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Tenant of Wildfell: Background & Resources
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Renee, Moderator
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Aug 14, 2017 05:37AM
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A couple of fun links.Some spoilers in this one: https://www.theguardian.com/books/boo...
No spoilers here:
http://www.harkavagrant.com/index.php...
Ginny wrote: "A couple of fun links.Some spoilers in this one: https://www
No spoilers here:
http://www.harkavagrant.com/index..."
Interesting. We can not help comparing the three sisters. Looking forward to seeing how Anne views men in a different way.
Did any of you see the recent movie about the three sisters? I wish I had.I am curious to know more about why they all became authors and how they were different.
Does any one know if there is a discussion link about this movie here?
Thanks Ginny for the two links. Loved both. Really, I don't understand the fascination for Heathcliff. I am no doubt in the minority, given the popularity of Wuthering Heights. I am reserving judgement on Rochester. Of all the Bronte sisters, I think, that Anne was the most down to earth and wrote about what she knew rather than what she imagined.
Mod
I agree with you view on Anne, Bharathi. Out of the three Bronte sisters, her work always feel real to me.
Charlotte wrote: "Did any of you see the recent movie about the three sisters? I wish I had.I am curious to know more about why they all became authors and how they were different.
Does any one know if there is ..."
I did see this movie not long ago on public tv here in the states. according to this movie the sisters were taking care of their father and their brother who was set to inherit everything. the sisters knew that the brother was wasting all the money and they chose writing because the could use a mans name and keep their status as a gentleman's daughters.
I got two books about the sisters to read along with Tenants: The Bronte Sisters by Catherine Reef and The Brontes by Juliet Barker. Have read a bit of the first and am finding it interesting and helpful.
Mod
I just started reading the book. I found the preface that Anne Bronte wrote for the second edition very interesting. Here is a link to that https://www.lang.nagoya-u.ac.jp/~mats...
I am using the Oxford World Classics paperback edition which includes Anne's Preface, but also an introduction which discusses her relationship with her siblings and the themes in the Tenant- including the woman's question and alcoholism. It does contain spoilers, however it is really informative. Evidently, what we know about Anne is mostly through the eyes of Charlotte which has greatly impacted how she is seen as both a person and an author. She thought Anne was a queer little thing and that she had no business writing a book like the Tenant. Sibling rivalry?
Linda wrote: "I am using the Oxford World Classics paperback edition which includes Anne's Preface, but also an introduction which discusses her relationship with her siblings and the themes in the Tenant- inclu..."In one of the links I found in Goodreads, there was a article about the relationship of Charlotte with her sisters. She had gone to Belgium with Emily to learn and to teach. She was closer to Emily than to Anne who stayed home with her aunt. So probably Charlotte did not understand Anne very well.
Linda wrote: "I am using the Oxford World Classics paperback edition which includes Anne's Preface, but also an introduction which discusses her relationship with her siblings and the themes in the Tenant- inclu..."After watching the story about the Brontes on Youtube (see the link above), what I think is that Charlotte was the most ambitious sister with the most drive and that she might have been jealous of Anne - in the competition.
Or perhaps she had problems with the connection between the theme in the book and their brother, Branwell...?
Charlotte wrote: "Linda wrote: "I am using the Oxford World Classics paperback edition which includes Anne's Preface, but also an introduction which discusses her relationship with her siblings and the themes in the..."
Have not seen the show, but am reading about this interesting, difficult family. Charlotte was the stronger, more successful, outlived them all. Anne, the pious, quiet one. Their lives were so hard. It must have been so complex with strong jealousy of each other's talents just one of the wrinkles. Really, they sound pretty miserable. But wrote heroically.
Have not seen the show, but am reading about this interesting, difficult family. Charlotte was the stronger, more successful, outlived them all. Anne, the pious, quiet one. Their lives were so hard. It must have been so complex with strong jealousy of each other's talents just one of the wrinkles. Really, they sound pretty miserable. But wrote heroically.
http://victorianweb.org/authors/bront...This is a link to a review of a new biography about Anne. The review is written by a professor from whom I've been taking continuing ed courses on 19th century authors- an area of expertise for her. She offers worthwhile insight about Anne and the family as well as commending the new biography.
I enjoyed the pictures of the moors in this documentary about the Brontes: https://youtu.be/QyTeDZZBphI
Lenora wrote: "Charlotte wrote: "Did any of you see the recent movie about the three sisters? I wish I had.I am curious to know more about why they all became authors and how they were different.
Does any one..."
i don't think there was much to inherit, the Brontes were not a rich family. Branwell seems to have drifted from one thing to another, never settling on any career.
Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because it was among a select group of topics acceptable for women writers. If a female writer wanted to be published, she would have to find a sponsor or mentor in some way. A husband, lover or friend with connections to publishing. Sometimes, as with the Brontes, they did submit their works as male authors, which made it easier but they still needed some type of connection.
If they wanted their books to sell, and what author doesn't- particularly if they are trying to make a living- they had to take into account the prevailing values of the time. I think this is at least one reason why Jane Eyre ends up with Rochester. She has been an independent woman, steadfastly opposed to becoming his mistress, but when she reunites with a disabled Rochester whose wife is no longer an issue, she decides to devote her life to him. Being married and a devoted wife is still a central value at the time and the only option available for most women. Charlotte puts a slightly feminist spin on it by having Rochester dependent upon Jane so that Jane still remains a strong woman.
If a female writer went too far outside the bounds of what was considered appropriate, there might be consequences. Tenant had mixed reviews because of its coarseness and Charlotte let it be known she didn't like it. In the second half of the century, Tenant went out of print and Anne's reputation as a writer began a downward spiral (thanks to Charlotte). Currently, interest in Anne is at a high and she is being recognized for the fine writer she was.
Linda wrote: "http://victorianweb.org/authors/bront...This is a link to a review of a new biography about Anne. The review is written by a professor from whom I've been taking continuing ed co..."
Just picked this up from the library. It looks good.
Linda wrote: "Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because it was among a select group ..."
Thanks! Wish I was in your course. It makes sense to me that 19th C female writers focused on romance, but so did male writers. I am reading a ton of Trollope with the FB Trollope group, I love his work, but book after book drives the plot through romance... There are so many other more interesting topics, especially in middle age. Not a complaint, just find it interesting, puzzling.
Thanks! Wish I was in your course. It makes sense to me that 19th C female writers focused on romance, but so did male writers. I am reading a ton of Trollope with the FB Trollope group, I love his work, but book after book drives the plot through romance... There are so many other more interesting topics, especially in middle age. Not a complaint, just find it interesting, puzzling.
Kathy wrote: "Linda wrote: "Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because it was among a..."You're certainly right about Trollope. I just finished the Barsetshire Chronicles and am reading Can You Forgive Her? I will try to ask my professor about the focus on romance ( she has written a lot on Trollope).
Linda wrote: "Kathy wrote: "Linda wrote: "Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because ..."
Oh! Now I REALLY want to be in that class! Enjoy and I look forward to hearing what she says. 😎
Oh! Now I REALLY want to be in that class! Enjoy and I look forward to hearing what she says. 😎
Just watched the 1996 BBC miniseries. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115387/
Really quite good, I thought. Of course, as readers, we always would have chosen different things to emphasize, especially in the motivation/transition of scenes and characters. But worth a watch.
Mod
Thanks, Ginny, I wasn’t aware of this production. I will also try to watch it.
Mod
Linda wrote: "Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because it was among a select group ..."i think stories of love, romance and marriage are still popular, bookshops seem to be full of them. Women write those sort of books still because people enjoy reading them, and because it is still a subject of abiding interest. People today are still interested in Jane and mr rochester getting together. I don't think the things people like reading about have changed that much.
Kathy wrote: "Linda wrote: "Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because it was among a..."I don't think that many subjects other than romance are really interesting enough to sustain a novel. There are adventure stories of course, though even they can have romance creeping in at some stage - Phileas Fogg in Around the World in Eighty days succumbs to the beautiful indian princess. Detective stories more often than not have romance creeping in somewhere. Three men In A Boat is one of very few novels I can think of that doesn't have any romance.
Kathy wrote: "Linda wrote: "Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because it was among a..."I asked my professor specifically about why romance figures so prominently in Trollope. Her answer was simple...It sold well and romance, courtship and marriage is an enduring human interest, which as others have noted, healthily survives till today. It is a plot device which grabs the reader and invests us in the themes which the author explores.
As regards 19th century authors, I also think that romance serves as a lens through which they can explore so many facets of their society. Romance, courtship and marriage intersects with women's rights, social class and its constraints, politics, religion, economics. Have I left anything out?
Linda wrote: "Kathy wrote: "Linda wrote: "Bits of information from a course I am taking on 19th century women authors. The reason why women authors wrote novels about romance, courtship and marriage was because ..."
Great, thanks!
Great, thanks!
I am reading some of the essays in New Approaches to the Literary Art of Anne Bronte. Several very different approaches, and much food for thought.One suggestion that struck me, concerning Helen's relationship to her God and the afterlife:
"As a creature wholly of this world, he [Huntingdon] is incapable of meeting her on this [spiritual] level, and his annoyance with anything and anyone who affords his wife even a moment's pleasure independently f himself gives us an idea of how potent his jealousy of her God becomes. Always a powerful marriage-wrecker, jealousy is at work in the Huntingdon Menage long before the Arthur-Annabella intrigue begins. It is only logical that Arthur Huntingdon should defy his wife's unshakable devotion to an invincible rival by heading towards the opposite camp, actively pursuing perdition in such places as 'the Hell fire Club.'" (page 155 of this reference)
Mod
Ginny wrote: "Just watched the 1996 BBC miniseries. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115387/
Really quite good, I thought. Of course, as readers, we always would have chosen different things to emphasize, especial..."
Having finished the book after watching this series, I am puzzled why they changed the ending. I thought the ending in the book was much more convincing. I don't see how it saved them time, although it involved a character, Esther Hargrave, that I think they left out altogether in the film.
Ginny wrote: "I am reading some of the essays in New Approaches to the Literary Art of Anne Bronte. Several very different approaches, and much food for thought.One suggestion that struck me, conc..."
Oh wow, thanks for that very vital info Ginny.
Renee is right, what a remarkable insight by Anne on this train wreck of a marriage or for that matter on possessive relationships overall.
The jealousy and possession and obsession.
While reading this at times I felt like it a parent-child relationship, the one that has gone sour. And for Anne to propel him towards the opposite of what Helen (literally) worships is typical of what teenagers do when their parents tend to be strict or misunderstand them ??
Piyumi wrote: "And for Anne to propel him towards the opposite of what Helen (literally) worships is typical of what teenagers do when their parents tend to be strict or misunderstand them ?? ..."So true. I often see this interaction in marriages--more like a mother with a teenage son than a partnership. Why does this happen so often, do you think?
Ginny wrote: "Piyumi wrote: "And for Anne to propel him towards the opposite of what Helen (literally) worships is typical of what teenagers do when their parents tend to be strict or misunderstand them ?? ..."..."
You hit on the mark there, often marriages spiral towards a mother-teenage son relationship, yes I've had a first hand experience with my parents marriage :D.
Why? oh well, do you have time to read my rant ;)?!
In my very humble inexperienced (i'm unmarried) view, it has to do with a mix of reasons. It can be categorized between how men and women are naturally are and to how they are brought up, the kind of ideas and up bringing they have had.
Coming from an Asian background I see all the time how men are given this entitlement, this notions that they are everything to a woman, to a family, and so can do with women as they like and do with their lives as they like. They are also not always held accountable to their actions.
Now take women in Asia, generally they are given most of the rules and responsibilities, told what to do and what not to do (under the pretext of being protected coz its a big bad world out there, true enough, but please) and also they are always held accountable, not only to their actions, but to the actions of their husbands and families.
What this results is in giving lofty ideas to men that they should get what they want (be it any woman, all the attention and all that they want), and in women this ridiculous pious highhandedness that religion will save them and they are all good and what not sitting cross legged and the sweet angels that will change/save the devil in the man.
Eventually it leads to this mother-teenage son relationship in most marriages.
Of coz we cannot and should not generalize men and women or Asians :D to just the two extreme behaviors I mentioned above, not all fall in to these categories. We none of us are completely one thing or the other, there are gray areas, where we will exhibit bit of the good and the bad and the confused in different situations and change as we age and mature with experience.
Why this particular relationship happens so often is what I am aiming to pin down on and I see societies STILL propagating these two particular categories when it comes to the two sexes.
I also see that at the start of relationships, women given in so much and then find that its too late. Unless its a woman who has gone through bad relationships or divorces, many just cave in to the man's attention. And when she starts to see him in the proper light, makes excuses and prolong the torture, best example being Helen. Till her child was in danger, she kept up the pretense.
Of coz they will say, but its LOVE and women love. I have no patients with that notion either. I think literature, poetry, songs, movies and novels has distorted the true meaning of Love. If you don't love yourself, if you don't respect yourself enough to tell a man to leave off when he is attempting to hurt you, humiliate you and disrespect you, how can you define loving anyone else in its truest form?!
Its only now with the younger generation of women you see them making decisions at the start of a relationship, stating what they want out of the relationship for themselves rather than just giving in to HIS needs.
I admit that the above is very rigid and does not accommodate human emotions much :) I'm looking at it from cold hard logic.
Whats your view on your question Ginny?
Would love to know yours and others take on it as well.
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Books mentioned in this topic
New Approaches to the Literary Art of Anne Bronte (other topics)New Approaches to the Literary Art of Anne Bronte (other topics)
