The History Book Club discussion
This topic is about
One Man Against the World
PRESIDENTIAL SERIES
>
WE ARE OPEN - WEEK ONE - PRESIDENTIAL SERIES: ONE MAN AGAINST THE WORLD - October 19th - October 25th - Author's Note and Chapter(s) One - Four - (1 - 42) - No Spoilers, please
message 2:
by
Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief
(last edited Apr 08, 2016 10:03PM)
(new)
-
rated it 4 stars
Mod
However if we discuss folks outside the scope of the book or another book is cited which is not the book and author discussed then we do have to do that citation according to our citation rules. That makes it easier to not disrupt the discussion. Thought that I would add that.
message 3:
by
Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief
(last edited Apr 08, 2016 10:05PM)
(new)
-
rated it 4 stars
Mod
The first week's reading assignment is:
Week One - October 19th - October 25th
Author's Note and Chapter(s) One - Four - pages 1 - 42
Chapter Overview and Summary:
Author's Note
Chapter 1: "A great, bad man"
Chapter 2: "This is treason"
Chapter 3: "He was surrounded by enemies"
Chapter 4: "He will let them know who is boss around here"
message 4:
by
Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief
(last edited Apr 08, 2016 10:17PM)
(new)
-
rated it 4 stars
Mod
Please post and check the table of contents and syllabus.
We Begin:
As an introduction - for all folks who have received your book and for those of you who will receive your book - please post a brief intro here for your fellow readers of One Man Against the World - introducing yourself and at the same time give us your general impression of the Author's Note and Chapter(s) One through Four and details that made an impression on you right from the start - Remember we are only talking about Author's Note and Chapter(s) One - Four right now.
message 5:
by
Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief
(last edited Apr 08, 2016 10:20PM)
(new)
-
rated it 4 stars
Mod
That way your fellow readers will get to know you "before we start posting about the book" and they feel comfortable interacting with you on these threads.
Remember Tim Weiner will be joining us so please make sure to follow the reading schedule weekly and stay within that week's reading assignment - it makes it a very enjoyable reading and discussion experience that way if you do not get ahead.
The books are going to be sent out around October 1st which gives you enough time to get your book without getting it too early.
Remember follow the schedule. And don't read ahead. Just read your required pages for the week and post and discuss.
Have another book in the background to pick up so you do not get ahead on this one.
We have thoroughly enjoyed having Tim with us in the past - and he is a very interactive author so post, post, post, ask questions on the Ask Tim thread and get ready for a great discussion.
So right now just post your intro etc. and say hello.
We will open the discussion to the book itself on October 19th - no earlier and no later.
Right now only introduce yourself here.
I. Hi I am xyz and from abc. I love history because of d and I am interested in this book and Nixon in general because of f.
Also try your hand at these pre discussion questions.
2. Tell us whether you were alive while Nixon was President and what did you think of him at the time and after.
3. If you were not alive when Nixon was President or just a little guy or gal at the time - what do you remember hearing about Nixon at the time from your parents and grandparents. Did this shape your perception of the man?
4. Do you think that Nixon should have been pardoned? Why or why not?
5. Do you think that Nixon was fairly treated? Why or why not?
6. Do you think that Nixon was a great, good, fair or bad president based upon how you feel before you read the book. Why? Failings/redeeming qualities?
Let us try to think about some of these answers before we begin our discussion and reading of the book to see if your impressions change after that or will they remain the same. Let us check back and find out.
1. Hi! I am Chris and I am from California. I love history because of how history is a story that connects everyone from our ancient ancestors to our future progeny and how history, and the ways we interpret it, affect our present and our future. I am interested in this book and Nixon in general because of how polarized interpretations of his presidency have become. He's either the mad tyrant of the American presidency who destroyed our faith in the beneficence of politics, or the flawed giant who bravely ended the Vietnam War, engaged Red China, and pursued Détente with the Soviets, paving the way for Reagan's successes in the 80s. Somehow the truth must be between these two opposites, and I hope to come closer to understanding the man and his presidency through this study.2. I was not alive during the Nixon presidency, so I have no memories of him in office.
3. I don't remember hearing much of anything about Nixon from my parents or grandparents. In fact, come to think of it, we didn't cover much but the basics about his presidency in school as he was still considered to be too recent for the more in-depth reading of him you would expect from earlier presidents.
4. I know why Ford did it and, from his seat, it seems reasonable that he would want to get the country moving again. But I think that the country was denied justice and the opportunity to find out how involved Nixon really was. So, no, I don't think he should've been pardoned.
5. Perhaps, perhaps not. I don't know enough about the process Congress used in its investigations of the Watergate scandal. But it does seem that Nixon and his administration were not as cooperative as they should've been.
6. I think he was a fair president who could've been a good or even great president were it not for his own demons. He was obviously smart and played both the domestic and foreign politics game well. But he saw enemies everywhere and didn't have enough good character traits to suppress his bad character traits.
Hi, I'm Francie, and I'm from Warner Robins, Georgia. My love of history comes from my dad. He was in the Air Force for 33 years and served in WWII, Korea, and Vietnam. He always encouraged me to learn about events in history and instilled in me my patriotic spirit. I am interested in this book and Nixon because I remember so much from that period of time and want to find out more about Nixon and his motivation for doing the things he did.I remember so much of Nixon's presidency, but I guess the most vivid memory I have is his resignation speech and his family standing beside him.
I do believe Nixon should have been pardoned. Ford needed to start the process of healing the nation and bring more confidence to the presidency.
Was Nixon treated fairly? Good question. I keep thinking about how he refused to turn over his tapes and maybe Congress should have pushed more for to get what they were asking from him.
I think Nixon's involvement in Watergate and the backlash from that overshadows any good he did as president.
1. Hi I am Jason and from California. I love history because it fills me with information and I am interested in this book and Nixon in general because I don't know much about him other than the "I am not a crook" quote. We also live very near the Nixon museum. I have never been to the museum, but hope to get there before we start reading the book.2. I was not alive during Nixon's presidency. All my opinions of him have been formed from what others have said about his actions.
3. I don't recall hearing much about Nixon when I was younger. Maybe '79 is just too long after he was out of office.
4. and 5. I don't know. I don't think I have enough information to even have a formed opinion about these questions.
6. I think most of my opinions about Nixon will come from this book as this will be the first book on him I have ever read. I'm excited to get started!
Hello everyone ~ I am Alisa and live in the great Pacific Northwest in Seattle, WA. My interest in history has come well after formal education when I found the topic dreadfully boring. In my adult years, as I read to expand my world view, history has become much more interesting to me. The office of the presidency and politics are high on my interest list so am glad to be part of this discussion. 2. I was in high school when Nixon was President and was just shy of voting in my first presidential election. I thought he was a good President until he wasn't. As Watergate unfolded I wondered if our Constitution and system of government would survive the crisis.
3. My Dad was a voracious consumer of all news related to Watergate and Nixon and watched those hearings on CSPAN every day. It was hard to absorb it all at the time.
4. I'm not sure there is a right answer to the question of whether he should have been pardoned. I do believe President Ford did so acting on his sincere belief that it was the best thing to do for the country at the time and I can't say he was wrong about that. On the other hand, there is a convincing argument to be made that Nixon should have been brought to justice for his crimes and the failure to do so foreshadows the question if there will ever be the willingness to do it if (dare I say when) something like this happens again.
5. Fairly treated - by who? I think the mistakes he made stripped him of any credibility he may have earned on other fronts. We all lie in the bed we make.
6. I think he was an able President up until the time that he destroyed the American people's faith in the Presidency and brought this country to its knees. Net net it puts him at the bottom of the barrel.
message 10:
by
Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief
(last edited Sep 28, 2015 08:17AM)
(new)
-
rated it 4 stars
Mod
Recently I too went to the Nixon Library and Museum and was thoroughly fascinated with the location, the museum and with Nixon.
2. I have no memories of Nixon in office and odd as it may seem - my parents never talked ill of any president - I think that is a phenomena that has more of a recent history - there was a respect for anybody who held that office whether you agreed with them or not.
3. In fact, my 93 year old father simply shakes his head and says when he watches the news - "what is he doing"? - which of course makes me just smile. He doesn't believe that the country is on the right path but at the same time he thinks that the job of president is not a picnic for anyone. I think I will have to ask him what he thought of Nixon.
4. Yes and no. I understand that the pardons were more for the country in some ways and for that reason they were a good thing but I am not sure why the others were not pardoned as well because I do not think they were more guilty or Nixon less guilty. I am looking forward to reading Tim's books to find out if I change my mind about this answer.
5. Hmmm - not sure.
6. I think that Nixon was not telling the American people the truth and I think LBJ might have been able to do more with ending the war if Nixon had not been stirring the pot before he was elected. Do I think he gave the perception of doing a credible job - yes based upon what I have read; do I think he crossed some lines - yes I do. But I am very interested in finding out what my perceptions are and if they change after reading this book. I think I would like to find out what his real accomplishments were and whether they were simply obliterated from public memory because of Watergate and how his presidency ended. I think it will be a very interesting discussion.
Hi all, I am Jill and am an assisting moderator here at the History Book Club. My particular areas of interest are WWI and WWII but this book caught my attention and I am glad I will be a part of the group.2. I do remember Nixon's presidency and did not particularly like him as I had heard he had pulled some dirty tricks while running for office in California. But, truth be told, I was not particularly interested in politics at that point in my life.
3. My parents really liked him in the beginning probably more because of his connection with Eisenhower than for the man himself. Their opinion, like most of Americans, changed dramatically once the trouble started.
4. I think the pardon appeared to place him above the law and set a precedent about how to treat a sitting President who has committed acts that are illegal. Although Gerald Ford may have been acting in good faith, it had a certain odor about it.
5. I'm not sure in what context of "fair treatment" we are speaking about in this question. He resigned before he was impeached, he was pardoned, and he was not legally held responsible for his involvement in dirty tricks. That's pretty fair.....but in the court of public opinion, it may have been a different story.
6. My perception of Nixon is that he was an insecure, haunted man, who needed recognition and the feeling of power. (I am basing some of that perception on anecdotes from Henry Kissinger which were very telling). The difference between Nixon and possibly some other Presidents is that he got caught! I don't have much of an opinion of his Presidency because Watergate has colored my thinking.
Hi everyone, I am Teri and one of the assisting moderators(t) here at the History Book Club from the great state of Texas. I have always enjoyed history with a varied interest in many areas, but particularly with local/social history and genealogy. I am interested in this book because Nixon was the first president I really remember.2. I do remember Nixon, but I was a young grade school student at the time. I remember seeing him on TV a lot, and watching Vietnam and Watergate play out on the news with my parents. I had no opinion of him, except that I knew that he was the leader of our country.
3. My parents were conservative at the time, but I don't remember that they really liked or disliked him, so I really had no particular opinion of him. I will say that to me, as a young girl, I didn't really understand Watergate at the time, and I remember thinking that Nixon got caught doing something really hideous. I honestly thought he was caught conspiring to off someone. Young minds!
4. I don't think he should have been pardoned, but understand why Ford did it. He got caught, he should pay the price.
5. Well, I have a pretty jaded idea of most anyone in modern politics. I don't trust many politicians and I think most have some sort of personal agenda. I also believe that the public doesn't know the half of what goes on behind close doors. I believe Nixon was treated fairly in respects to being impeached for what he did. However, there are others that were involved that I assume did not pay any price. I'm sure that many pointed the finger at Nixon to keep the heat off of themselves. I'm sure the media (I'm also jaded about them) probably only focused on his faults.
6. I never particularly liked Nixon. He seemed smarmy and untrustworthy to me. I actually know little about him and most of my views have been based on what little I have read on him and seen in media.
Greetings All, I'm Virginia from Texas and was born loving history and politics. I think my parents had something to do with it. I am interested in this book because I've yet to read a detailed history of his life.2. Yes, I was alive when Nixon was president. I recall listening to the Nixon-Kennedy debates, and, with my parents, going door-to-door in my neighborhood canvassing on his behalf. These activities were my introduction to politics. I really had no clue about party differences; just went along with my parents.
3. n/a
4. At the time I was very disappointed he was pardoned as I felt he should have been held accountable for any wrongdoings. In retrospect, Ford made the very tough decision to do the right thing for the country.
5.I do think he was fairly treated. He was allowed self-dignity, respect, and courtesy throughout the whole sordid mess.
6. Without having read the book, I would say he was a fair to good president. He seemed cold and distant from the American people. His most redeeming quality was having the good sense to take on Henry Kissinger as an advisor.
Mod
I. Hi I'm Bryan from Virginia. I love history since I was a kid and I study the presidency professionally, so I'm living the dream, lol. I'm excited to read this book because Nixon fascinates me, his policies and his character.2. I was a kid when Nixon was president, so I don't remember anything. I learned more about him from history books. My uncle read a lot about Watergate and read all the books that came out and gave them to me to read.
3. My uncle supported impeachment.
4. I get why Ford did it. He could not govern the country if there was a trial and felt the nation had to move on. Part of me wished there was some justice, maybe more information would have come out.
5. Still not sure. I think the actions he did warranted an impeachment trial, though. The more we know, the more Nixon seemed more involved.
6. Nixon was a great politician, champion of "realpolitik". However, Watergate and the recent work on the "decent interval" over Vietnam really makes me think he should not have been in the Oval Office. Jill, I like your description for number 6.
Hello all. My name is Mike Green. I am a historian that teaches History, mostly in the modern era from 1492 to the present. I specialized in American Labor History and Radical History of the early 20th century. No PhD yet. 2. I is interesting that this question is being asked. I was born during the Johnson Presidency and I remember being home when the Watergate trials were televised. I was sick and I mostly remember that they interrupted day time TV programming. We were a sort of typical family at the time. My mother worked at home as my brother was born in November of 1973.
3. Being just a 5-6 year old, I remember that this story was something that all the grown-ups were talking about. As I recall, this was something that was very much dragged out. It was a length process where information did not all come out at one time. Hence, people both for and against Nixon were reassessing their feeling for the man. One has to remember that Nixon did not win a majority of the popular vote in 1968. It was as razor thing as 1960. He won 43.2% of the popular vote to Humphrey’s 42.7%. And he has won on the promise he would end the Vietnam war, whose peace negotiations he had worked to sabotage with Kissinger in October of 1968. And by 1972, after 4 years of continuing a war that we could not win, his popularity plummeted. Then he made the historic visit to China which really was a feat extraordinaire.
4. Pardon? This is the ultimate question. Since most people who were involved in Watergate went to prison, albeit for a short time, I do think that the mastermind behind this got off easy. I do not think that Gerald Ford in any way agreed to pardon Nixon at any time. I also think that this was a gutsy move on President Ford’s part. His reasoning was a good one. He wanted to get Watergate off the table so he could continue lead the country. In some ways, that worked. However, the American people do not have the short memories that many claim. For many, Watergate was a betrayal of their core beliefs. Forgiveness was not in the minds of many and they would not do so right away. The 1974 Congressional elections gave the Democrats a stronger Supermajority in both the House and Senate. I think that Ford would have the baggage of Watergate with him for the rest of his presidency. He was seen by many as an illegitimate president because he was appointed. Even in the 1976 Presidential Election, he was still being asked about Watergate. I think that Ford’s pardon in many ways contributed to his loss in the 1976 election. Oddly enough, Ford and Carter became very good friends after Carter left office. I think he should not have been pardoned. The one reason is that by allowing him to be pardoned, the papers he claimed that were his own ended up being classified as personal papers and were not declassified until now. I think had there been a trial, the materials would have been disclosed sooner and we would have known more about the depths of Watergate instead of wondering for 40 years.
5. Nixon fairly treated, Yes and no. Yes, he was fairly treated at the time. We had a much better press corps that relied on “facts” and not propaganda, for some reason Fox mis-news comes to mind. When Walter Coronkite did a whole news session on Watergate everyone paid attention. I wonder in the present political situation whether he would have gotten away with it. He just might have. But this was not just a political caper. This was a conspiracy on the part of the President of the United States to obstruct justice. Nixon’s lawyers had argued before the Supreme Court, that the “president has the same power as a king except he is elected every 4 years.” This was from the US v. Nixon Supreme Court Decision in July 1974. A 8-0 decision. Even the president cannot withhold evidence in a criminal investigation ruled the Court. I say NO, in that I think he got off with little punishment. He kept his pension which we paid for the next 20 years; he was able to write several books and keep the royalties. I think that was allowed to obtain the profits of an ex-president which he should have been forced to forfeit because of his dishonesty.
6. Assessment of Presidency? Well I can say this. I think that Watergate and the tools used therein can be traced back to the ruthless and illegal methods will forever cover his presidency and haunt him. We do need to give credit where credit is due. He did open relations with China a very successful enterprise. Nobody but Nixon could have done this at the time. And he did work and endorse the Family Assistance Program and establish the Environmental Protection Agency as its one independent agency.
Hello everyone, I am Lynne from New Hampshire. I am always interested in reading biographies of people of historical importance. I look forward to reading about Nixon as it seems there was a great deal of hidden information at the time of his presidency and resignation. I remember watching the news reports of his resignation in total shock that this would happen to a President of the U.S. I would like to learn more of the story from our reading. My parents seemed to have little to say about him and I heard no major complaints. I was very involved in the Vietnam war demonstrations on campus in the early 70s and of course Nixon was blamed for not ending the war sooner. I have felt since that he did many good things for the country and was sorry to see him destroy himself through his actions surrounding Watergate. Maybe there is more to the story?
Hi! I am Nita and I am from Virginia. I love history because my father is a World War II veteran and a professional historian, and I fell more in love with history when I started to study it on my own. I am interested in this book and Nixon in general because I remember his presidency well, as well as the Watergate hearings and Nixon's resignation. This was a divisive and dangerous time for our country.2. I was in college while Nixon was President, and my parents remembered him and talked about him from his time on the House Committee on Unamerican Activities. I believed even then that Nixon was paranoid and deceitful and a danger to the country and the world. My feelings were supported by the revelations that came out during the Watergate hearings and later. My opinion of him has never changed and has only been strengthened by the release of his private papers and tapes.
4. I was disgusted when Gerald Ford--our only unelected president--pardoned Nixon. It may have been "good for the country," but Nixon should have had to pay for his crimes. Additionally, many of his fellow travelers were put in prison, and they were just carrying out Nixon's wishes and orders. He was more guilty than they.
5. In my view, Nixon was treated quite generously. I was shocked when he died and was given a full state funeral such as is held for any former president--not one disgraced from office. He did not deserve this. At the time, it seemed that the nation had already forgotten Nixon's treachery. This deeply troubled me.
6. I think that Nixon was a bad president. He was paranoid and believed that everyone who questioned him was a communist and/or a spy against him. The more I learned about Nixon, the more I realized that we were dealing with a mentally ill megalomaniac.
I am really looking forward to reading this book and discussing it in this forum.
I. Hi I am Ted from MA. I've always loved history and it pretty much takes up all the space on my bookshelves. I was interested in this book because I loved Weiner's history of the CIA (Legacy of Ashes) and have not come across a good book on Nixon. I'm hoping this is it! I was not alive but from my basic knowledge I have a mixed view of his presidency. Lots of good things seem to have come during his tenure, but the man himself clearly was very flawed. I definitely have grown up with a bad perception of the man, but like I said, the things that actually got done during his time in office seem like they have some significant positive elements. It is also interesting because in many ways he seems extremely moderate (in his politics anyway) when compared with members of his Republican Party today. Of course this is all looking back at history and comparing it with today, which is certainly problematic. I may have a different view if I was alive during his presidency.
Hello, everyone. I am Tomi from Arkansas. I am a retired history/English teacher and librarian. Even though I tell everyone that I am only 29, I was alive and remember Nixon's presidency. At the time, I wasn't particularly interested in politics. I remember that there was a big fuss about Watergate but there was little said about anything political in my family. Vietnam was a more important issue and we were thankful that Nixon was going to get us out of the war without surrendering.I think Ford had good intentions when he pardoned Nixon, but that torpedoed his chances for being elected president. Nixon should have been held accountable for his role in Watergate, especially since so many others were punished.
I always told my students that history would show Nixon to be a better president than the current thinking. We did get out of Vietnam and I have friends who are alive because of that. And opening relations with China was a definite plus.
Overall, I think he was a pretty good president. Seems that everything he did is overshadowed by the Watergate situation. I believe every powerful person/politician has a corrupt side; it just didn't get reported in the media in the past.
I am looking forward to reading this book - my perceptions may change!
1 - This is Gary and I am from Whitehall PA. I am a big fan of presidential history so I make it a point to read as many book as possible about all of the presidents. I try to read books with opposing points of view that aren't too extreme (or should I say...books that have some major agenda for or against a president such as LBJ Kills JFK?!)2/3 - I was 9 years old when Nixon resigned so my memories are limited to the 1972 election, hearing the word Watergate almost everyday and seeing the "Nixon Resigns" headlines on all the daily papers.
4 - The pardon of Nixon was absolutely the right thing to do (in hindsight). At the time it was seen as another cover-up (which was/is perfectly reasonable) but as President Ford proclaimed the day Nixon resigned, "Our long national nightmare is over." Had Nixon not been pardoned, the trial would have been dragged out for years as he would have surrounded himself with a "dream team" of attorneys. It would have been one appeal and delay after another so by the time the trial started, some ten years might have passed. This would have affected the elections of, at minimum, 1976 and 1980. Remember how long the OJ Simpson trial and aftermath lasted? And he was just a football player.
5 - Fair treatment for any politician is that everything they say or do is open to interpretation. The American press and public has a very healthy lack of respect for 90% of anything that goes on in Washington DC.
6 - Nixon, like anyone that has been a president and did good things, can never overcome the bad things when it comes to certain members of the press and public. I would give him an A for his foreign policies and an F for his domestic policies.
Lastly, I have read several books about Nixon and Watergate but as a recent New York Times Book Review wrote about this book along with Evan Thomas's "Being Nixon: A Man Divided" are the first books in a long time that gives complete look at Nixon's life. I hope that this book spends some quality time on Nixon's post-presidency because he did not just disappear into history. He reappeared as a statesman, writing many books and continued to offer counsel to several presidents.
Another book about Watergate is as useless as another book about JFK's assassination.
I. Hi I am Glynn and currently living in Florida. I really like reading about history I guess because it is a challenge for me. I am interested in this book and Nixon in general because I read Enemies: A History of the FBI by
Tim Weiner and thought it was a fantastic book. Also, I was confused by the Nixon presidency and would like to learn more.2. I was just beginning high school when Nixon became president. I wasn't paying a lot of attention to politics at the time. I was more into the moon landing. My dad thought Nixon was going to be a great president. He was very disappointed when things began to unravel.
4. I seem to remember thinking that it was a good idea to pardon Nixon at the time because it was a divisive issue in the country.
5. I think that Nixon was as fairly treated an any president can be in this country.
6. I think that Nixon did some good things and some bad things. Opening diplomatic relations with China and ending the draft I think were good things.
My name is Jason and I live in Colorado. I love history because it gives me the opportunity to learn how men and women throughout history have used different ideas and means to obtain varying levels of success. I'm most fascinated when two similar thought processes were used, but obtain different results. I find Nixon fascinating as he achieved a large level of success using questionable tactics. In many ways he's similar to Lyndon Johnson. Nixon was president when I was born, and left office when I was at the tender age of one. I have no memories of him as president, but I do remember my parents talking about him as a child. My dad is a Vietnam War vet, and this shaped much of the discussion.
I understand why Nixon was pardoned by Ford. I currently don't have a strong opinion on whether that was right or wrong.
I don't have a opinion on whether Nixon was treated fairly. I'm looking forward to reading the book and using the disguising here to make that assessment.
My understanding of Nixon's legacy is that he had the opportunity to be a very good president, but Vietnam and Watergate overshadow any positive achievements.
Looking forward to reading and discussing the book.
1.) Hello! I’m Jordan and I live in California. I love history because of my glorious years of undergrad as a history and economics student where I studied mainly Soviet-era Russia. I’m interested in this book and Nixon because he’s a president that I heard so much about but no one ever really taught on in school. It was always just a few lines about Watergate and they would move on. 2.) I was not alive when Nixon was president because my father was an infant and my mother was not born yet.
3.) When I did a project on Watergate in eighth grade, I remember my grandmother (a Democrat) telling me Nixon was a cheat and my grandfather (a Republican) refusing to speak of it. That obviously influenced my report!
4.) and 5.) I am honestly not sure because I only have heard the basics of the events from textbooks. Being able to form an educated opinion is one of the reasons I’m looking forward to the book!
6.) I am not sure I know enough about Nixon to make a judgement. If he is like most presidents, there will probably be a decent mix of good and bad depending on what you focus on.
I’m so looking forward to reading and discussing the book with you all!
Gary wrote: "1 - This is Gary and I am from Whitehall PA. I am a big fan of presidential history so I make it a point to read as many book as possible about all of the presidents. I try to read books with oppo..."Gary: So happy to have you with us for this discussion and I enjoyed reading your comments. One little thing, though, when we mention a book/author in a post, we cite it as follows:
by
Evan Thomas
Glad to have you with us, Glynn. Just a little nit, when mentioning a book, the correct citation is the book image followed by author's picture and link as follows:
by
Tim WeinerThanks for making the correction.
1. Hello all- I'm Brian, from New York State (in the mountains but close enough to NY City to enjoy it). Enjoy history - interested in this book as I participated in the discussion group on
by
Tim Weinerso I know I'll learn a lot and enjoy the read.
2. I was a grade schhool student during the 60's - vividly remember the first campaign and debates. Was in college and the Marine Corps during Nixon's presidency - so Vietnam issues / policies were very real to me. Also remember Nixon's wage and price freeze - as a low paid Lance Corporal (about $40 a week - not too happy that my "over two year" longevity raise was taken away!). Nixon had become a caricature - "Tricky Dick" so I'm interested in learning and understanding the man and his administration more.
4. I think President Ford had good intentions in pardoning Nixon. Whether it was right to do so - I'll be thinking about that during the read.
5. Nixon created his own nightmare. One could credibly argue both sides of the fairness issue. He never faced criminal charges over Watergate, but his actual accomplishments are forgotten in the shadow of his misdeeds.
6. On balance, I'd say Nixon was a fair President. I believe he was a politician first and foremost, rather than a statesman, but he did manage to open relations with China, keep the Cold War muted and both reestablished relations with Egypt for the first time since 1967 and became the first president to visit Israel.
I hadn't read a word but I think the title is perfect. I always got the feeling that Nixon felt like everybody was against him. Then in the second paragraph, the author quoted Nixon saying, "I gave them a sword (referring to his enemies) and they stuck it in me."
Mod
2. I was first aware of Nixon as a child when he was serving as vice-president in the Eisenhower administration and then in 1960 during the presidential campaign against Senator John Kennedy. In the eighth grade, my father and I watched every televised debate between Nixon and Kennedy. I did not have a favorable impression of Nixon. The presidential election of 1968 was the first time that I was eligible to vote. This was a very volatile time in our country following the assassinations of John Kennedy and Martin Luther King, and then in June 1968, the assassination of Robert Kennedy followed by riots in a lot of the major cities including Chicago, the site of the Democratic National Convention that same year. Our country was also deeply divided because of the continuing escalation of the Viet Nam war. I think because the nation wanted an end to the war, Nixon won his second term in 1972 carrying 49 of 50 states. I watched all of the Watergate hearings, many with my toddler son, as the nation viewed the unraveling of a presidency.
3. N/A
4. I always admired President Gerald Ford for pardoning Nixon and "putting an end to our national nightmare" but at great cost to his own political future. I have always believed that it was in the best interests of our country at that time.
5. I think Richard Nixon was fairly treated and felt that having to leave the presidency in disgrace was probably the worst punishment for him.
6. I think that Nixon accomplished a lot during his presidency, including ending the war in Viet Nam and opening relations in China but ultimately his paranoia and resulting mistrust of everyone led to his undoing.
Mod
Also, here is the link to the Q&A thread for Tim who will be joining us. Make sure to follow the question format outlined.
Here is the link:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
We kick off the discussion officially tomorrow October 19th.
I. Hi I am Michael from Alberta, Canada. I love history because of the lessons we can learn from great mentors of the past and events that have shaped what we have become and I am interested in this book and Nixon in general because I have some memories of his time as President and I admire the statesmanship he practiced after his presidency. 2. Tell us whether you were alive while Nixon was President and what did you think of him at the time and after. I have vague memories of Nixon as President. I remember my parents discussing Watergate and had perhaps a small understanding of what had taken place. I remember him boarding Marine One for the last time and I remember some of the newscasts of him during Vietnam. I was still pretty young during his time in office.
3. If you were not alive when Nixon was President or just a little guy or gal at the time - what do you remember hearing about Nixon at the time from your parents and grandparents. Did this shape your perception of the man? I guess I answered this in part in question 2. I agreed in my limited understanding with him being impeached likely because of conversations I heard around the house. I remember him more for his diplomatic work afterwards.
4. Do you think that Nixon should have been pardoned? Why or why not? No! Even though I admire the man for his efforts after his time in Washington. I think we are too often light handed with people of high office when they do things that are either illegal or unethical.
5. Do you think that Nixon was fairly treated? Why or why not? I believe so! He knew what was going on and as the man in the oval office that was where the buck stopped.
6. Do you think that Nixon was a great, good, fair or bad president based upon how you feel before you read the book. Why? Failings/redeeming qualities? I would say good. I think the power of the position went to his head. However, I thing the positives more than balance out his weaknesses over the long run. For example his efforts to open up relations with China, hard decisions made as he inherited Vietnam, etc. As I mentioned before I think he shines as a statesman after being President.
I. Hi, I am Kristen from Camano Island, Washington. History and politics really did not hold much interest for me years ago when I was a student, but fast forward a couple of decades and I seem to be wanting to make up for lost time. I am interested in this book because my knowledge of Nixon's presidency is limited primarily to media sound bytes and broad generalizations, and this group read will be a great opportunity to become better educated on this important piece of history and establish some opinions of my own.2/3. I was born the year he took office. I have no recollection; even years later, my exposure to politics at a young age was limited.
4/5. I will decide about his pardon and treatment after I am better educated on the history.
6. My view (pre-reading) is that Nixon was a man with a character that was not fit for the office of President. That's not to say he wasn't a capable, skillful, experienced statesman.
This should be an engaging read and group discussion. I'm excited to get started.
Looking forward to beginning the discussion this week!1. Hello everyone, my name is Cindie and I'm from NYC. I fell in love with history when we first started learning about U.S. History in 7th grade, and haven't looked back since. After entertaining the thought of becoming a history teacher for about five minutes, I decided I would rather keep it as a hobby.
2/3. I was not alive when Nixon was president, and my parents were in their early teens, so I am not sure they fully grasped what was going on at the time. My grandparents are Republicans whose policies line up relatively closely with Nixon's, but they have mentioned being taken aback at his paranoia and Watergate left a bad taste in their mouths.
4/5. I think that the pardon was necessary to let the nation move past the "drama", if you will, and can see why it was done although I don't believe he deserved it. I know that other presidents have at times acted above the law or felt that they should be able to, but since he did and he got caught, I believe he was treated fairly. Of course, this is a very black and white viewpoint to have so I am anticipating that my views will change over the course of reading this book.
6. I think Nixon's refusal to commit to domestic issues made him a bad President, but some of his foreign policies redeemed him. He's not the worst President we've ever had, but I wouldn't say he was a Good President.
Hi I’m Helga from Columbia, SC. I love history because of the lessons from the past and the opportunity to learn about the men and women involved. I like all aspects of history. I am especially interested in this book because I want to learn more about Nixon and to understand more about why I never liked him.2) I was in elementary school when Nixon became president so I was just starting to pay attention to politics but not really into it. Most of my opinions have been formed from what I have read and heard from others.
3) My father, a World War II vet, had negative opinions about Nixon so my early opinions were influenced by him.
4) I think Nixon should have been pardoned by Ford so Ford could start the healing process of the nation and his time in office with confidence. I think he needed to it for himself.
5) I think Nixon was treated fairly. He was trying to cover up his involvement and conceal evidence that needed to come out. He was no longer credible and could not be trusted. But I hope to find out more from this book for the basis of my opinion.
6) I think Nixon could have been a good president but he felt everyone was out to get him. He was paranoid and trusted no one. He wanted to take the credit for everything even if he wasn’t committed to it. I would like to find out more about his accomplishments because my main memory of him is Watergate.
message 35:
by
Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief
(last edited Oct 19, 2015 08:01AM)
(new)
-
rated it 4 stars
Mod
Today marks the beginning of the discussion of the book and this thread is focused on the following:
Week One - October 19th - October 25th
Author's Note and Chapter(s) One - Four - pages 1 - 42
Chapter Overview and Summary:
Author's Note
Chapter 1: "A great, bad man"
Chapter 2: "This is treason"
Chapter 3: "He was surrounded by enemies"
Chapter 4: "He will let them know who is boss around here"
Here is the link to the TOC and the syllabus for the discussion:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Chris from Maryland. I didn't enjoy history until a Western Civ class in college. After that I read mostly on WWII and the Civil War. I think Watergate was the first "real" news story I can remember as a kid but we never discussed it as a family so it faded from my sphere of interest fairly quickly. I have not read about Nixon or Watergate extensively but have a general idea that while he certainly had some foreign policy triumphs they were undermined by the numerous other debacles of his presidency.
Bentley, just to be clear, this thread is "no spoilers", meaning we can talk freely about only the chapters for the thread (and we don't need to use the spoiler HTML). We use the spoiler threads if we choose to read ahead or add additional research, etc. Do I have that right?
I am hooked already since I am finding out even more dirty tricks by Nixon of which I was unaware. His contacts with the government of South Vietnam prior to the election in order to one-up Johnson were mind blowing. Even before he was President he was starting to exert power to which he was not entitled and trying to control world events as a private citizen. Very scary.
Mod
Yes on this thread you can talk openly and freely about anything on pages 1 through 42 - this is not a single thread discussion like the book of the month or buddy reads.
However, do not place any spoilers here - place them on either the glossary thread, the book as a whole thread or the bibliography thread and on those threads - because they are marked as spoiler threads - you do not have to use the spoiler html on spoiler threads - at the top of the message box if you want - you can post the word - SPOILER ALERT - but even that is not necessary on a spoiler thread.
Once we get to the week two non spoiler thread - then you can post anything about the current week's assignment and also about any pages that came before.
Mod
Sorry Bentley, I just re-read your notes at the top. I'm so used to putting everything in a spoiler tag, I was afraid to just speak!I have read through chapter two so far and Jill, I couldn't agree more! I was so unaware of how self-serving and egotistical a man Nixon was! To disregard human lives for the sake of being elected president is ....well it's so horrifying I have no words! I feel very naive about this politics game, and I hope that there are catches in place these days so that this can not be occurring now.
Mod
Great point Jill - my immediate thought in the opening chapters is we all know, or at least have heard about Watergate, but Nixon's sabotaging the peace deals in 1968 seems like at least as big a deal. I wonder why he doesn't get as much flak for that.
Mod
Here is the link:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Jill wrote: "I am hooked already since I am finding out even more dirty tricks by Nixon of which I was unaware. His contacts with the government of South Vietnam prior to the election in order to one-up Johnson..."Eye-opening, the Chennault affair was an attempt by Nixon's team to get him elected. A violation of the Logan Act could be argued.
Why it never came up is beyond me and that was a horrendous mistake since it may have defeated him if it had been made public.
Hi, I am 'G' (short for Germaine) and I am from the Metropolitan New York area. I cannot remember a time when I did not love history. There is often a 'fantasy' quality to it, even when it is painfully real.I hope you will understand my interest in Nixon and this book from my answers to the pre-questions below:
2/3. The Nixon/Humphrey presidential election was the first one in which I voted. I did not vote for Nixon. I was still in college and very influenced by the social and political tone of the country at that time. Nixon seemed to be a hold over from my parents generation and he just didn't get it. What I have since learned about him reinforces my youthful prejudices. I hope this book can moderate those feelings.
4. Yes. For the sanity of the political arena of the country, he needed to be pardoned. Ford threw himself on his sword.
5. By whom? He was and he wasn't.
6. He was a very complex man in a very complex position. He was at once good, great and bad. He was bad because he had demons which dictated his actions. He was good because he started a guaranteed health care program, and for me a very important thing, he created the EPA. He was a great president because he managed a very bad economic situation and brought it under control.
I am looking forward to a new take on Richard M Nixon.
That was very surprising to me. He really tried to control things early. I'm sure his tenure as VP under Eisenhower gave him some early connections.
Dwight D. EisenhowerJill wrote: "I am hooked already since I am finding out even more dirty tricks by Nixon of which I was unaware. His contacts with the government of South Vietnam prior to the election in order to one-up Johnson..."
Mod
Hi I'm Tim from the Chicago area, I love history and reading all kinds of history and am looking forward to this book.2/3 I was 8 in 1968 when Nixon was elected and 14 when he resigned. Both my parents had very negative views of Nixon and that influenced my opinion of him.
4 I think Ford did the right thing by pardoning Nixon to heal the country although at the time I think I would have said the opposite
5 I think he was treated fairly
6 I do not think he was a good President, but his Presidency was very complex. I will be very interested in this book and seeing if it changes my opinion of him.
The History Book Club
Books mentioned in this topic
Chasing Shadows: The Nixon Tapes, the Chennault Affair, and the Origins of Watergate (other topics)Fatal Politics: The Nixon Tapes, the Vietnam War, and the Casualties of Reelection (other topics)
Vietnam: A History (other topics)
Richard M. Nixon: A Life in Full (other topics)
Richard M. Nixon: A Life in Full (other topics)
More...
Authors mentioned in this topic
Ken Hughes (other topics)Stanley Karnow (other topics)
Conrad Black (other topics)
Conrad Black (other topics)
Niall Ferguson (other topics)
More...
For the week of October 19th - October 25th, we are reading the Author's Note and Chapters One through Four of One Man Against the World: The Tragedy of Richard Nixon.
The first week's reading assignment is:
Week One - October 19th - October 25th
Author's Note and Chapters One through Four
We will open up a thread for each week's reading. Please make sure to post in the particular thread dedicated to those specific chapters and page numbers to avoid spoilers. We will also open up supplemental threads as we did for other spotlighted books.
This book is being kicked off on October 19th.
We look forward to your participation. Amazon, Barnes and Noble and other noted on line booksellers do have copies of the book and shipment can be expedited. The book can also be obtained easily at your local library, local bookstore or on your Kindle. This weekly thread will be opened up October 19th.
There is no rush and we are thrilled to have you join us. It is never too late to get started and/or to post.
Bentley will be preparing for this discussion and Assisting Moderator (T) Teri will be moderating on a weekly basis.
Welcome,
~Bentley
TO ALWAYS SEE ALL WEEKS' THREADS SELECT VIEW ALL
REMEMBER NO SPOILERS ON THE WEEKLY NON SPOILER THREADS - ON EACH WEEKLY NON SPOILER THREAD - WE ONLY DISCUSS THE PAGES ASSIGNED OR THE PAGES WHICH WERE COVERED IN PREVIOUS WEEKS. IF YOU GO AHEAD OR WANT TO ENGAGE IN MORE EXPANSIVE DISCUSSION - POST THOSE COMMENTS IN ONE OF THE SPOILER THREADS. THESE CHAPTERS HAVE A LOT OF INFORMATION SO WHEN IN DOUBT CHECK WITH THE CHAPTER OVERVIEW AND SUMMARY TO RECALL WHETHER YOUR COMMENTS ARE ASSIGNMENT SPECIFIC. EXAMPLES OF SPOILER THREADS ARE THE GLOSSARY, THE BIBLIOGRAPHY, THE INTRODUCTION AND THE BOOK AS A WHOLE THREADS.
Notes:
It is always a tremendous help when you quote specifically from the book itself and reference the chapter and page numbers when responding. The text itself helps folks know what you are referencing and makes things clear.
Citations:
If an author or book is mentioned other than the book and author being discussed, citations must be included according to our guidelines. Also, when citing other sources, please provide credit where credit is due and/or the link. There is no need to re-cite the author and the book we are discussing however.
If you need help - here is a thread called the Mechanics of the Board which will show you how:
http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/2...
Also the citation thread:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Introduction Thread:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Table of Contents and Syllabus
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Glossary
Remember there is a glossary thread where ancillary information is placed by the moderator. This is also a thread where additional information can be placed by the group members regarding the subject matter being discussed.
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Bibliography
There is a Bibliography where books cited in the text are posted with proper citations and reviews. We also post the books that the author used in his research or in his notes. Please also feel free to add to the Bibliography thread any related books, etc with proper citations. No self promotion, please. We will be adding to this thread as we read along.
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Book as a Whole and Final Thoughts - SPOILER THREAD
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Directions on how to participate in a book offer and how to follow the t's and c's - One Man Against the World - What Do I Do Next?
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...