Reading with Style discussion
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Beth wrote: "My goal this challenge had been to read four big long books and one other. I finished my first big long book and while none of the other three are halfway through yet, I completed the biggest of th..."Well done! I, too, felt a sense of accomplishment when I finished War and Peace. It may be that Tolstoy was against any "great man" theory, but I think he didn't except himself.
Beth wrote: "My goal this challenge had been to read four big long books and one other. I finished my first big long book and while none of the other three are halfway through yet, I completed the biggest of th..."I noticed (in the completed task thread) that you had read War + Peace! I am impressed. At some point, in my life(!), I want to read that book. I'm glad to hear it is manageable.
I have conquered and enjoyed War and Peace as well. I have some big ones I'm afraid of though; Ulysses is the one that first comes to mind.
I read both W&P & Ulysses. I had been intimidated by both beforehand...but was pleasantly surprised with W&P. Ulysses on the other hand I don't think deserves any of the praise it gets...Just because it makes a lot of literary and mythological references does not equal worthiness to me. I read it along with another book that even explained the references page by page...and it still didn't make it interesting. I just found it to be pretentious BS. I forced myself to finish it...just so I could say the things I just said.
Ed wrote: "I'm almost finished with Daniel Deronda (and not loving it)...but it made me think that other than the broad outlines, I know little about how the State of Israel came to be. I wonder if..."The Source by James A. Michener is one of those books that go to prehistory and gradually gets back to modern times. The book opens with an archeological group finding a place that is a treasure trove of past layers.
From Beirut to Jerusalem by Thomas L. Friedman is a pretty good travel journal of this politically hot area as the travelers meet different groups that seem to be opposites but in reality have so much in common.
Arab and Jew: Wounded Spirits in a Promised Land by David K. Shipler is a Pulitzer Prize winning work on the area
The Case for Israel by Alan M. Dershowitz &
The Case Against Israel by Michael Neumann give the two opposing sides.
But really going back to the BCE days is essential to get the whole perspective because it didn’t just start in 1948. The British Colonialism and Resulting Mandate that was so unfair to the indigenous people, which is tied to the Horrific Holocaust that Europe tried to make some amends which is tired to the overwhelming, starvation oppression of the Germans to punish them for WWI, which is tied again to Colonialism, despotism and politics in Europe, and so on and so going back to the Inquistions, the import of Jews and some Arabs during the Renaissance , the Holy Roman Empire, going back to Crusades, dissolution of the Roman Empire and so on and so on back to Abraham. It becomes quite clear why peace in the Middle East is so complex and entangled with history, past wounds, invasions and religion.
itpdx wrote: "Your question certainly made me think. My view of the founding of Israel has been based on Exodus by Leon Uris (historical fiction) which I read many decades ago and I h..."That’s a good book too. A good view from the people from both sides who are trying to make it work or at least recognize some empathy with each other is I Shall Not Hate: A Gaza Doctor's Journey on the Road to Peace and Human Dignity by Izzeldin Abuelaish
I would like to get a book from the POV of the Palestinian Christians. You don’t hear much about them but they are definitely there and are the direct descendants of the “original Christians” but as indigenous people are receiving the same treatment as Palestinian Muslims. There are also the Druse and the Samaritans and the only book I’ve read about all those groups is Tea with Hezbollah: Sitting at the Enemies' Table Our Journey Through the Middle East by Ted Dekker which is more naive than the Friedman book
Rebekah wrote: "Ed wrote: "I'm almost finished with Daniel Deronda (and not loving it)...but it made me think that other than the broad outlines, I know little about how the State of Israel came to be. ..."Thanks Rebekah.
BTW.... just a little anecdote about my visit to Palestine 2 or 3 years ago. I was there briefly...but the one place that we visited that did not seem shabby was a souvenir shop/ jewelry store that was owned and operated by Christians. They seemed to be doing very well while almost all the other people I saw in Palestine seemed to be having a rough time. I know that my observation doesn't mean much in the big scheme of things...but that is the impression I came away with.
Just announced:The Carnegie Medal for fiction goes to the Great Believers
And nonfiction goes to Heavy: an American Memoir
Karen Michele wrote: "Just announced:The Carnegie Medal for fiction goes to the Great Believers
And nonfiction goes to Heavy: an American Memoir"
So our Amazon 100 books didn’t make it!
Ed wrote: "Rebekah wrote: "Ed wrote: "I'm almost finished with Daniel Deronda (and not loving it)...but it made me think that other than the broad outlines, I know little about how the State of Isr..."Were you able to visit both sides of the wall?
Rebekah wrote: "Ed wrote: "Rebekah wrote: "Ed wrote: "I'm almost finished with Daniel Deronda (and not loving it)...but it made me think that other than the broad outlines, I know little about how the S..."Yes. I'll never forget it. When I got back into Israel....there was a major fight that broke out amongst the taxi drivers. I suspect someone stole a fare out of turn.
Beth wrote: "I actually read War and Peace. It was much less painful than I expected and I enjoyed most of it. Everything was very readable and in small chapters. It just keeps going and going.... and then ends in dry philosophy on free will and history. Tolstoy was extremely against the "Great Man" theory.Yay! It's done!"
Yay! Congrats, Beth! What a feat :)
I've got 250 pages to go ;p but yes mostly enjoyable... especially since I seem to be imbibing in a lot of vodka whilst reading lol
I've run out of vodka and am now trying to bake some Russian sweets (?) . I made sharlotka (Russian apple cake) a few days ago which was pretty good. I want to try, at least, 1 other thing. Anyone got any suggestion or good recipe for me?
Rebekah wrote: "Karen Michele wrote: "Just announced:The Carnegie Medal for fiction goes to the Great Believers
And nonfiction goes to Heavy: an American Memoir"
So our Amazon 100 books didn’t make it!"
They didn't, but I loved The Great Believers! Those top three fiction books were all so good I don't know how they decided. All of the nonfiction books look great as well. I don't read as much nonfiction, but I'm determined to at least read the winner.
Here's the link Heavy: An American Memoir.
Here's a link to all of the awards announced last night (coming soon):https://rusaupdate.org/category/award...
Karen Michele wrote: "Here's a link to all of the awards announced last night (coming soon):https://rusaupdate.org/category/award..."
Thanks for this link! It isn't up on the ALA website yet (or wasn't yesterday when I looked, so couldn't update GR.
EDIT: that website doesn't have 2019, but the ALA site has been updated. I'll get them added later.
Thanks! Now I’m waiting for the Caldecott, Printz, Etc :)
Ed, further response to your question about a history of the State of Israel. Today, looking at things, I came across The Yellow Wind. In the description is: The Yellow Wind is essential reading for anyone who seeks a deeper understanding of Israel today.And, as a heads up, this is one of the titles I was perusing for spring. Not sure it will make *my* list, but ... (It also works this season.)
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Ed, further response to your question about a history of the State of Israel. Today, looking at things, I came across The Yellow Wind. In the description is: The Yellow Wind is essenti..."Thanks Elizabeth...that also looks like an interesting read.
Does anyone else find forwards or intros by other authors annoying? Do you skip them? I’ve learned to at least save them after the rest of the book as they are often full of spoilers.I also dislike it when the into is the longest chapter in the book, commenting on very sentence structure, phrasing and even punctuation.!
Karen Michele wrote: "Thanks! Now I’m waiting for the Caldecott, Printz, Etc :)"When is that?
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Ed, further response to your question about a history of the State of Israel. Today, looking at things, I came across The Yellow Wind. In the description is: The Yellow Wind is essenti..."Looks good.
Rebekah wrote: "Does anyone else find forwards or intros by other authors annoying? Do you skip them? I’ve learned to at least save them after the rest of the book as they are often full of spoilers.I also disli..."
I always start reading them. The beginnings are often comments on the author, or places the work in context with the times and/or other published works. But there is often a spot when I feel the intro is becoming spoilerish and I just skip to the beginning of the novel. Sometimes I go back and finish reading it and other times not.
Rebekah wrote: "Karen Michele wrote: "Thanks! Now I’m waiting for the Caldecott, Printz, Etc :)"When is that?"
The awards were announced Monday morning. I was in the room waiting to hear:)
http://www.ala.org/news/mediapresscen...
Rebekah wrote: "Does anyone else find forwards or intros by other authors annoying? Do you skip them? I’ve learned to at least save them after the rest of the book as they are often full of spoilers.I also disli..."
You made me chuckle, Rebekah! I agree. I don't mind them if it is an another author writing a very brief intro as a fan, not a critic. Although, in my mind, it is the intros written by academics (or wanna bes) that often are the worst. (And don't any academics in the group take offense - I love academics, many of my friends fall into that category). But honestly, if I want to read a treatise on the novel I'll pursue it later.
Rebekah wrote: "Does anyone else find forwards or intros by other authors annoying? Do you skip them? I’ve learned to at least save them after the rest of the book as they are often full of spoilers.I also disli..."
I usually save them for after I finish the book (or during, if I'm wondering to myself what I'm supposed to be getting from the text). I appreciate the insights of readers more knowledgeable or critical than I am, but I can't actually appreciate their insights until after I read the actual book. :)
And example of my thinking an author introduction is worthwhile is my review of The Widow by Georges Simenon. Note that I say I stopped reading it when he started talking about the novel.https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
I think intros are all over the map. I have read some especially by translators that have been invaluable. Sometimes some background on an author is good. But the spoilers are maddening. Why not save them for an afterward?
itpdx wrote: "But the spoilers are maddening. Why not save them for an afterward? "Yes, indeed. It's as if they are talking to an audience who has already read the book and ready to discuss it.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "itpdx wrote: "But the spoilers are maddening. Why not save them for an afterward? "Yes, indeed. It's as if they are talking to an audience who has already read the book and ready to discuss it."
I've had intros completely ruin a book for me - not because of spoilers, since I don't really care that much about them and have been known to read the end of the book before finishing - but because I notice things I might not have noticed otherwise. I guess that's good in a way, since it meant I was paying closer attention to the book, but it's still frustrating. I remember specifically when reading Graham Greene's The Quiet American that the intro pointed out (probably unintentionally) things I found very sexist in the writing. Ruined the book entirely.
I think of an intro as an introduction to the study of the book rather than the reading of a book so if I want to study the bok I will read it if not I will read the book first then decide if I want to read the intro.
itpdx wrote: "I think intros are all over the map. I have read some especially by translators that have been invaluable."This! I only read intros by translators - they are usually good about not spoiling anything while passing along interesting/important info. All the others get saved until I'm done with the book (and then only if I remember, hehe).
I have also had books spoiled by the intro, so I never read them until afterwards if I want to know even more about the book.
Found another author for you A-Z author people. William Le Queux. His The Seven Secrets is free today in the US, but maybe also other places? Surely he is in the public domain, so maybe this and others are free every day!
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Found another author for you A-Z author people. William Le Queux. His The Seven Secrets is free today in the US, but maybe also other places? Surely he is in the pub..."Thanks, Elizabeth! It sounds amusing (although I've got my Q for this year with Raymond Queneau ). I got The Seven Secrets for 0.99, which is a good deal!
Valerie - does the US Project Gutenberg work for you? He has a whole slew of titles over there. I see he has some nonfiction titles, so sorting which are mysteries and which are not might be a challenge in itself!
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Valerie - does the US Project Gutenberg work for you? He has a whole slew of titles over there. I see he has some nonfiction titles, so sorting which are mysteries and which are not might be a chal..."It looks like it does. I haven't explored it more in depth (yet), but I think I can access the works on there.
Great! Canada's does not work for us, but that may be due to the difference in your public domain law, which I think in some cases allows more recently published books than ours does. (But I'm not positive about the differences - and I'm glad I don't have to work those things out!)
Time to start looking for all of your sharp pencils! Spring sub-challenge this weekend, probably tomorrow!
Yes! I’ve been hoping and will probably be snowed in, too! I know it’s funny that snow stops us in the NW, but they just can’t justify having enough equipment on hand to clear the roads and it creates a mess even for those of us who grew up with snow (Colorado for me).
I've been seeing that you've had snow. I know that's just hard for you along the sound. We had some snow on Wednesday - about 5 inches, but it doesn't stop us up the same way.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Time to start looking for all of your sharp pencils! Spring sub-challenge this weekend, probably tomorrow!"Oh good! As you know I always get ridiculously excited by the planning stage! ha, ha..... The spring season is going to be an interrupted one for me though, as we will be on a trip for a portion of it.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Time to start looking for all of your sharp pencils! Spring sub-challenge this weekend, probably tomorrow!"Good. I need something to distract me after my sister's death this week.
I'm glad for needed distractions and sending many hugs and much love, Coralie.
Oh, that's sad news, Coralie! Sorry to hear of your loss.
I'm so sorry, Coralie. I hope you'll be able to find something to read in her honor.
Coralie wrote: "Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Time to start looking for all of your sharp pencils! Spring sub-challenge this weekend, probably tomorrow!"Good. I need something to distract me after my sister's death..."
Sorry to hear of your loss, Coralie. Take care.
Coralie wrote: "Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "Time to start looking for all of your sharp pencils! Spring sub-challenge this weekend, probably tomorrow!"Good. I need something to distract me after my sister's death..."
Oh, I'm so sad for you. Hoping you do find some pleasant distractions...
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I actually read War and Peace. It was much less painful than I expected and I enjoyed most of it. Everything was very readable and in small chapters. It just keeps going and going.... and then ends in dry philosophy on free will and history. Tolstoy was extremely against the "Great Man" theory.
Yay! It's done!