Pakistani Readers discussion

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Lord of the Flies
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lord of the flies, Buddy Read! :) [[Oct. 2022. ]]

yes! totally
however, the reviews on the book aren't all that great :( we could still give it a try though."
Hmm. Okay. Well, I think I will watch the movie before committing to the book. I'll let you know if I decide to read it and then we can set something up :-)

Yes you're right. The romance part is very questionable too to me xD. Suspense and Gothic is spot on."
Sorry, I missed this. Yes, you're right. It's more like Gothic Novel than Gothic Romance.
Suspense. Some Mystery. Little Horror. Very little Romance. Set in a historical time period.
Gothic Romance is pretty much the same, except it has a bit more Romance. For example: Victoria Holt's books.

I'd be alright with horror too. But I'll scarcely be around , if at all till November because the Mdcat is coming.
Besides I think I've put "The Trial" on hold for enough time now lmao.
Oh and I recently experimented with Stephen King books too. Same verdict. Very. Very boring reads.
The premises themselves are interesting , like in my case I read The Long Walk which seemed very exciting . I enjoy characters fighting to the bitter end and all manner of military involvement and this seemed to have both.
But it ended up being just what the title says. A walk. And it was real long.
In the case of the shining it was marketed as a horror but again it seemed to be more of a family's descent into chaos with occasional bouts of horror in the final third of the book.
But as Ramla put it : To each their own.
King is critically acclaimed afterall , and my friend that doesn't read ( who lent me his copy of the shining ) swears by him.
It's actually kind of funny because I read "On Writing : A memoir of the Craft" where King basically gives out advice to aspiring writers and that was a better read

Anyway, you guys could consider Romantic Suspense for the buddy read if you don't want to go for Horror. Different books have a different level of scariness. Some can be very intense. Others are a lot lighter.
There's also Paranormal Romantic Suspense if you wish for a touch of supernatural in the story.
You could also consider Crime Thriller, which is similar to Romantic Suspense, except it's darker and the Romance is minimal.
You could also try Psychological Thriller if you don't want to go for Psychological Horror. I'm not sure what factors differentiate both genres from each other, but I'm sure you can find out by comparing plots and reviews.
Just a few suggestions from my side :-)


If you can't find it or don't like the sound of it then Now You See Her by Linda Howard is also quite enjoyable. I personally liked her Mr. Perfect more but that one doesn't have any supernatural element.
Plus, I know a fellow GR member who's very much into this genre. I could ask her for more recommendations if you like.
Of course, if you guys decide to go for basic Romantic Suspense then I can offer tons of recommendations. Lol.
If you decide to consider Psychological Thriller—as I assume that would be closest to Psychological Horror—then I know someone who reads this genre as well. I could get recommendations from her. In the meantime, you can check out The Girl on the Train and Gone Girl. I haven't read them but both seem to be popular books in this genre.


There are also Cozy Mysteries if you wish for something lighter in the Mystery genre. But you won't get a thriller type feeling from them if that's what you're looking for. They're more like a modern version of Classic whodunits with a bit of Romance and humour.
For example: Death on Demand, Hail to the Chef, and Grime and Punishment.
Just to give you an idea :-)
Or you could go for Golden-Age Mystery aka Classic Whodunits. Like Agatha Christie. Or perhaps Georgette Heyer's books if you want something with more humour.
For example: Death in the Stocks, Why Shoot a Butler?, and No Wind of Blame.

Regarding Romantic Suspense:
If you want something intense then you can check out Closer Than You Think


If you wish for something lighter in this genre then you can check out Survive the Night


I could recommend loads of more books in this genre, but I'd probably end up confusing you all. Lol.


this month i was also planning to read the secret history by donna tart it's also a dark book but it is long with up to 400 pages i guess.
There are alot of books in this genre if you want any recommendation i am in.
@zarshal, as you said you didn't end liking books of this genre well you could try some shorter books, first they are short to complete even if you don't like them,
and you can even read some lightweight books in dark and spooky genre there are alot of books as "the yellow wallpaper"
you can even get a good star with a little dark psychological thrillers this genre is spooky and dark but it is quite enjoyable alot I've read quite alot books in this genre and i absolutely liked them,

I never did get around to reading And Then There Were None by Agatha Christie. I hear people raving about it, but then they go on to say it's different from her other books. This makes me reluctant to try it since I love her other books. Lol. Stupid, right?
I strongly recommend her Hercule Poirot and Miss Marple books though. I can't imagine any Mystery lover not enjoying them :-)

Ramla Zareen wrote: "There are also Cozy Mysteries if you wish for something lighter in the Mystery genre."
There are also Paranormal Cozy Mysteries if you are interested. Just thought I'd share :-)

Good luck with mdcat :D study hard"
Yes, best of luck @Uzair :-) May Allah bless you with success. (Ameen).

I'll definitely check out the night owl.
You must give the dark history a chance. Best book to read in winters while snuggled up in a blanket. Really engaging thriller mystery plus the dark academia element really adds to the allure. I read it last year around this time and really enjoyed it. Wished for it to never end.
The yellow wallpaper is on my tbr too. it's pretty short so I might try reading it soon to end my reading slump :D

Ramla Zareen wrote: "Regarding Romantic Suspense:
If you want something intense then..."
One more Romantic Suspense worth checking out:
After the Dark by Cynthia Eden
And if you're looking for something really fast paced and full of action then Hostile Pursuit by Juno Rushdan is a good option.

wish you good luck with it:D

Short stories can sometimes help to end a reading slump as they're less overwhelming than a full-length book. Try "Carry On, Jeeves" by P. G. Wodehouse. These are light stories and serve well as a palate cleanser between heavier books. Just a suggestion :-)

Thank you for your feedback on The Silence of the Lambs. I guess I'll watch it after all. My husband will be happy, and if I wake him up with nightmares then it will be his own fau..."
I think it's always better to watch the movie first and then read the book because movie adaptations are usually pretty bad :P and well, by reading the book first my expectations for the movie aren't that high and there's minimal damage xD
But really, it's your own preference. I really like the movie but I haven't read the book. You can watch the movie first for like 2 hours and then know whether you like it or not, and if you want to use your time reading the book too afterwards, great!
I'll try to read it with you guys but I really can't promise anything. I have exams coming up, some family events, and too many unfinished books. ._.

this month i was also planning to read the secret history by donna tart it's also a dark book but it is long with up to 400 pages i gue..."
I'll surely try them, thanks for your suggestions. For now, I have this urge to start reading Islamic history. :P

I'd be alright with horror too. But I'll scarcely be around , if at all till November because the Mdcat is coming.
Besides I think I've put "The Trial" on hold for enough time now lmao.
Oh..."
Yay you're finally going to finish The Trial! I wonder when I'm gonna do that xD
Good luck for your mdcat, make us proud! xD


Let's start with the why. Why do we read books?
Before we had other forms of entertainment media (movies, video games, VNs etc), the answer was straightforward: primarily for knowledge, secondarily for a refined sort of entertainment. If you go further back around the advent of the Neolithic, reading was just an exercise in passing information compactly, more concretely than oral tradition. It was only somewhere around the earlier affluent civilizations -- it's hard to pin down exactly which since nearly all had 'myths' which served as children stories while also preserving tradition and providing guidance for adults -- that we see the rise of literature that is purely for entertainment. Fine, as self-serving creatures, we don't wanna say no to fun, right?
In modern times though, there's lots of other options for fun. It almost appears, at first glance, that if your goal is to just have fun then movies are superior to books given that the former is just .. easier to consume -- it gets straight to the point, no lengthy descriptions, no imagination required, you see the facts straight up. Characters talk, story progresses, you see it in real-time as if it's happening in front of you. If you want to be a part of the story then you have video games or visual novels. Interactivity: something that books can only approximate vaguely (and if your goal is to have fun, you would never wanna read those hard, hard books ya know).
But we still read. For fun, apparently. How is that possible?
There is something that books have that no other media can replicate: an inside view. When you're reading a book, you don't just see the interactions of the characters with the world around them; you read their thoughts, their feelings -- you paint a picture of them that is closer to life than what any movie or video game can accomplish because while monologue is possible in those media, it is still vocalized monologue: still an external interaction. It's not ... in there, so to say. You can find a movie character extremely relatable, but you never really get inside their minds like you would for a character in a book.
And it's not limited to just characters. For example, Andrei Tarkovsky, the famous Russian movie director of the 20th century, used 'still shots' a lot. The camera would fix upon a certain imagery and then stay there, focusing in slowly and then out just a little. The cinema-goers of today feel that it's intended as a soporific, thanks to their low attention-span, but during his time, people understood the trick: the still shots were intended to focus just long enough on an imagery so that a viewer can put it in the context of the movie and find its significance. The literature equivalent of a still shot is ... just describing the imagery lol. That's it. You could impart any scenery and, depending on what words you choose to describe it, make it majestic, lonely, fearful, desolate, etc. It's up to you to put the imagery into context and not rely on the reader to figure it out. Tarkovsky's still shots were a half approximation to the descriptive prowess of literature. Only literature reserves the right to provide the inside view of things.
It stands to reason that, once you know exactly why you like something you'd want to hone into that feeling so you can appreciate it more. I mean, for you Romance readers, it shouldn't be too hard to imagine that if you like a person and yet can't quite put a finger on it until one day you figure out it's because he looks like Shrek or treats you like Flynn Rider, then you would cherish that trait forever ... in theory at least.
And so my quest for 'better literature' began: once I learned that the power literature has is exactly this, it would be unwise to not find more of it. It would be exceedingly unwise to ignore my findings out of some inane imperative to just please myself with the status quo because I don't want to be judgmental to people who never took the time to figure things out. It would be even more unwise to go on reading books that had less and less of that quality only to end up saying that reading books has not made me any better than the people around me and therefore reading is on the same level as gardening or cooking or just shitting on the streets because it's all the same.
You ask for better when you know exactly what you have or what you like.
You make more conscious, more active, decisions when you know exactly where you're headed. To live passively and satisfy yourself with whatever, you only need to constantly delude yourself that things are fine as they are -- and the internet has helped you plenty in doing so.
Why should we justify our choices to others?
Have you ever bothered to justify them to yourself?
Have you ever paused and asked yourself, could things be better?
Have you ever wondered that this world existed long before you were born and will continue to exist long after you and therefore you have an almost sacred duty to understand what is happening?
Have you ever counted all the things you have and put them squarely against all the things you're capable of giving back?
Have you ever questioned yourself, what will I leave behind?
I believe all human beings of sufficient intellect and a working conscience have come across these questions once in their lives. If you haven't ...
You see, you don't have to make an allowance for fun, for pleasure, for what is easy. It's always there. We always tend towards it. No one has to tell us, "have fun!", because we'll be having it one way or another anyway. No one has to tell us, "do what your heart desires!", because we'll be doing it one way or another anyway, and if we can't, you bet your ass we'll spend our whole lives trying to find a way to do it .
For instance, Buddy Reads is not a compulsion. You are not expected to read only the Buddy Read in a given month. If it's not to your liking, you just simply skip it and go on reading whatever the hell you want. But for the last month or so, we have been choosing literature that is supposedly difficult and it took literally nothing else for some people to feel like it threatened their 'freedom' or their 'fun', enough so that the last few pages of this thread have been dedicated to, what I can only label as, the most inane defense of mediocrity I've ever personally read and I've read some shit in my life.
It took literally nothing.
You would imagine that it's common sense that one would read whatever one desires if there's no social imperative to read anything else, so in group reads or other contexts where there can be a social imperative, then one should choose the books that one WOULD NOT want to read precisely because there one has a reason to expand one's horizons. If left to one's own devices, there will only be a myopia.
Ask yourself, you spent your whole life reading books you wanted to read. Did you ever intentionally foray into the more serious side of literature by yourself?
And if you did, did you find enough guidance to push through it?
But of course, it's easier to dismiss this branch entirely. It's easier to just say, "To hell with your judgments! I do not owe you an explanation for my choices! I can do whatever the hell I want".
That is my point. You can do whatever you want. If you want to insist on mediocrity, by all means do so. But there are some who don't want to do it. They want to read better literature. They want to be better human beings, not just for the people around them but for the future generations ahead, millennia ahead. They want better, and they don't care if it's not momentarily fun.
Can we make an allowance for that?
Or do you want to pull everyone down to your level too lest they become 'arrogant'?
Can we let people who are willingly offering themselves up for a better understanding of the world have their way or do we want to reduce everyone to the lowest common denominator which is your pleasurable passivity and a 'non-judgmental' narrative that has spent the last 2 pages judging the other side for wishing better?

I will say this though. Let's not get swept away by our passions , let's remain cordial and productive. I have immense respect in one way or another for the people involved in this debate , you've helped me grow over the years , and I do believe no one has malicious intentions here. It's a clash of philosophies and those can get heated but logic and reason win out.
We all stand to learn something here so let's try to avoid jabs at one another and getting defensive.

wish y'all good luck.


They’re both interesting, I liked reading both of them and I would rate them equally usually. But since you’re asking which one to read first, ask yourself if you need more mystery or autobiography? Because both have romance.
Also, there’s a Count of Monte Cristo movie too if you wanna watch it first. It’s really good.

Why do we read books? There's no single answer. I've interacted with a lot of readers over the years, and everyone seems to have their own reasons for reading.
Even one person can have a different reason for reading at a different time. I know someone who reads philosophical books because they make her think. She also reads light genres as a palate cleanser between heavier books or when she wants to relax after a hard day of work.
I once met someone who was reading a book because she loved the way the author phrased his thoughts even though she didn't agree with what he wrote. Lol. She said she appreciated the language and the writing.
Anyway, you made a few good points. I even agree with some of what you said. Books can offer us an insight that's hard to gain through other mediums. They open our minds. They can help us learn and improve ourselves.
However, I still hold to what I said earlier—it's wrong to judge someone based on what they read. Just because someone reads a lighter genre or doesn't read at all doesn't make him an inferior person.
Good things can be learned from any source, anywhere, and at any time. It could be from reading an intellectual book. It could be from a Romance novel. Watching a documentary. Travelling. Gardening. Playing with your child. You can learn as long as you keep your mind open. That's what I believe.
I could see two people sitting side by side on a bench. One is reading a philosophical book and the other is reading a Mystery or a Romantic Comedy. Should I automatically assume that the person reading a philosophical book has superior understanding, knowledge, abilities, and values? I don't think so. But hey, that's me. You're entitled to your own opinion :-)

I've only read Jane Eyre. It was a long time ago, but I remember I enjoyed it. Just thought I'd share :-)

Why do we read books? There's no single answer. I've interacted with a lot of readers over the years, and everyone seems to have their own reasons for reading.
Even one person can have a d..."
I'm all of those people you've mentioned. I also read lighter genres in between, every now and then, though I really much prefer to go out with friends or actually engage in romance in real life than read about it, but I'm still open to it.
Again, the point is not that a certain genre is better than another. If you read my post again, you would fail to find any mention of any genre (not even philosophy).
What I'm getting at is a characteristic that can be found in any genre: that inside view. It's just by chance that it often happens to be Psychological/Philosophical. But it's purely by chance.
For instance, I just recently finished the book "The Recognitions". It was by no means a philosophical book; it had some psychological bits here and there but nothing too out of the ordinary. And yet it offered an inside view in a depth that I've rarely found anywhere else.
Is that book, hence, better than others? Yes, because saying otherwise means a deeper insight into things is the same as a shallow one.
Is valuing things for what they are better than valuing them for what they offer you? Yes, because saying otherwise means nothing matters except your feelings.
My thesis, in short, is learning to love things for what they are -- difficult, dense, elitist, whatever -- rather than for what they can offer you -- enjoyment, pleasure, 'palate cleansing'.
Side note:
I've been in multiple romantic relationships in my life and the worst partners I've had were avid Romance readers. Go figure.

You're welcome @Batool Hope you enjoy whatever book you choose to read first :-)

Well, a lot of Cozy Mystery, Contemporary Romance, and Contemporary Romantic Suspense books I read are written in Third Person Deep POV. Some Romantic Comedies/Chick-Lit I read are in First Person POV.
In both cases, I manage to get into the heads of the main characters. I get an insight into their thoughts and feelings as they go through different situations. It makes the books more enjoyable. Plus, it helps me connect to the characters and even learn a thing or two as they evolve.
Most Classics were written in Third Person Omniscient though. From what I remember. Yet I managed to relate to and learn from the characters in a lot of books. Like Anne of Green Gables Eight-book Series, the Little Women Four-book Series, and others.
Thall wrote: "And yet it offered an inside view in a depth that I've rarely found anywhere else.
Is that book, hence, better than others? Yes, because saying otherwise means a deeper insight into things is the same as a shallow one."
Well, I could have my own set of criteria for evaluating which book is better than the other. Another person could have a different criteria. Or they could have the same set of criteria as me but their way of evaluating those criteria could be different.
How can I claim my set of criteria is superior or that my way of evaluating those criteria is superior?
To make it simpler—you considered a book good because it offered you knowledge and insight. Another person could call a certain book good because it made him happy.
Now—isn't happiness as important as knowledge?
Everyone is allowed to answer this question differently. However, I'd like to share something. There's this documentary called "Where to Invade Next" by Michael Moore.
Description on Wikipedia:
The film, in the style of a travelogue, has Moore spending time in countries such as Italy, France, Finland, Tunisia, Slovenia, Germany, and Portugal where he experiences those countries' alternative methods of dealing with social and economic ills experienced in the United States.
Here's the part where he explores Finland's education system and compares it to US:
1) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe8S7G2...
2) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Cpy7qkf...
In the second video, a Math teacher was asked what he wanted the kids to learn at school. He said he wanted the kids to be happy and have a happy life. The principal said she wanted the kids to play. Finland's education system is ranked near the top in the world. Just something to consider :-)
Thall wrote: "Is valuing things for what they are better than valuing them for what they offer you? Yes, because saying otherwise means nothing matters except your feelings.
My thesis, in short, is learning to love things for what they are -- difficult, dense, elitist, whatever -- rather than for what they can offer you -- enjoyment, pleasure, 'palate cleansing'."
When we say books can help us become better. Aren't we valuing them for what they're offering us? Just wondering :-)
Appreciating a piece of writing for what it is? Sure that's good. However, literature is subjective. Different people can perceive the same book differently. There can be conflicting opinions about even the same aspect of a book:
Great characterisation. One-dimensional characters.
Crisp writing. Rambling sentences.
Fast-paced story. The story dragged.
Endearing heroine. Stupid heroine.
Interesting. Boring.
Difficult. Easy.
Insightful. Shallow.
I've seen these kind of conflicting opinions in reviews and beta readers feedback.
I once had my book beta read. One reader labelled a certain action of my character as "he's so sweet" while the second reader highlighted the same action as "what a jerk". I sent the book to a third beta reader to break the tie. She didn't make any comment on that action. Lol.
I then asked the appreciative beta reader why she liked that action and the critical one why she didn't. Then I tweaked the scene accordingly. It was interesting to discover the thought process through which they arrived at a different conclusion about the same action. I actually ended up learning from the experience :-)
Anyway, my comment is going way off track and unnecessarily long. Lol. As @Zarshal said, this is a Buddy Read thread and not the right place to have these type of discussions. You made certain comments. I disagreed with some of them. If I misunderstood what you wrote or offended you with my opinions then I apologise. Have a nice day :-)

Thall wrote: "Have you ever wondered that this world existed long before you were born and will continue to exist long after you and therefore you have an almost sacred duty to understand what is happening?"
Everyone has their own way of trying to figure this out. I wish to start by trying to understand the Quran. I'm trying to do this online course—trying is the keyword here—which I hope will help me. InshAllah. I shared details about the course in another thread in case anyone's interested in checking it out:
https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Please pray for me that I manage to do this and that it works out well for me. (Ameen).
Thanks :-)



So, I finally gathered the courage to watch The Silence of the Lambs but then we found out it was no longer on our Netflix in Germany. Lol. However, we watched another Psychological Thriller—Hypnotic. It was scary, creepy, weird, and disturbing all rolled into one. Yet we enjoyed it :-) Just thought I'd share :-)


Glad to hear you enjoyed hypnotic :D
I personally enjoy the works of ari aster and Mike Flanagan alot in horror. Really mind bending and trippy stories. Do try their movies as well :D


Update fairly quickly with new stuff.
Good qualities and lots and lots of subtitle options
Of course there's ads what with it being free but they're waaaaaay less than. Other sites

How's everyone else faring so far?
Books mentioned in this topic
Small Things Like These (other topics)After the Dark (other topics)
Hostile Pursuit (other topics)
Armed 'N' Ready (other topics)
Closer Than You Think (other topics)
More...
Authors mentioned in this topic
Rene Denfeld (other topics)Rene Denfeld (other topics)
Francesca Zappia (other topics)
Nicola Yoon (other topics)
Neil Gaiman (other topics)
yes! totally
however, the reviews on the book aren't all that great :( we could still give it a try though.