Vicious by V.E. Schwab

[Zara's Retreat]

This thread is to discuss V.E. Schwab's book, Vicious.


***Please remember to mark spoilers.***

Participants:
Bobbi, Cassandra, Ariel, Kady

[Zara's Retreat]

Suggested break down of reading so that you can check in and let us know how you're going. The following breakdown is purely a suggestion and is therefore not set in stone.

Rather than putting dates for each section I've done it so that it takes into account that not everybody will necessarily have the book at the same time.

Week 1: 91 pages
Week 2: 91 pages
Week 3: 91 pages
Week 4: 91 pages

[Bobbi]

Heyo,

I'm not terribly creative and Zara's suggestion works for me. It's a leap year so it's roughly 12-13 pages a day at that rate so most definitely manageable I would think.

[Cassandra]

I have this one on hold at the library and should get it shortly!

[Bobbi]

I officially started it today and I like it a lot so far.

[Kady]

Is there any chance that I could join in? I ordered the book and it just came in the mail! (:

[Cassandra]

Sure thing, Kady! Glad to have you. :)

I haven't picked mine up from the library yet, but it did come in. With everything I've got going this week, I probably won't start reading until the end of the week. I'll catch up, though!

[Bobbi]

Sure, Kady! :) Welcome.

I feel something sinus related going on, so I might tuck myself in early and read a bit in case my PTC gets bad because of the pressure.

[Zara's Retreat]

Kady wrote: "Is there any chance that I could join in? I ordered the book and it just came in the mail! (:"

Hi Kady,.

Consider yourself added.

[Kara]

I'm in!

[Yenny]

Wow, reading Vicious ASAP to understand this discussion! :)

[Cassandra]

Woohoo! The more the merrier. Welcome Kara and Yenny. :)

[Ariel]

I completely forgot about this BR tbh but I'm really excited about the book. I'll probably start it after I gobble down the latest In Death book that came out today lol.

[Cassandra]

Sounds great, Ariel!

[Bobbi]

Yay for more people! :)

[Cassandra]

I'm just starting this one today! I'm looking forward to it.

[Cassandra]

I finished part one. It's dark and I like that there isn't a clear good-vs-evil distinction. The characters aren't exactly likable, but they are engaging. I'm really enjoying this one.

Has anyone else been reading?

[Bobbi]

I've got about 5 more pages in part one which I figure I'll knock out during the less than exciting parts of the Superbowl.

I really like this so far, and you're right. There's not a single character that you can point to and think that's is clearly the person who is our measure of good. Toward the very beginning, minus the super IQs, some of the rivalry between Victor and Eli reminded me of a lot of premed students I know/knew.

So I have to ask, (view spoiler)[who do you think Victor and Sydney are digging up? (hide spoiler)]

[Cassandra]

That's interesting that the author captured the premed profile so well! Were you a premed student as well?

In answer to your spoiler question:
(view spoiler)[I thought they were digging up someone that both Eli and Victor knew, someone significant to them. The actual answer makes a lot more sense... While Sydney can bring people back to life, that probably doesn't work so well if the body is extremely decomposed. (hide spoiler)]

[Bobbi]

I was a biochemistry major so had a lot of overlapping classes.

[Bobbi]

Cassandra, I saw that you finished the book. Is anyone else reading?

Angie. If ever there was a glimpse into one of the "cracks" that Victor saw in Eli's perfection, I think we saw it in his reaction to her death. The argument on page 131 is very telling of both of them, really.

[Cassandra]

I agree! That really brought out some of their motivations and thought processes in a situation of desperation. My favorite thing about this book is that neither character is completely good or evil, but an odd, shifting mix of both.

Where are you at? What do you think so far?

[Bobbi]

I stopped around page 203. Eli had just realized that Victor was back in Merit.

I really like it so far. Admittedly, while I had heard good things, I'm a big comic book fan and this was my first book by V.E. Schwab so I was really nervous that she was going to write the characters as very polar opposites and the very definitions of good and evil, especially when I saw the back cover and saw Magneto and Professor Xavier. That neither Victor nor Eli are particular likable was a wonderful surprise.

I'm only a little more than halfway through, but she's got a fan.

[Kady]

I've finally finished my books for classes - very excited to crack the spine on this today and catch up!

[Cassandra]

I really like her book A Darker Shade of Magic which is similar in that it has kind of a dark fantasy atmosphere with characters that aren't necessarily "good", although the villains are pretty villain-y. But even that is reasonably well explained by the differences between each world's London - the magic in each London shapes the people who rule it. Check it out!

Kady, I can't wait to hear what you think of it!

[Kara]

So I'm late and am only about 1/3 of the way through--but I really like it so far!

[Cassandra]

No problem! I'm curious to see what you think as you read further.

Do we want to officially move the topic to March?

[Kara]

If I'm the only one still going, I don't want you all to have to move it on my account, but if there are others, sure.

[Cassandra]

It looks like Kady is still reading, so I'll move it.

[Carolyn]

I just started reading Vicious last night! Mind if i join in?

[Cassandra]

Please do!

[Sid]

Cassandra wrote: "I really like her book A Darker Shade of Magic which is similar in that it has kind of a dark fantasy atmosphere with characters that aren't necessarily "good", although the villain..."

Is this essentially A Darker Shade but with superheroes or do you get the sense you are reading a different book? This book seems intriguing, but I also worry sometimes that an author gets a writing schtick and it becomes a tad repetitive.

[Ariel]

I finished awhile ago and I actually thought I'd already commented in here but I guess that happened in an alternate universe lol.

I did really like that it isn't your cookie cutter superhero tale and that seems to be what a lot of people point out in their reviews so I think that's one of the big pulls of the book.

I think I was hoping for more though. :/ Looking forward to reading what everyone thought once they get through it though.

[Bobbi]

Heh, I do that a lot Ariel. I might have to borrow your alternate universe reasoning.

I didn't go in with any expectations, just a hope that it wouldn't be terrible because superheros and this was my first book from this author. I was hard to disappoint.

Out of curiosity Ariel, have you read the short story that she put out before this that takes place in the same universe? Warm Up?

[Yenny]

I'm still reading it, currently on 1/3 of the book. Catching up real fast now!

[Cassandra]

I think it's sufficiently different than A Darker Shade of Magic. It has a similar noirish tone, but they feel like different characters, stories, and worlds to me. I would say that I think A Darker Shade of Magic is stronger than Vicious, but I enjoyed reading both. Like Ariel said, Vicious lacks a certain completeness.

[Ariel]

Bobbi wrote: "Out of curiosity Ariel, have you read the short story that she put out before this that takes place in the same universe? Warm Up? "

Haha, feel free to borrow. It's very convenient for any number of things.

No, I haven't read the short story. It looks interesting, I think I'll give it a go.

[Bobbi]

Cassandra wrote: "I think it's sufficiently different than A Darker Shade of Magic. It has a similar noirish tone, but they feel like different characters, stories, and worlds to me. I would say that..."

... Do you think if I bribe the people ahead of me on the list at the library with food they will read quicker?

[Cassandra]

I wish! I've been anxiously waiting for a couple of books at the library for quite a while now. :P

[Carolyn]

Okay, so I am almost done reading Vicious...I couldn't help myself! It is just too good. I love it when a book captures me and pulls me in, making it extremely difficult to put it down.

I have not read A Darker Shade of Magic but it is next on my list!

(view spoiler)[
I really like the characters so far...even though they're not actually likeable. I just love that they are NOT good and evil. They are complex. Just like actual people. It encompasses the grey area that we live in, were good and evil are a matter of perspective. Eli believes he is doing God's work, eliminating all EO's (which I would say is pretty bad since he is murdering innocent people based on his own convoluted belief systems) while Victor is seen as the villain for trying to stop Eli.

I was also surprised about how Eli handled when Vic (accidently) killed Angie. I got the sense that Eli might be a psychopath from the beginning but I did not expect him to betray Vic so quickly, without even giving him a chance to explain what happened. But the rationalization going on through Eli's head during that time was spot on. How he killed his Professor and the janitor because they could tie what was going on back to him.

I love Syd and Mitch. I like the deminsion that Syd brings to the novel. Also the relationship between Serena and Syd is quite interesting.

Another thing I found interesting, is Serena and Eli. For having such a strong will, Serena is quite easily persuaded by Eli and his belief that all EO's go against God and are unnatural. It's heartbreaking that she would allow her younger sister to be almost killed by him. Regardless of her own feelings towards herself and her power, she can't automatically assume that her sister feels that same way.

The audacity that Eli has really grinds my gears. But is also accurate to what a killer might think. He is still a psychopath but he's a psychopath with a mission from God, so that apparently makes it ok. I am interested in Eli's past...Schwab touched on Eli being abused by his minister father but I personally would like to know more about that.

I was also wondering about when Vic was trying to become an EO after his failed attempt. When he was in the bathroom snorting the coke and Eli stops him. I wonder if Eli stopped him because he didn't want that for his friend, the hollowness he describes. Not what Vic thought...that Eli wanted to be the only special one and have Vic on the sidelines.

Overall, I am really enjoying it!!

(hide spoiler)]

[Kara]

Wow! This was excellent. I ended up finishing the last half in more or less a single sitting. I'm really excited to read more of her books.

I tweeted a quote from it ("Plenty of humans were monstrous, and plenty of monsters knew how to play at being human") and the author herself responded that it's also how her next book starts.

[Winter, Group Reads]

Should add it to tbr then?

[Bobbi]

Kara wrote: "Wow! This was excellent. I ended up finishing the last half in more or less a single sitting. I'm really excited to read more of her books.

I tweeted a quote from it ("Plenty of humans were monst..."

I want the next book so much. Now please and thank you.

Winter, I personally think so. I was really impressed with her characters and it just draws you right in. I very rarely reread anything and I might just reread this in a couple of years.

[Winter, Group Reads]

Great! Added it:)

[Ariel]

I'm glad so many are really enjoying it. It's a good group read book, I think. Lots of discussion material.

(view spoiler)[As I mentioned above, I also liked that the characters weren't cookie-cutter Good and Evil. I think I'm hoping there's more psychology in the next book though. Like the backgrounds of the characters were hinted at but not really developed imo. That's why I was more drawn to Syd and Mitch, they had a bigger psychological presence. (hide spoiler)]

[Bobbi]

(view spoiler)[Yes! I really want to know more about Victor's upbringing. His parents are famous psychotherapists who then disown him when he goes to prison. That's... a pretty harsh thing to do, but as Victor said, an incarcerated son isn't really great for book sales, but his almost pathological need to deface their books? There's more to that than just rebellion.

Then, of course Eli and his abusive pastor - minister? - father. I want to know more about that as well. (hide spoiler)]

Cassandra, Dimitri read Warm Up and then started reading Vicious this morning. When he got to (view spoiler)[the tub scene where Vic helps Eli with his NDE, he figured out that it was Eli in Warm Up because of the prayer beforehand and the talk of the abusive religious father. (hide spoiler)] He liked it though because he said it gave him enough of a spoiler that he wants to keep reading that much more to see where it goes with the information he has.

So, yeah, maybe reading it first would have been better but definitely didn't ruin either.

[Cassandra]

Good to know, Bobbi! I'm glad that he is enjoying the book. :)

[Yenny]

I just finished reading the book today! Wow sorry for it take me so long, because I got bored and put it down for a while. But the last 50% of the book was very excellent for me.

This is the first time I read this kind of book, and I just loved the way the author tells us the readers about each EO's powers.
(view spoiler)[Particularly Serena's (the effect on Eli's mind when they met) and Dominic (the depiction of the shadow) I literally jumped from my chair when Mitch faced Serena with a gun on his forehead...wasn't ready for that! I do not know much abt chemistry and such but somehow she did not make it confusing, more like a convincing story not just out of the blue extraordinary. I also was relieved that Sydney never take other's lives, as if it was emphasized that her role is to bring back the dead. In the midst of revenge, Vic & Eli's different takes on the existence of EOs, I was drawn to how good of a friend Mitch was, Serena's conscience and affection on her sister at the last minute. Loved the ending where it all came down on Eli on the crime scene now that Serena's dead. The realisation of the characters that their powers are dangerous & how they felt something is missing from themselves (soul or conscience, what makes them human, maybe?) are interesting, too. (hide spoiler)]

Overall Vicious was obviously an enjoyable read!! I kept picturing the book as in crime drama / action movies. The chills! I'm glad I chose to join the buddy reads for this. It was fun to have ppl read the same books! (My first time expriencing this since I joined GR) :)

[Yenny]

Cassandra wrote: "I think it's sufficiently different than A Darker Shade of Magic. It has a similar noirish tone, but they feel like different characters, stories, and worlds to me. I would say that..."

Woohoo then I'll be reading A Darker Shade of Magic soon!

[Cassandra]

This would make a good gritty action movie! I definitely had an action-packed mental movie going while reading this one. I'm glad to hear you liked it, Yenny!