Discussion for Monique and the Mango Rains

[Diane , Armchair Tour Guide]

Start discussion here for Monique and the Mango Rains: Two Years with a Midwife in Mali by Kris Holloway.

[Diane , Armchair Tour Guide]

Summary (From ReadingGroupGuides)

Monique and the Mango Rains is the true story of the life and death of a remarkable West African midwife, seen through the eyes of a young Peace Corps Volunteer who worked side-by-side with her, birthing babies and caring for mothers, in a remote, impoverished village. It is a rare tale of friendship that reaches beyond borders to vividly and irrevocably unite another woman's world with our own.

Discussion Questions

1. Monique and Kris grew to be very close friends, yet they came from radically different background and faced many cultural barriers. What makes these rare connections possible?

2. Is Kris’ experience as a Peace Corps volunteer what you thought it would be what would have been the hard parts to adapt to in village life? What do you think you would miss when you came back to the U.S.?

3. How does your culture affect how you think about childbirth? What do you think we could learn from working with Monique? Where would you rather give birth? Why?

4. How do you think Kris’ presence in the village affected Monique? How was Kris’ life changed by having known Monique? Have you ever known someone that well from another culture?

5. The title of the book is Monique and the Mango Rains. Why is weather so important in this book? What are the “mango rains” and how do they relate to Monique’s life?

6. In many places in the text, there are references to the connections between the land and the people. People are described with adjectives / words pertaining to the earth and vice versa. For example, “the moon showed only a fingernail of light,” “the earth had gone five months with out a drink,” and “I longed for her to lie fallow...” What does this say about the culture? About how the society constructs our relationship with the earth?

7. “Every act of development necessarily involves an act of destruction.” Do you agree or disagree? Explain. (Quote by George Appell, from Cultural Anthropology, Daniel G. Bates, Elliot M. Fratkin, 1999.) Do Americans and other foreigners have the right to intrude in another culture?

8. Do you feel that certain values are universal and that all peoples should be encouraged to adopt them? Name some of these values. What did both Monique and Kris share as values that they worked hard to implement? Are some human rights inalienable? If so, what are these rights? (See the Universal Declaration of Human Rights on www.un.org/rights)

9. How can North Americans to be involved in transforming the health care and poverty situations in places like West Africa? It’s wonderful that Oprah has made a $40 million gift to girls’ education in South Africa, but most of us aren’t in this league. Monique’s story is an example of how large amounts of money are not always needed to make life better for people with few resources. How do you think we can best help the Moniques of the world?

10. The news is riddled with stories of war, disease, and famine in Africa. Yet Kris has said “I’m immensely hopeful when it come to Africa because I knew Monique.” After reading the book, what is your perspective?

[Janet C-B]

I just received my copy of this book. I am only on p. 30. I will be back when I have gotten further into the book.

[Janet C-B]

Question 1:
1. Mutual respect
2. They both had a deep need for connection. Kris was alone and immersed in a culture that was very new to her. Monique was very isolated in an unhappy marriage.
3. Monique was in great need of help with her work as a midwife and health care provider. Kris has no knowledge of midwifery or experience with providing health care in a 3rd world country.
4. Non verbal communication allowed a bridge for understanding, when verbal communication was initially non existent, then limited.

[Janet C-B]

Question 2: Kris' experience as a Peace Corps volunteer did not surprise me. The detail that Kris wrote about in her account, gave me a much better understanding of the culture and lifestyle of the community that Kris lived in for 2 years.

[Janet C-B]

Question 3: In the US in 2015, it is the norm for women to give birth in a hospital. Women have the option to use a midwife to assist with delivery in this setting.

I would have a strong preference for giving birth in a hospital in the U.S. It is important to me to have medical backup for problems that can arise with mothers and or babies while in labor and giving birth. I can think of several friends and relatives who likely would have died, due to medical problems, while giving birth. I can also think of many babies who would not have survived childbirth without skilled medical intervention. In a country where we have the advanced medical care to avoid infant and or maternal mortality, I would have trouble justifying the risk of a home birth.

I could learn a lot about assisting with childbirth from Monique. I have not given birth myself, therefore I do not have the Monique's experience with helping moms with giving childbirth. She is very compassionate in her role as a midwife. Through her life experience, she knows a lot about doing more with less in providing health care. The U.S. is a country with advanced medical care. It is also a country where there is a lot of waste of medical supplies, unnecessary testing, and overuse of specialists.

[Janet C-B]

Is there anyone else who plans to discuss this book?

[Dee]

i actually read this one a few years ago and blogged a review about it - it still routinely shows up in my stats for one of my most popular reviews

[Dee]

10. The news is riddled with stories of war, disease, and famine in Africa. Yet Kris has said “I’m immensely hopeful when it come to Africa because I knew Monique.” After reading the book, what is your perspective?

I think this question could go a couple of different directions and my answer also ties into question 9 - its great that Oprah can make a 40 million dollar donation, but in the end, its the deeds of the people, like monique and kris who, I believe, will have a more direct influence - something that isn't monetary in value.

there is that quote, the only thing it takes for evil to succeed is for good people to do nothing (or something like that) - i think the good people doing something, in similar situations to Monique will slowly turn the tide towards good - its not an overnight evolution, it takes time

[Janet C-B]

Dee wrote: "i actually read this one a few years ago and blogged a review about it - it still routinely shows up in my stats for one of my most popular reviews"

Wow! I had not heard of the book. Ordered it from a used bookseller. Worthwhile reading.

[Dee]

i atually read it as part of ATW80 - in 2011

my reveiw from back then - http://deesbookblog.com/2012/08/29/re...

it shows up on the first page of a google search if you add review to the search block

[Janet C-B]

Question 9: Our church community has been working with groups in Haiti for the past 10+ years. One of the early programs was extending very small business loans to women who would use the money to purchase needed materials for a business start-up. An example is a loan to purchase a sewing machine and fabric for makng clothing to sell. There was 100% repayment rate on these loans. The children walked many miles to school and were malnourished. For this problem, our church community donated chickens, who were cared for by the Haitian community, and the chickens provided eggs for the students at the beginning of the school day. There are projects for providing clean water with simple filtration devices. The latrines have been upgraded to improve sanitation. One big goal that we are currently working on is building a 6 classroom school. Planning is done with the Haitians. The local people provide the labor in building the school. Our church community will raise the funds for building materials and school supplies. The current "school" has no floor, walls or roof. It is an outdoor area, with benches, and a tarp for a roof. The new "school" will be concrete block construction, with a cement floor and roof. It is very modest by American standards, but will provide a basic structure for learning. There will be no electricity, because there is no electricity in that part of the country. The teachers currently get no salary. They have asked for livestock as a way of compensation. Each teacher will be given a cow, which will have calf's & provide milk. The project is self sustaining. At this site, the people are attending church in a structure that was condemned after the earthquake. A future plan will be working with the people to build a modest church structure. As with the school, the labor will be provided by the local people, construction supplies will be provided through fundraising in our church community. What I have learned over the past few years is that projects need to be practical, and self-sustaining. Our church group works in an area for 5 years, helping to meet basic needs, then moves on to another location. It has been a win-win for the Haitian people and for our church community.

[Dee]

Micro loans are a huge thing right now - where people like you and me (even without church's or other community support) can make a difference in someone's life

I listened to King Peggy: An American Secretary, Her Royal Destiny, and the Inspiring Story of How She Changed an African Village - last month and it had similar themes from a non peace corp perspective

[Janet C-B]

Question 8: universal values...respect, honesty, self determination
My opinion of inalienable rights...food, shelter, clothing, basic health care, right of self determination.

Does anyone else have a different perspective on this issue? I might be way off with my answer. I noticed that the provided link about human rights is not working.

[Janet C-B]

Dee wrote: "Micro loans are a huge thing right now - where people like you and me (even without church's or other community support) can make a difference in someone's life

I listened to [book:King Peggy: An ..."

The book sounds interesting.

How do micro loans work, if not through an organization? How would an individual know about the needs or requests from different impoverished countries...or. Impoverished areas in our own country?

[Dee]

I was thinking organization as in your church arranges to provide money to - there is likely someone they work with to identify places to look/need

[Dee]

Kiva is one I've heard of - https://www.kiva.org

[Janet C-B]

Dee wrote: "Kiva is one I've heard of - https://www.kiva.org"

Dee, I am not familiar with this type of organization. Interesting.

I just read about a fundraising effort that is currently going on in an elementary school that my daughter attended (decades ago). The goal of the project is to raise funds to provide simple water filtration devices for people living in 3 communities in Togo, Africa. I think that is a good example of regular US citizens being able to help people in 3rd World countries in a small way. The average American will not be travelling to these impoverished countries, but there are ways we can help the Moniques of the world. These strategies can also be used to help the most impoverished people in our country.

[Tania]

I just finished reading this book - I avoided the discussion thread until after I'd read it. It was really moving, and very well written. I thoroughly enjoyed learning about a new culture, and these incredibly selfless people who spent so much time caring for the women of the village.

Question 1 - I think that the connection between Monique and Kris was partially due to their mutual admiration and respect for each other, as Janet said. I also think that it was their shared experiences - sitting up through the night during a difficult labor, bearing the mosquitos and flies and other unpleasantness just to care for their patients, watching the suffering, experiencing the pain together, and the good times too, the joy in welcoming new life, the celebrations and the accomplishments of teaching the women what to do and watching them do it. The bond they forged in times of great sorrow and great joy, those are very strong bonds indeed.

[Tania]

2. I think Kris really made the most of her experience as a Peace Corps volunteer. For me, I believe the heat and the illnesses would have been the hardest parts to adapt to, and I feel like those are what she struggled with the most (and what ultimately made her decide to leave once her term was up). I think I would have been very homesick for my family as well, after a period of time. That part we never did see her struggle with. In a book I think that is fine, it would have detracted from the story if she had not been as optimistic and fully engaged in her opportunity as she was, but in reality I imagine longing for home has to insert itself at some point.

I would probably miss the people I'd grown to love most after returning to the U.S. Kris clearly grew close to many of the people that she spent those years with, particularly Monique. It was wonderful that she stayed in touch afterwards, and I believe I would have done the same.

[Tania]

4. Kris' presence in the village gave Monique hope. She had her struggles, but her friendship with Kris was something new and refreshing. They could talk about subjects that Monique could not broach with others. They learned a lot from each other - often Monique would bounce ideas off of Kris, traditions they held or things she'd heard that didn't seem quite right - and realize there were different ways of doing things in the world. Kris learned a lot from Monique as well, and took home with her a better appreciation for how different cultures react to events. For example, Kris was initially surprised at how death was handled in Mali, but soon she came to understand how precarious life was there. The lack of sadness didn't make life less precious, it was simply that death was more expected, and so the villagers were thankful for every day. I think that helped Kris learn to be thankful for every day as well.

[Tania]

Janet wrote: "Question 9: Our church community has been working with groups in Haiti for the past 10+ years. One of the early programs was extending very small business loans to women who would use the money to ..."

What a great program to be involved in. I think that people underestimate the importance of smaller projects. Your sewing machine example is a good one - it's a small investment, but you could be setting someone up with a full time business and steady income that changes their life. In the book, Kris did this when she helped Korotun by setting her up in business growing and selling potatoes. I was so disappointed that in that case it didn't work out because of her marital situation, but the idea was solid.

[Samantha]

1) I think as humans we are always intrigued by people who are different than us. I think that Monique and Kris were able to have such a strong connection because they genuinely listened to each other. More than once, both women talk about topics that are both hard to talk about and take trust in order to talk about. Monique was very welcoming to Kris and tried to make sure that she had all that she needed while Kris showed up to work everyday and tried to help the community as well as she could with the materials that she had. They had a mutual respect for each other and appreciated their differences. They embraced each others differences and enjoy each others company. They are there for each other.

2) I thought what Kris went through as a Peace Corps worker was exactly what it should have been. I would not have thought that Africa was lacking so much in medical needs. I don't know why I thought that, but I was shocked. I wasn't shocked about her living conditions, the weather, or the community at all. I am shocked about the lack of medical skills, the lack of schooling, and the lack of women's rights. That was not at all what I expected.

I think what I would miss the most is clean water that I can just drink. I drink a lot of water daily and to think that I would have to stop, boil water, make sure it's clean, and drink that water... I would miss water that I don't have to think about cleaning anymore and could just drink.

3) I think as Americans, we put a lot of value on childbirth. We want to have children (many with the thought of after marriage), most want to wait until they are in their mid twenties and have a stable job, and we want to give birth in a hospital with trained medical staff.

Being on this adventure with Kris and Monique taught me to be thankful that we have modern medicine and education for women. We have people that can help them understand how to raise a child, what the next step is, how long to wait before having sex or another child after birth, and we allow our mothers to rest and take care of their child. If I was going to give birth, I feel like I would at at a hospital. I would want to know that I am in one of the safest places to give birth... especially if something were to go wrong.

4) First of all, I think Monique was already strong woman before she met Kris. This being said, I think that Kris gave her more strength to be who she wanted to be. She was able to talk to Kris about things that bothered her and although Monique was not able to always stand up for her self or fix the things that she thought was wrong, Kris was able to take steps to help fix some of those problems. Kris was also able to receive funding from the Peace Corps to help fix the birthing house. While talking to the village elders, they wanted to use the money to do other things that weren't necessarily important. Kris had a little more power than women within the community.

Monique helped change Kris's life by totally and completely having a friend that she could rely on. A friend that she could love and trust. Monique had helped Kris see her strength and helped her also see how she could better the community. Monique hosted her, gave her advice, fed her, showed her the life of an African woman. They laughed and cried together. That is true friendship. That is something that cannot just be given, but must be earned.

My best friend is from the UAE and I have learned so much not only about her, but about her culture and heritage as well. She was the first person that I met that actually challenged my thinking, and I, hers. She has helped me be a more well rounded person, but also a more loving and caring person. She is also my conscious and tells me when some of the things that I am going to say are wrong, not appropriate, or just plain silly to hold them to myself. She is my best friend and I believe we were meant to meet to share each others cultures and ways.

5) As a farmer, rain is the stuff of life and if you don't have rain and sun, you don't have food and livelihood. The mango rains are important because if they come too soon, then the crops will wither and dry. If they come too late, the meat will not be good as it didn't have enough time to grow properly. It is called the Mango rains because when the rains come, that is the time that is needed to get the mangos to grow to make delicious fruits. The mango rains relate to Monique because like her, the rain brings life into Africa. She is constantly giving, just like the rain, in order to help the next generation grow and mature into the next adults of Africa.

6) The way that the people speak of the Earth as another being is important because the people realize that the Earth is an important source of life. Everything that they do, see, or interact with relies on the Earth. To drink- they need the rains. To grow- you need the rains. To relax- night, cooler weather. To see- the sun. To grow- the sun. To travel- the land. Everything that one does is somehow connected to Earth.

7) I would agree that every act of development leads to an act of destruction. To farm we must disturb and destroy the land. To grow we must destroy food. To "modernize" we must destroy our old way of thinking. To develop our cities we must destroy our slums. I do not think that Americans have the right to disturb other cultures. We can learn from other cultures, just like they can learn from us. However, we should not force our ways onto others. We should LEARN from each other. One way is not always the right way or the best way.

8) I feel like the right to life, women's rights, children's rights, men's rights, the rights to education, religion, the right to work and receive your own paycheck are all rights that everyone should have. I would love the right to receive health consultations, water, food, medicine to be added to this list, but I understand that all of these things are hard to include in any country.

Monique and Kris shared the values of hard work, treating everyone with respect regardless of who they were, getting everyone the medical attention they deserved (to the best of their ability), and enjoying their community. They both gave everything that they could to the community that they chose to work in. They valued some traditions, were willing to try new things, but above all respected each other. They were also great listeners, making sure to listen to the concerns of others. Both were highly dedicated to helping all they could within their community.

9) I think the best thing that we can give is education. I know that it may sound funny because it doesn't end starvation, it won't end not having a home, it won't end the medical needs of Africa, but it can help people grow more sustainable crops and not destroy the land. It could help get more food output. It could help others get money to help build a better home. It could help people see the benefits of having less children and how to prevent children and STDs. It could help with creating the next generation of doctors, farmers, politicians, inventors, or whatever is needed. Education can help end violence and hatred. A more educated person can be more informed about life in general. I know it is not an end all solution, but it does have potential to help patch it.

10) I am hopeful for Africa. There are many people within Africa that are trying to make change and make Africa a country not of poverty and war and disease, but of hope, change, love. Yes there are many problems within Africa, but there are many problems within America, too. Both countries have poverty, both countries have homelessness, both countries have diseases. America combats it a little better, yes, but there are still problems here. Africa has many people that are passionate to make Africa great. I think that is totally possible through education (which Monique was doing), caring people (like Kris) helping out in the Peace Corps, and people who are willing to donate to help others receive an education and give back within their communities.

[Samantha]

Dee wrote: "10. The news is riddled with stories of war, disease, and famine in Africa. Yet Kris has said “I’m immensely hopeful when it come to Africa because I knew Monique.” After reading the book, what is ..."

I agree. I think money can only go so far... it can build a school, it can get teachers in there... but it cannot make them teach or help the kids once that 40 million runs out. I think that is totally valid

[Samantha]

Janet wrote: "Question 9: Our church community has been working with groups in Haiti for the past 10+ years. One of the early programs was extending very small business loans to women who would use the money to ..."

This is so cool Janet! I wish more people could see this side of churchgoers instead of the extremists. Best of luck helping the Haitian communities!

[Janet C-B]

Samantha, I was interested in your answer to Question 7. That is a question that I thought about, but really couldn't figure out. What you are saying makes sense to me.

I am feel more firm about the second part of the question: Do American's have a right to intrude on other cultures? No. I think we can offer our ideas of different ways of doing things, but the decision to adopt the suggestions is up to the members of the other culture,

[Janet C-B]

Samantha, I was very interested to find out that your best friend is from a different culture. That must really keep you on your toes with re-evaluating what we take for granted in our culture.

I would say you are way ahead of me with that experience. I know people from different cultures and I think I respect differences, as well as commonalities. However, I am have not had the experience of having a close relationship with a person from a different culture. That must be a very enriching experience for you.

[Janet C-B]

Samantha, I was also interested in your answer to Question 5. I think I also drew a blank (or maybe all of that thinking was hurting my head.)

Based on your view of Mango Rains needing to come at just the right time, I can think of another perspective on how that relates to Monique. Perhaps Kris was assigned to her village at just the right time for Monique to re-look at the relationship she was in with her husband. Likewise, Monique came into Kris's life at just the right time for Kris to transition into a more adult role, based on the experience that she gained through Monique. It was a win-win for them, bearing good fruit.

[Samantha]

Janet that is also a strong answer. I think that their friendship was able to ripen because they came into each other's lives at a time when they were best able to nourish each other. Good comment and insight!

[Lauri]

This was one of the best books I've read in a long time. Monique just had the kind of personality that made people love her. Not to say that Kris didn't, but Monique was like a force of nature. It was amazing how they could bridge the cultural and language barrier to forge such a strong friendship.

[Janet C-B]

Lauri wrote: "This was one of the best books I've read in a long time. Monique just had the kind of personality that made people love her. Not to say that Kris didn't, but Monique was like a force of nature. It ..."

I agree Lauri,

It is amazing how they could communicate and have such a close relationship, despite the language barrier and cultural differences. That says something about the power of non verbal communication.