The Mookse and the Gripes discussion
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Authors I Will Never Read Again
OK - so after the Booker last year, someone is going to have to work very hard to persuade me to read another Coetzee. The two "Jesus" ones were my first and, as it stands, last.
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Norwegian Wood was the first Murakami I ever read and on finishing it I decided it would be the last.
Neil wrote: "OK - so after the Booker last year, someone is going to have to work very hard to persuade me to read another Coetzee. The two "Jesus" ones were my first and, as it stands, last."Disgrace is a masterpiece - The Jesus books and his retelling of Robinson Crusoe are totally different to the typical Coetzee novel. Even the writing style is different
Isobel wrote: "Norwegian Wood was the first Murakami I ever read and on finishing it I decided it would be the last."There are two types of Murakami novels. The surrealistic ones and the 'normal' ones. Generally people who don't like Norwegian Wood will like Kafka on the Shore or A Wild Sheep Chase. I wouldn't recommend his wackier books like Wind Up Bird Chronicle or 1Q84 at this stage.
I felt the same way about reading Coetzee's fiction after reading Disgrace - it was simply too dark, depressing and bleak - but I love the nonfiction Here and Now: Letters he did with Paul Auster.There are plenty of authors where I go "oh well not for me" - and then those that I have a much stronger reaction against. It's interesting I agree, to examine why.
I really disliked The Corrections and will never read Franzen again. After having perceived him as very negative, self-important and arrogant in various articles/interviews, and then finding his book at best mediocre, I wrote him off as an "emperor's new clothes" phenomenon.
I forced myself to finish The Broom of the System by Foster Wallace, and it just irritated me so much, that I'll have a hard time trying him again. The same with Will Self's Umbrella - which I made it 20 pages into. Here I think the problem was, that I was hoping to really like it - but just couldn't relate to it at all.
Have any of you found yourselves thinking you'll like/love an author, and thus buying several of their books before actually reading the first one? Then it's really a bummer to discover that they're not for you.
Other than authors I have three big problems book wiseTranslated Books - 9 times out 10 I can feel that the book has been translated. I still try though but I am constantly disappointed. Last year the only translated novel I liked was The Vegetarian.
Short Stories - I tend to see if they live up to Roald Dahl's short stories. They never do. The glaring exception is Barbara the Slut.
Time Travel books- I've tried to like them but I end up hating them and finding them boring - notable exception: The Bone Clocks.
Roth, Franzen, Lethem, Joshua Ferris, Jonathan Littell, Ben Lerner for me. Nathan Hill has successfully added himself to that list this year.Most of those though are based on one bad experience.
David Mitchell is probably the author where I've read most books (6) but would struggle to face another - he is the Radiohead of authors (each book/album worse than the last).
Murakami on the other hand is on my list of authors who I have, and likely will, read every novel they've written - alongside Kenzaburo Oe, Krasznahorkai, Per Pettersen, Javier Marias, Kazuo Ishiguro, Salman Rushdie, Orhan Pamuk, Andrei Makine amongst those still active. Which may be a topic for another thread - who are your completists (actually there is a separate GR group for this).
And McEwan is someone where I tend to read each new book even though some (Saturday, Children's Act) are dreadful.
Robert wrote: "Isobel wrote: "Norwegian Wood was the first Murakami I ever read and on finishing it I decided it would be the last."There are two types of Murakami novels. The surrealistic ones and the 'normal'..."
Maybe I'll give one of those a try then!
So Paul, if "Saturday" is the only McEwan book I tried, and I wasn't thrilled - which one should I read next?My completists are Paul Auster, Murakami, Sjón, Jon Kalman Stefansson, Siri Hustvedt & Rushdie
You should give A Wild Sheep Chase a shot Isobel - it's wonderful
Michel Houellebecq. He's the reason that I created my "never again" shelf. Congrats, Michel!
The chances are that if you really don't like an author's writing when its the first work of that particular author you've tried, you are unlikely to welcome subsequent exposure to that author.There's a distinction between those writers who are always likely to grate, and those whose body of work might fluctuate depending on their age and subject matter.
The only author I can think of where I've had the polar opposite reactions to his writing is Don De Lillo. If I had read Zero K as my first experience of De Lillo I would probably never have taken up Underworld
Robert wrote: "Neil wrote: "OK - so after the Booker last year, someone is going to have to work very hard to persuade me to read another Coetzee. The two "Jesus" ones were my first and, as it stands, last."Dis..."
I agree re the different styles - but I hated Disgrace and hated the two Jesus ones as well! Definitely an author I would try to avoid, but if he were Booker longlisted again I would try again.
Louise wrote: "So Paul, if "Saturday" is the only McEwan book I tried, and I wasn't thrilled - which one should I read next?..."
I would say Atonement
Mc Ewan like Howard Jacobsen is an author who doesn't really change his style that much - but sometimes that style works (for me with Jacobsen with J) and sometimes it doesn't (for me with Jacobsen Finkler Question)
Gumble's Yard wrote: "Louise wrote: "So Paul, if "Saturday" is the only McEwan book I tried, and I wasn't thrilled - which one should I read next?..."
I would say Atonement
Mc Ewan like Howard Jacobsen is an author ..."
I agree re mixed style because I didn't like Atonement,I found it too 'normal' I prefer the sinister McEwan of the past. The one who wrote about Stalkers (Enduring Love, the comfort of strangers) and Kids keeping their dead parents in a basement ( The Cement Garden)
Robert, Dahl is great, but what about Poe? His short stories are amazing!Talking about McEwan: Atonement is a masterpiece, IMHO.
...and to put some off you off a little: I like Murakami, Hill, Roth (hello, Paul! :-)), DFW, Houellebecq (La Carte et le territoire is brilliant), and some Franzen (Freedom is great). :-)
I have a rather difficult relationship with Thomas Mann. Yeah, he has a Nobel Prize, but I am underwhelmed: Stuff like Confessions of Felix Krull, Confidence Man: The Early Years makes me want to scream.
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...and of course: Ayn Rand! I read The Fountainhead to find out what this objectivism nonsense is all about, and it is really scary that people do actually buy into that.
I read "Atlas Shrugged". Why would I read another Ayn Rand?On the plus side, I am with Paul on Murakami and I would read anything Richard Powers writes (probably several times). Several other favourites too, but that's yet another topic, not the one here.
Meike - we picked on Ayn Rand together - your post appeared at the same time as I posted mine!
And I am trying to resist arguing with Paul about Radiohead, because that's yet another topic!
Neil wrote: "Meike - we picked on Ayn Rand together - your post appeared at the same time as I posted mine!"Neil, it is so funny how often we like and dislike the same books/authors! Ayn Rand is truly, truly horrible, her worldview is not only morally deplorable but also logically incoherent...I could go on picking on her forever! :-)
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I think the ones that are more interesting are the ones you have read several books by before giving up on - the list of writers I have read one of is getting very long!
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Paul, Neil, Hugh - I would actually enjoy reading your argument about Radiohead! :-)
Hugh - does that include books in a series? For example, I read, I think, 8 V.I.Warshawski books before I decided I was just reading the same book over and over again and gave up. I think I was about halfway through.
Meike wrote: "Robert, Dahl is great, but what about Poe? His short stories are amazing!Talking about McEwan: Atonement is a masterpiece, IMHO.
...and to put some off you off a little: I like Murak..."
I don't like Poe's style too much but I do need to reread.
I tried to read The Magic Mountain and did not like it at all.
I don't think it's much of an argument. Paul thinks they get worse, I think they get better. I think it's a matter of taste and we just have to agree to disagree!When I listen to music, I head first for Kid A, then In Rainbows, then A Moon Shaped Pool. I might sometimes listen to other bands, too.
But it relates to another discussion on re-reading. Ali Smith questioned the fact that we never expect to "understand" a piece of music on one listen, but we are quite content to read a book only once. I never like Radiohead albums on the first few listens, but I have learned to listen several times before forming an opinion.
Neil wrote: "And I am trying to resist arguing with Paul about Radiohead, because that's yet another topic!"yeah my sentiments exactly :)
( I only don't like King of Limbs, other than that they can do no wrong)
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Robert wrote: "Meike wrote: "Robert, Dahl is great, but what about Poe? His short stories are amazing!Talking about McEwan: Atonement is a masterpiece, IMHO.
...and to put some off you off a little..."
I love Poe, especially The Tell-Tale Heart and of course The Fall of the House of Usher.
I didn't have the courage yet to try The Magic Mountain, because the probability that I will also not like it is quite high, and the book is a real brick...the only piece of writing by Mann that I found quite good was Death in Venice.
Hugh wrote: "Jonathan, for most authors I would agree, but there are authors who have written one or two very sub-standard ones. I could easily have given up on Rushdie after Fury, but most of his more recent o..."For me David Mitchell is a mixed bag. I like ghostwritten, cloud atlas, bone clocks and slade house but I dislike the books where he strays from the whole intertwining destiny thing.
I read The Infatuations and Thus Bad Begins by Javier Marias. I know lots of people here admire him, but I have no desire to read anything else by him.But, I am open to persuasion. More open than I am on the Coetzee front.
I couldn't see the fuss behind Wolf Hall. But if the Manbookering group will choose it, I will definitely give it a second chance.
Hugh wrote: "going back to Mann, I have only read the Magic Mountain and Doctor Faustus, and although both were heavy going they were both richly rewarding. Not sure I am in much of a hurry to read more though."Hugh, yours is definitely the majority opinion. When I say that I am not a big fan of Mann, other Germans tend to look at me like I was some kind of barbarian! :-)
Hugh - seems like you were right to say this could be a "fertile topic"!
Neil wrote: "I read The Infatuations and Thus Bad Begins by Javier Marias. I know lots of people here admire him, but I have no desire to read anything else by him.But, I am open to persuasion. More open than..."
Javier Marias is another I don't like, having read three of his books but it could be the translation.
Neil wrote: "I don't think it's much of an argument. Paul thinks they get worse, I think they get better. I think it's a matter of taste and we just have to agree to disagree!When I listen to music, I head fi..."
I definitely have to step up my Radiohead game....will start later today when I am in the forest with the dog and my headphones!
A slightly related topic: series ruined by other people taking them over.I'm thinking of Dune. Wonderful when done by Frank Herbert. Less so (I DNF-ed) when done by his son.
Neil wrote: "I don't think it's much of an argument. Paul thinks they get worse, I think they get better. I think it's a matter of taste and we just have to agree to disagree!When I listen to music, I head fi..."
Same here Kid A is the one I revisit.
I mentioned earlier today that I approach rereading like music - they deserve a second chance
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For me, Black Swan Green was hugely enjoyable, but mostly for nostalgic reasons. It would only take one more like Slade House to persuade me I have had enough.
Meike - Kid A in the forest, then? You may need to listen to it a few times before it clicks. Or, if you are like Paul, you might hate it however many time you listen!
I rated Slade House highly when I read it, but I regret doing that now. But I do like all his interlinked bits. I like it that a book that seems to be more "normal" (The Thousand Autumns...") suddenly has characters from other books appearing in it.I think he's said somewhere that all his books take place in the same "universe", so even the more "real" ones show signs of being linked to the others.
Meike wrote: "Neil wrote: "I don't think it's much of an argument. Paul thinks they get worse, I think they get better. I think it's a matter of taste and we just have to agree to disagree!When I listen to mus..."
I think it's an amazing idea! I like to contrast my sounds so If I'm going to town then i'll put on folk but if im going for a walk in a valley i'll put on something like Kid A, Four Tet, Boards of Canada, Nils Frahm etc etc.
Robert wrote: "Meike wrote: "Neil wrote: "I don't think it's much of an argument. Paul thinks they get worse, I think they get better. I think it's a matter of taste and we just have to agree to disagree!When I..."
Neil wrote: "Meike - Kid A in the forest, then? You may need to listen to it a few times before it clicks. Or, if you are like Paul, you might hate it however many time you listen!"
Neil, Robert, I can report that listening to Kid A while walking through a forest is just great - I think I will listen to more stuff from Radiohead's back catalogue in the same way over the next weeks! :-)
Paul, re Kid A: What's wrong with you? ;-)
I could be tempted to give it a go, except I am a wildlife spotting/photographing enthusiast - when I am outside I want to hear the birds in case I hear one I don't recognise and need to find it to take a picture. I couldn't go outside with headphones on.
Neil wrote: "I could be tempted to give it a go, except I am a wildlife spotting/photographing enthusiast - when I am outside I want to hear the birds in case I hear one I don't recognise and need to find it to..."Hear! Hear! I also find it impossible to wear headphones outdoors.
*wields the camera*
Neil wrote: "I could be tempted to give it a go, except I am a wildlife spotting/photographing enthusiast - when I am outside I want to hear the birds in case I hear one I don't recognise and need to find it to..."I just have to be careful not to drift off and get totally lost in the music - I have to spot the animals too, so I can call back my terrier before he sets off to hunt them! :-) Unfortunately, I don't know much about birds though...
The Mookse and the Gripes
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I think this has the potential to be a fertile topic for a more general debate about the writers who have provoked such extreme reactions, or perhaps just those we have been avoiding subconsciously since one bad experience. Howard Jacobson is another name that cropped up a few times!