General Questions

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Please post your general questions about the Spring 2014 challenge here. Specific questions about individual tasks should be posted in the Help Threads for those tasks.

[Susan A]

I have a general question for moderators.

I know the book I chose works for 5.9 -- the word is on the cocktail list, matches exactly, so I don't have a question about it. However, is it just easier for you if I post for approval and then link the approval when I post for points?

And the same question for similar tasks

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Susan A wrote: "I have a general question for moderators.

I know the book I chose works for 5.9 -- the word is on the cocktail list, matches exactly, so I don't have a question about it. However, is it just easi..."

No. There is no need at all to post for approvals. The help threads are designed to ask about questionable books - whether a cover is green enough, or whether some variation of a word works, etc. If it's clearcut, just post it in the completed task thread. If you're not sure whether a book works, then use the help thread.

[Setalpgninnpsekil]

I have a question about ebook page length involving different translations. Let's say I have a translation of the Iliad by Richard Lattimore. Per the rules, if I read the Iliad on my Kindle, I'm supposed to use the mass market edition for the page count. However, this translation is not available in mass market. Would I just use the regular paperback version for this translation? I only ask because a different translation can wildly vary the story and page/word count, and it can be almost like reading a completely different book.

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Setalpgninnpsekil wrote: "I have a question about ebook page length involving different translations. Let's say I have a translation of the Iliad by Richard Lattimore. Per the rules, if I read the Iliad on my Kindle, I'm su..."

yes, if there's no MMP edition of this specific translation, use the regular PB edition.

[Setalpgninnpsekil]

Awesome. Thank you.

[Susan A]

I have a question about page requirements or maybe this is a comment.

As a reader of books that are not mainstream, page count requirements can be a killer for me. Especially when the task is really specific. The page count requirement eliminates at last half of the books I own or am interested in.

I do understand that the "pages" listed for ebooks varies widely, so much so that it is completely unreliable. But in a similar manner, this is true for paperbacks as well -- all 200 page books do not hold the same number of words.

Lots of ebooks list a wordcount.

I would like to suggest that we consider wordcount acceptable for tasks that require a certain number of papes.

[Dee]

but if we make allowances, then it kind of takes the challenge element out of it...at least to me, it seems kind of counter to the challenge, if you only want to pick books that you own/are interested in to read...that in itself does not make it a challenge...but that is jsut me

[Susan A]

I am not asking for a one time allownance. I would like to ask if we can consider or discuss using converted word count for pages.

Words per page in a paperback is not at all standardized, so I think that word count is actually more consistent than number of pages.


I don't think it is productive to make a comment about what I consider to be a challenge vs what you consider to be a challenge.

[Dee]

Knowing the amount if work that the moderators already put into the challenge verifying Ebooks only page counts to meet the minimum requirements - this would place additional/undue requirements on them and that really seems unfair considering some tasks require 250, some 300, or combos to reach a certain point - where should the line be drawn on time constraints / approvals in the challenge

[Lulu]

I'm just wondering if there is actually a way to verify word counts for paperback books, even? I've just tried searching for the word count for about 5 books - two of them Kindle books (maybe I'm missing how to check this?) and the other three paperbacks - I'm planning on reading for this challenge, and I can't find the word count for any of them.

My point being, while ebooks can be verified for page length, I'm wondering if/how paperback or professionally published ebooks will be verified? And if there are separate conditions for both, isn't that a lot of work for the mods?

[Setalpgninnpsekil]

If a conversion rate was agreed upon, then we could just math it out.

I've read somewhere that the average is about 250 words per page. This of course is varied per size of the font and page. But if the best standard possible was picked, the challenge could read that the books must be 100 pages minimum in print or 25,000 words minimum in ebook form.

[Susan A]

I am not a moderator. So, no I haven't any idea how much time it takes. I can imagine that it is a lot of time and that time is appreciated.

ebooks are already subject to getting approval in the length approval thread.

Here is a word to page converter, once a standard was agreed upon - -font, font size, spacing -- word count would standardized.

http://www.wordstopages.com/

If for example 12 pt Arial, single space was agreed to be the standard, then 90,000 word = 200 pages - -every time, no need to look it up again.

Cold Front This book list 156,550 word count. Clearly more than 200 pages - -there is no aditional work after the standardization.

For tasks that require a combined number of pages, it could be required that the reader plug in the word count and link the results in the post. THat would save some work.


Again, as I am not a moderator, I can't forsee the amount of additional work this would add - -that is why I am asking the moderators to consider this.

More frequently, books are only published in ebook format. THe paperback page count is limiting what we can read.



Lisa --
I'm not sure I follow your post. There would be no need to translate paperback pages to word count under my proposal .

[Dee]

you know - its obvious that no matter what people say, you are going to argue because you think your way is right - yes its bitchy but i'm kind of tired of it - in the last several seasons the number of complaints about the way things are run has increased significantly - gripes about how the genre tasks are written, gripes about page counts - its getting fustrating - if you don't like the rules of the challenge, don't participate, no one is forcing you.

all of the complaining is actually starting to ruin my enjoyment of the challenge, because its like whenever I see a comment on my task or others, its like, what are people going to complain about this time

[Dana]

Dee wrote: "you know - its obvious that no matter what people say, you are going to argue because you think your way is right - yes its bitchy but i'm kind of tired of it - in the last several seasons the numb..."

I absolutely love this challenge. I have read more books, and a wider variety of books, since I've been doing this. I can't say enough how much I appreciate the time and effort the mods put into something that is here just for our enjoyment. It's not like we're getting paid by the correct point-entry or something - just figure out the task, get it clarified if necessary, and then just go with it.

I'll be so bummed if this group gets bogged down in technicalities that cause the mods to feel unappreciated and frustrated.

If there is anything else I can say or do, somewhere I can send a cake or a dollar, let me know :)

[Dee]

I may need some alcohol ;)

[Susan A]

I didn't realize I was in a argument. I was simply asking if there could be a discussion about a change and offering suggestions as to how it could work.

I do enjoy in this challenge. One of the many good things about it is how it is different each time. Because it is different each time, I didn't think it would be inappropriate to ask for a discussion about including word counts.

I'm not sure why my comments are offending you. I mean nothing personal toward you.

[Fiona (Titch)]

Where about can I put this book in the challenge please?

- Nadine Christian?

[Dlmrose, Moderator Emeritus]

Fiona (Titch) wrote: "Where about can I put this book in the challenge please?

- Nadine Christian?"

I moved this question to (the now open, sorry about that) 0.0 fit this book

[Book Concierge]

Question: Task 5.3 Candyland ... Must include the sequence "and" in a word in the title or subtitle.

Would the word "AND" (as a standalone) count? E.g. The Master and Margarita

Or must "and" be embedded within another word, such as Austenland?

[Dee]

You need to ask that in the specific task thread

[Book Concierge]

Dee wrote: "You need to ask that in the specific task thread"

There is NO specific task thread for this task....

[Dee]

there is - right here - https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Book Concierge wrote: "Dee wrote: "You need to ask that in the specific task thread"

There is NO specific task thread for this task...."

there is a specific task thread for every task. When you open the list, look at the bottom - you'll see that there are two or three pages of different threads.

[Book Concierge]

Question: When a task requires that a particular "genre" appears on the books "main page" ...
Does that mean this page: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...

Or this page: https://www.goodreads.com/work/shelve...

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Book Concierge wrote: "Question: When a task requires that a particular "genre" appears on the books "main page" ...
Does that mean this page: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1......"

the first. The book's main page, with the name, author, plot description, etc.

[Book Concierge]

Question: Are we also to keep a page count?

I see that in some posts. Obviously we have to note the pages if claiming the Big Book ticket, but do we need page count for all books?

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Book Concierge wrote: "Question: Are we also to keep a page count?

I see that in some posts. Obviously we have to note the pages if claiming the Big Book ticket, but do we need page count for all books?"

People put all kinds of things in their posts, but that doesn't mean it's required. You should read the Posting Requirements to see what you must include.

One thing that can be very helpful is to include a little info in your post - "I chose option 1, book with the genre 'mystery'" or something like that. When we're doing the readerboard, we're juggling lots and lots of tasks, some of which are very similar. It can help to have a quick reminder of what we're looking for!

NOTE: Edited to make the link go to the most recent posting requirements!

[SamZ]

I have a question regarding task 10.6.
I don't want to start an argument regarding lifestyles, but I am uncomfortable for personal reasons reading a book with the genre LGBT. I don't want to replace the task, but possibly add to it. Maybe have a LGBT genre OR another option. Would it be possible to modify the task slightly to include other aspects of rainbows? Maybe have a rainbow on the cover or have the author's initials be in the word RAINBOW?
Once again, I do not wish to bring politics into the SRC, but I'd love to be able to finish the challenge this season.

[Ty]

I hate mystery. But still make myself slog through that stuff to finish. shrug. up to you to comply with the tasks or not. No politics, no force. Just you making the decision yourself.

[Setalpgninnpsekil]

Sam wrote: "I have a question regarding task 10.6.
I don't want to start an argument regarding lifestyles, but I am uncomfortable for personal reasons reading a book with the genre LGBT. I don't want to replac..."

I mean, a ton of the challenges here ask us to read romance novels. I believe one of the task options is to read a book with a bare chested male on the cover. I'm a heterosexual guy..

Now, are these the type of books I immediately go for at my local bookshop? Absolutely not. Am I going to read them to try and complete the challenge? Sure. Maybe I'll learn something about the genre in the process.

Do what I do. I made a list of every book I want to read for every task. Completing a challenge is VERY VERY hard, and unless you are pretty sure you are going to beat the challenge, just make the book you are least looking forward to the last one you read. If you don't get to it, then be happy. If you do, then consider it an opportunity to learn about a literary genre you aren't familiar with.


Every book, no matter how bad it is, is part of a continuing literary education. In fact, I sometimes learn more from the bad books than the good books. And what's the worst that could happen? You like it?

[Dee]

And I'm sure if you ask in the help thread someone may be able to give you some ideas of potential books to check out

[Sassafrass]

Ty wrote: "I hate mystery. But still make myself slog through that stuff to finish. shrug. up to you to comply with the tasks or not. No politics, no force. Just you making the decision yourself."

Ty, I hear ya. My achilles heel is NF. I have so much trouble finding something that I am actually interested in to try. But, you know the last few challenges, I've had to read some NF books that I've really enjoyed!

[SamZ]

Dee wrote: "And I'm sure if you ask in the help thread someone may be able to give you some ideas of potential books to check out"

That's a great idea, thanks Dee!

[Ty]

Sassafrass wrote: "Ty wrote: "I hate mystery. But still make myself slog through that stuff to finish. shrug. up to you to comply with the tasks or not. No politics, no force. Just you making the decision yourself."..."

NF is hard for me, too! I think the key is to find a subject you really, really enjoy. For me, that's the geeky stuff: astronomy, space flight, certain historical figures. I've loved the last few that I've read.

[Stacie]

I'm hoping to read The Winged Wheel: A Half-Century of the Detroit Red Wings in Photographs for a task during the challenge.

I know the title makes it seem like sort of a coffee-table book (a lot of pictures but little writing), but after flipping through it, there a certainly more than 100 pages of writing. I's just like to avoid this coming into question when I post. Can I get it pre-approved?

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Stacie wrote: "I'm hoping to read The Winged Wheel: A Half-Century of the Detroit Red Wings in Photographs for a task during the challenge.

I know the title makes it seem like sort of a coffee-ta..."

From the descriptions of this book, it appears that it is primarily focused on pictures with some "commentary." This book does not appear to be widely available, nor does Amazon have a "look inside," so this will have to be determined by your own judgment. Since this is a reading challenge, the books used should be primarily focused on text, not on pictures. From the descriptions of the book, it does not appear to be appropriate for use in the challenge, but you will have to use your own judgment as to whether the primary focus of the book is the text and it contains at least 100 pages of solid text (as opposed to picture captions and brief descriptions).

If you do use the book, please include an explanation in your competed task post of how it fits the challenge, as being primarily focused on text, not pictures.

[Book Concierge]

There is no HELP THREAD for the group read task 20.10 ...

Do we have to read the exact edition of the book shown, or will any edition work, as long as we read and participate in the discussion?

[Dee]

any edition works as long as you read/participate in the discussion

[Susan A]

Not sure where to ask this -- please re-direct me if necessasry.

Is this children' book , Menace From the Deep, acceptable for 5, 10 ,15 pt tasks and those tasks that allow for < 300 page children's books?

It is a Scholastic book. The back of the book states: "Appeals to 5th - 7th graders", reading level Grade 4.

From the rules:
When evaluating a book under this rule, ask yourself, "Who is the intended audience of this book?". If that intended audience is 9 years old or younger, it probably doesn't work for SRC tasks.


In my school district 4th graders are 10 years old so it seems that this should work. But I am not sure if age/grade is the same everywhere. My 11 year recommended it.

Thanks for your help.

[Ty]

4th grade is usually 9 years old in our school district. You start kindergarten @ age 5...

[Dlmrose, Moderator Emeritus]

Susan A wrote: "Not sure where to ask this -- please re-direct me if necessasry.

Is this children' book , Menace From the Deep, acceptable for 5, 10 ,15 pt tasks and those tasks that allow for < ..."

Menace From the Deep may be used for a 5, 10 or 15 pt task or those tasks that allow for < 300 page children's books

[Jen]

I just wanted to make sure this book would work, and that it doesn't count as a picture book: The Chronicles of Harris Burdick: Fourteen Amazing Authors Tell the Tales. It has full page illustrations throughout, but each story is based on one illustration, and is anywhere from 6 to 20 pages long.

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Jen wrote: "I just wanted to make sure this book would work, and that it doesn't count as a picture book: The Chronicles of Harris Burdick: Fourteen Amazing Authors Tell the Tales. It has full..."

this works as a childrens book under 300 pages.

[Bekka]

Maybe I'm just being really impatient, but I asked a question on help thread 5.8 - Go Fish over a week ago and it still hasn't been answered. Did I just get skipped? Should I post again? Or should I just keep waiting?

Thanks!

[Sandy, Moderator Emeritus]

Bekka wrote: "Maybe I'm just being really impatient, but I asked a question on help thread 5.8 - Go Fish over a week ago and it still hasn't been answered. Did I just get skipped? Should I post again? Or shoul..."

sorry, Bekka, I never got the red "new" indication. It's answered now. When something like this happens, you can always post again or send me a message. I always answer questions quickly unless I don't know about them, so you could just follow up with me.

[Bekka]

Sandy wrote: "Bekka wrote: "Maybe I'm just being really impatient, but I asked a question on help thread 5.8 - Go Fish over a week ago and it still hasn't been answered. Did I just get skipped? Should I post ag..."

Thanks, Sandy! I know you are so busy, so I didn't want to be a bother. I appreciate your response.

[Setalpgninnpsekil]

I have a question about posting. In the rules, it states that if we use and ebook or audiobook, use the mass market for page count. If no mass market, then use paperback. Etc.

When we post, however, do we post with the edition of the book we read and then note the mass market for the page count? For example, I read the Odyssey translated by Lattimore on the Kindle. Is the post below correct?

Sample post:

The Odyssey Of Homer by Homer, Translated by Richard Lattimore.

Page count of the paperback version of the same translation: 374

[Kristina Simon]

Setalpgninnpsekil wrote: "Sample post:

The Odyssey Of Homer by Homer, Translated by Richard Lattimore.

Page count of the paperback version of the same translation: 374 "

That would work. It's also really helpful for the moderator verifying books if you include a link to the paperback edition.

Sample post:

The Odyssey Of Homer by Homer, Translated by Richard Lattimore. This is the Kindle version.

Page count of the paperback version of the same translation: The Odyssey = 374 pages.

To get the link for the exact edition you want, put the ISBN for that edition into the add book/author search box instead of the title.

[Kathy G.]

If a book lists two authors, and the second author is
the one noted as a "goodgreads author", does the
second author count?

Thanks