The Most Overrated Books Showing 2,101-2,150 of 5,680

[[deleted user]]

I liked Midnight In the Garden of Good and Evil. I like Thomas Wolfe,too.
But I suppose the best of Southern Gothic are the playwrights. Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil.

For a long time, it all reminded me of Russian literature.
ANd then I thought about the fact that the serfdom was abolished in Russia at the same time as slavery was abolished in the South, so all those stories of change , the aristocratic societies disintegrating.
Chekhov and Southern Gothic is fairly similar.

[Karen]

Petergiaquinta wrote: "It's had to suggest an entry text to Faulkner. The easier stuff isn't the best. The harder stuff might turn a reader off. I'd try As I Lay Dying for a start. Anyone else?"

Light In August is good to start with also

[Petergiaquinta]

Lucie wrote: "I liked Midnight In the Garden of Good and Evil. I like Thomas Wolfe,too.
But I suppose the best of Southern Gothic are the playwrights. Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil."

O'Neill would find it funny to find himself lumped into this company. Or maybe he wouldn't. He strikes me as pretty damn grumpy.

[Renee E]

OH! Excellent observation, Lucie!

>Lucie: "For a long time, it all reminded me of Russian literature.
ANd then I thought about the fact that the serfdom was abolished in Russia at the same time as slavery was abolished in the South, so all those stories of change , the aristocratic societies disintegrating."

[[deleted user]]

Petergiaquinta wrote: "Lucie wrote: "I liked Midnight In the Garden of Good and Evil. I like Thomas Wolfe,too.
But I suppose the best of Southern Gothic are the playwrights. Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil."

O'Neill w..."
Yes, I actually had my doubt if O'Neil is from the South. LOL But his plays look like he is! ANd I am an ALien, entitled to blunders!

[Petergiaquinta]

Yeah, I understand...O'Neill is mostly industrial northeast. And Irish. But it would be funny to see some of his characters pop into the middle of a Faulkner novel. It would be more likely to find a Faulkner character popping into an O'Neill play, though. Quentin Compson spent some time up North, although he didn't exactly prosper up there...

[Cosmic]

Lucie wrote: "I liked Midnight In the Garden of Good and Evil. I like Thomas Wolfe,too.
But I suppose the best of Southern Gothic are the playwrights. Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil.

For a long time, it all ..."

This is a very insightful post. Because it was pointed out to me on this YouTube video that slavery was losing its status in the south long before the civil war started.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQiW_l...

The Civil War was about states rights and about unfair tariffs.

But also coming from a different angle "money": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgeIVD...
The Secrets of Oz has another view about the Civil War

Enjoy.

[[deleted user]]

To me he just seemed " Southern" not sure why
Long Day's Journey Into Night, The Iceman Cometh, Mourning Becomes Electra.
Maybe he is just American I like him, anyway

[Renee E]

Oh, and an often sadly overlooked SL novel, The Dollmaker, by Harriette Arnow. It, and others, really deserve a sub-genre, Appalachian Southern Lit. Jesse Stuart would fall into that category. There's nearly always a shade of humor, even if it's dark, in the characters' outlooks. It's how they survive.

[[deleted user]]

Cosmic wrote: "Lucie wrote: "I liked Midnight In the Garden of Good and Evil. I like Thomas Wolfe,too.
But I suppose the best of Southern Gothic are the playwrights. Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil.

For a long..."
The video is no longer available due to copy right claim!

[[deleted user]]

Cosmic wrote: "Lucie wrote: "I liked Midnight In the Garden of Good and Evil. I like Thomas Wolfe,too.
But I suppose the best of Southern Gothic are the playwrights. Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil.

For a long..."
the first one works

[Kallie]

Lucie wrote: "I liked Midnight In the Garden of Good and Evil. I like Thomas Wolfe,too.
But I suppose the best of Southern Gothic are the playwrights. Tennessee Williams, Eugene O'Neil.

For a long time, it all ..."

Flannery O'Connor is great, especially her short stories.

[Karen]

Karen wrote: "Petergiaquinta wrote: "It's had to suggest an entry text to Faulkner. The easier stuff isn't the best. The harder stuff might turn a reader off. I'd try As I Lay Dying for a start. Anyone else?"

L..."
Oh; sorry- I didn't read the above post by Paul Martin about LIA. Well I wasn't helpful, but Faulkner is meant to be re-read anyways

[Paul Martin]

Karen wrote:Oh; sorry- I didn't read the above post by Paul Martin about LIA. Well I wasn't helpful, but Faulkner is meant to be re-read anyways

Hehe, I figured. Maybe I'll try it again, since I already have a copy.

[Kallie]

It's interesting to think about what Gothic means. A simple definition says that gothic fiction combines elements of horror and romance, which covers quite a lot of territory: Hawthorne, Melville, Poe, and on, to many contemporary writers from all over the world.

Here's an interesting list from an author I've meant to read, since he includes noir fiction (of course! that fits too) as well as fantasy:

http://www.theguardian.com/books/book...

One that I recently read and thought superb was Kerstin Ekman's 'Blackwater.'

I enjoyed 'As I Lay Dying.' 'Dead' funny it was.

[Karen]

As I Lay Dying was absurdly funny; disturbing also. That's why I love Faulkner; his books have everything, dark humor and tragedy, not necessarily in that order but at times in the same sentence.

[Geoffrey]

Right on Mick.

[Geoffrey]

Mick wrote: "Renee wrote: "I've run into way more of what Mick describes than I'd like. I call them Regurgitators.

They read stuff, whether it's classic literature or current pop science articles or anything i..."

Borges was a Regurgitator too. He has a complete anthology of short stories in which in every paragraph he alludes to another piece of literature.

[Renee E]

I'm unfamiliar with him, but did he exhibit any unique understanding of them? Any insights? And did he acknowledge the origins?

I love reading works where the author uses references to books, etc., to show something about the character talking about them or quoting them or generally and intelligently to enhance the story in some way. It's a sort of inside *thing* and sometimes it's even made me go read something new.

[Geoffrey]

Karen wrote: "Petergiaquinta wrote: "Karen wrote: "I don't even know what a hippie is. I'm 56 so I'm not young, but the term hippie is very much a cliche."

It was pretty clear in the '60s and '70s who hippies w..."

Superficially, the term hippie applied to anyone with long hair, hirsute, slovenly dressed, reeked of incense, marijuana or both, had love beeds and burned candles all night long...flashed the peace sign and wore love beads and sandals, was mellowly laid back.....

Essentially he/she was interested in a non materialistic, non ambitious lifestyle, given over to spiritual and communal matters, brotherhood and love and leading a philosophic life....somewhat like David Throreau.

[[deleted user]]

Karen wrote: "As I Lay Dying was absurdly funny; disturbing also. That's why I love Faulkner; his books have everything, dark humor and tragedy, not necessarily in that order but at times in the same sentence."

I put it on my to read

[Karen]

Lucie wrote: "Karen wrote: "As I Lay Dying was absurdly funny; disturbing also. That's why I love Faulkner; his books have everything, dark humor and tragedy, not necessarily in that order but at times in the sa..."

Yay. It is on my re-read! My favorite so far is The Sound and the Fury, maybe it always will be.

[Anne Hawn]

My dad was from Mississippi. I lived there and in Tennessee and Virginia and we came back to MS every year. I still have family there and I loved the deep South and Southern Literature.

This is what I love about it: First, Southerners love to tell and listen to stories and they never skip the details. It's the process, not the product, although that's there too. Stories start on a darkened porch after a long hot summer day. No one's interrupting anyone, there's plenty of time for everyone to say their piece. They understand that listening is a way of loving.

Second: Second: The Designing Women quote is absolutely true.

"I’m saying this is the South. And we’re proud of our crazy people. We don’t hide them up in the attic. We bring ‘em right down to the living room and show ‘em off. See, Phyllis, no one in the South ever asks if you have crazy people in your family. They just ask what side they’re on."

Southerner's are idiosyncratic and they allow others the same latitude. I've lived in Northern states where they want to chop off all your jagged edges so you fit the same round holes everyone else is in. My aunt's friends, Booger and Wobbly Weeks could have never sprung from Northern soil. (I'm not making that up. They were lovely people who loved each other so much one died in the hospital and the other died on the way home.)

This is what I think gives Southern Literature that richness and texture. Southern writers wrap their arms around their characters, all their characters, even Big Daddy.

[Renee E]

Southerners do like to tell their stories, and yes, they are detailed. One thing you learn, coming here, is that you're going to be doing a lot of listening.

Another thing I've learned, from being transplanted into the south, from "someplace else," is that, when a non-native queries, "you're not from around here, are you," it's a compliment.

When a native says that, it's NOT a compliment.

I made that observation to The Boyfriend at the Time (he was definitely a temp, didn't like dogs, always a sign there are other serious character flaws) who was From Around Here and he latched onto it and repeated it — as his own thought — repeatedly. He's probably still using it. /facepalm

[Cosmic]

Geoffrey wrote: "Superficially, the term hippie applied to anyone with long hair, hirsute, slovenly dressed, reeked of incense, marijuana or both, had love beeds and burned candles all night long...flashed the peace sign and wore love beads and sandals, was mellowly laid back.....

Essentially he/she was interested in a non materialistic, non ambitious lifestyle, given over to spiritual and communal matters, brotherhood and love and leading a philosophic life....somewhat like David Throreau..."

I think they were interested in individuality, getting back to the land, environmentalists, experimental, creative types. I think their was a huge movement to move to southern California and I believe all of those creative people were responsible for what we call silicone valley. I don't think that could have happened anywhere else in America. You had to have creative types that were thinking out of the box and that were willing to think their own thoughts. I am pretty sure the marijuana didn't hurt either.

Great movie to get you back in touch with your hippie cousins....Easy Rider. Maybe other people have some suggestions for movies.

As for books I would put Living on the Earth: Celebrations, Storm Warnings, Formulas, Recipes, Rumors, and Country Dances Harvested by Alicia Bay Laurel.on top of your non fiction must read. A lot of things have nothing to do with building codes or good restrictions or other human prisons. But it is about personal freedom and living with people to the betterment of the world and children.

[Cosmic]

Anne Hawn wrote: "My dad was from Mississippi. I lived there and in Tennessee and Virginia and we came back to MS every year. I still have family there and I loved the deep South and Southern Literature.

This ..."

Could you link the book you were quoting from. I couldn't find it and wanted to put it in my reading list.

I personally did find the southerners to be conformist and want you to conform as well. Perhaps it isn't apparent when you all ready fit into the mold. But this is why I suggested the movie Easy Rider.

[M.R.]

Karen wrote: It's turning students off to some great literature. They're not ready for it (a lot of them), and having to take tests on books just creates a dislike for them. Reading for pleasure is so different and more rewarding, IMO.

Sorry, I have no sympathy for that argument. 1) kids are always going to hate being assigned something if they don't enjoy going to shcool; tough -- they're there to learn, whether they like it or not. 2) Being exposed to literature actually introduces some kids to things they never realized they'd like, even though they may not be able to admit that at the time. 3) We're talking about adolescents here: they're flooded with hormones, and their brains' logic circuits won't finish growing in until they're 21 or 22; why on earth would we assume they're making any sense? More likely, kids are simply more distracted than they used to be, and reading literature competes with texting, video games, and preening before your peers. The answer isn't to stop assigning them literature to read but to start limiting their TV time before they get to school and keep exposing them to a lot of different books instead, ban video games at home, and stop giving them cell phones before they're 18. The preening before peers you won't be able to do anything about: that's part of growing up.

[M.R.]

Paul Martin wrote: "Gary wrote:He does have variations, and his voice did develop over time, but by the time he got to "Old Man" he was pretty much the writer he was looking to be.

It isn't his writing style per se that always bothered me -- it's all that testosterone poisoning behind it; it infected his life, too. Doesn't matter if he's running with the bulls or struggling with a fish: it's more macho horsesh*t, and frankly, none of that ever appealed to me. Really not impressed. I'll take Borges or Alan Lightman or Anne Rice or a good mystery over Hemingway every time.

[Karen]

Anne Hawnn wrote; "I’m saying this is the South. And we’re proud of our crazy people. We don’t hide them up in the attic. We bring ‘em right down to the living room and show ‘em off. See, Phyllis, no one in the South ever asks if you have crazy people in your family. They just ask what side they’re on"

This is why I read William Faulkner-his characters are weird and he shows them to us with compassion and subtle humor.

[Paul Martin]

M.R. wrote: More likely, kids are simply more distracted than they used to be, and reading literature competes with texting, video games, and preening before your peers.

To a certain degree, sure. But I hardly think kids and adolescents used to sit indoors reading literature all afternoon before the television became normal.

[Karen]

M.R. wrote: "Karen wrote: It's turning students off to some great literature. They're not ready for it (a lot of them), and having to take tests on books just creates a dislike for them. Reading for pleasure is..."

I never said the answer is to stop assigning literature- I never mentioned anything about having an answer for this.

[[deleted user]]

Anne Hawn wrote: "My dad was from Mississippi. I lived there and in Tennessee and Virginia and we came back to MS every year. I still have family there and I loved the deep South and Southern Literature.

This ..."
I loved what you wrote.and one day, I want to travel round the US South, seeing all those places I read about!

[Kallie]

Anne Hawn wrote: "My dad was from Mississippi. I lived there and in Tennessee and Virginia and we came back to MS every year. I still have family there and I loved the deep South and Southern Literature.

This ..."

Booger and Wobbly Weeks. Ha. And a lot of people get their lifelong names from their initials: T.J., A.C., etc. Yeah, and I remember the front porch stories of an evening, an uncle telling me grisly stories while we watched the fireflies.

[Cosmic]

Renee wrote: "I love reading works where the author uses references to books, etc...."

I love this too! I am reading Ulysses, the slow way. I had to stop and read Hamlet, then I picked up Ulysses again and stopped to read the Odyssey and Decadence: And Other Essays on the Culture of Ideas. This last book was recommended by a Goodreads reader and it just dovetails into the style of writing that James Joyce used in Ulysses.

I think the first book that I did this with was The Catcher In The Rye. Salinger used a lot of reference material that I was not familiar with. His (Salinger) favorite movie was The Thirty Nine Steps by Alfred Hitchcock. I was not familiar with it but after watching it I could see all these children in school being stuffed with certain facts so that they behave in a predetermined way. They reach for the gold ring because that is what all kids are doing. They don't decided to go live in the country, pretend they are mute and become a gas station attendant. (Seems like I read a story about someone doing this and thought Salinger may have been referencing that novel. I am going to go and find the book and edit my post.) Anyway it made me look for more references, in names and books that movies were based on, and actresses Little Shirley...her first movie was Stand Up And Cheer. Which reminded me of the football game where you are suppose to cheer your team on. Penney was playing against the Saxons. How cleaner! Hamlet (Holden feigning madness) was a Saxon. So was Holden really mentally ill or was he just a coward like Hamlet? Was this a story about a brother poisoning another brother? War being the poison and England and Germany monarch's being related.

I have enjoyed getting and education from Salinger because I was not privileged to go to Valley Forge Academy, and I am sure that his approach to writing was effected by his education there.

[Geoffrey]

Lucie wrote: "Karen wrote: "As I Lay Dying was absurdly funny; disturbing also. That's why I love Faulkner; his books have everything, dark humor and tragedy, not necessarily in that order but at times in the sa..."

The funniest passage in AS I LAY DYING was when the pregnant daughter goes to the pharmacist for a "morning after pill". The second most funniest scene was when the father gets his dentures. Yes, there is a lot of humor in the novel.

[Carrie]

Ron wrote: "keep in mind, some of these books are forced reads in high schools. any time you force something on someone they're going to hate it."

That's exactly why I hate Scarlet Letter. maybe I need to reread it as an adult.

[Petergiaquinta]

Re: Cosmic and Hamlet

Hamlet is a Dane not a Saxon. The Danes and Saxons are historically enemies, but at the time of the play England is ruled by the Saxons. Hamlet's uncle the king sends him to England to be executed by the Saxons. Perhaps this fits your reading, though. I dunno...it's not something I've thought about, but Pencey does have this big rivalry with Saxon Hall.

[Anne Hawn]

Cosmic wrote: "Anne Hawn wrote: "I personally did find the southerners to be conformist and want you to conform as well. Perhaps it isn't apparent when you all ready fit into the mold. But this is why I suggested the movie Easy Rider"

I found much more latitude for individuality in the South than any other place I've been...except, perhaps, Alaska. However, if a person is not native and attempts to show those yokels how to do something better, it won't go well. My grandfather tried it and it didn't work well at all! I think you are making a valid point though. There are some personalities which will never fit. In fact, that is at the heart of a lot of Southern writing.

[Anne Hawn]

Cosmic wrote: "Anne Hawn wrote: "Could you link the book you were quoting from. I couldn't find it and wanted to put it in my reading list."

If you mean the Designing Women quote, it is from a TV show and I got it from this group. "Big Daddy" was in "Cat on a Hot Tin Roof."

[Anne Hawn]

Kallie wrote: "And a lot of people get their lifelong names from their initials: T.J., A.C., etc. Yeah, and I remember the front porch stories of an evening, an uncle telling me grisly stories while we watched the fireflies."

Yep! My uncle's name is FH, initials only. When he went in the Army they didn't like it one bit, so he wrote F(io)H(io)Xxxxx. It came back Fio Hio Xxxxx. He had to do some quick explaining before he was disciplined for making fun of the U. S. Army. We also have a T.E. in this latest generation.

My dad had a friend called "Grandpap" from the age of 4 and one called "Sweet Thing." We don't have a "Bubba" though, but there is a "Sister," and my dad grew up being called by his first and middle name, John-Alson.

I think Eudora Welty is the one that captures the Southern Voice the best for me. The Optimist's Daughter is my favorite. Rick Bragg does a great job with Southerners at the other end of the scale.

[Ron]

M.R. wrote Sorry, I have no sympathy for that argument. 1) kids are always going to hate being assigned something if they don't enjoy going to shcool; tough -- they're there to learn, whether they like it or not. 2) Being exposed to literature actually introduces some kids to things they never realized they'd like, even though they may not be able to admit that at the time. 3) We're talking about adolescents here: they're flooded with hormones, and their brains' logic circuits won't finish growing in until they're 21 or 22; why on earth would we assume they're making any sense? More likely, kids are simply more distracted than they used to be, and reading literature competes with texting, video games, and preening before your peers. The answer isn't to stop assigning them literature to read but to start limiting their TV time before they get to school and keep exposing them to a lot of different books instead, ban video games at home, and stop giving them cell phones before they're 18. The preening before peers you won't be able to do anything about: that's part of growing up.


While what you say is true. I think you missed the part about reading for pleasure. Personally I never read for anything else. Certainly, every writer I've ever read has left his/her influence on me, but that's my choice. Even strawberry shortcake isn't going to taste as good as it should if your forced to eat it.

[Anne Hawn]

M.R. wrote: "1) kids are always going to hate being assigned something if they don't enjoy going to school; tough -- they're there to learn, whether they like it or not. 2) Being exposed to literature actually introduces some kids to things they never realized they'd like, even though they may not be able to admit that at the time

I agree with you 100%, and I will add that kids have to be taught how to read and study literature. How can they appreciate the symbolism, the angst, the irony and all those things that enable us to understand what the author was trying to show us? Literature is never just about the story and that is what educators should be teaching kids. It isn't important that they like all the books they study, it is just important that they are introduced to them and given the tools to understand them.

[Ron]

Again, There's truth in your words, but without the pleasure of the read you lose the teen's interest. How can a teenager appreciate the story if he/she doesn't care about it.

the comment Literature is never just about the story isn't true In fact Mark Twain / Samuel Clemens even made the comment that his books were only stories and should not be interpreted in any other way

[Daniel]

Just because an author said it doesn't make it true, that's something we call Intentional Fallacy within literary studies. I don't mean to come off as rude, btw, I'm just saying. I think teachers should try to strike a balance, but not between classic books and bestsellers; rather between teenage-friendly good literature and teenage-challenging good literature.

[Petergiaquinta]

Uh...Twain was being a bit facetious when he said that. He was a funny guy, dealt in a bit of irony, understatement, overstatement even...but you knew that, right?

[Ron]

I actually took that comment by Twain to be serious because I believe he was. Not all books are written with an ulterior motive. Granted a lot are but truly anyone can make any book say whatever he or she wants it to say

[Renee E]

I believe you're right, Daniel.

Even in working on my stories, especially this novel, sometimes when I go back and read, or even after I've just written a passage I realize there's an aspect (or several) that is more than "only a story," that there's some of that juicy stuff those wonderful lit teachers I had in high school introduced me to.

I wish, instead of making work out of finding those lovely lagniappes in literature a chore, more students could realize it's like finding something extra, a bonus, on a scavenger hunt, not "that damned shit I've got to come up with so I can pass the test."

[Anne Hawn]

Ron wrote: "the comment Literature is never just about the story isn't true In fact Mark Twain / Samuel Clemens even made the comment that his books were only stories and should not be interpreted in any other way."

We are talking about two different things. Some books are just stories...that is what they are written to be. That is what the "Best Seller List" is full of.

Mark Twain's short stories are a great introduction to literature because they are fun. Tom Sawyer is fun and it is basically a story. Huckleberry Finn is NOT just a story. It is about a white boy and a black man who become close friends in a time when that was unheard of. Neither of them knows how to have a real relationship with a member of another race or even understands that's what is happening to their relationship; that they are becoming friends and that their lives depend on that friendship.

It is about a quest, about loyalty, freedom and fear. It is far more. It can be read as just a story or it can be taught as Literature. Kids have to learn to find a deeper meaning that lies under "just a story."

The whole point of studying literature is to understand what is going on in a variety of books that have something important to say. Teachers use books that they feel kids need to know about.

It's a little hard to understand why we feel that kids should just read what they like. Do they get to only do algebra or geometry problems that they like? Do they only study the parts of history that are fun, the Roaring 20's and skip all the boring parts like the framing of the Constitution? Do they only do the science experiments and not study the textbook?

[Ron]

Well said Anne. You made my point as well as your own.

[Renee E]

Twain encompassing all his works in that statement — well, the man definitely had a sense of humor.

"Just a story" . . . right. Take, for instance, The Man Who Corrupted Hadleyburg. Or Letters from the Earth.

"Just stories" my . . . posterior.