Borderland Series Order

[James]

This is listed as #5, in the Borderland Series. It's not.

The series ran in the late-80s to the early 90s. This book in a new (well, newer), 2011 publication that revisits Bordertown, with more contemporary authors. As such, it is (at best) the most recent book in the series. The series ran 7 books, up to 1994, making "Welcome to Bordertown" the 8th book.

This will, of course, necessitate the renumbering of the books currently listed as #6, #7, and #8.

[[deleted user]]

Anyone able to help with this? Does seem odd that it became #5 when it's the newest edition. It seems like it fed in that way rather than a human on GRs named it such.

Book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/9...
Series: https://www.goodreads.com/series/5075...

The series description has some links including this one: https://bordertownseries.com/the-books Nowhere I saw, does it seem to show that it should be numbered as it is.

[James]

New note:
The Essential Bordertown is listed as number #4, but it should be #7, as it's the second-last one published.


Tim wrote: "Another aspect is that only three of the books are novels while the rest are anthologies/omnibuses. I could not find info saying they are to be read in a par..."

This is a feature, not an issue that may change the order or make it irrelevant. I don't understand the issue, though.

This is a Shared Universe series (link provided in case you don't know about shared universe works) and each volume contains stories (or a novel) taking place in the same town. Some of the stories are continuations of lives of specific characters, so yes, it needs to be properly numbered.

You wouldn't un-number Martin's Wild Cards series or Asprin's Thieves' World series.

[James]

The proper order, based solely on publication date and the official Bordertown series website is:

1. Borderland
2. Bordertown
3. Life on the Border
4. Elsewhere (currently listed as 6)
5. Nevernever (currently listed as 7)
6. Finder (currently listed as 8)
7. The Essential Bordertown (currently listed as 4)
8. Welcome to Bordertown (currently listed as 5)

[James]

Tim wrote: "I'm hoping he's read the works"

Only the first book, but I'm well-aware of the series.

I would be reading more of the series, if the books didn't have insanely ridiculous costs (starting at around $30.00, USED for the out-of-print second book in the series).

[[deleted user]]

Ok. I'm going to put them in User provided order

i/p

[James]

Cool.

I wouldn't want anyone to spoil stories, by reading them out of order.

Thanks, for the attention to this.

[[deleted user]]

I paused because I have to do some more manual/rules research. Someone went in and changed the titles to that order and I would have to go in and undo their changes.... Can't take that lightly.

So all i did was change the order on the series list for now. (Edit: and uncheck the numbered box)

i/p open to advice.

[[deleted user]]

I went through some of the edits and found a librarian who did some of the title edits this year. I sent her a PM and gave her a link to this conversation. Asked her if she could jump in. She is still active and maybe she can offer some insight on the current numbering order.

Again, would hate to undo another librarians edits without proper research. (p.s. not that I doubt your knowledge of the series James)

[James]

Corinne wrote: "I went through some of the edits and found a librarian who did some of the title edits this year"

I would love to hear why the order was changed.

[[deleted user]]

James wrote: "I would love to hear why the order was changed."

She may have found the order that way and just added series info to the title. I just noticed title edits.

[[deleted user]]

James can you edit your subject to: Borderland Series Order please.

[James]

Corinne wrote: "James can you edit your subject to: Borderland Series Order please."

Done.

[James]

Tim wrote: "I hope that was clearer than mud. "

If it helps, it was clear to me and I'm not even a librarian.

[[deleted user]]

Tim wrote: "... Corinne, I am thinking you went into the series editing and unchecked the Numbered box which typically would show series as a series but no particular order.
..."

yes I did do that purposely. I just went back in and rechecked the numbered box and put them back in the original order. I don't want future lookers to be confused by what was my i/p work. (So it's back to it's original condition)

At this point someone more confident can take over. I knew the titles needed to be edited but was uncomfortable un-doing another librarians work.

[rivka, Former Moderator]

Please move threads to a different folder, rather than posting the same thing multiple times.

[James]

rivka wrote: "Please move threads to a different folder, rather than posting the same thing multiple times."

I'll do that. Will it be noticed or is there a risk it will look like other librarians are already dealing with it?

[[deleted user]]

I'm sure it will be noticed. If not you come back and "bump" it.

p.s. the original librarian I mentioned PM'd me back. I will report back what she says if she doesn't want to jump in herself.

[[deleted user]]

She said she got her info from 3 different sites which still confirm her order is correct. I asked if she would pass those sites on to us because 2 links on the series page are dead and 2 don't list an order. She hasn't gotten back yet.

But I did find this:
http://www.loony-archivist.com/border...

Anthologies
Borderland
Bordertown
Life on the Border
The Essential Bordertown
Welcome to Bordertown
Double Feature

Novels
Elsewhere
Nevernever
Finder

Related Novels
The Last Hot Time [NOTE: while The Last Hot Time is not a canonical Borderlands novel, it does however feature characters and locales from Emma Bull & Will Shetterly's Bordertown stories and novels, and is, for the purposes of this website, considered a related work of the Borderlands shared universe.]

Quick link to GRs listing: https://www.goodreads.com/series/5075...

[[deleted user]]

Final comments from the PM conversation

"This is one of them: https://www.thriftbooks.com/series/bo... The same was also consistent with what i have found ordered on scribd on series lists and names. I have no idea why this was mismatched to this degree."

[James]

The only part of these that makes any sense is that some of them separate the anthologies and the novels (which makes sense to non-readers, I would think).

[[deleted user]]

Yeah IMO, I think the best thing to do will be to put them in publication order as you have already suggested. Or explain more clearly why they are numbered as they are.

What did you think about that book "Double Feature" being listed on Loony-Archvist site but not added to the GRs series? As well as The Last Hot Time? In your opinion should they be added?

Need to re-read pertinent sections of the manual and sticky posts or have to have an expert weight in on; do we number the books in a series when we put them in publication order?

[James]

Corinne wrote: "What did you think about that book "Double Feature" being listed on Loony-Archvist site but not added to the GRs series? As well as The Last Hot Time?"

I don't know if there's a policy for that (I assume not, given how uncommon it probably is), but my opinion is that:
Double Feature contains a novelette from the series and is written by one of the main contributors to that series, so it should at least be included as a 7.1 (the rest of the book is from an entirely different shared world series that probably needs it added, as well).

The Last Hot Time, again in my opinion, should also be a fractional number (7.2), as it's not part of the series, but includes characters from it and is from the same publisher (suggesting everyone was okay with that).

[James]

As I say, this brings up that Double Feature is part of the Liavek series and should also be #5.5 of that series.

Ah, the madness of it all...

(and you are welcome for my efforts at opening this can of worms)

[[deleted user]]

I added a separate 'publication order' series.

https://www.goodreads.com/series/2162... new

There are many other series that do this.
ex
https://www.goodreads.com/series/5006... pub order
https://www.goodreads.com/series/4933... chrono order

James, Your welcome to offer advise. In fact encouraged.

[[deleted user]]

James..... Where did you get your publication order? msg #5

I think something is wrong with it at least the GR pub dates don't support it but this wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bor... does nvmd figured it out.

You linked this one in msg 5 https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1... it was pub 1982. It is vol 2 of 3. See here https://www.goodreads.com/series/9626... I thought you might of messed up with the order but you only linked the wrong Elsewhere. This is with the "original" series https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/7... and that matches your publication order.

What do you think that 1982 Elsewhere series is? Nothing to do with Borderland?

[[deleted user]]

Librarian Questions: Are we allowed to link a wiki page in series description area ? The original listing had 2 dead links which I removed. One of which was a private blog which doesn't seem proper to use. Was it okay?

Here is the wiki one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bor... I was wondering if we can use. answered

[[deleted user]]

Tim wrote: "Corinne wrote: "Are we allowed to link a wiki page in series description area ? The original listing had 2 dead links which I removed. Once was a private blog which doesn't seem proper to use.
here..."

Hi Tim, tysm

[[deleted user]]

James, All done.
New publication order series https://www.goodreads.com/series/2162...

I did msg 29 also but if you want to help add details to that series I'd appreciate it. It looks wrong tagging that extra book on there without any words in the description. How it's related is all I really need.

[[deleted user]]

Original list, can you find any evidence supporting it's book order? We even renamed the books to this order but I can't seem to find solid evidence that it is correct. It looks like the order is based on anthologies first (in pub order), then novels (in pub order). Does it make sense to number them that way?

[James]

The best I can reference is that even on Terri Windling's personal site, the only listing is by pub date. I'm unaware of any volume being exclusively retro. I have to assume that "publication date order" and "series order" are exactly the same thing and just needlessly complicated.

Note that Windling separates the anthologies from the novels, but her goal was less explain the order, than to explain individual books.

This was a series of anthologies (with a few novels thrown in) that was produced, volume by volume, like the Thieves' World anthology series (which also had the odd novel thrown in). There was never anything complicated in the order and each volume can (almost certainly) be placed in the order it was published.

At least, that's my opinion.

[[deleted user]]

James you back read, starting with #30? There was a question on 31 & 35

[James]

Corinne wrote: "It looks wrong tagging that extra book on there without any words in the description. How it's related is all I really need"

Double Feature is comprised of short stories written by the editors/creators of Liavek and almost all are set in that world.

However, after a touch more research, I can say that they were all printed in official volumes of the actual series and are reprinted, here. I don't know how that's resolved, internally at Goodreads. Basically it is directly related, but has no new work.

[[deleted user]]

James wrote: "... I don't know how that's resolved, internally at Goodreads. Basically it is directly related, but has no new work."

It's fine to include as is. thanks.

[James]

You're welcome.