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SEVEN group read, week four (Ch.s 19-24)
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A past that won’t let go…
After losing his job, Chase Sarim finds himself living in a shit hole apartment. His new neighbor calls himself Seven, wears aluminum hats and carries around a ceramic rooster. He also seems to know what Chase is going to do or say before it happens, and talks about people named, Nine, Three, and Four.
Chase knows better than to get involved with someone like that.
But some men are just to hot to resist.
A future of fear…
Seven has been running for his life ever since he escaped Sub-Floor. In order to elude those hunting him he can never have a home, never have friends…and love? It’s nothing but a weakness that can be used against him.
Hiding had become a way of life. Until Chase.
Greed, power, and corruption…
Dr. David Stone knows Seven has a secret. Why else would his colleague, Dr. Radcliff, help Seven escape Sub-Floor?
It wasn’t the loss of a defective precog that bothered Stone, it was the fact Radcliff was willing to die to keep Stone from knowing why he did it. Or better yet, how.
Two men, one love, brought together by a series of impossible circumstances and destined by fate for an entangled future.
But maybe fate has nothing to do with it.
Mod
This was my first Wilder book and "Wow".
Just bought my copy ^.^
Vivian wrote: "This was my first Wilder book and "Wow"."Mine as well. I really enjoyed it. I'm interested in seeing everyone's thoughts.
Ah, I'm new to this, so -- is there someway you have to sign-up to be official part of this discussion or is it just go ahead and post?
Mod
Just post!
Welcome everyone.
Getting my copy now - shhhhh, don't tell my boss. I love that we're doing so many chapters each week. I've tried to do a group read in a real life club and everyone read at their own pace. It made it extremely hard to discuss the book.
I have some very general comments for right now.First, so folks here know the Amazon link on the books Goodreads' page does NOT work. Amazon says it doesn't exist.
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...
Next off, I do like the cover, BUT... I get annoyed when someone decides to play around with the book's title on the book's cover.
The Library of Congress standard is that the *official* title of a book is what is on the title page, not the cover.
The problem is, this book's title page/in verso and structure is odd. First off, they do not come first in the book, they come after the Table of Contents. That has the title as "7" -- then the book's publishing information (which usually comes *after* the title page, but here comes *before*) also has the title as "7".
BUT then comes the title page and the book is named "Seven".
Now this might seem minor to some, but after working in public libraries for over 25 years, this does bug me.
So, does anyone have the *official* word if we are reading a novel titled "7" or "Seven"?
Inquiring minds want to know! :)
. . .
The Amazon link does work, you just have to pick out the kindle edition. There are several editions listed in the general info next to the cover, the kindle edt. is the next in line, ASIN B00FCAZOHC
I read this book forever ago... Can't wait til you newbies get caught up!! Lol
Oh, crap! I misread the above (darn dyslexia!) and thought we had to read chapters 1-6 *by* today, Sat., Aug. 16th!But actually it is next week!
DARN IT! I read all 6 chapters yesterday and was all set to go today, really looking forward to people's comments.
:(
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But actually it is next week!
DARN IT! I read all 6 chapters yesterday and w..."
No, you read it right - or at least how I meant it! Discussion starts today and people should expect spoilers through Chapter 6, so have at it.
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The good - this is going to be fun. I am enjoying the humor, and the bad guy has the creepiness and seemingly unbeatable power base of a Bond villain. The Others are fascinating, and all different from each other in abilities and character. Seven is just riveting. I adore him already.
The not as good - there are some noticeable editing errors. Naming all of the Others after numbers makes sense, but I have a feeling I am going to have trouble keeping track of them all. I may list the characters as I go. Chase seems a bit bland and feckless so far - apparently he has been on the run from his father for fifteen years, and from what we have learned so far this is an overreaction. Chase's best friend Martin seems to think so anyway.
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Characters: The first main character, Chase Sarim, is a journalist who has just been fired from his job at a place called Inside Sources for reasons we don't understand yet. He moves into a ratty apartment to save money, and meets his next door neighbor Seven. Seven is apparently a delusional OCD whacko, though we who have read the blurb know that isn't what is going on. The way he arranges his apartment is hilarious, as is his actual aluminum foil hat. It isn't clear what his superpower is at first. Telepathy maybe?
Chase's friend Martin helps him move in. Martin urges Chase to get in touch with his father, who Chase has been hiding from for fifteen years. Apparently there was some kind of accident and someone killed himself, and Chase blames his father (and himself for this). I can't quite get a bead on Martin. Is he right that Chase is holding a grudge and overreacting? Should we be suspicious that Martin has talked to Chase's father? Probably not, but something feels off about their interactions.
We also meet Nine, by phone. Nine Knows Things, so I guess he is a clairvoyant. He is sort of a big brother figure to Seven - tries to take care of him, tells him what to do (with little success). They discuss their nemesis Dr Stone (ominous music) and his pet clairvoyant Thirteen. We learn about Dr. Radcliffe, who sacrifices himself to allow some of the Others to escape from Stone. Thirteen is trying to find Seven for Stone.
Finally, we meet Dr. Stone and his assistant Sarah. Stone is every bit the creepy sadistic control freak we thought he would be. There is a discussion of getting Thirteen to work harder to pinpoint Seven, at some danger to himself. They have already placed Seven in Atlanta - they are closing in.
I read this book some times ago. . . loved it. . . rated it five stars. I love the Others. . . Seven and Thirteen and Nine and Three and Four and Twenty-three.
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This chapter was kind of a let down from Chapter 1. There were a few moments of humor and we got to know some of the characters better, but not much happened other than a lot of bickering. Chase and Martin argue because Martin has talked to Chase's father and thinks Chase should call him. Seven invites Chase to breakfast but Chase takes off before eating. Chase's father calls him and Chase hangs up on him.
Best moments: Seven showing up with a porcelain chicken and a shower cap on his head - and then later with Spock ears.
Open question: did Chase's dad get him fired those other times? Has he really always known were Chase was? Has Martin been talking to him more than Chase realizes?
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In which the plot thickens at Dr. Stone's evil lair. Also in which Chase acts like an ass and is lucky he is wrong about Seven.
Eighteen, aka Mort, is the entity who guards the lair. Apparently he can make people perceive whatever he wants. There is also a statement that his mind is so powerful "even the earth itself responded to his presence." Not sure what that means. Mort is the reason the Others can't escape from the lair and no one can infiltrate. Nine, Seven, Twenty Three, and Five escaped while Mort was unconscious, induced by the now-dead Dr. Radcliffe (the good half of the mad science team).
According to Dr. Stone, he knows where all of them are except Seven, and he is about to pull out all the stops to find Seven, including torturing poor Thirteen, the clairvoyant stuck in adolescence.
Back at the ranch, Chase shows us what he is like drunk, and it isn't pretty. He thinks that Seven is severely mentally ill and that he is bullying Seven into a sexual encounter. Seven is not crazy, and he wants it too, but that is just luck. I'm really not liking Chase at all so far. I hope he steps up. He at least does go over to apologize and is in the right place at the right time to render some much needed aid.
There is a pretty exciting clash between Seven, Nine, and Thirteen. Nine calls up Stone to threaten him - pretty pointless, but entertaining.
In general I like the story a good deal so far though I have to admit I did read up to Chapter 9 because I didn't want to stop. (So I am checking things as I write them to be sure they don't appear in any plus-Chapter 6.A few comments:
I do wish "Seven" had been named another number than Seven. I kept think of 7 of 9 from ST: Voyager. (Well, okay, the two Seven's don't look that much alike.) (Four would have been a bad number as well because of that book, but the Four who appears in this book is very, very different.)
I'm finding no problem at all keeping the character's separate, especially the numbered ones. He makes each of them very, very different from the others. There is quite a bit of creativity being shown with them.
I did like it when the reason why Seven was acting like a crazy person is explained. Again, within the novel, it was not only reasonable but clever.
Jumping ahead to Chapter 5, I like how the over-the-top "love at first sight" relationship between Chase and Seven is explained with the idea of "Centers".
Well, I should say, that does seem the explanation to me, though it is never specially stated (yet) in the novel, but it seemed fairly obvious to me.
Nine is clearly the wild card in this story.
There is a bit too much sex for me in the story, but that is a general problem I have with M/M novels. The novel's premise has become somewhat of a cliché one in SF now, bit I have to say that the author's approach to it is quite good as well as the fact she has created interesting, sometimes very interesting characters.
Even the villain, Dr. Stone, is an evil asshole in his own special way!
. . .
Okay, so about chapter 3, I got the crazy idea in my head - what if Dr Stone is Chase's father??? I mean, sure, Chase has a different surname (which I found out after when I was reading everyone's thoughts - um, on Goodreads), but he could have changed his name as part of disowning his father. Not even carrying his family name. Plus, we know Chase's father is the head of a financial company. Stone uses psychics to manipulate the stock market in his favour. It's plausible that Stone could be the head of a financial company he trades with, with a super secret department.
But if this was true, what kind of conflict would that cause? Chase would hate his father for new and inventive ways. Seven could doubt Chase, tearing them apart, but he'd probably know about the estrangement sometime in 10 chapters.
So maybe it's just me.
I'm not sure that Chase is overreacting over what his father did. Well, if his father really did arrange to have his first lover killed. (Especially if his father IS Stone and could arrange it, accident and all.)
Yeah, I'm not having trouble keeping the numbers apart either. For now. I mean, if there's 89 Others... well, how would I keep 89 characters named anything straight in my head???
And listening to this week's Writing Excuses episode on using scifi as science education, I'm wondering how factual all of this really is. I mean, besides that actually doing this would give people psychic powers. Then again, the science stuff is just zooming over my head (yes, I've clutched onto evil medical torture making psychic test tube babies, but beyond that, and knowing sort of what serotonin is, I'm lost). But are air syringes real? I thought it was a syringe full of air at first. O.O
Most of the science in SEVEN is fictional -- or just far extensions of what is current science.An air syringe? Technically what an air syringe is, is the tube in a regular syringe that holds the liquid. As to what is meant in the book, I think the idea is STAR TREK with Dr. McCoy giving someone an injection and you hear a hissing sound. It basically is suppose to be a syringe with no needle, that uses pressurize to force the fluid into you. I believe attempts have been to create one, but without success.
I have a good understanding of science in general so most of this in not a problem for me. If you don't understand it, well, here is a suggestion: When STAR TREK:TNG's scripts were written, when the writers got to a part where some special super-science was needed to be used or explained something, they would write [TECH]. (Seriously.)
Then someone would fill it in with some created term later on. So if you run across something you don't understand in the science, just think that.
HOWEVER, science fiction *can* be used for science education. This is what is called hard science fiction where actually science fact is stressed, but then extended some into fiction. Using science fiction in education would include explaining the difference between the real science and the fictional science.
ALSO, there is this: if you don't know if something is real or not, look it up! You can do it right then or do it later. But for me, reading science fiction (or historical fiction or so on) is not only something I enjoy, but also a way I learn more. And your knowledge accumulates: the more science fiction you read, the better you understanding the science fiction you read.
We now return you to the novel SEVEN....
Mod
Oooh, intriguing idea! It is fun reading the book a few chapters at a time and discussing it, because I don't know. I am going to come down on the side of "no", just because I don't see Dr. Stone needing to do things like get a friend to look up phone records. But you are right that the conflict would be delicious.
By the rules of story telling, there will likely turn out to be some relationship between the various antagonists. Another idea: perhaps Chase's father will repent of his evil controlling ways and be on their side. That would bring in a bunch of different delicious conflict.
Mod
Chapter 4: in which Nine is devious (since I am pretty sure he wants Chase involved at this point - you don't try to pay off an investigative reporter unless you want them to do more investigating). We meet Terry who has a gruesome video (probably from Dr. Radcliff?) and has published stories related to the whole mess. I suspect we had better not get too attached to Terry, because Dr. Stone will swat him like a fly.
Also in which Seven starts to tell Chase what is going on and how his powers work.Some paths are set and some can be affected by entanglements. (Or maybe not!)
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Nine has A Plan.
I am having a bit of trouble believing that Dr. Stone never used Four to Control Three before. Seems like an obvious move for a sadistic control freak.
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Seven is going to go with Chase tonight to talk to Terry, and then he plans to disappear.
**sex scene**
Okay, so Chase's father apparently isn't actually Stone, at least by the way Nine acts. If Chase's father was Stone, Nine wouldn't be counting on him to spread the story. And Nine knows everything. But Nine also lies. Even if he is technically the dead, and the dead don't lie.
But it would be thrilling.
Thanks Franklin for the suggestions! I actually did try to google the air syringes, but got a bunch of syringes. Because as you said, that's what an air syringe is. I'm still kind of like, "Ah! Don't put air in syringes!" But handy to know :)
I'm a little impressed with Chase's madness. Wilder did not really hold back to make her character still sexy. Basically, the drool. But still really good. I had a whole "awww, you poor kitten" moment when Nine was putting the whammy on Chase. I have a soft spot for angst and guilt.
What did you guys think about this week's (last week?) reading?
Mod
This was a really good, exciting chapter. Chase and Seven do meet with Terry, and his story gets Seven suspicious. Too many coincidences. So he calls Nine, who lays out his whole plan. Supposedly, Nine is off the grid and therefore can't lie, but something feels fishy about his story. Evasive answers and odd word choices - he says things like this is meant to happen, and that must happen and it's all part of the plan.
Stone has found about about Terry's story and is moving to hush it up. Already every server associated with Third Gunman has been taken off line. A trail of dead bodies is next.
Mod
Whoa - Nine can talk to dead people? Actual dead people? That's ... surprising. I thought he was just on the astral plane because of being in a coma. He also has a much nastier power which he uses on Chase to get him to do his bidding. Ouch. Onus - psychic madness.
The following scene is quite cinematic. I'd like to see it filmed. Chase lurching to the subway, Three (astrally) and the hounds closing in, Seven using his true power for the first time that we see. Very awesome.
Then we meet Twenty Three in his warded lair.
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Kind of a quiet chapter with plans and discussions of Centers and what it means that Chase was taken into the fold and no one can see his future anymore.
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I wonder if they know each other? They seem like they would run in the same circles.
But Nine also lies.
He is certainly very deceptive. I think maybe he manages to not quite flat out lie by how he states things. In a "it depend on what the meaning of 'is' is" sense. Like he tells Chase that if he goes to the subway, the Onus will stop - but he doesn't say how it will be stopped!
I'm a little impressed with Chase's madness.
Yeah, that was intense.
Mod
Ha! Dr. Stone forgot that Nietzsche quote: "And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Thirteen is learning things Stone didn't teach him and it is changing his perspective.
We also learn more about Centers and why Twenty Three is such a sad puppy.
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Seven takes note of yet another very improbable coincidence and this leads to more speculation on what is really going on with Nine. My current theory: he has several plans and fallback plans in various permutations and combinations. If Chase had died there was one path (or more than one). If Chase had followed up on the story right away, there was another. Yeah Nine knows a lot and can arrange a lot, but if he was as all-powerful as he likes to pretend, he could have taken down Dr. Stone long before this. I think Nine utilizes the Xanatos Gambit:
See http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php... -
"The key to strategy... is not to choose a path to victory, but to choose so that all paths lead to a victory."
— Cavilo, The Vor Game
And the chase for the McGuffin (aka the thumb drive) is on.
I started late, then had a Doritos week and got caught up in the story and finished.**hangs head in shame**
I will post comments in the appropriate locations tomorrow.
PS, I LOVED it.
Mod
**hangs head in shame**
I will post comments in the appropriate locations tomorrow.
PS, I LOVED it."
I've managed not to read ahead, but this is the first time in my life ever, so I feel you. No spoilers! :-)
Charming wrote: "Chapter 12 - Seven takes note of yet another very improbable coincidence and this leads to more speculation on what is really going on with Nine. My current theory: he has several plans and fall..."
Ooh, that's better than what I was thinking.
Although, having the power to lie when no one thinks you can lie is a pretty awesome power to have. While everyone thinks Nine can't lie, they act based on his lies in certain ways... Certain ways that are exactly what Nine wants. The ultimate manipulator.
Jerry wrote: "I started late, then had a Doritos week and got caught up in the story and finished.**hangs head in shame**
I will post comments in the appropriate locations tomorrow.
PS, I LOVED it."
Wow, predictive text is amazing sometimes. It should have read "horrible" week. I don't think I've had Doritos for ever....I'm a Cheetos man.
I had a family emergency and haven't been on GR's at all. I've only been able to read up to chapter four, so I'm not going to read the above comments until I catch up. It's been a craptastic two weeks, but all is calm now and I can't wait to keep reading. I've really enjoyed what I read so far.
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Martin gets Chase an Interview at The Tribune (with some psychic help), but he doesn't want to hear any human experimentation stories. I don't like Martin much.
More explanation of set futures and entanglement.
Terry provides a locker combination from beyond the grave.
Thirteen has learned about the Power of Love from being in Seven's mind. :-)
Mod
We learn a few more details of Nine's plan. Three must convince Stone to let Four go outside. He will need to open the cell doors when Nine signals. He definitely can't let Stone figure out his restraining collar is broken.
Chase and Seven stay in a really gross motel. Ew.
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Poor Thirteen. He tries to be a decent human being and Stone curb stomps him. :-( And Poor Four, having to experience it with him.
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Oh, Nine! What a devious bastard you are. You got both Chase and Seven captured.
And how about Stone, cloning his own brother to make Thirteen. Creepy.
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Chase's father gets him out of jail. He seems a bit chastened and willing to listen to Chase. A bit. He even apologizes. Chase grudgingly goes along with Nine's advice to get Mr. Serim interested in the Other story. Maybe Chase is finally growing up a little. Although he does storm out at the end.
Mod
Ok, the plan is coming together now (although we only get to know bits of it). The video is about to be released. Four is outside. Three has his orders - he will open the doors to the cells downstairs. Nine has "someone to be his hands." Hmm - who? Sarah?
Chase is getting his orders when the chapter ends.
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Chapter 19 - the news on the Others has hit the papers, and Dr. Stone knows the jig is up, at least at his present location. Nine calls Dr. Stone, paints picture of his horrible demise, and then tells Stone that his future is set. We who are on to Nine's tricky ways notice that he doesn't actually say that Dr. Stone's death is the set future, but Dr. Stone doesn't notice this.
Here is one of my quibbles. Why didn't Dr. Stone have Nine found and killed? He is obviously infuriated by Nine, and Nine messes with his plans. Dr. Stone observes that there isn't anyone who can create a set future as well as Nine. I feel like he would have stopped it. I also found Dr. Stone to be a bit too obtuse during this section.
Second quibble: how can Nine direct Chase so precisely when he has been taken into the fold. Nine says that he can see the people Chase affects, but that doesn't make sense. Thirteen could have tracked down Seven if that worked.
But it is great fun to watch Nine's plan unfold. At the end of the chapter, Four is in place and has the right power to get Chase onto the grounds.
Mod
Poor Chase has to kill Eighteen. :-( Not pleasant, but I do believe Nine when he says that Eighteen was his friend and this is a mercy for him. What a hellish existence.
Almost time for Three to open the doors.
Mod
Three is pretty damn brutal in this section. So is Nine - the "monsters" on the lower level have to die for their own good. Quite a few Others we haven't met do escape though. And we get to see Seven use his time stopping power again. Very cool.
Schedule:
Week one, beginning Saturday, August 16: Chapters 1-6
Week two, Beginning Saturday, August 23: Chapters 7-12
Week three, Beginning Saturday, August 30: Chapters 13-18
Week four, Beginning Saturday, September 6: Chapters 19-24 - end
Spoilers:
Since this is the final week, no spoilers need to be marked.
Note that this book is available as an Amazon Prime borrow, and under Amazon Unlimited, and the author does get paid for those programs.
Here's the book: