Hugo & Nebula Awards: Best Novels discussion

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Hugo & Nebula Awards: Spreadsheets and more!

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message 1: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (last edited Apr 02, 2020 07:51AM) (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod


This deserves a thread of its own:

Bryan's original Spreadsheet
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1K4-G...

Our group's Google Drive, containing spreadsheets from other members:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folder...

Bryan: "That's the link to the spreadsheet. All you have to do is put an X in the Read column next to the book you've read. The math is all automatic.

The first column is what list the book is in (H for Hugo and N for Nebula, H/N is for both), the 2 column is which book was the winner for that year.

Feel free to ask any questions about it or if you have an suggestions on how to make it better! ..."


*****
Here are Oleksandr's spreadsheets:

Oleksandr wrote: "Here is the list of novelettes, which were nominated or won Hugo and/or Nebula. If the novelette was written by more than one author it appears once for each author
"


Novellette

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...

Novella

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...

*****


message 2: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
Update*

Hey everyone, I just added the 2018 nominees to the spreadsheet.


message 3: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
I have finally got around to calculating at what point my completion percentage is and am thrilled to announce that I am at 5% already!

Just gonna breeze through the remaining 95% like it's nobody's business, your spreadsheet better not crash on me while I'm jotting down all them Xs, Bryan!


message 4: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
Lol, it hasn't YET...but you may be the first!


message 5: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
To all new members, if you are serious about completing the whole list of Hugos and Nebulas, this Bryan's spreadsheet right here is absolutely invaluable.

Fill it out with your read books and let us know how far along with the completion you are!


message 6: by Laura (new)

Laura (lauradragonchild) | 10 comments Hi guys. I just checked that spreadsheet and it's mindblowing!

I'd like to give a try to reading as many titles as possible from there. And view it as a sort of personal challenge. So what do I have to do? May I download that spreadsheet on my comp and fill in the Xs there or are we doing it in the group as a common challenge and using this thread to update the progress.
I'm sorry if my question is redundant but my WIFi is not working these days and I have to use the phone which doesn't really allow me to see stuff properly.


message 7: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
I think everyone is using it to keep track of personal individual progress with all the award-winning books. Feel free to share your milestones with us, bragging rights are included with the file, hehe.


message 8: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
I downloaded it and added it to my file that I use for tracking, which also has my combined "top 100", more or less my master reading list. My number stands at 14%, and I have about the same number of unread books on my shelf at home.


message 9: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
Laura wrote: "Hi guys. I just checked that spreadsheet and it's mindblowing!

May I download that spreadsheet on my comp and fill in the Xs there..."


First off, thank you! I spent a long while on that. Second, of course you can download it. That why it is there for! I'll be keeping it updated every year with the new nominations and winners. So you can check on it to update your copy.


message 10: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
I've nerded out on this spreadsheet. I not only marked the ones I've read (14%) but the ones on my shelf as well (oddly, exactly the same number of books). Then I broke them out by decade and vicennium to see if there were periods I was neglecting. The 80's/90's period had notably fewer reads, but surprisingly not the last 20 years. Still playing around with it.


message 11: by Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning (new)

Kateblue | 3779 comments Mod
I used to be at about 17%, Allan. But then I recalculated my goal percentage by adding what we've read and also going back and adding ones that I know I read because I can see, in my mind's eye, the Science Fiction Book Club book sitting on my long-gone bookshelf.

0.2468916519

But it doesn't really matter how high because those ones I can't remember, I will have fun reading again


message 12: by Oleksandr, a.k.a. Acorn (new)

Oleksandr Zholud | 3716 comments Mod
Just calculated: I've read 16.52%, with last few years usually up to 50% of the books.
Bryan, Thanks for the list!


message 13: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
My lame excuse is that I got to 14% without even focusing on it! Not completely true - this year is when I really got into Goodreads, set some real reading goals, and started knocking some out. But the list has given me much more awareness, especially if more recent titles.


message 14: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
You guys have me beat. I'm sitting at 12.75%.


message 15: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
Finally got back into the Worlds Without End site. Its awards section shows 316 Hugo nominees and 336 Nebula, for a total of 652. Winners total 120. That's a pretty big difference - 642 vs 557. Another research project.


message 16: by Robin (new)

Robin Witte | 30 comments I'm at 36.4%. Thanks for the spreadsheet. It helps me highlight where I need to focus a bit!

Has anyone else been having an issue getting on to the Worlds Without End site? It gives me a server error every time, across multiple devices and browsers, unless I use incognito/private browsing mode.


message 17: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
Lol, DUH! Of course, the lists overlap.....


message 18: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
I love WWE, I could look at the lists for hours. I've been having trouble with it for a couple weeks now - server error. I was able to get on today by clearing all my browsing data, but it still drops out repeatedly. Seems I have to clear it each time.


message 19: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
WWE had three books listed that I didn't see in the spreadsheet:
Mockingbird by Sean Stewart, 2000
The Guardsman by Beese & Hamilton, 1989
Up the Walls of the World by James Tiptree, 1979


message 20: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
Worlds Without End ceasing to exist, I get a feeling there's irony there but I can't quite put my finger on it!


message 21: by Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning (last edited Jul 23, 2018 09:58PM) (new)

Kateblue | 3779 comments Mod
According to a blurb on my library's website, Mockingbird by Sean Stewart was a Nebula nominee. But it doesn't even know of the existence of the other two books

Allen, are the other two Nebula or Hugo?


message 22: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
Robin wrote: "I'm at 36.4%. Thanks for the spreadsheet. It helps me highlight where I need to focus a bit!

Has anyone else been having an issue getting on to the Worlds Without End site? It gives me a server er..."


Amazing, I believe that you are the frontrunner at the moment, way to go!


message 23: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
Allan wrote: "WWE had three books listed that I didn't see in the spreadsheet:
Mockingbird by Sean Stewart, 2000
The Guardsman by Beese & Hamilton, 1989
Up the Walls of the World by James Tiptree, 1979"


There are two novels titled Mockingbird on our list, I think both were nominated for a Nebula.

Guardsman is on neither of the lists afaik, am I missing something?
Neither is Triptee.


message 24: by Robin (new)

Robin Witte | 30 comments Art wrote: "Amazing, I believe that you are the frontrunner at the moment, way to go!"

Thanks Art! It helps that I started reading sci-fi in High school and had all summer long to read and had access tp plenty of used books stores. I quickly became obsessed with finding all the Asimov, Hebert, and Heinlein books I could get my hands on.


message 25: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
The Guardsman - there was a controversy in the 1989 Hugo nominations. It was nominated but withdrawn because the administrators determined that some votes were bloc votes, and disqualified them. It was later determined that there was an enthusiastic group of fans in NY who were responsible.


message 26: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
Under the Walls of the World by James Tiptree - her first published novel in 1979, after a decade of establishing herself through short stories. I found it listed as a nominee on tor.com, in Jo Walton's series of articles reviewing each year's Hugos. However, I don't see it listed in other locations beyond WWE.


message 27: by Oleksandr, a.k.a. Acorn (new)

Oleksandr Zholud | 3716 comments Mod
The Guardsman hasn't been reprinted since 1988 which supposedly suggests it is a weak book


message 28: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
Yes, I did see a comment that it was mediocre.


message 29: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
I only see one Mockingbird, the 1981 Walter Tevis novel, in the spreadsheet. Am I just missing it, or is the Sean Stewart 2000 Nebula an accidental omission?


message 30: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
Allan wrote: "I only see one Mockingbird, the 1981 Walter Tevis novel, in the spreadsheet. Am I just missing it, or is the Sean Stewart 2000 Nebula an accidental omission?"

I believe the spreadsheet is missing the other entry. I am sure Bryan will sort it out, but thanks to you bringing it to our attention I made sure that both of the novels are on our Group bookshelf.


message 31: by Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning (new)

Kateblue | 3779 comments Mod
WWE came right up for me. I'd never heard of it before, so thanks!

Has anybody found Goodreads to be sluggish lately? Particularly in the evening (I'm on Eastern Daylight time right now).


message 32: by Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning (last edited Jul 24, 2018 01:04PM) (new)

Kateblue | 3779 comments Mod
Also I am inserting Mockingbird, the 1981 Walter Tevis novel, in my spreadsheet copy as a 2000 Nebula entrant

I get that we are saying that The Guardsman was not really a nominee so I will not enter it.

the Internet Speculative Fiction Database at http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/eaw.cgi?57, says that Up the Walls of the World by James Tiptree, 1979, was withdrawn. It does not say why. I'm going to poke around and see if I can find out


message 33: by Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning (last edited Jul 24, 2018 01:37PM) (new)

Kateblue | 3779 comments Mod
Well, it could be a hugo scandal or it could be that Ms. Tiptree was just not interested. She was outed as not a man by 1979, so I'm not sure the privacy thing could be it.

Here's some hugo and nebula bickering:

http://fancyclopedia.org/1979-best-no... says:

Up the Walls of the World by James Tiptree, Jr. received enough nominations to appear on the final ballot, but the nomination was withdrawn by the author.

Here's an interesting article about withdrawn nominees and ballot box stuffing, though it sheds no light on the Tiptree book
https://chaoshorizon.wordpress.com/20...

Apparently such goings on are still going on as of 2015
https://www.theguardian.com/books/201...

I hope to get the library to buy this biography of Tiptree, but absent that, I don't think there is anything out there to find, at least without a lot more effort than I am willing to expend.


message 34: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
Thank you, everyone, for all for work! It makes this group very enjoyable for an analytical completist list-maker like me. Bryan's spreadsheet is just one tab of my own, which has six; more data to do sorting and statistics on. In all my list variations, I color code books I've read this year, those prior to this year, and those I have waiting on my shelves. Yesterday, I chopped Bryan's list down to 124 books that were nominated for both Hugo & Nebula. It's a starting point to knock out more nominees, since I've focused more on winners. I've read 23% of that list, as compared to 71% of the double winners. My composite "top 100" sf list is very different (49%). What's really interesting to me is that there are so many books considered "classic" that DON'T fall onto the composite.


message 35: by Oleksandr, a.k.a. Acorn (new)

Oleksandr Zholud | 3716 comments Mod
Allan wrote: "What's really interesting to me is that there are so many books considered "classic" that DON'T fall onto the composite. "

I guess this is because a lot of classic books weren't instant hits, therefore weren't nominated to a short-list, like A Wizard of Earthsea


message 36: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
Well, I'll be adding those books to the main Spreadsheet. With drawn or not, they were on the list once before which is good enough for me.

Also, thanks Allan for introducing us to WWE...not the wrestling, but the website.

I'm already starting a Bram Stoker spreadsheet. Let me know if there is a spreadsheet you guys want and I'll get one out there. Using the same template, of course.


message 37: by Ed (new)

Ed Erwin | 689 comments Kateblue wrote: "Well, it could be a hugo scandal or it could be that Ms. Tiptree was just not interested...."

When her story "The Women Men Don't See" was nominated, she withdrew it saying she wanted more other people to have the chance to win. But it is suspected that her real reason was that she thought she was nominated for being a man who is able to write good female characters, and that wasn't fair since she wasn't really a man. (Or maybe Tiptree *was* a man, but a fictional man who was a character/persona of Sheldon. I've read the biography of her, and her identity is more complex than just a woman using a pseudonym. She seems to have lived inside that character.)

Anyhow, can't find any explanation for withdrawing the later novel.

One site says that for the Hugo that she did win, she displayed it in her home between two vibrators.


message 38: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
Ed wrote: "One site says that for the Hugo that she did win, she displayed it in her home between two vibrators. "

That's where I keep all my trophies!


message 39: by Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning (last edited Jul 26, 2018 09:19PM) (new)

Kateblue | 3779 comments Mod
Thanks for the clarification through the biography. I hope to read it sometime, though not soon. And thanks for the graphic "display" {chuckles}


message 40: by Ed (new)

Ed Erwin | 689 comments Art wrote: "Ed wrote: "One site says that for the Hugo that she did win, she displayed it in her home between two vibrators. "

That's where I keep all my trophies!"


Of course, the Hugo award is suggestively shaped.


message 41: by Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning (new)

Kateblue | 3779 comments Mod
ed said: "Of course, the Hugo award is suggestively shaped."

Ah, I get it now!


message 42: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
Wow...this took a left turn...then a right...then some batteries were added...


message 43: by Art, Stay home, stay safe. (new)

Art | 2551 comments Mod
Updated my spreadsheet copy today with the recent group reads, seems like I'm up 1%. I know it ain't much, but then again it was a satisfying couple of months with some amazing group reads.
Not sure whether I will ever be able to stick exclusively to Hugo/Nebula reads, there's just too many non sci-fi/fantasy books out there that I am dying to read.


message 44: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
Alright, I got the spreadsheet updated. I added Mockingbird by Sean Stewart, 2000 & Up the Walls of the World by James Tiptree, 1979. I used Alice Sheldon's pen name in the spreadsheet instead of changing it.

I didn't add The Guardsman by Beese & Hamilton, 1989 as it doesn't seem like a valid Hugo based on what I've read.

I also made a small improvement to the spreadsheet. I added the % complete at the top of the page that moves with the titles. That way we won't have to scroll all the way down when we want to see!

Also, my person completion is now 12.70% with the addition of the 2 books...sad day.


message 45: by Ed (new)

Ed Erwin | 689 comments I just looked at that spreadsheet and was surprised to see so many volumes of "The Wheel Of Time" nominated in 2014. What was really nominated was "The Complete Wheel Of Time" which collects a bunch (all?) of them. At more than 11,000 pages, there is NO WAY I'm going to read that!

Personally, I have no intention of trying to get near 100% on that spreadsheet, but I will read and discuss some of the books with y'all.


message 46: by Bryan, Village Idiot (new)

Bryan | 481 comments Mod
Ed wrote: "At more than 11,000 pages, there is NO WAY I'm going to read that!"

You say that now...but if you start the first book, you'll be hooked!

From what I was reading about it. After Robert Jordan passed away and the final book was completed by Brandon Sanderson, the series was nominated in 2014. Bring one of the few big series I've completed, twice, I can say they are pretty damn good.


message 47: by Oleksandr, a.k.a. Acorn (new)

Oleksandr Zholud | 3716 comments Mod
Ed wrote: "Personally, I have no intention of trying to get near 100% on that spreadsheet, but I will read and discuss some of the books with y'all.

Not all nominees are worth reading, so I won't reach 100% as well I guess. After all, most people read to enjoy and not doing a chore


message 48: by Antti (new)

Antti Värtö (andekn) | 801 comments I have no intention to reach 100%; there are way too many nominations that I'm not interested in. High fantasy has never been my thing,so I guess that cuts 20-30% on the nominees right out, and that's just one thing.

I'm currently at 15%, and I doubt I ever reach 50%.


message 49: by Robin (new)

Robin Witte | 30 comments I enjoyed the Wheel of Time series, but some of the books were definitely easier to get through than others. What's funny is that I gave up halfway through a reread; I don't think I've ever done that before. I realized that while there were many aspects of the series that I loved, I just couldn't take the time to wade through all of the things I didn't like. There were whole plot lines and characters that I didn't care for and didn't feel like they added anything to the books.


message 50: by Allan (new)

Allan Phillips | 2084 comments Mod
Time well spent. I read the first 12 books several years ago, starting the series on a whim and getting hooked with the first book. Sanderson had not finished it at the time. I read other things as I worked my through, but the great thing about it was the variety of stories, plot lines and characters. I never lost track or forgot a character, and if I paused to read other things, I had no trouble picking it back up. I was hesitant to read Sanderson's books as I felt they might fall short of Jordan, but then I read that Sanderson was his chosen successor, that Jordan had thoroughly briefed him on the rest of the story, and had left a library full of guiding documentation. So I plunged in and was not disappointed, in fact was delighted. Through all the books, you wonder how the conclusion will come together and it was really well done. I gained a lot of respect for Sanderson and want to read more of his work at some point.


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