A novel is more than an idea

[A.J.]

People often say they 'have an idea' for a novel. Like that's all it takes. See what is really involved at:
http://awaines.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03...

[Wayne]

It's a conversation I often have with clients, and I always use a particular episode of Father Ted as an example, the one when Dougal — normally idea free — happened to have an idea, and a good one at that.

However, when challenged by the eponymous Father Ted to expand on that idea, Dougal replied:

"I didn't know you had to follow a good idea with loads more little good ideas."

Unfortunately, that's exactly what you have to do, be it writing a story or developing an application.

[A.J.]

Nicely put, Wayne - when you say 'clients' who is it you're working with? I'm intrigued, as I'm a Psychotherapist.

[Wayne]

A.J. wrote: "... when you say 'clients' who is it you're working with?"

Hi AJ. I have clients in many different industries — from physiotherapy, mechanical engineering, medical, event management, manufacturing, an actor (actress, to be specific), and education over the years.

[Justin]

It's one thing to have an idea for a novel, it's another thing to expand on that idea and turn it into a 250 page adventure that people will fall in love with. It takes time, concept and persistance.

[Vanessa Eden]

I may have an idea for a novel but the real work is the research. It takes me longer to compile my research than it actually takes to write the novel. One can have an idea but to make your idea into a novel and to add the details and make the characters come to life is the real work.

[Arabella]

An idea for a novel is a useless thing.
It's only when you put time and effort to use the idea as a seed for a great big tree...a novel... that it comes alive.Its like saying I have a great idea for a movie or a great idea for a play. It's just all hot air unless acted upon.
It's kind of why we are all here. Because someone's idea became concrete and we can discuss the finished effort.

[Feliks]

I kinda disagree. Talk about the 'methods' for writing is all well and good, but it skips over the real issue: what is the motive one has for writing in the first place?

Would you write--if you were absolutely sure no one would ever read your words? Would you write, if you were assured that it would entertain no one? Would you write, if you were assured that you would never be regarded with renown, esteem? What if your thoughts would never change the world or even any one person in any way, shape, or form? Who are you writing for? I think this is the crux which determines any writer. Sense of reward is what makes this tedious chore, worth applying oneself to.

You can have content and technique but if you have no reward in writing, you won't write. What is that reward? People's esteem, yes? Well, there's other ways to deal with that urge. Perhaps writing reflects the same kind of insecurity that actors are said to exhibit.

[Justin]

Feliks, an idea is an idea what we choose to do with that idea if anything is up to us. I've written countless articles and they've gotten no comments on my site but I keep writing them in hopes some reads them. It's about writing and knowing your words and ideas will reach someone. We may not have a audience right away but it takes time and those ideas if authors feel are worth the effort to take the time to work on, it will pay off.

[Vanessa Eden]

I could give a shit less if anyone reads or likes my stuff
I write for me. period

[Feliks]

Justin wrote: "Feliks, an idea is an idea ...."

Justin wrote: "what we choose to do with that idea ...."

Justin wrote: "if anything ...."

Justin wrote: "is up to us...."

o_0!


Vanessa wrote: "I could give a shit less if anyone reads or likes my stuff
I write for me. period"

I call 'BS'. Conceit. Because if you really write for yourself alone, you wouldn't write at all. You'd simply think your thoughts to yourself, enjoy them in their purest form, and eliminate the secondary effort. Writing is nowhere as near as elegant or efficient as simply...thinking. Incarnating your thoughts into the cruder format of language, words, paragraphs, and paper...implies effort expended to some audience other than yourself.

[Carla]

I think writing is/should be for yourself. I don't think most people set out to write for millions of people and fame. I think it's an outlet that eventually develops and matures to become what others can relate to. Did that make sense? Or answer the question?

[Vanessa Eden]

I don't call it b.s. because none of my writings have been published as I have never submitted any of them. and where do you get off talking to me so disrespectfully. you don't know me. if you can't respond to with with respect then don't do it at all. I am so sick of your arrogant attitude it could make me puke.

[Arabella]

I don't think you write, Feliks. I have always written first and foremost to entertain myself.It is like painting I see a world and I write it down and developed it. I am mistress of this universe. When I am done it it gets stored away unless I think it's good enough to publicly display!
An idea...simply an idea and nothing more...well is next to nothing. As I said before an idea is inert unless acted upon.

[Wayne]

Vanessa wrote: "I may have an idea for a novel but the real work is the research. It takes me longer to compile my research than it actually takes to write the novel..."

Vanessa, you and I appear to face the same challenge. Just out of curiosity, do you use any particular software for your research?

[Vanessa Eden]

Wayne, I actually look through books and I go through news papers. Wikipedia has been a big help as cliche as that may seem. I also watch many documentrys if the subject allows. I don't know if that helps you but that is what I do.

[Wayne]

Vanessa wrote: "Wayne, I actually look through books and I go through news papers. Wikipedia has been a big help as cliche as that may seem. I also watch many documentrys if the subject allows. I don't know if tha..."

Vanessa, the reason I ask is — and I hope this doesn't sound like a sales pitch, because it's not — I've struggled with curating and collating my research for so long, I wrote my own web application to do do just that.

So I'd be very interested to know more about your process, workflow, and the software you use.

[Vanessa Eden]

hey man I will check out your website :)

[Wayne]

Vanessa wrote: "hey man I will check out your website :)"

Hi Vanessa, the software is kind of in stealth mode; there's just me and someone else using it.

It's called the Under Cloud. Even though it's a work in progress, Anna and I use it on a daily basis.

Anna is studying astrophysics, and it's helping with her studies, while it helps me with my writing, and with a whole host of different things.

[Vanessa Eden]

I bet it will help in researching nursing diagnosis! :)

[John]

A great novel is like a great pro wrestling angle. You have to have dynamic characters, snappy dialogue, a flowing storyline, and an intriguing conflict resolved in an unforgettable climax. Without these components, your book is destined for the bargain bin, provided it ever makes it to print.

[John]

Vanessa wrote: "I could give a shit less if anyone reads or likes my stuff
I write for me. period"

I think Andy Kaufman's philosophy went something like that, and it worked very well for him.

[Vanessa Eden]

right on John. Btw I love Andy Kaufman.

[[deleted user]]

Hi A.J.,
I read your blog. You hit it right on the head. My latest novel, The PAC Conspiracy started with the idea from an essay. It took me a year to develop the plot and then there were the characters and when to introduce them, what were there conflicts, how were their conflicts resolved, etc. etc.

If you want to get an idea how an idea from an essay developed, see my website below and click on the tab at the left: Inspriatin for PAC.

Richard Brawer
www.silklegacy.com

[Brenda]

Ideas are easy. You want to see?
An alien arrives in the US and lives in the suburbs. That's the idea. What turns it into ALF, or E.T., or even SMALLVILLE? It's the execution. It's a boatload of scriptwriters and puppeteers, or Robin Williams riffing like a maniac.
Writers do not have problems with ideas. That's the easy part. That's why nobody worries about "people stealing my idea." You go for it, baby. It will not be ALF. It'll be your own, if you are worth anything.

[Cate's Book Nut Hut]

Why should writers have to write for anyone if they don't want to? Felik's argument is invalid in so many ways, for example the great diarists wrote for themselves not for an audience, they had no idea that in their future people would quote their works and, in the case of Anne Frank, use it as an insight into a past life. If Feliks we're to be taken at his word, and writing should only be done for an audience, historical research and insight would fail and all those who faithfully keep journals for whatever reason, would come to a standstill.

Why do we have to have an audience in mind for anything we do be it writing, painting or any other craft? And is it so hard to believe there are those that do so simply for the pleasure of creating and their own enjoyment.

[Vanessa Eden]

I just have to say...I write and always have written first me. When I say this I am saying this literally. I started out writing to express the feelings I had when I went through one of the deepest darkest depressions of my life. When I read them back to myself I felt like I took my first breath of fresh air in a long time. That was when I not only understood the meaning of art, but I felt it. Art is the expression of emotion through a medium...I had finally expressed myself through prose ...my pen found the words when my mouth couldn't and my words gave me peace that Xanax could not provide. That's why I write.
.for me...period.

[Vanessa Eden]

for*

[Vanessa Eden]

Cate I agree with you
The argument Felix provided was weak and inaccurate and dare I say...ignorant?! I also agree with Arabella, I don't think Felix is a writer.

[Cate's Book Nut Hut]

He/She has some very strong opinions on the matter though, not just here but throughout Goodreads.

[Vanessa Eden]

yes Felix does and some (very few) I agree with and most I don't. I respect ALL opinions but I detest an overbearing attitude. Its unnecessary and sad.

[Vanessa Eden]

I am sorry I posted that last bit. it was unnecessary! sorry!

[Reed]

A novel is certainly much more than an idea. I have a notebook filled with half baked ideas for books but to date have only fully finished one 80000 word novel and 2 10000 word short stories. Those all together took me 8 months of ignoring my friends, sitting hour after hour in front of a computer screen, and copious amounts of editing and re editing. It actually amuses me when I hear people talk about how "easy" it is to write a book.

[Philip]

Much more than an idea, and even when written it's not a novel in the publishing sense. Research for me starts with odd snippets that often spark the first idea, even for my sci-fi, for my second book it was partly a measles outbreak. Research then followed including some highly technical medical papers , well above my brain power, but I wanted my sci to be close to reality.

Then I plot outlined and character described including a timeline. I too use a software tool Scrivener with Aeon Timeline to help. Since discovering these tools after fighting with Word for years, the physical process is easier if not the editing. Formatting is straightforward.

It's still not a novel and until I get professional editing help my efforts will always be criticised, but I write because I have to. I hope that what I write brings enjoyment to those that read it, if anyone is kind enough to bother