This is a novel about a family named Givens, who came to America from Northern Ireland after their father was cheated out of his land. They find themselves in Cincinnati in 1819 with almost nothing to their name. Very quickly, the mother dies in childbirth and the father leaves on a riverboat to seek his fortune, and is never seen again.
The three children—James, Olivia, and Erasmus—teenagers, are left to fend for themselves. Olivia chronicles their poverty, their rise to prosperity, marriages and deaths, births and adoptions in the decades before the Civil War. From cholera epidemics to runaway slaves to grave robbers to Victorian autopsies —this novel has everything. Through it all, Gamble rightfully and without flinching portrays the terrible facts of slavery, as the Givens family go from their initial indifference to slavery, to many courageous acts helping slaves escape to freedom.
MC: Terry, your family came from Northern Ireland; were they an inspiration to you for writing this novel?
TG: In fact, they were the genesis of this novel. After my father died, I came across a letter from a great-great-uncle commissioning a monumental obelisk headstone in 1890 to be erected at the Spring Grove Cemetery in Cincinnati. Included with the letter were a bunch of receipts... for bodies, as it turned out. All the original family that had emigrated from Ireland, along with the next generation, were to be exhumed and reinterred at the fancy family plot. I began to wonder who they were, what they thought of this new country, how they viewed slavery (they had never even seen a black person in Northern Ireland), how they managed to fit in and make their way. I became obsessed with these buried bodies -- not only WHERE they were buried, but under what circumstances, and what that said about their lives.
MC: I loved the narrator, Olivia Givens. She is so snarky and smart. Tell us a little bit more about her, and how she developed.
TG: Olivia was originally one of several narrative voices. She was snarky from the beginning... and not a little eccentric, especially in the context of the time in which standards demanded that women conform to "The Cult of True Womanhood"; in other words, women should spend their time stitching, bearing children, affecting piety, and refraining from opinion. Olivia's thoughts and actions served as an avatar for myself had I found myself in her situation. When I switched (thanks to my editor) to telling the story exclusively from Olivia's POV, she sort of moved in with me for about a decade. Not to sounds "woo-woo", but she often nudged, cajoled, and corrected me. Although her "radicalism" seems mild by today's standards, I see Olivia as the kind of woman who paved the way for the suffragists, abolitionists, and feminists.
MC: We both did a lot of research for our novels in Cincinnati. Can you tell us a little bit about that process for? What surprised you in your research, if anything?
TG: When I embarked upon this project, I had very little notion of what would compel me about early 19th C. America, but it soon became apparent that slavery was the existential issue of the time, along with public health, religion, and the role of women. I had no idea how fascinating and nuanced these issues were and how they laid the groundwork for the issues that persist today. If we want to understand today's world, look to the lectures, essays, letters, and sermons of the past. Take, for example, the theological dispute about whether one is born elect or reprobate vs. whether one can have a hand in ones redemption through good acts. This idea still reverberates in how, say, "prosperity Christianity" contrasts with the Christianity of someone like Rev. William Barber who advocates for civil and human rights.
MC: This novel has so many interesting themes — in addition to slavery, you touch on religion, public health, and immigration, as well as community prejudice around new immigrants. What do you find is common to issues we are grappling with today?
TG: See above as a partial answer to this question. In the time I was writing this book, the "religious right" was becoming more powerful in our political discourse; superstition around vaccination was on the rise; the #MeToo movement hadn't even happened, nor had Black Lives Matter; and immigrants of all stripes -- particularly brown people and Muslims -- are viewed by some as the scourge of the country. How quickly people who have made traction in this country can begrudge the same opportunity to others.
The three children—James, Olivia, and Erasmus—teenagers, are left to fend for themselves. Olivia chronicles their poverty, their rise to prosperity, marriages and deaths, births and adoptions in the decades before the Civil War. From cholera epidemics to runaway slaves to grave robbers to Victorian autopsies —this novel has everything. Through it all, Gamble rightfully and without flinching portrays the terrible facts of slavery, as the Givens family go from their initial indifference to slavery, to many courageous acts helping slaves escape to freedom.
MC: Terry, your family came from Northern Ireland; were they an inspiration to you for writing this novel?
TG: In fact, they were the genesis of this novel. After my father died, I came across a letter from a great-great-uncle commissioning a monumental obelisk headstone in 1890 to be erected at the Spring Grove Cemetery in Cincinnati. Included with the letter were a bunch of receipts... for bodies, as it turned out. All the original family that had emigrated from Ireland, along with the next generation, were to be exhumed and reinterred at the fancy family plot. I began to wonder who they were, what they thought of this new country, how they viewed slavery (they had never even seen a black person in Northern Ireland), how they managed to fit in and make their way. I became obsessed with these buried bodies -- not only WHERE they were buried, but under what circumstances, and what that said about their lives.
MC: I loved the narrator, Olivia Givens. She is so snarky and smart. Tell us a little bit more about her, and how she developed.
TG: Olivia was originally one of several narrative voices. She was snarky from the beginning... and not a little eccentric, especially in the context of the time in which standards demanded that women conform to "The Cult of True Womanhood"; in other words, women should spend their time stitching, bearing children, affecting piety, and refraining from opinion. Olivia's thoughts and actions served as an avatar for myself had I found myself in her situation. When I switched (thanks to my editor) to telling the story exclusively from Olivia's POV, she sort of moved in with me for about a decade. Not to sounds "woo-woo", but she often nudged, cajoled, and corrected me. Although her "radicalism" seems mild by today's standards, I see Olivia as the kind of woman who paved the way for the suffragists, abolitionists, and feminists.
MC: We both did a lot of research for our novels in Cincinnati. Can you tell us a little bit about that process for? What surprised you in your research, if anything?
TG: When I embarked upon this project, I had very little notion of what would compel me about early 19th C. America, but it soon became apparent that slavery was the existential issue of the time, along with public health, religion, and the role of women. I had no idea how fascinating and nuanced these issues were and how they laid the groundwork for the issues that persist today. If we want to understand today's world, look to the lectures, essays, letters, and sermons of the past. Take, for example, the theological dispute about whether one is born elect or reprobate vs. whether one can have a hand in ones redemption through good acts. This idea still reverberates in how, say, "prosperity Christianity" contrasts with the Christianity of someone like Rev. William Barber who advocates for civil and human rights.
MC: This novel has so many interesting themes — in addition to slavery, you touch on religion, public health, and immigration, as well as community prejudice around new immigrants. What do you find is common to issues we are grappling with today?
TG: See above as a partial answer to this question. In the time I was writing this book, the "religious right" was becoming more powerful in our political discourse; superstition around vaccination was on the rise; the #MeToo movement hadn't even happened, nor had Black Lives Matter; and immigrants of all stripes -- particularly brown people and Muslims -- are viewed by some as the scourge of the country. How quickly people who have made traction in this country can begrudge the same opportunity to others.
Terry Gamble