Ursula Le Guin year-long reading challenge

[Lesley]

I just picked up a vintage boxed set of the Earthsea Trilogy at my local used bookstore, and I’m planning to join for Atuan and Farthest Shore when you get to those. I read Wizard earlier this year and loved it.

[Kaa]

Sorry, Rachel, I missed your comment! I've been reading Wizard for the last few days, and I'd love to discuss as you read it. We can use the dedicated discussion thread linked up top.

Lesley, I'm probably going to finish Wizard tomorrow and get started on Tombs, so jump in whenever you're ready.

[Ariana]

I know I'm a little late, but I'm rereading the first few Hainish novels.
I read Worlds of Exile and Illusion: Rocannon's World, Planet of Exile, City of Illusions years ago, so I know I read Rocannon's World, but I remembered exactly nothing about it. And nothing really rang any bells as I read it. It was pleasant, but it also felt a little forgettable as I was reading it. I started Planet of Exile, and I remember much more about that one, at least a lot more of the images, if not the characters.

I'll jump in to Earthsea when you all are finishing Tehanu; I've been meaning to read Tales from Earthsea and The Other Wind for a while now.

[Kaa]

Ariana wrote: "I know I'm a little late, but I'm rereading the first few Hainish novels.
I read Worlds of Exile and Illusion: Rocannon's World, Planet of Exile, City of Illusions years ago, so I kno..."

I agree that Rocannon was pretty forgettable - it's not a bad story, but Le Guin leaned pretty hard on existing mythology and so it doesn't have the originality and personality that make her later books so influential. Her growth as a writer through that first trilogy is pretty amazing to see.

[Beth]

I am skipping the Earthsea reread, but I read Buffalo Gals and Other Animal Presences. Really liked the title story, as well as Direction of the Road and The Author of the Acacia Seeds.

[Jemppu]

Beth wrote: "I am skipping the Earthsea reread, but I read Buffalo Gals and Other Animal Presences..."

Aah, so good! All those three you mention. "Direction of the Road" was truly moving - had such beautiful, quiet solemnity to it. And I just last night read "The Author of the Acacia Seeds" too, and it was a riot, in a very true Ursula-ish manner.

"Eat the eggs! Up with the Queen!"

[Kaa]

Moving last month put me really far behind on this... but I'm picking up Tombs of Atuan and the rest of the Earthsea books today! Hopefully I'll be able to get through that series by the end of the month, and then work on getting caught up on the rest of August's books.

[Maggie]

I got REALLY ill this summer and got way behind, and plan to at least read City of Illusions and hopefully Lavinia if I get that caught up!

[DivaDiane]

Oh! Lavinia is one of those unread ones on my shelf. It’s like I’m hoarding her books for a particularly bad day when I need a new book by UKL!

[Kaa]

I'm still behind on Earthsea, so knowing others are interested in Lavinia, I may skip over the Orsinia books for now, so that I can be sort of back on track by October.

[Kaa]

Ok, I think it's time to finally own up to the obvious and admit that I'm a bit burnt out on this challenge. I'm still hoping to read all of the books on my list eventually, but the pressure of being so far behind was making me not want to read Le Guin at all.

Now that I have that off my back, I'd love to schedule some BRs for a few of the books that other people wanted to read - in particular, Lavinia and Tales from Earthsea/The Other Wind.

[DivaDiane]

Oh, good for you Kaa! That was an incredibly ambitious challenge and I’m amazed you made it as far as you did. By all means cut yourself some slack and take a break. Let me know when you might like to read Lavinia. It’s one of the few that I haven’t yet read, so obviously, I want to. I hope I can fit it in.

[Beth]

I have started this (I think I misread the date of the buddy read?) but maybe I will return it to the library for now and get it later. Looking forward to it.

[Kaa]

Yes, sorry, we moved Lavinia back to April 4.

[Mareike]

I started Lavinia tonight and I really like how we're introduced to her (in my version this is page 3 - there don't seem to be chapter numbers):

(view spoiler)[

I know who I was, I can tell you who I may have been, but I am, now, only in this line of words I write. I’m not sure of the nature of my existence, and wonder to find myself writing. I speak Latin, of course, but did I ever learn to write it? That seems unlikely. No doubt someone with my name, Lavinia, did exist, but she may have been so different from my own idea of myself, or my poet’s idea of me, that it only confuses me to think about her. As far as I know, it was my poet who gave me any reality at all. Before he wrote, I was the mistiest of figures, scarcely more than a name in a genealogy. It was he who brought me to life, to myself, and so made me able to remember my life and myself, which I do, vividly, with all kinds of emotions, emotions I feel strongly as I write, perhaps because the events I remember only come to exist as I write them, or as he wrote them.

But he did not write them. He slighted my life, in his poem. He scanted me, because he came to know who I was only when he was dying. He’s not to blame. It was too late for him to make amends, rethink, complete the half-lines, perfect the poem he thought imperfect. He grieved for that, I know; he grieved for me. Perhaps where he is now, down there across the dark rivers, somebody will tell him that Lavinia grieves for him.

That's a really interesting way of thinking about the (possible) historical person "Lavinia", the character Virgil wrote, and the character we get in this re-telling. And of course the differences between these versions. I like to imagine that Le Guin had a lot of fun with this and is kind of winking at us through the page because we of course all know that she is another "poet" here who is writing Lavinia, but the text's conceit is that Lavina is writing about herself. (I just really have a thing for the meta-ness of it all.)

And that Lavina is grieving for "her poet" is strangely moving. As is this bit in the next paragraph: But I won’t have to tear myself from life and go down into the dark, as he did, poor man, first in his imagination, and then as his own ghost. We each have to endure our own afterlife, he said to me once, or that is one way to understand what he said. (hide spoiler)]

[Kaa]

I started Lavinia last night as well, and I have to admit that I may not be able to take it slowly - Overdrive informs me that I am already a quarter of the way through the book. It is very different than the other Le Guin books I have read, but still gorgeously written and atmospheric.

Mereike, I was also struck by that introduction. (view spoiler)[I agree about how enjoyable the meta-ness of it is. How like Le Guin to pair her interpretation of this myth with a story about the creation and life of myths themselves. (hide spoiler)]

[Mareike]

Kaa wrote: "I started Lavinia last night as well, and I have to admit that I may not be able to take it slowly - Overdrive informs me that I am already a quarter of the way through the book. It is very differe..."

I will probably not be able to take it slow with this one either. I already love it too much.

Yes! That bit about the introduction felt very much like LeGuin. And you can tell that she did her research into the different cultures and how they evolved over time.

I'm at 25% according to my e-reader and (view spoiler)[the interaction between Lavinia and Virgil are very moving and once again a very interesting reflection on myth and storytelling and that who is telling a story determines what is told. That was especially striking in the moment when Lavinia gets angry at him about how he describes the underworld and especially the "limbo" (for lack of a better, non-anachronistic term) the babies are lingering in. I also liked their differing perspective on Juno.
And the nod to Dante in the same section (I think) was very nicely done. (hide spoiler)]

Going back in the book a little to 15% by my e-reader's count (view spoiler)[ I really liked the contrast between Camilla, who Virgil admits to making up, and Lavinia here.

Camilla basically seems to be what we today would call a "strong female character", i.e. a woman who behaves like a man, but is still sexy. Virgil saying that Lavinia is "worth ten Camillas" is both a reflection of what would have been expected of a "good" woman at the time, i.e. her paying attention to a man, but also, I think, a nod by Le Guin at the fact that women ignored in great Western literature/Western history because their lives were supposedly boring (because they did not go to war or did other, stereotypically male things (read: things coded as valuable and interesting) are actually more interesting than made-up "strong female characters". The great tragedy of Virgil's artistic project is that he realizes it too late. (hide spoiler)]

[Kaa]

Yes, the one thing that may slow me down is just how many layers Le Guin has constructed in this book! (view spoiler)[There is so much here about the interaction of cultures and mythologies, and about the way women are remembered (or not) and the things they are remembered for vs valued for... (hide spoiler)] It's been a very long time since I read much Greek or Roman mythology/history, so I think I'm missing some of the details, but she does a good job of providing the most necessary context.

[Mareike]

Yes, agreed. The layers are fantastic.

[Beth]

Great comments so far. I will check in later.

edit: I just remembered, I wanted to comment on the characterization of Juno and of the gods in general. What LeGuin says about the gods with human emotions (jealousy ect) being an invention of the poets, I wonder if there is any historical evidence for that or is she using, well, poetic license here?

[Kaa]

Yes, Mareike, I wanted to thank you for your thoughtfulness - you prompted me to think about a lot of aspects of the book that I would not have considered otherwise.

Beth, I think I missed that part - I was interpreting it as a difference between the Greeks and the pre-Roman Italians.

[Mareike]

Kaa wrote: "Yes, Mareike, I wanted to thank you for your thoughtfulness - you prompted me to think about a lot of aspects of the book that I would not have considered otherwise.

Beth, I think I missed that pa..."

Aw, thank you for saying that! I'm really loving this book and I appreciate you giving us this space to talk about it.

As for Beth's point, I think it was both. It may be Le Guin commenting on religion/Gods being a human invention. But I think it might also be a reflection of maybe the Etruscan/pre-Roman conception of Gods and then the Greek/Roman one? But my Latin classes are a long time ago, so I'm not quite sure about the historical developments there.

[Anna]

Kaa, do you remember which collection has the essays about gender pronouns?

[Kaa]

I think it's either The Language of the Night: Essays on Fantasy and Science Fiction or Dancing at the Edge of the World: Thoughts on Words, Women, Places. Maybe both? At least one of the essays is called "Is Gender Necessary?"

[Anna]

Thanks! Dancing is on my TBR, I'll move it up.

[Beth]

My checkout for Lavinia will expire soon, so I thought I would post the quotes I had bookmarked in the ebook in case people want to comment.

(view spoiler)[

I am not the feminine voice you may have expected. Resentment is not what drives me to write my story. Anger, in part, perhaps. But not an easy anger. I long for justice, but I do not know what justice is. It is hard to be betrayed. It is harder to know you made betrayal inevitable.
*
Why must there be war?
Oh, Lavinia, what a woman's question that is. Because men are men.
*
I was fated, it seems, to live among people who suffered beyond measure from grief, who were driven mad by it. Though I suffered grief, I was doomed to sanity. This was no doing of the poet's. I know that he gave me nothing but modest blushes, and no character at all. I know that he said I raved and tore my golden tresses at my mother's death. He simply was not paying attention: I was silent then, tearless, and only intent on making her poor soiled body decent. And my hair has always been dark. In truth he gave me nothing but a name, and I have filled it with myself. Yet without him would I even have a name? I have never blamed him. Even a poet cannot get everything right.
*
But I will not die. I cannot. I will never go down among the shadows under Albunea to see Aeneas tall among the warriors, gleaming in bronze. I will not speak to Creusa of Troy, as I once thought I might, or Dido of Carthage, proud and silent, still bearing the great sword wound in her breast. They lived and died as women do and as the poet sang them. But he did not sing me enough life to die. He only gave me immortality.
(hide spoiler)]

[Kaa]

Such good quotes, Beth. I was really struck by the way Le Guin seems to be processing her own experience of growing old in the last few pages. There are some very poignant observations that feel very personal.

[Mareike]

Oh, I hadn't thought about how Le Guin's own aging might have played into this! Thanks for pointing that out, Kaa!

I highlighted several of those quotes, too, and I liked the second to last in your list especially. It's an interesting way of thinking about patriarchy and how women are depicted in art made by men. It made me thing of Virhinia Woolf's "A Room of One's Own".
And I wonder how Le Guin's essays mentioned above might read when put in conversation with this book.

And that last quote is just too sad.

[Beth]

my review is up:
https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

[DivaDiane]

I just started Lavinia!

[Mareike]

Oh wow! That's quite the strong reaction to Paradise Lost. I'm not at Book 9 yet, but I'm already side-eyeing how Milton is writing Eve.

[Mareike]

I hear you.
Though I must say, the podcast I'm listening to does a good job of teasing out both the queer parts of this poem and the smaller subversive aspects of Eve's characterization.
(The Apostle Paul can still take several seats, though.)

BUT I also love responses to "canonical" texts like that which is why I enjoyed Lavinia so much. And I'd love to read your version of Eve.

[Silvana]

I plan to start my slow read of The Unreal and the Real: Selected Stories, Volume One: Where on Earth tomorrow

[Joelle.P.S]

Silvana wrote: "I plan to start my slow read of The Unreal and the Real: Selected Stories, Volume One: Where on Earth tomorrow"

I've just read the 1st 4 stories so far (the Orsinian tales), & found them all about 3-stars. I often adore Le Guin's ideas without enjoying the style....

[DivaDiane]

I listened to these stories and found the first few a little interchangeable. There were several that were very memorable. I don’t know their titles though! The one from the perspective of a tree is amazing.

[Silvana]

Joelle wrote: "Silvana wrote: "I plan to start my slow read of The Unreal and the Real: Selected Stories, Volume One: Where on Earth tomorrow"

I've just read the 1st 4 stories so far (the Orsinia..."

I really don't get the first three stories. Nothing clicked, barely recognized any plot, even.

Also, I just found it this is a non SFF collection. Uh oh 😅

[Anthony]

@Silvana there are stories that definitely qualify as fantastical in this. I agree that the first three are a bit obtuse. Have faith, Le Guin comes through more than once here.

[DivaDiane]

I agree, and when I looked at my review from a few years ago, I had only commented on the first 3 or so that I’d listened to at a certain point and I was a little puzzled too. But it gets a lot better and more fantastical. They just take place on Earth as opposed to a made up planet somewhere.

I don’t know the titles of the ones I loved the one from the POV of an oak tree. Brilliant. Also several others have remained quite vivid.

[Jemppu]

Diane wrote: "....I don’t know the titles of the ones I loved the one from the POV of an oak tree. Brilliant...."

Yes! One of my favorites, too. "The Direction of the Road"? So tranquil and enduring.

[Mareike]

@Diane: I really enjoyed that one, too.

Apart from that, I most vividly remember "The Diary of a Rose," "May's Lion," and "Buffalo Gals, Won't You Come Out Tonight".

[DivaDiane]

@Jemina, until the accident!!

Yes, @Mareike, I can’t be sure of the titles because I listened to it and that a few years ago and didn’t pay attention to the titles (which I had to eye read on the app). Pretty sure Buffalo Gals was one of the ones I really loved.

[Jemppu]

Diane wrote: "@Jemina, until the accident!!

Spoilers! <:D

[Anthony]

Yes yes yes, Mareike, those three are phenomenal, all of them.

[Mareike]

Anthony wrote: "Yes yes yes, Mareike, those three are phenomenal, all of them."

I still remember exactly where I was when reading "Diary of a Rose" because it shook me so much.

Thinking about these really makes me hanker for some Le Guin. If only my schedule hadn't turned so crazy this month. Maybe I'll start The Unreal and the Real: Selected Stories, Volume Two: Outer Space, Inner Lands in June, though.

[Silvana]

Diane wrote: "I agree, and when I looked at my review from a few years ago, I had only commented on the first 3 or so that I’d listened to at a certain point and I was a little puzzled too. But it gets a lot bet..."

Anthony wrote: "@Silvana there are stories that definitely qualify as fantastical in this. I agree that the first three are a bit obtuse. Have faith, Le Guin comes through more than once here."

Thank you both for the much needed boost! 😊

[Silvana]

Mareike wrote: "@Diane: I really enjoyed that one, too.

Apart from that, I most vividly remember "The Diary of a Rose," "May's Lion," and "Buffalo Gals, Won't You Come Out Tonight"."

These three I did like! But May's Lion somehow is the most touching one.

Eight stories to go!

[Mareike]

Yay! I'm glad they worked for you.

[CBRetriever]

in conjunction with your reading, here's a virtual exhibit at the Portland Art Museum about the Mount St Helen's volcanic explosion with drawings by Le Guin and a drawing of her by another artist plus some of her words on the subject

https://portlandartmuseum.org/volcano...

[Silvana]

I have one story left, and kind of sad that I admit most stories just did not resonate with me. Often times I found them slow, hard to understand, or, just when I got into groove in one story then it ended.

Well, my next Le Guin book is The Word for World is Forest so I have high hopes for it.

[Jemppu]

Wow, yes. I dare suspect Word for World is Forest will make up for any lost resonance in multiples. A powerful one.