THE WORLD WAR TWO GROUP discussion
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2016 - October - Theme Read on any Unit Involved in WW2 (unit history).
'Aussie Rick' wrote: "A bit of interesting information on the Volks-Grenadier Division of late 1944:"In all, three-fourths of the division's transport literally relied upon horsepower to move its stocks of food, ammunnition, and other supplies. To move everything, each Volks-Grenadier Division was authorized a total of 426 motor vehicles of all types, 119 motorcycles, and 1,142 horse-drawn wagons and trailers"
By comparison, what are the numbers for the motor pool of a U.S. Infantry division ?
According to the author an American infantry division "possessed as many as 1,440 motor vehicles".
Yesterday, I began reading the book '57th Fighter Group: First in the Blue' by Carl Molesworth. It's about one of the first United States Army Air Force (USAAF) fighter units to be deployed against the Germans, first seeing action in North Africa in September 1942 (in concert with Britain's Desert Air Force) and later taking part in the invasion of Sicily and the campaign in Italy. 
Today I finished reading "57th Fighter Group: First in the Blue" by Carl Molesworth.Feel free to check out my review.
The author of Victory Was Beyond Their Grasp has just finished discussing the fighting around Bergstein (Hurtgen Forest) which American forces took in early December 1944. The fighting was pretty bloody with heavy casualties on both sides:"When Hauptmann Rhein reported to the headquarters of the 89th Infantry Division at 1240 hours he had only 150 men remaining out of the 520 he had started with six hours before. At least seven German armored fighting vehicles lay smouldering on the field and in the town itself."
"The Americans had not gotten off lightly either. From 4 to 6 December, CCR lost twenty tanks and eleven tank destroyers in Bergstein. Most of the mechanized infantry companies of the 47th Armored Infantry had been reduced in size to platoons, one third of their authorized strength."
by Douglas E. Nash
KOMET wrote: "Today I finished reading "57th Fighter Group: First in the Blue" by Carl Molesworth.Feel free to check out my review.
[bookcover:57th Fighter Group: First in the ..."
Good review Komet, thanks for sharing your thoughts on the book with the group, much appreciated.
Started my theme read for the month:
Rogue Heroes: The History of the SAS, Britain's Secret Special Forces Unit That Sabotaged the Nazis and Changed the Nature of War I won a copy in the GR Giveaway program - an uncorrected proof. Sadly, it doesn't have the maps or photos which will likely appear in the retail published version. But it does have great stories:The very first combat mission of the SAS;
Operation Squatter
The wind had reached gale force by the time the bucking Bombays neared the Libyan coast, two and a half hours after take-off. Storm-driven sand and pelting rain completely obscured the flares on the ground, dropped by the Royal Air Force to guide the planes to the drop zone, 12 miles inland. The pilots could not even make out the shape of the shoreline. German searchlights on the coast picked out the incoming planes, and flak began exploding around them in blinding flashes. A shell ripped through the floor of one plane and missed the auxiliary fuel tank by inches. One of the sergeants made a joke which no one could hear, though, everyone grinned.
The pilots indicated that the parachutists should prepare to jump—although, in truth, they were now flying blind, navigating by guesswork. The parachute-canisters were tossed out first containing explosives, tommy guns, ammunition, food, water, maps, blankets and medical supplies.
Then, one by one, the men hurled themselves into the seething darkness.
From Rogue Heroes: The History of the SAS, Britain's Secret Special Forces Unit That Sabotaged the Nazis and Changed the Nature of War, the founder of the SAS:The nurses in the hospital knew him well, for he frequently popped in during the morning, whey-faced and liverish, to request a blast from the oxygen bottle to cure his hangover. Before his parachute jump landed him in hospital, he had been under investigation to establish whether he was malingering and ought to be court-martialed. His fellow officers found him charming and entertaining; his senior commanders, for the most part, regarded him as impertinent, incompetent and profoundly irritating. On completing officer training, he had received a blunt appraisal: “irresponsible and unremarkable.”
Lieutenant David Stirling of the Scots Guards was not a conventional soldier.
Great stories Mike, its been released over here in card cover, maybe I will need to buy a copy!
Looks like a very interesting book Nita, I am sure a few group members will be keen to hear your thoughts on the book.
Finished
Rogue Heroes: The History of the SAS, Britain's Secret Special Forces Unit That Sabotaged the Nazis and Changed the Nature of War. Highly recommended. I am in awe of these men and what they did. Non-stop action from the deserts of North Africa to Italy to France and into Germany.
Damn you Mike, now I will have to go buy a copy, if I get in trouble off my wife I'll blame you :)
Not sure but I think this book will qualify. I just started reading
Ship of Ghosts: The Story of the USS Houston, FDR's Legendary Lost Cruiser, and the Epic Saga of Her Survivors by James D. Hornfischer.
It will be a fine book for the theme read Doreen, I hope you enjoy it, keep us all posted.
Completed this one, author stopped by here awhile back. A Mexican American Unit in the Ital Campaign, Rapido River especially.
Ship of Ghosts: The Story of the USS Houston, FDR's Legendary Lost Cruiser, and the Epic Saga of Her Survivors The crew of the USS Houston was made up of a hardy and diverse group of men. Many of the older sailors were dear friends of FDR.
Never read James D. Hornfischer but many of you consistently rate his books highly.
He is good - I think I've read all of his and haven't read a bad or even mediocre one.FWIW, it seems he is Ian W. Toll's mentor.
Interesting enough, my book on the 272nd VGD has a cross over with another unit history from one of the authors in this group. The Battle of Bergstein and Castle Hill involved the US Army 2nd Ranger Battalion which was the focus of Patrick K. O'Donnell's book; Dog Company.
Dog Company: The Boys of Pointe du Hoc--the Rangers Who Accomplished D-Day's Toughest Mission and Led the Way across Europe by Patrick K. O'DonnellThe German officer commanding the defence in this battle, Hauptmann Adolf Thomae, was awarded the Knights Cross for heroism and his battalion's performance from 5 to 8 December.
4ZZZ wrote: "Never read James D. Hornfischer but many of you consistently rate his books highly." You will really enjoy his books they are amazingly engaging.
Good catch on the cross reference AR.'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Interesting enough, my book on the 272nd VGD has a cross over with another unit history from one of the authors in this group. The Battle of Bergstein and Castle Hill involved the US Army 2nd Range..."
Just finished
Steel Inferno: I Ss Panzer Corps In Normandy; I think it was a case of "it's not you, it's me" - I was just unable to get behind it, although I'm sure it was a good book. I'll have to revisit it in the future.
Hi Jonny, I have four of this author's books on units of the Waffen-SS and they are interesting books but not always the best reads if that makes any sense.
I liked this account from my book on the 272nd VGD which highlights the selfless devotion to comrades that is common amongst front-line soldiers in all armies:"Despite the danger, the men worked throughout the long nights to retrieve their comrades' bodies. One man in particular, Gefreiter Rudolf Schniesko of the company trains, was cited for his dedication to duty. He volunteered for the work despite the fact that he had a duty position in the rear area and did not have to face the hazards of front-line combat. He did not stop until all of the casualties were brought back, even though he was lightly wounded in the effort. For his steadfastness in a particularly difficult and gruesome mission, he was awarded the War Service Cross, 2nd Class with Swords by Hauptmann Heldt
Some interesting tactics used by the Germans during the fighting for the village of Kesternich during the American drive to the Roer dams:"The Germans used Panzerfausts as indirect fire weapons to create tree bursts that had a devastating effect on troops moving through the orchards on the town's western outskirts. Another German tactical innovation that made the fighting even more difficult involved the remote firing of machine guns using a system of wires and pulleys operated by Volksgrenadiers from cover several meters away."
4ZZZ wrote: "Thanks Rick. Much appreciated.Not that this matters at all but just a passing comment the image you have found has reprint in the bottom corner. My book is also a reprint and is the same cover bu..."
When I was in Queensland I always went to Nambour Book Exchange.
Creative use of the Panzerfaust. In another Nash book, Hell's Gate, a large group of bedraggled, retreating German infantry are trapped against a freezing, raging river. Still the T34s stay afar.
I just picked up Ray Ellis' Once a Hussar: A Memoir of Battle, Capture, and Escape in World War II.It's a personal account of service with the South Nottinghamshire Hussars. The South Notts Hussars can trace its roots to 1794. It was, as the name states, a cavalry unit which converted to artillery in the 1920s. During WW II is was part of the Royal Horse Artillery -- though not at that time "horsed."
Graeme wrote: "4ZZZ wrote: "Thanks Rick. Much appreciated.Not that this matters at all but just a passing comment the image you have found has reprint in the bottom corner. My book is also a reprint and is the ..."
200,000 books says their website. Nambour is a bit out of my way just to go to a bookshop but I was up the Sunshine Coast for work at least once a month over the last 3 years and if I had known and thought of Nambour I would have had a look. I have finished with that job as of now so no longer working trips to that area. Damn it! :-)
The author of my current book on the 272nd VGD mentions the actions that lead to the posthumous award of the Medal of Honor to Sergeant Jonah Kelly during the fight for Kesternich.http://valor.militarytimes.com/recipi...
Another story from the same book which was a tad amusing although I'm not too sure if I would try the same remedy:"Leutnant Josef Stefan, having survived both the Hurtgen Forest and the retreat to the Rhine, crossed the river with several of his comrades in a bullet-riddled Volkswagen Schwimmwagen with its many holes plugged with pieces of bread."
Must have been some pretty old tough bread!
Thought I'd round the month off with
Jagdgeschwader 400: Germany’s Elite Rocket FightersBoth an interesting unit and a fascinating aircraft.
From Ray Ellis'
Once a Hussar: A Memoir of Battle, Capture, and Escape in World War II.Ellis joined the South Nottinghamshire Hussars of the Territorial Army in late 1938. He experienced his first summer encampment in June, '39. Soon he was assigned his first stint of guard duty. He wrote:
I swear that no guardsman ever had a straighter back and my drill was impeccable as I paraded up and own the beat, stamping my feet and with my rifle swinging in precise arcs as I came down from the slope to the order arms position. A very proud soldier indeed. I noticed the regimental sergeant major...watching me. He was a regular soldier with years of experience and I could see he was duly impressed. After a short time he marched smartly over until he was standing directly in front of me and I waited to hear his words of praise. He drew a deep breath and bellowed:
'Straighten yourself up, boy; you're a disgrace to the regiment. Do you know what you look like?'
'No, sir,' I quavered.
'Then I better enlighten you...You don't look like a soldier at all. You look like a bag of shit tied up ugly!'
Welcome to the army, Gunner Ellis!
Great account MR9 - loved the RSM's response; "Then I better enlighten you...You don't look like a soldier at all. You look like a bag of shit tied up ugly!"
Finished reading today 479th Fighter Group: ‘Riddle’s Raiders’ by John Stanaway. I highly recommend it to all members with an interest in the air war (Second World War), Feel free to checkout my Goodreads review.
Good review Komet, thanks for sharing with the group.
Bread was a lot tougher in those days!'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Another story from the same book which was a tad amusing although I'm not too sure if I would try the same remedy:
.."
Does look like a good one.Jonny wrote: "Thought I'd round the month off with
Jagdgeschwader 400: Germany’s Elite Rocket FightersBoth an interesting u..."
I'm finishing October read off with
A unit of sorts, a very large one.
carl wrote: "I'm finishing October read off withA unit of sorts, a very large one."
Should be an interesting read Carl.
From Ray Ellis' Once a Hussar: A Memoir of Battle, Capture, and Escape in World War II.Ray Ellis was captured at Knightsbridge in North Africa when the South Nottinghamshire Hussars were virtually wiped out. He was firing his 25-pounder over open sights at Panzers less than 100 yards away. His gun position was overrun by enemy tanks. The Germans handed over the British POWs to the Italians. Life in the Italian POW camp at Sforzacosta was arduous -- less from cruelty or oppression and more from incompetence, neglect, and callousness. According to Ellis, the official daily ration, per the Italian regs, was:
Bread. 30 grams (slightly over one ounce).
Cheese. 48 grams.
Meat. 11 grams (about four-tenths of an ounce).
Rice/pasta. 66 grams (about 2 1/3 ounces).
Olive oil. 15 grams.
Ersatz coffee. 11 grams.
Sugar. 15 grams.
They rarely received such. Ellis wrote they never saw any sugar. What saved them was Red Cross parcels. The parcels were marked with their origins, and while the British packages were good, rationing was in effect in the UK. The prized parcels were Canadian. The Canadian Red Cross packages were bigger and contained butter, powdered milk, jam, canned meats, and chocolate!
Ellis' obit from the Daily Mail in 2014:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/artic...
Jonny wrote: "Thought I'd round the month off with Jagdgeschwader 400: Germany’s Elite Rocket FightersBoth an interesting u..."
I interviewed a few of these Komet pilots, and I was a guest historian on the History Channel show on that subject.
Thanks for that account MR9, those Canadian Red Cross parcels sound pretty good and must have been like heaven for the POW's.
Colin wrote: "Jonny wrote: "Thought I'd round the month off with Jagdgeschwader 400: Germany’s Elite Rocket FightersBoth an..."
I'm still working my way through the development history at the moment (the unit still being an Erprobungskommando), but the Komet definitely brings to mind the old quote about old pilots and bold pilots...
Finished
Jagdgeschwader 400: Germany’s Elite Rocket Fighters; neat little unit history, and not as sweeping as some of the Osprey titles: as much due to the short operational life of the unit I'd guess. Very interesting.
Interesting aircraft the Me163, glad you found the book of some value. One book that I really enjoyed on this amazing aircraft was "Top Secret Bird", just in case you are interested in further reading :)
Top Secret Bird: The Luftwaffe's Me 163 Comet by Wolfgang Späte
I knew Wolfgang Spate, Rudi Opitz, hans Glogner and some others who flew the Komet. I was one of two guest historians (Barrett Tillman was the other), along with Glogner on the History Channel show about this aircraft.
'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Interesting aircraft the Me163, glad you found the book of some value. One book that I really enjoyed on this amazing aircraft was "Top Secret Bird", just in case you are interested in further read..."'Aussie Rick' wrote: "Interesting aircraft the Me163, glad you found the book of some value. One book that I really enjoyed on this amazing aircraft was "Top Secret Bird", just in case you are interested in further read..."
Cheers Rick, I'll add it to the To Buy list. Been fascinated by the Komet ever since William Woolard explained the "interesting" facts about the fuels on a video of The Secret War.
THE WORLD WAR TWO GROUP
Books mentioned in this topic
Patton's Vanguard: The United States Army Fourth Armored Division (other topics)Revenge of the Red Raiders: The Illustrated History of the 22nd Bombardment Group During World War II (other topics)
Revenge of the Red Raiders: The Illustrated History of the 22nd Bombardment Group During World War II (other topics)
Rocket Fighter (other topics)
Top Secret Bird: The Luftwaffe's Me-163 Comet by Wolfgang Spate (other topics)
More...
Authors mentioned in this topic
Wolfgang Späte (other topics)John Stanaway (other topics)
Patrick K. O'Donnell (other topics)
Ian W. Toll (other topics)
James D. Hornfischer (other topics)
More...
"In all, the company was authorized eighty-nine Mauser 98Ks, eighty-four submachine guns or assault rifles, seven light MG-42 machine guns, two heavy machine guns (tripod-mounted MG-42s), two 80mm mortars, and two 75mm Model 18 light infantry howitzers. It was a small, yet hard-hitting force, possessing four times the amount of firepower as the average German Infantry Company of 1941. According to Fleischer, a Fusilier Company at its authorized strength could fire 570.3 kg weight of shot per minute, compared to the 135.1 kg of shot per minute of a 1941 German infantry company."