Watcha Doin' - 2017.1 edition Showing 4,551-4,600 of 5,020

[Kristie, Moderator]

Cody wrote: "@Kristie, what does the I mean?"

The I is for intersex. So LGBTQI is an acronym for lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, questioning (or queer), intersex

[Cody]

Kristie wrote: "Cody wrote: "@Kristie, what does the I mean?"

The I is for intersex. So LGBTQI is an acronym for lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, questioning (or queer), intersex"

Thank you :)

[Sarah]

I didn't realise Q was for questioning. I thought it was queer too. Generally the word is frowned upon here yet people within the gay community use it. That said, one of my friends who is a lesbian refers to herself as a lesser and a lesbo too which anyone else wouldn't get away with.

The Q and I are quite recent additions here. I'm really interested in the intetsex term and what it means and have read a number of articles on it this last year. I had no idea that such a significant percentage of people are born with both male and female genetalia (apparently about the same amount as people with red hair) and that it is doctor's who decide when they are still very young what sex they are going to be and operate on them.

Anyway, I'm surprised that "gender neutral" hasn't been included in the acronymn yet.

[Kristie, Moderator]

That's an interesting thought about gender neutral, Sarah. I wonder if it's because gender neutral doesn't necessarily refer to a person's sexuality, but to their fitting into societal expectations of what it means to be male/female. I think gender neutral is more just not wanting to be labeled and having those expectations placed upon you.

[Sarah]

Perhaps but then transgender and intersex don't necessarily have anything to do with sexuality either. They just don't identify with the gender they were born to (or chosen for them). Sure some T and I people will also be L or G but they are seperate.

[Travis]

No more letters. Gonna have the whole alphabet on there. How about LGBT and all the rest. You know like how they originally didn't give Mary Ann and the professor they're names just and the rest in the opening of Gilligan's Island. Of course eventually they did add the professor and Mary Ann

[Kristie, Moderator]

I get that too, Sarah, but I think the difference is the social aspect. With transgender, they feel they were born the wrong gender. With intersex, they have anatomy from both genders. With gender neutral, they just don't want a label or don't feel they fit into gender stereotypes. Those stereotypes are externally based, versus internal. They may or may not also fit into other LGBTQI categories. I suppose it could be added as they don't identify with either gender. I don't really have a strong opinion on whether it should be added or not to be honest. I'm just not sure they want that as a label.

I know of people that are raising their kids as "gender neutral" meaning they buy typically gender oriented toys for either gender (e.g. dolls for boys) or let them wear whatever clothes they want, etc. Basically, they just mean that they aren't going to let gender stereotypes lead their parenting and their children can have any interests they want. That doesn't make the child gender neutral though. They may be a little girl that is rough and tumble, playing with trucks and climbing trees, but they still feel they are female.

Ok, so that was a long rambling explanation of my thoughts, which still ends up with me not having a strong opinion on the matter of adding it or not. lol

[Peggy]

The latest one I have come across is LGBTQIAP+

Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender and Two-spirited, Queer and Questioning, Intersex, Asexual, Pansexual and other marginalized orientations/identities.

[Kristie, Moderator]

Oh yes, Peggy. I forgot about the +. That’s been there for a while. I’ve seen it with the A & P as well. I think it’s just less common to see, but would incorporate everyone, I think.

[Margo]

@kristie - Haven't had chance to read through the entire thread yet but want to say that but i think you expressed it all very well. I am v close to a trans/inter person and that is pretty much what they tell me. But yeah, i get fed up with all the labelling. We are all somewhere on an infinate spectrum of sexuality and humans were never designed to fit into a tick box for the convenience of marketing departments!

I am hunkering down for a long wait at my spine docters clinic. Last time i waited nearly 1.5 hours - lots of time to catch up online ;-)

[Peggy]

I wouldn't be surprised if more letters were added in the future. Not so long ago we were satisfied with just lgbt.

I don't really understand pansexuality. Isn't it falling for personality regardless of sex? I just see a lot of overlap with bisexuality. Maybe pansexuals would also fall for people who don't identify as male or female, but that would make bisexuality more like a subgroup of pansexuality.

Do you also have discussions about gender neutral toilets in public buildings and gender neutral announcements at for example train stations?

[Margo]

Why would an announcement at a train station be gender specigic peggy?

[Margo]

We have had those sort of discusdions over toilets in ireland. More interesting is the question of fathers bringiny toddles into mens toilets. Why do men need urinals anyway? It is surely preferable to pee alone?

[Lisa]

Margo wrote: "Why would an announcement at a train station be gender specigic peggy?"

I guess it's because they usually say "Ladies and Gentlemen" in announcements. There is debate in some quarters as to whether the wording should be changed so that people who are gender neutral or gender fluid are included.

I agree with your comment about being fed up with all the labelling. I think human sexuality is too complex and in some cases, too fluid, to fit neatly inside a box.

Good luck at your appointment!

[Lisa]

Peggy wrote: "I wouldn't be surprised if more letters were added in the future. Not so long ago we were satisfied with just lgbt.

I don't really understand pansexuality. Isn't it falling for personality regard..."

Peggy, I seem to remember there being debates about gender neutral toilets here in the UK. I know there are a few places that have them. Not sure about station announcements though.

[Travis]

I took my son and daughter in a restroom. All three of us went into the same stall obviously that's kind of the point of taking them rather than letting them go. Anyway. We walked out of the stall and there's a bunch of guys in there and one guy washing his hands looks at me and says nice work there dad.

[Lisa]

Peggy wrote: "I wouldn't be surprised if more letters were added in the future. Not so long ago we were satisfied with just lgbt.

I don't really understand pansexuality. Isn't it falling for personality regard..."

There is some overlap between bisexuality and pansexuality, Peggy. In both instances, people who identify as being either bisexual or pansexual can become romantically and sexually attracted to both males and females. However, a pansexual can also become attracted to people who identify as gender neutral, gender fluid, androgynous etc.

[Peggy]

Yes, it would be like 'Dear Travelers' instead of 'Ladies and Gentlemen'.

I think some organisations started incorporating this. Gender neutral toilets in a few places too, but there are also many people who think it's nonsense and also a few (women mostly) who say it would make them feel uncomfortable. We saw quite a few of those in Norway.

Lol, my bf just told me he heard today on the news that the most annoying word of 2017 (there's an election every year) is gender neutral.

[Peggy]

Lisa, that's how I understand it too, which thus basically makes bisexuality a subdivision of pansexuality.

[Lisa]

Peggy wrote: "Lisa, that's how I understand it too, which thus basically makes bisexuality a subdivision of pansexuality."

Yes, that's very true.

[Sarah]

That makes sense Kristie.

I agree that there is too much of a desire by some to label things which aren't necessary.

When i was at uni the toilets of the SU were unisex. There is one at a cafe i go to regularly. Let's leave them as unisex toilets and not label them gender neutral. I don't mind using toilets like that. I think it makes more sense anyway. I have often used men's toilets because when out at clubs and gigs etc there are always queues for the ladies. Seems stupid toilets going unused in another room.

[Lisa]

Sarah wrote: "That makes sense Kristie.

I agree that there is too much of a desire by some to label things which aren't necessary.

When i was at uni the toilets of the SU were unisex. There is one at a cafe i ..."

I've used men's toilets a few times too when the queue for the ladies was ridiculously long and there was no one in the mens. Sometimes it's just got to be done.

[Kristie, Moderator]

I think there may be some places you can get in some sort of legal trouble for using the men's toilets here in the US if you're a woman and vice versa. I'm not sure if that's actually a law or if it was just some states trying to make it a law. Either way, it is frowned upon in many places. Ridiculous.

[Janice, Moderator]

Peggy wrote: "Yes, it would be like 'Dear Travelers' instead of 'Ladies and Gentlemen'.

I think some organisations started incorporating this. Gender neutral toilets in a few places too, but there are also man..."

How about a tone to get people's attention and then broadcast the announcement? I've been in several airports where you hear a tone over the PA and then, "Do not leave your luggage unattended, blah, blah..."

[Janice, Moderator]

Kristie wrote: "I think there may be some places you can get in some sort of legal trouble for using the men's toilets here in the US if you're a woman and vice versa. I'm not sure if that's actually a law or if i..."

Wasn't there a bunch of fearmongering suggesting that if you allow transgendered people to use the women's washroom, there is a risk of sexual predators abusing women and girls? I thought it was the most ridiculous argument.

[Peggy]

Janice, yes, a tone would work just as well I think.

[Kristie, Moderator]

A lot of places already say, "Attention, Passengers."

And, yes, Janice. That's still the argument. It's really just ridiculous. They claim that men will pretend to be transgendered in order to use the women's room and gain access to women and girls.

I read a story a while back where a girl was trying to use a women's room and security removed her. They thought she was a male. She and her friend were arguing that she is a female, born female, etc, but the security guard didn't believe her and refused to let her use the bathroom. I want to say it was in one of the Carolinas. I was so upset reading the article. I can't even imagine how embarrassing that was for the poor girl. How is she even supposed to prove that she is who she says without dropping her drawers?! I thought it was so awful. The US has taken so many steps backward recently. Sad, really.

[Sarah]

I'd have dropped my drawers and pissed on the security guard if that had been me. It would have served him right. Actually, I probably would have been as mortified as that poor girl was. But i'd have wished i'd done the former.

[Margo]

Peggy wrote: "Yes, it would be like 'Dear Travelers' instead of 'Ladies and Gentlemen'.

I think some organisations started incorporating this. Gender neutral toilets in a few places too, but there are also man..."

Oh, that makes sense - over here they never they say "ladies and gentlemen" it's something like "attention all passingers". Much more appropriate ;-)

[Margo]

Kristie wrote: "A lot of places already say, "Attention, Passengers."

And, yes, Janice. That's still the argument. It's really just ridiculous. They claim that men will pretend to be transgendered in order to use..."

Oh that's awful! Didn't that happen to an olympic athleth too! Competed as a woman and when she won - i think it running- they decided she looked too masculine and sent her off for genitic testing which proved , some time later, she was female.

[Lisa]

Margo wrote: "Kristie wrote: "A lot of places already say, "Attention, Passengers."

And, yes, Janice. That's still the argument. It's really just ridiculous. They claim that men will pretend to be transgendered..."

Yes, that is Caster Semenya, who competes for South Africa. She is a runner and won the gold medal in last year's Olympics. I felt really sorry for her having to go through all that testing. It must have been so uncomfortable for her, all the world's media watching her and pointing the finger. Yes, she has quite masculine features and I think I remember reading that the tests did reveal that she was producing more testosterone than the average woman does, but that can and does happen in some women. The tests ultimately proved that she is a woman but there are still plenty of people who think she shouldn't be allowed to compete because she has an unfair advantage. I think it's all a load of nonsense myself. Why shouldn't she be allowed to compete? If she wasn't allowed to compete that would be the end of her career because she can't compete in the men's races either because she isn't a man.

[Travis]

Old man winter showed up. Can't say as though I've missed him. Sure it's only 6" but it's 6" more snow than I really needed. Lol

[Kristie, Moderator]

I just saw this article and thought it was interesting to see some 2017 books that are going to be made into movies. Hope the link works. I’m on my phone. https://www.bookstr.com/7-books-from-...

[Kristie, Moderator]

I remember that too Margo & Lisa. How awful. They basically just told her that she looked too manly.

Travis - Glad we haven’t gotten snow yet! My hubby and I moved further south last year just to get away from so much snow. We still enjoy having the seasons, just a bit less winter.

[Janice, Moderator]

Old Man Winter must have moved from here to there. We haven't had snow over the last week and temps above freezing.

[Peggy]

He's coming here too. Nowhere near 6", but 2" are predicted for the weekend. That's pretty impressive for the Netherlands. Yuk, I hate it. I'm glad it's on a Sunday and will probably have all disappeared by Monday morning.

[Lisa]

Peggy wrote: "He's coming here too. Nowhere near 6", but 2" are predicted for the weekend. That's pretty impressive for the Netherlands. Yuk, I hate it. I'm glad it's on a Sunday and will probably have all disap..."

And here. Large parts of the UK could get snow over the next few days. It probably won't amount to more than a couple of cm, but the way the press, media and weather forecasters are carrying on, you would think we are due to get 20ft!

[Peggy]

I had to cycle through the snow this morning! It didn't stay on the ground luckily, but the flakes were very cold and felt very sharp. We also have strong wind at the moment. I wonder why I even went to work instead of working from home today, especially since I'm the only one in the office!

[Sarah]

We have hailstones as I am writing this. It's pretty cold outside today and it's supposed to stay that way for the next week. And we have some snow forecast too - Monday it says heavy snow. But the day before it's due to rain and later in the day after the heavy snow too. So I don't think it will stick around if we do end up getting some. As long as it stays long enough for me to take some pictures. We've not had a snowy winter on the boat yet.

[Rusalka, Moderator]

Peggy wrote: "I don't really understand pansexuality. Isn't it falling for personality regardless of sex? I just see a lot of overlap with bisexuality. Maybe pansexuals would also fall for people who don't identify as male or female, but that would make bisexuality more like a subgroup of pansexuality. "

My understanding it is it's people who are not attracted to genders, but whoever they are attracted too. No matter their bits, or their sexuality.

It'd be nice really if we all ended up thinking this way. You love who you love. People may have likes and preferences one way or another, but people aren't hung up on labels and the like. Just whomever you are attracted to and click with is fine by society's standard. Would make life so much less complicated.

[Rusalka, Moderator]

For about 15 years here in Canberra, the law has been you can go into whatever change room or toilet you identify with. I can assure some pollies that the world hasn't collapsed and we've functioned quite fine

We don't have gender neutral toilets usually, however, we do like everywhere does. Like, you go to a small restaurant/cafe right. And there is one toilet. Do you say it's a gender neutral toilet? Or is it just the toilet? Again, overcomplicating things. A toilet is a toilet, it's not really somewhere you want to spend too much time in.

[Rusalka, Moderator]

Enjoy all your snow everyone!

We've had a wet start to summer, with nearly a month's rain in a couple of days. The tomatoes are loving it, but my beloved berries are a bit water damaged.

[Margo]

Yay, no hard border in in ireland :-D A step back into tue last century has been avoided! Great news.

[Margo]

On the minus side - i don't get to build a snowman :(

[Margo]

Rusalka wrote: "For about 15 years here in Canberra, the law has been you can go into whatever change room or toilet you identify with. I can assure some pollies that the world hasn't collapsed and we've functione..."

And in hospitals - everyone shares a toilet there with no issues, right?

[Rusalka, Moderator]

Margo wrote: "Yay, no hard border in in ireland :-D A step back into tue last century has been avoided! Great news."

Fantastic! Common sense wins!

[Rusalka, Moderator]

Margo wrote: "And in hospitals - everyone shares a toilet there with no issues, right?"

Exactly!

[Peggy]

I'm preparing myself for a second cycling trip through the snow. This will be one of those weekends where you just stay warm and cozy inside. We're having friends over tonight for boardgames and beers, I'm so glad it's at our place!

[Travis]

You need snow Margo. I've probably got 10 dump trucks worth already piled up

[Margo]

Ooh - make a snowman for me travis pleeease????

Correction - SNOWPERSON?

maybe SNOWBEING?