The Diary of a Young Girl
discussion
Anyone else hate this Diary
It may to you. That's fine. I get it. But saying that its all American teens is generalization.
Dustin wrote: "Tytti wrote: Maria wrote: "the thing that amuses me to no end is the sex scandals in there" I must have missed that part of the Frank diary. Granted, I read the play based on the diary since my ..."
That was part of a comment, not regarding the diary itself - it was an off-topic thing. It was about the sex scandals in the US and the way they coppe with them and the amusement they always bring me. If you will, just to contextualize, please read my full comment on the page before this one.
How the heck did a thread about a diary get to this! C'mon people, I'm no prude, but really.....it's not relevant
Olivia wrote: "But saying that its all American teens is generalization."It doesn't really matter to me whether they are American or British. They are not that often people for whom English is a foreign language. And they are often teenagers.
Yes because "feels" is a term in the fangirl community. It was created by English speakers.
Dustin wrote: "I must have missed that part of the Frank diary."There are more "clean" and more explicit editions of the diary out there. I can't remember which one I read. Mr. Frank censored it, I believe.
Olivia wrote: "Yes because "feels" is a term in the fangirl community."Which is a very good reason not to read books that have many that kind of reviews. And that was my point to begin with.
Fine. Don't be a fangirl. It isn't my concern. But don't ignore books because of their fanbase.
Olivia wrote: "But don't ignore books because of their fanbase."Why shouldn't I? If there are lots of other books to read that I will probably enjoy more, more interesting and complicated books. Books that fangirls are not reading because they are more complicated.
ETA: If they read them, they should then be able to also express themselves better.
Fangirls read interesting and complicated books. I'm saying I DON'T CARE WHAT YOU READ IT IS YOUR CHOICE.
The fan base of a book doesn't determine how good it is! Who said that??? I mean, I know a lot of really smart people who enjoyed the hunger games, which in my opinion is high on the list of worst books I've ever read. Then there's lots of people I wouldn't ever hang around who say they love things like Harry potter! It just depends on your taste. I don't think anyone should be judging anyone for the way they're expressing themselves, or judging the books they read by the way that the readers express themselves. That's just stupid.
Oh, and don't even get me started on tfios. So many people who I know and love told me about how great, funny, sarcastic, and sad it was. I read it, and was soooo disappointed! It sucked, to say the least. Are you all seeing my point? Books do not necessarily correspond to their readers, and vice versa.
Margot wrote: "I don't think anyone should be judging anyone for the way they're expressing themselves"Well that's exactly the way you are going to be judged, at least online and also in real life. What else is there, really?
And actually you just proved my point. The Fault in Our Stars is one of those books I WON'T be reading, the same with the Hunger Games. I didn't get past the first chapter with Harry Potter.
At the moment I am very much enjoying Anna Karenina (I want to read it slowly) and wonder when I might read for example The Feast of the Goat. You see, no "feels" in those reviews.
Fangirls do understand complex books. There are multiple forums online where people join and pick apart books. I don't know what you think a fangirl is, but it isn't some mindless teenager going AAAAAHHH FEEELSS or Squeal!! And I loved The Fault In our Stars. I mostly liked the hunger games, but not the romance. Margot and I are still both friends. And fangirls for different things.
And the person with the sheep profile (it won't show the whole name) containing Dumbledore's entire name In your user proves you are somewhat of a fangirl.
Tytti, you're reading Anna Karenina? Oh my gosh! I loved that book! I have literally read it two and a half times! Unfortunately, I had the ending spoiled for me by an accidentally indiscreet person who shall remain nameless, so I only got about halfway through the first time. Anyway, how are you liking it? I'm sorry, but I just cannot accept that Vronsky is just so in love with Anna that he refuses to realize that he's ruining her life, and by doing that that he is deemed a good person! That's horrible! Whatever happened to 'if you love them, let them go?' Truly awful. I would also like to say, however, that the way that we express ourselves has nothing to do with how we experience and the depth of our understanding of books. I may say things like 'oh my gosh!' or use the word like in an ungrammatical context every couple sentences, but do you think that that limits my capacity to enjoy and understand books like Animal Farm, Catcher in the Rye, The Odyssey, or Anna Karenina, which, by the way, are some of my favorite books? You may think that's right, but I know that it's wrong. My intelligence wasn't affected by the people around me. That honor belongs to my speech patterns.
It's like saying a person with a cockney accent is not intelligent because of how they speak.
oh my god. seriously, how did the conversation take a turn about fangirling?
Belle wrote: "oh my god. seriously, how did the conversation take a turn about fangirling?"I'd rather talk hippos but as Anamika does not seem able to play ball there are better things to discuss than her unexplained hatred for Anne Frank and her diary.
Anamika, I think that most people that are still posting, if not all, have stated their opinion. Since people keep posting while waiting for your reasons, it's only natural that the topics being debated deviate from your original question. I think you'd have a right to complain if, for example, you had stated your reasons and people were ignoring you for the sake of discussing something else. The one person with the power to make the conversation stay on topic is you, by giving us our reasons, so I'd say that you're powerless for a week more, sorry. Till then, nationalities, culture, fauna and whatever else comes to mind are all fair game.
Read my post again, please. I didn't say that you were helpless at all or powerless in absolute terms, only powerless to stop us from discussing whatever we please, while waiting for your reasons. And though I don't have the time to compile a list of your mistakes, you forgot the verb on your last post.
Olivia, Anamika whenever they question her use of the english language she says "she is not taking English as a second language" which shows she lives in the US, as you most know ESL is a course for non english speakers. But she has never stated that english is her first language. That in itself and her use of the language, tells me that in fact english is not her first language. She may have even been born in the US, but still speaks another language at home-- that would make english her second language ( she is clearly not bilingual or very young). And when I say that I don't know anyone over 100… I was Precisely referring to your defensive comment that the USA is a relative young country (there was a little sarcasm in my comment). I am a USA citizen, attended a Seven Sister College in the US, went to Law School in Puerto Rico, spent all my summers in France for most of my life, have lived in Italy, Ireland and Germany and now I am in Corsica. My theory is that, we are as old as our age… living in an 800 year old city, does not automatically make you more mature or more cultured. I find the whole "relatively young country" argument silly, when you considered that it was founded by Europeans by western standards, and not by the American Indians attempting to be European. It is used as an insult by Europeans and an excuse by US people.
Maria wrote: "Tytti wrote: "Yeah, they showed women's breasts in the movie, big deal. They can show naked people at any time in Finnish tv, and kids don't get traumatized. But with "all" that nakedness and sex (..." Good point!
Mae wrote: "Olivia, Anamika whenever they question her use of the english language she says "she is not taking English as a second language" which shows she lives in the US, as you most know ESL is a course fo..."oh my god. why do you even care? you can see it bugs her when you say that, so why do you keep saying it? We get it, English is probably not Anamika's first language.
Maria wrote: "Olivia - i didn´t saw any attack on US people or the likes of it! Stupid and rude people are everywhere, in the US, Europe, Latin America, India, etc. I´m from and european country, do not think my..."Totally agree!!!!!!
Maria wrote: "Dustin wrote: "Tytti wrote: Maria wrote: "the thing that amuses me to no end is the sex scandals in there" I must have missed that part of the Frank diary. Granted, I read the play based on the ..." There are some sexual references in the Diary… about her anatomy!!!! -- and in fact in the US some schools read a version of the diary in which these have been eliminated.
Margot wrote: "Tytti, you're reading Anna Karenina? Oh my gosh! I loved that book! I have literally read it two and a half times! Unfortunately, I had the ending spoiled for me by an accidentally indiscreet perso..." Actually this was very good Margot, I read Anna Karenina at 14, and the Idiot at 15… but I also read harlequin Romances in those days… I was reading close to 40 books a summer in my early teens… all genres… even read Cereal Boxes if needed. You are absolutely correct about the fangirl issue. Some people see things in compartments… and judge too harshly. I agree with you all on this one.
Belle, fYI if you haven't noticed before, english in NOT my first language, more like the third out of five. a point I already mentioned and you were quite rude about it… remember? By definition, in my personal dictionary, there is absolutely nothing wrong with english not being your first language. Anamika, I am not referring to grammatical errors… its about your usage of language! A topic that has been beaten almost to death on this thread.
Anamika wrote: "Mark wrote: "Belle wrote: "oh my god. seriously, how did the conversation take a turn about fangirling?"I'd rather talk hippos but as Anamika does not seem able to play ball there are better thin..."
Chere Anamika, your topic as you started it is as one dimensional as your explanations and smart people do need more imput/stimulus on the subject to stay on the subject which is: I hate this diary and I will explain myself later when I have the time.
Or do you HATE hippos too. That would make you detestable in my humble opinion.
Mark wrote: "Anamika wrote: "Mark wrote: "Belle wrote: "oh my god. seriously, how did the conversation take a turn about fangirling?"I'd rather talk hippos but as Anamika does not seem able to play ball there..."
I think Anamika is a girl's name. Otherwise, nothing to say
Anamika wrote: "Sorry about the grammatical mistakes.I was kind of in a hurry and not feeling well so I just typed everything that my fingers managed to.Well a few people have been defending me,I'm glad that you..."
"this thread was name…" this is not a typical Americanor UK construction, and this is not the only usage that is not typical. It could just be that you are really young. And I have no reason to try to hurt or offend you, so that is why I am only posting one.
Joana wrote: "Anamika, I think that most people that are still posting, if not all, have stated their opinion. Since people keep posting while waiting for your reasons, it's only natural that the topics being de..." good
Anamika has visited this page as follows:2 hrs 22mins ago
2 hrs 13mins ago
2 hrs 10mins ago
1 hr 47mins ago
1 hr 32mins ago
1 hrs 18mins ago
By my calculation that's SIX times in slightly less than 2.5 hours, Now - do you not think instead of all the silly comments about grammatical errors* (see my last line) and second language etc, an explanation could have been offered? Yes I think so too.....
I reckon she's holed up somewhere, maybe on the back end of the moon, frantically reading Anne Frank's diary in the vain hope of finding some justification for her hatred of it. Okay, right at the beginning she said she hadn't read it - and I think that was true, but I think she's now decided to read at least some of it in order to appease us.
Either that or she is, as I've suggested earlier, a CG robot....
Oh - Anamika - did you want us to go through all of your posts, proof read them and send them back to you corrected? I can only assume this is what your request to "pick out the grammatical errors" means
Trixie wrote: "Anamika has visited this page as follows:2 hrs 22mins ago
2 hrs 13mins ago
2 hrs 10mins ago
1 hr 47mins ago
1 hr 32mins ago
1 hrs 18mins ago
By my calculation that's SIX times in slightly l..." Actually she did say, earlier, that even after she read it she still hated it. But I had thought of the possibility that she is trying to reread it, and with her exams she has no extra time.
Margot wrote: "Tytti, you're reading Anna Karenina? Oh my gosh! I loved that book!"I don't want to read that too closely because I don't want to get spoiled.
Margot wrote: "the way that we express ourselves has nothing to do with how we experience and the depth of our understanding of books."
Yes you might be very intelligent but squealing "I love it! My Emotions!" doesn't tell that to a reader. If there are then some "adult" reviews telling me the book isn't very good, all those 5-star ratings from teen(girl)s don't make me pick it up. It doesn't matter what they have also read, they get judged by what they have written in that specific review. As far as I know, they might write the same to every book and give them all 5 stars.
Olivia M wrote: "It's like saying a person with a cockney accent is not intelligent because of how they speak."
You can say smart things with a cockney accent. "My feels" isn't really smart.
Babafaba wrote: "But most of the fangirls don't even understand how bad the writing of a book really is, the usually care only for the romance that's responsible for the "feels"."That is my "fear", too. I read Gone with the Wind when I was eleven and even then, even if I enjoyed the "romance" (if you can call it that), I thought it was more of a survival story. I admired Scarlett's strength. (There's hunger games for you: a 19-year-old pampered girl takes care of the whole plantation and feeds everyone around her, even her "love interest" who isn't much of a help.) There has to be something more than romance in a book to make it interesting. And even an otherwise good book can be ruined by the mandatory romance if it feels forced.
Tytti wrote: "Margot wrote: "Tytti, you're reading Anna Karenina? Oh my gosh! I loved that book!"I don't want to read that too closely because I don't want to get spoiled.
Margot wrote: "the way that we expre..." Tytti, I get what you are trying to say. But, the fact that a teenager, uses the expression Oh my gosh, or reads fangirl books, does not define the person or their intelligence, you are not doing yourself a favor, judging people period. Or judging a book by who reads it, for that matter. I have met brilliant children that speak like their silly peers, and yet are capable of highly intelligent discussions and deep comprehensions of highly difficult issues. I have also met brilliant human beings that have not had the privilege of being well educated. And I am not talking about students in the USA, I am speaking of aboriginals in the South American Amazonian jungle. I have also met Europeans and so called intellectuals that are only capable of derivative speech. And finally, saying something stirs your emotions and your feelings should not imply not being smart. Poetry is in my opinion one the highest levels of literature, feelings )not necessarily love) is inherent in its message. Art, even conceptual, stirs emotions. When I was young I made fun of people who went to galleries and talked about emotions and feelings, I was an expert, knew about the artist and his/her work. I could only listen to serious comments. As I grew older, I realized that honest feelings and reactions along with some intelligent talk is better than derivative and pompous "connoisseurs" - whether its art or literature.
Mae wrote: "Tytti wrote: "Margot wrote: "Tytti, you're reading Anna Karenina? Oh my gosh! I loved that book!"I don't want to read that too closely because I don't want to get spoiled.
Margot wrote: "the way..."
Brilliant!
You have the wrong definition of fangirls. Fangirls DO NOT just care about the romance. I don't like romance. The fangirls of: The Mortal Instruments, Twilight
Mae wrote: "And finally, saying something stirs your emotions and your feelings should not imply not being smart."If you look at the default reviews of for example TFIOS, you'll see what I mean. No way I will ever be reading that, I hate tearjerkers. (I rarely like bestsellers, either.)
First and foremost: i have no opposition to the language difference discussion. My original comment had nothing to do with Anamika's writing style. And I like hippos. Okay. That is out of the way.
You have the wrong notion of fangirls. Fangirls are not mindless. Fangirls DO NOT read just for the romance. Fangirls of The Mortal Instruments, Twilight, Percy Jackson, and the hunger games are a different breed, I will grant you that. Like other humans, fangirls can understand complex plots and appreciate beautiful writing. If you read some reviews of books, you will notice this. Some people just add mindless praise, but if you look for more reviews than 5, you will see that people love books like The Fault In Our Stars for a multitude of reasons, be it the writing, the tragedy, the story, or, yes the romance. Fangirls are people with depth. Just because fangirls use a phrase that makes little sense to describe their feelings caused buy an author is no reason that they do not feel or understand the language or implications or metaphors.
Tytti wrote: "Mae wrote: "And finally, saying something stirs your emotions and your feelings should not imply not being smart."If you look at the default reviews of for example TFIOS, you'll see what I mean. ..."
Interesting response Titty… "I hate tearjerkers". Maybe we have to start a whole knew thread. Why do we "hate" books, any book. There are some really good tearjerkers out there, some that are even classics. For me Romeo and Juliet, yes the play by William Shakespeare, is probably the biggest tearjerker ever and I loved it!!! oops, emotions!. And the Diary, made me cry almost throughout the whole book. Maybe we are getting somewhere here. Maybe at 53 I could start my own fanwomen group. Older ex-intellectuals that want to be free to read whatever, whenever and oh my gosh, love books. Wait, that is what Goodreads is.
I was going to ask what exactly is a Fangirl? A sure sign of ageing is not knowing, or understanding new street language - however, girls. before you rush to provide me with a definition here it is....http://www.urbandictionary.com/define...
LOVE this definition - it conjures up a wonderful mental picture......
Trixie wrote: "I was going to ask what exactly is a Fangirl? A sure sign of ageing is not knowing, or understanding new street language - however, girls. before you rush to provide me with a definition here it i..."LOL (in upper case, on purpose). I wish I did that when I sat across the table from Gabriel Garcia Marques!!! I think he would have loved it. And, yep, he is a Novel prize winner. He made us laugh to tears, talking about how the experts interpreted his books and how different is was from the reason why he said some things.
Please don't use that definition..... Fangirls are people who are obsessed with certain books/shows/movies. They talk about said topics and are very excited when their "fandom" is brought up. That definition is funny, but not complete. (Hugh jackman?? Psshhh)
Olivia wrote: "Please don't use that definition..... Fangirls are people who are obsessed with certain books/shows/movies. They talk about said topics and are very excited when their "fandom" is brought up. That ..."Sorry Olivia, but that IS a definition, whether you like it or not.
Urban dictionary is less reliable than Wikipedia.
You think Wikipedia is reliable? Hahah - if only....Some of it is, but chunks of it are not. However, the mental picture the Urban dictionary conjures up pleases me and is, actually, what I assumed "fangirls" to be - just from reading about them on this thread. I confess to never having heard the word prior to yesterday.
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It still sounds stupid.