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Writing / crit groups.
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Not used either myself. I understand the principle of expecting participation in return for a critique, but humour is such a mercurial property that you need reviews from like minds.Hope your dogs are weighted down, it's still blowing a gale here.
This is what I'm thinking, James. And, I'm not saying my work is anything half decent, but honestly - there is some real pish out there. I kinda feel I'm wasting my time reviewing some of the stuff that's been taking up my time.I'm thinking of letting my subscription lapse and concentrating on just banging out 'SS' as a complete first draft and then revisiting, instead of constantly taking various comments on board and seemingly forever editing instead of writing.
Yeah - think I'll concentrate on the folks in this wee group. I know all your comments would be valid as everyone has a proven track record and I've read, or at least downloaded and have in a queue, just about all the CLOGGERS' books.
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Rob wrote: "Ages ago, I put a few chapters of UH on Write On, which is also used by Ray Holland and several other former Authonomites. However, since I haven't been the least bit active there, I have neither g..."Cheers Rob,
Do you just use pals and CLOGGERS for feedback?
I was only with Authonomy for about 6 months before it folded, which I still feel guilty about. But there were a few 'trusted' reviewers on there that offered some solid support and tips.
Scribo has a few I use to bounce ideas off, but it can take absolutely ages for your work to get to the top of the queue for a review. Critique Circle seems to populated by a mix of terribly serious, almost 'snobby' writers ..... and a bunch of psychopathic trolls.
And Booksie, I think, seems like a reincarnation of Wattpad, where you are likely to get a lot of hits on your piece, but very little in the way of feedback.
Ah well - head down and press onwards and sidways.
Cee Tee - I think you're better off sticking with your old CLOG pals. We write comedy so we're more familiar with the problem of weaving humour into a story. When you have something you're happy with you can always bang it over to me and I'll happily give you my comments.
There's a big problem with feedback. People have such varied views which range from sensible to completely barking. If you happen to be swayed by barking mad feedback you're done for ... dead in the water ... game over ... end of.
Corben wrote: "Cee Tee - I think you're better off sticking with your old CLOG pals. We write comedy so we're more familiar with the problem of weaving humour into a story. When you have something you're happy w..."
Cheers Corben,
Barking feedback may have helped with my first effort, but I think you're dead right with your comment.
I need to crack on with SS and the feedback I've had from Cloggers to date has been excellent. And the thing is, I feel I can trust those comments.
You guys totally rock! (Sigh.)
Thank you Corben. I'll batter on and then take you up on your offer. Cheers.
Can I upload a 900 word article for you funny men to comment upon. I promise not to sulk.
Thanks, Corben. I'm a bit new these groupy things. How do I get the file into the comments panel. It won't let me paste.
It's probably the size of the chunk. There is a character limit. You might have to break it into sections over a couple of posts.. I've just done a paste test and that was fine.
Mod
However... the danger with working with a relatively small group is that writing stuff they happen to like can lead to a misguided sense of confidence. We're relatively like-minded people here, so we're probably not representative of the broader market. For that reason, it's probably no bad thing to cast your net more widely in the hope of gathering broader feedback. Yes, there could be a lot of dross, but chance remarks can often be very useful. I didn't agree with a lot of the stuff that people said on Autho, but there was definitely some good stuff mixed in amongst it.
Readers ad feedback is always difficult. I'm really lucky that I have a few beta readers who I really trust, and an editor and publisher who I can bounce ideas off. As an aside, my next opus has an acknowledgement to Corbyn and the Cloggers as a few of you read my short stories, and young Master Duke read the whole damn thing. Now Im going to watch some Laurel and Hardyy to pick up some ideas for a slapstick scene my editor wants.
Mod
That’ll come in handy (The beginning)My mother was a hoarder. The cupboards in her flat were full of objects she regarded as useful. ‘That’ll come in handy,‘ she would say. Bottles, jars, wrapping paper and string were all neatly stored away for one day in the future when they would be put into service. I can see her now, laboriously unpicking the knots in string, chuckling with satisfaction as she rolled it into a tidy ball and placed it in the biscuit tin with a final chuckle ‘That’ll come in handy.’
The habit lingered until her death in the summer of 2003. I had the mammoth task of clearing out her belongings from the council flat in Weston Super Mare. Nearly two skips were filled with That’ll come in handy stuff. I remember hesitating over a square biscuit tin. The lid was jammed tight but I didn’t need to open it. Shaking the tin confirmed my memory of an assortment of ribbons and balls of string. Absent mindedly I put it in the boot of my car thinking - That’ll come in handy.
A week before Christmas whilst having a clear-out I stumbled upon the dust covered biscuit tin in the attic, I realised this Come in handy tin of string hadn’t been called upon to give service during the seven years since my mother’s departure. The lid wouldn’t budge, without further thought I dropped it into the dustbin.
Great start, Gordon. It's a situation very familiar to most people, so the reader is likely to be engaged from the off. And I want to know what's in the biscuit tin. In fact I have to know. So you've hooked me.A couple of things. The sentence that starts 'A week before Christmas ...' could be improved. It's a bit tangled, like the string. And I'd personally like a little more comedy in the discoveries you made when sorting through your mother's things. Did she store half sucked mint imperials? Did she save any really weird things?
Looking forward to more.
Rob wrote: "CT. To answer your question, I mainly rely on you guys, on Ray Holland (who is also marvellous) and another former Authonomite who writes under the name Maurice R. I'm reading his latest now. The m..."Valid point, Rob. It had crossed my mind, but I guess it's a case weighting the trust of those you 'know' against the words of some points-grabbing troll.
Bottom line - I / we should be writing stories that we as the authors are happy with, so perhaps ALL feedback, even the plain crazy, could help achieve that aim. Just having the confidence to recognize what is helpful an what is plain stupid may be the tricky bit.
Maybe I'll do another year with Scribo .... but if ok with the folk in this group, I'll be leaning more in this direction.
Cheers Rob.
Mod
Gordon wrote: "That’ll come in handy (The beginning)My mother was a hoarder. The cupboards in her flat were full of objects she regarded as useful. ‘That’ll come in handy,‘ she would say. Bottles, jars, wrapping..."
Interesting.
Our Diane would testify to my being of the same ilk. She calls it 'hoarding.' I say it's 'collecting.' There's a difference. A big one. My collections of vinyl records, books, magazines and football programmes will 'come in handy' when I'm old(er) and maybe have some time to enjoy them. More - they may even attract value.
Sorry - a little'vent' there. Point is - I can identify.
Reading of other people's lives is generally pretty interesting - I think we all have a touch of the Nosey Parker in us. So even something like your opening is likely to entice the reader to delve further.
Immediately, I'm wondering if you regret dumping the tin, and in what circumstance you might do so.
Regards the writing, the only little points I'd make would be to review using the word ''chuckle' twice within a couple of lines; I'd maybe break into shorter paragraphs, like a new one from 'I can see her now ...' etc. (but that's maybe just a wee personal foible of mine - others here may think differently.
I'd also surround the description 'that'll come in handy' with inverted commas.
As I said in my earlier message, I'm way behind with my reading and need to catch up, but if there's anything short & quick you'd like feedback on then I'll do what I can.
Cheers
Rob wrote: "Always happy to help. And I do think varied feedback helps. Trolls can be very annoying but sometimes it's the more savage stuff that proves useful in retrospect. I remember someone on Autho giving..."Thanks.
I've not ha experience of any trolls as such. Just inane comments such as why there were no females in a particular scene. and another saying having a female secretary was sexist!
:-D :-D
Gordon wrote: "That’ll come in handy (The beginning)My mother was a hoarder. The cupboards in her flat were full of objects she regarded as useful. ‘That’ll come in handy,‘ she would say. Bottles, jars, wrapping..."
It's a nice human story which many of us can relate to. A shade more sombre than most of the pieces we write, but holding and nicely structured. As others have said, watch out for repeated use of words within close proximity to themselves, and perhaps read it out loud to see where the natural pauses invite you to slip in a couple of commas. I think perhaps you could add a little more detail about her to add detail to the picture. 'Sweeping grey locks back from her forehead as she wound the string with aged fingers' or some such, for example.
Do you have a firm plan for what to do with the finished piece? Stand alone? Part of a series? Or some other purpose?
I still need to know what was in the biscuit tin. Gordon, where are you? I had a sleepless night worrying about that bloomin' tin. Was it a Dead Sea scroll? Maybe it was a fragment of an alien spaceship ... with weird powers. Or perhaps just biscuits.
Anyone seen Gordon and his mysterious biscuit tin? I'm going to finish the story off myself. It's either that or another sleepless night. I'm off for a biscuit ... think I'll have a Jammie Dodger. They're my favourite.
Careful Corben. It might be like Pandora's box. Or a portal to another world. We would miss you if you got pulled in and the lid slammed shut.
Corben wrote: "Anyone seen Gordon and his mysterious biscuit tin? I'm going to finish the story off myself. It's either that or another sleepless night. I'm off for a biscuit ... think I'll have a Jammie Dodger..."
The answer was posted yesterday, Corben, - in this thread, I think. But I don't see it anymore.
Guerrilla posts. Great marketing ploy.
Oh no. Does this mean I'm never going to find out what was inside Gordon's mum's biscuit tin? I wonder if it was a piece of paper with a string of numbers scrawled on it - the combination of a safe or co-ordinates and time of an alien invasion?
Firstly, apologies to Andy P an Kimmy - I've fallen WAY behind with my reading.Too much work and sport, I'm afraid. getting back on it now, although i appreciate you're both well past the stage of requiring feedback. (I will, of course post an Amazon review for 'Pussy Planet,' Kimmy.)
Part of the reason for falling behind is because I've re-visited the Scribo site and have posted a some work there to be critiqued. Which meant I had to read a lot of, quite frankly, very mixed submissions, in order to earn 'karma points' before I could submit my own work.
So here's the question: does anyone else subscribe to sites like Scribophile and Critique Circle, and do you think they are worthwhile as regards the feedback?
The idea of earning the right to post your own work is good - but I wonder how many critters actually crit the work because they are genuinely interested, or just banging something out so they get the points to spend.
Any other sites that Cloggers use?
Alright - gotta go. Bursting dogs to go see.
Laters.