (view spoiler)[ Otoh, Before Mars gets even deeper inside the narrator's head and even more talky, but it doesn't have the magic the first book did. Still, I feel compelled to continue because of the interesting larger world Newman is building up piece by piece. (hide spoiler)]

I used spoiler tags for those readers who are *very* sensitive, but honestly I don't think I'm revealing anything, so if you want to click through feel free.

Newman's books are good enough, imo, that we can read for the journey, whether we know the destination or not. And some ppl are rereading multiple times! So, yeah, what I'm saying is that I don't think they're 'spoiled' by revelations. :)

[Cheryl]

So, yeah I'm done with Before Mars. And I really don't think I'm spoiling anything to say that I got a bit tired of all the introspection that made the book telling instead of showing. But those repetitive thought patterns were very much in character, so ok fine.

And I really liked some of the little details. Like when adjusting to weightlessness, you kind of lose track of your limbs, and when returning to gravity, you become over-aware of them.

[Anna]

Beware that Atlas Alone needs similar content warnings as After Atlas, if you're continuing.

[Kari]

Thanks, Anna and Cheryl! It seems like I might be interested in the rest of the series, so I'm going to give it a go. :)

[Cheryl]

ty Anna... I might stop then...

[Anna]

News from a short Q&A at Dublin Worldcon: There will eventually be two more books in this universe! <3 She'll be writing something completely different first, but we can expect to return to this series at some point in time.

I'm so happy! ^_^

[Allison, Fairy Mod-mother]

Nice!! Any indication if we're going back to some previous characters?

[Anna]

Nothing about that in my news source, but I would be very surprised if that wasn't the case.

[Gabi]

Great news! I still have to read the following three books. I need more time!

[Jemppu]

After Atlas was rather a pleasant relief after Planet Fall. I was able to enjoy it as a spectator much more, when not too close with the subject. Somewhat curious about continuing the series, just to see the issues dealt with, but as Gabi said: would need more time! (And I already use pretty near all 24 hours currently, so that's not gonna happen).

[Ryan, Your favourite moderators favourite moderator]

I think this is my favourite science fiction series, but I've not written a review for any of the books because I still don't know how to talk about them. Not in a pithy manner anyway.

I'm going to reread these in 2021 in the hope of clarifying in my mind why I love them as much as I do.

[Anna]

<3

I also really want to reread these very soon. I haven't read any Emma Newman scifi in 2020, and that is perhaps the worst thing that happened to me personally this year. I mean I did it to myself, but that's beside the point. I'm typing in my sleep again.

[Ryan, Your favourite moderators favourite moderator]

It's funny, cause when I was reading the series for the first time I was also attending an offline SFF book club. In our post meeting get together I was raving about how much I love this series to someone who turned out to be a friend of Emma's.

I've been thinking about that and her a lot since reading her last newsletter.

[Anna]

I think of Emma often and wish her all the best things. It’s weird to feel that way about a person I don’t really know at all, but she’s often in my thoughts ❤️

[Christopher]

I rated the first one 5 stars, bought a few more, but then never got around to reading them... should try to remedy that in 2021...

[Lee]

Really interesting to read everyone's views on this series - I've had Planetfall on my tbr list for ages, but the blurb on Amazon sounded a bit bland/samey - seeing the comments that there is something deeper to be had from the series, I think I'll give this a go now - thanks for the comments!

[Grace]

I have it in my TBR, bought during that Amazon deal thing (thanks to the folks who i think live inside the book sales thread), it’s in the group shelf, if i can read the series that is 1 square in the series bingo - this series is completed right? Win, win, win.

Whew! A lot going on in this group stirring the fate of my 2021 reads!

[Anna]

The series does have more books planned, but I don't think Emma has even started writing them, so it's complete for now.

[Allison, Fairy Mod-mother]

actual lol at "live inside the book sales thread" They're dangerous! Little pixies that steal all my money!

I do actually wanna talk about After Atlas, so spoilers for book 2

(view spoiler)[ re: Carlos being more "sane" than Ren, I think that's interesting, and I'm not sure I agree. I do agree that he disassociates and represses regularly, but looking at his inner thoughts and his conflicts, it's clear to me that he is constantly IN his trauma. Yes, it stems from childhood and he can "blame" someone for it, but much like the abused partner acts like everything is normal while the abuser is home, he never gets distance--he's never safe enough to realize how hurt he is. Which makes going to the Circle such an interesting time because for the first time he can choose freedom and kindness and feelings, and we see how fast he falls apart there. Even the decision to leave Earth is not a safe one for him, it is not what he wants! But it's better than dying. And I think that's carried over into them being on the ship, too. Sick for days, accepting that having to hate eating is the "best case" scenario for his freedom which is pretty effed up, and his first thought on coping with the destruction of earth? "we can't tell anyone." Right back to his disassociation and isolation.

I think this was a really extremely well done portrait of trauma. And if we were to follow him, I would imagine that as he relaxes, being stuck on another ship he can't leave with food that makes him feel ill will show him slowly unraveling, unless he can keep up the stress around himself (like being the only detective on board) to keep all those emotions at bay, which is just a classic limiter on the expression of healthy masculinity.

(hide spoiler)]

[Anna]

re: above spoiler

(view spoiler)[ I think what I meant by Carlos being "more sane" is that his problems have a clear external cause we can point to, unlike Ren's. I absolutely didn't mean to diminish his trauma in any way, it's very real. Not the best wording from past me.

No spoilers but we do get to see more of Carlos later in the series. (hide spoiler)]

[Ryan, Your favourite moderators favourite moderator]

Maybe it's that (view spoiler)[ Carlos' mental illness of disassociation and isolation is close to what is advocated by the majority to navigate reality. (hide spoiler)]

[Allison, Fairy Mod-mother]

That's exactly what I mean by the bit about masculinity, Ryan!

[Bonnie]

After Atlas
I finished. No complaints (I mean, no serious ones) i am glad I read it although I'm not as gunho as some of you. Solid midlist.

Carlos' childhood:
I imagine the images of (view spoiler)[little Carlos clutching his bear and the food printer spitting out black goo will stick with me. No wonder he was traumatized, JeeMuh. (hide spoiler)]

The indentured servitude akin to slavery was quite bothersome; how did Europe and NorAm reach such a pass as to allow it?!

Criticisms:
#1 I could not buy Carlos, written in first person, as a male. Time after time I felt uncomfortable and thought "That doesn't seem like something a man would think" or feel or notice. (OK am I being sexist?) Why not just make baby Carlos a Carlotta?

This has happened to me before, one time was The Cassini Division I think? I could not suspend my disbelief that the main character was actually female... like author Ken MacLeod* just thought "I'll have her admire her tight green bodysuit, and think about what she's going to wear to the party" and that was enough.
Somewhere around Chapter 23,24,25 (view spoiler)[Carlos thought something about facing his manhood and I thought that's it! That's what everyone is hiding behind all the spoiler tags in this thread... he got a sex change when was young on that cruise ship, he's trans and their society does not allow! but no. (hide spoiler)]

#2 I did not think this at the end was earned:
(view spoiler)[Carlos, Dee and Travis are on the new ship (was it called Rapture? was the name of the ship or the name of the project) looking back at Earth, and lights start flashing and they think it's missiles. For the same reasons that IRL we have not had more atomic/nuclear bombs since WWII: Cold War and Mutually Assured Destruction and diplomacy and all that, I did not think the nations would have started bombing each other in retaliation.
(hide spoiler)]

Overall I enjoyed it: the detective, mystery with clues, virtual assistants, Moor Hotel, icky parts of their society, and the story's change of direction.
Next up, Mars?


*This is not to say that you should not read Ken MacLeod.
-- Learning the World: A Scientific Romance - definitely
-- The Execution Channel - wouldn't hurt

[Anna]

Bonnie, are you talking about book 2, After Atlas? (I know you are, but people who haven't read it yet might not pick up and won't know if they can open the spoilers.)

[Bonnie]

Geez you're right, sorry! I will edit.

[Anna]

No problem, I was just baffled for a second because I thought you'd finished the series but only had comments about Carlos :D

[Bonnie]

Thank you for pointing out so quickly!

[Anna]

Everyone should just give me their GR passwords so that I could edit all posts :P

[Bonnie]

Hee hee!
Then you could really organize things.

Bonnie wrote: The indentured servitude akin to slavery was quite bothersome; how did Europe and NorAm reach such a pass as to allow it?!

The story takes place in Europe and NorAm, AND I am being Western-centric here I see.

[Ryan, Your favourite moderators favourite moderator]

The impact of losing a thousand of the world's greatest minds...

[Bonnie]

Ryan wrote: "The impact of losing a thousand of the world's greatest minds..."

It took me two hours before I understood Ryan's comment. The first shuttle, the Planetfall one!

Whew

[Bonnie]

Thousand minds or no, I still should probably give the rest of the planet more credit.

[Ryan, Your favourite moderators favourite moderator]

After Atlas complete

I didn't think that it was world leaders that decided to give us that ending...

We're talking about a planet that lost its greatest minds/influencers. The next bestand most powerful have basically (view spoiler)[ given up on everyone else and are seeking to follow in the first groups footsteps whilst not wanting others to follow them. Others with abandonment issues...

Mutually assured destruction can only work when the mutual destruction is assured!
(hide spoiler)]

[Anna]

re: https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

I said I don't like Dee, and the short reason why is (view spoiler)[ because I really connected with Carlos, and Dee selling him out didn't sit well with me, and my gut reaction to dislike her never went away. (hide spoiler)] (After Atlas spoilers)

My first read of Atlas Alone (view spoiler)[ was difficult because I went in disliking her and her actions didn't exactly endear her to me. I tried to connect with her more upon rereads, but my gut reaction is still NOPE. (hide spoiler)]

I'm due a reread anyway, so I'll have to pay more attention to this next time I do.

[Ryan, Your favourite moderators favourite moderator]

I forgot that first spoiler. :/

[Anna]

OK well that explains it a little bit :D I was wondering!

[Ryan, Your favourite moderators favourite moderator]

I found this note written back in 2020 that I don't seem to have shared with you all.

For those who have read Planetfall and After Atlas, (view spoiler)[How do you feel about Newman taking a thousand of the 'greatest' minds on Earth to an alien planet and its impact on the remaining population? The Great Man idea has been pretty much debunked and ridiculed at this point but a thousand people... I don't know. Taking a handful of people that were heavily involved in scientific breakthroughs seems like it would be quite the setback to progress. Although I'm not sure (hide spoiler)]

I was amazed that this idea was almost lost on me by how brilliantly Newman writes about the psychological issues of her main characters. My first reading of Planetfall was so frustrating as it steadfastly refused to tell the story of civilisation development on a new planet that I was hoping for. Giving us this much more focused personal story instead. For so long it wasn't sci-fi enough, which should sound ludicrous considering that it all takes place on a planet that isn't Earth, but that's because it was incredibly human. It wasn't until I read other books in the series that it dawned on me just how much of the more typical sci-fi fare that I crave was seeded throughout Planetfall. That's where Newman's genius lies. Its all well and good having wondrous settings for exploration but for her to create these worlds where we're confronted with humanity without being clichéd... Its astounding.

I look forward to rereading these again and seeing if I'm not just romanticising.

[Meredith]

I just read After Atlas and (after kicking myself for waiting so long to read the book) remembered there was a thread for the series.

I really enjoyed the story since I love a sci fi mystery. (view spoiler)[ At times, I thought the police procedural aspect was a bit ploddy, but the details of the world Newman created and Carlos as a character helped keep it engaging. I was most gutted when Carlos' contract was bought by Stefan Gabor and he was realizing that the few rights he had as an indentured person were gone. I caught on quicker than Carlos that the 'big secret' was another rocket to space, but I was completely rocked by the very end of the book. (hide spoiler)]

I will not be waiting so long before I pick up Before Mars.

[Anna]

After Atlas and Before Mars (and Atlas Alone) are more (immediately) connected to each other than to Planetfall, so it makes sense to read them closer together!